nogs

3 minutes ago, Bailey said:

If Schneiderlin is that bad why haven't we played so much better without him? We were shite in the middle against City and Newcastle when he didn't play? Same against Arsenal for that matter! 

If Gomes is the shining lightweight have we been absolutely battered with him in the team as well? He is streets above the rest but he still suffers from the same problems the rest of them do.

I am pointing out that there is far more to it than changing a player for another similar player. We have been through similar problems for years now, and if you still think Schneiderlin is the answer to our poor form, you are asking the wrong question.

Who has been consistently played though? Digne, Pickford, Siggy, Richarlison. That probably does tell it's own story to be fair!

I agree with most of the 2nd paragraph. We didn't deal with the pressure, they also didn't deal with having to deal with an extra man against them. Do you not question why a manager would play two shockingly bad midfielders (by everyone else's standards), against an opposition midfield with more players, and then try and get them to play football through them? Is that not a bit of madness?

Look at what Dunc achieved. It wasn't pretty but we defended deep but we lumped it forward to two big lads and when they won the first or second ball then the rest of the team joined in and moved up the pitch. For most of last night's game the front 4 were anonymous. No help for the midfield or the full backs at all. The only option was to punt it forward and hope for the best. Once Klopp twigged, they saw us off with ease because we kept trying to play from the back and instead of long passes we were playing clearances.

You know my thoughts on our midfielders, I think they are a very average bunch at best, but at the same time you have to play to what you have and for the last 2 or 3 games we haven't (albeit we did at the end against Newcastle).

I thought we were very good v Burnley with Sidibe out wide, Bernard providing the extra man in midfield and Delph allowing Sigurdsson to play a bit more. Granted they play nothing like the way any Liverpool side play, but we showed we looked decent in possession with that line up. 

As to why you'd play those two numpties in midfield together and try to pass the ball - well I just wouldn't have played them. Against Liverpools first XI, sure - sit back in a low block and try to hit them on the break. But surely against the kids we should have had footballers out there who are good enough to break the press and get at a very inexperienced defence? 

I actually wonder if the number of changes Klopp made caught us by surprised, we were set up to play on the counter, then thought we should go another way. I'm not sure I got the formation at all either, with Sidibe, Walcott and Coleman all on the right. It just all looked a mess. 

2 hours ago, Palfy said:

McCarthy what a mistake letting him go, we wouldn’t have lost with him instead of Schneiderlin or Gylfi, if them young pups started giving him the run around he would have launched them into the top row of the Kop no messing. 

We'd have been better of with Mo Besic in midfield yesterday. Or his current team mate at Sheff Utd Lundstram - why did we let him go?? Fit as anything, athletic, mobile, can pass, tackle and pops up with goals - everything Schneiderlin can't do! 

Or, his head has been turned and he wants out. 

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

Maybe because 4 managers think they aren't bad players? 

What we know is that anyone couldn't do better. Davies can't, Delph can't and Gomes showed at times last year that he can't either. 

Then I'd politely ask what the fuck our last four managers have been on! 

Schneiderlin has been in and out the side countless times, which tells its own story. Same as Tosun, Keane, Walcott - inability to pin down a place, because they basically aren't good enough. Sigurdsson gets played because everyone knows he has a match winning goal or set piece in him. But he has been awful this season, truly awful. 

Look, my thought last night were largely the same as v City - we couldn't handle the high press, we were left chasing shadows by a team that was very comfortable in possession moving the ball quickly and purposefully. What's really galling is last night we got taught a lesson by a reserve side, which can never be good enough. We never got our foot on the ball in the middle of the park, whether it was system or personnel I don't know, but surely if we'd done that there'd have been more of a chance to get at such an inexperienced side? We should have been bossing that game, second half we didn't touch them. 

4 hours ago, Palfy said:

Ancelotti won’t be able to achieve anything with this team, he can bollock them throw cups of tea or boots at them it won’t make a difference, it’s not a football team it’s a bunch of over paid cunts. 
Some were in the region of over 400 million spent in just over 3 years and Norwich Brighton and Southampton play more attractive football than us. 
But that’s not the end of it if some reports on our financial situation are correct we can’t even expect to buy our way out of this mess, it’s already been reported that Ancelotti is going to get a smaller budget than he anticipated, whether or not he’s the man to turn us round or not I fear we may never get to find out, because if he can’t do what he needs to in the way of playing staff he will walk away, he won’t allow his reputation to be ruined by Moshiri. 
What is the answer god knows, is it to promote some of the youngsters and shelf the players that aren’t and haven’t been performing for a long time, it couldn’t do any more harm than we are seeing now, it’s been working for Chelsea Man Utd and to a degree Spurs and Liverpool, since we have consistently had one of the better U23 squads for years why haven’t we you would think it would make sense to most people, but unfortunately Moshiri isn’t most people he works on the basis of I can buy success, well I think we can all see that the project buy our to the top has completely failed. 
So let’s look with in for some inspiration and blood some of our young talent it could be the breath of fresh air we need, and if some of the players throw their dummies out the pram or even the manager for not getting the funds he was promised, then good because this club is bigger than any person in it, and that includes Moshiri who has a lot to answer for in the way this team  has gone backwards since he took over. 

We need a vision for how to build a successful football team. If that involves bruising a few overpaid egos, so be it. There really is no reason for the likes of Sigurdsson, Schneiderlin, Tosun etc getting a kick for us any more, no matter what wages they are on. They're not delivering, they shouldn't play, regardless of who's in charge. 

9 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Don’t worry about him Finn.  He just shows up when we are doing bad to rant.  Part of the boo boys

I've generally ignored everything you have to say since many years ago you accused me of being a 'Red Shite' fan. I'll continue doing the same. 

9 hours ago, Finn balor said:

I’m not being a smart arse I’m merely pointing out after 4 games you think you know better than Carlo Ancelotti 

No I'm not. I'm pointing out that everything was wrong about yesterday's capitulation and no one should be excused criticism, including the manager. 

4 minutes ago, Finn balor said:

Yeah it was awful first half. We should have been 3-0 up guess you would have known better then aswell 

Stop being a smart arse. It isn't about knowing better its about having an opinion on the game.

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

The other side of that argument is who comes in and do they have the skills that compliment the first teamers? Can Adeniran do that? If not who else is there that can? I'm sure if Gordon was a central midfielder he would have been playing games by now. 

Simple answer is - anyone! I'm sick to the back teeth of giving the likes of Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin chance after chance after chance to take the piss out of what it means to be an Everton player. And I wouldn't necessarily say its skills we're looking at short term, it's desire, energy, fitness, willingness to learn from a highly decorated coach and run yourself into the ground for 90 minutes that we need right now. That's what Liverpool's kids showed today. So yeah, Adeniran, Banigime, Evans, Denny... or we seem to be blessed with several highly thought of CBs in the U23s, why not stick one of them alongside Mina and play Holgate at CM until we can recruit better? 

Thing is, there's a lot of criticism of Man Utd and Arsenal for under achieving at the minute, and that has come about because a complete lack of strategic direction in terms of signings they've made over a number of years, a failure to rebuild teams. But at least they have recognised where some of the issues are and are blooding kids in the meantime. We have recruited worse than any team in the PL over the last five years, we've brought players in with absolutely no thought about how they fit together as a successful unit, we've overpaid for them and we have gone backwards as a result. Yet here we are still starting Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin in fucking midfield. When you sit back and think about it, it's hard to get your head round how, four managers later, that can still be happening. 

12 minutes ago, Finn balor said:

You should have talked to Carlo yourself before the game pal. That way we would have won. He has been here for four games with hardly any chance to spend time on the training field because of fixtures. 

Just observations. We don't need to be playing Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin in midfield and I posted that I was annoyed with the long ball tactic during the first half. 

7 minutes ago, Finn balor said:

Don’t blame Carlo at all. He’s lumbered with shit and there is no way he will stand for that. It’s sensitive but we need a clear out and I’m sure he knows what to do.

I think he made mistakes today. Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin in the middle is a disaster waiting to happen. I keep saying it but I'll say it again - when do we ever win when Schneiderlin starts? I also thought the way we went long so often first half was a mistake. Yes we forged chances we should have taken, but we also gave away possession easily and allowed an inexperienced opposition to grow in confidence with the ball. We saw their defence was vulnerable first half, we should have been able to dominate the ball high up the pitch and pass through them. 

But yes, he is stuck with some utter dross. When will this cycle of signing sub par footballers end? Two things do worry me about what today could mean for us under Ancellotti though. One, I just don't think we'd have got that performance under Ferguson. Is Ancellotti able to light a fire under the plsyers and get the passion and commitment you need sometimes? Two, Liverpool put out a side that was clearly much fitter and sharper than ours. Ancellotti has said himself he doesn't like to work players too hard, which is fine with professionals at the top of their game. But I think we're desperate for a hard task master who will demand players either shape up or ship them out. 

I've argued with many in here who don't see the value in bringing youth players through. Well we've just been knocked out the FA Cup by an U23 side who are clearly being coached to play in exactly the same way as the senior side, with one clear objective - they are absolutely ready to step in if and when needed. We've just won the last couple of PL2 titles, which means our U23s are in theory better than that lot. So what would have happened if we'd played Unsworth's side tonight? Why the fuck are we persisting with the likes of Sigurdsson, Schneiderlin, Walcott, even Digne now, when they cannot keep up with a bunch of kids that our kids have beaten??

We can hate Liverpool all we want. But if you want success as a football club, that's how you do it. We're just set up for mediocrity, top to bottom.. 

The big lesson from this is how comfortable and composed their kids are in possession, and how fit they are to press relentlessly. By comparison we are so, so slow and not a single one of our players is good enough to receive the ball under pressure and use it. It will take years to turn this shit around. 

I don't think I've ever seen us play as badly as we have in the second half. We've played like a lower league side getting spanked by PL high fliers. Total, total shit. 

This is what happens when you spend 5 years spunking money on second and third rate footballers with clever agents instead of investing seriously in scouting, the youth system and proper development throughout the club. Forget we're playing against their reserves - we're fielding players that should never, ever have worn the Everton shirt, and yet we're paying them more than 100k a week to not give a fuck. The whole ethos of how this club is run has to change or we'll continue to be a mediocre joke. 

This is embarrassing now. I hate to say it but their fucking reserves are a better side than us. 

I take it back. Thought Walcott was dangerous for half an hour but his complete lack of ability on the ball is disgraceful. 

We simply have to get someone else in midfield this January. Sigurdsson is finished here

Like against City we're being caught out by their press. Doesn't matter that it's their reserve team, they're fitter than us. 

We've been poor in front of goal but worse in possession. Their defence is shite, if we just got our foot on the ball and played with a bit of composure we'd carve them open. No excuses for not winning this. 

Just now, TallPaul1878 said:

Walcott has to go. Dont know what Keown has been sniffing but he has been awful in attack. Every single chance he has fucked it all up.

Really could do with Bernard

Walcott has been our best player

Ancellotti needs to change this in midfield. Sigurdsson is lost. 

We're going long far too often. We should be bossing possession against such an inexperienced side. 

Got to be in with a chance with that Liverpool line up. Then again we're starting Schneiderlin...