General Election

[Cornish Steve]

Just seen some of the swings. A "safe" Labout seat, and they lose by almost 6,000 votes. The swing to the SNP is almost 30%. I've never seen such complete and utter domination before. SNP might actually win every single seat in Scotland!

 

Absolutely delighted that UKIP are doing so poorly.

[Cornish Steve]

Why on earth in this day and age is there still a manual count? Prone to errors and fixing.

 

Because electronic voting can be much more easily manipulated. How can you prove that your vote for actually counted and applied to your candidate? With paper, you can demand to see. Personally, I have no problem with paper ballot sheets, despite being very much a technologist at heart.

[Btay]

As an outsider to any of the government related issues in the UK what are the main things that people are upset with over here? During my brief stay, ive somewhat noticed that nearly all Government related services seem to take as long as possible in order to get people to use fast track options - paying stupid amounts of money for a really quite simple service. For instance, my Gold CSCS Plumbing Card i had to pay 85 pound to fast track because it had already taken over 4 weeks for a 3 week service and once i had paid i had received it within the 4 day fast tracked time....

Also car insurance for under 25's is beyond disgusting... i got quoted over 6,000 pound for a year of insurance on a cheap run about car. Cannot even fathom that.
Fuel - You pay over double what we pay in Australia, i would love to know why...
Public transport - seems they know purchasing a car is out of the question for most people ( younger people especially ) so the public transport prices are huge here!

[MikeO]

Bloody hell, looked pretty bad when I went to bed but this morning it looks even worse.

 

Unbelievable the "experts" and pollsters got it so wrong.

[MikeO]

As an outsider to any of the government related issues in the UK what are the main things that people are upset with over here? During my brief stay, ive somewhat noticed that nearly all Government related services seem to take as long as possible in order to get people to use fast track options - paying stupid amounts of money for a really quite simple service. For instance, my Gold CSCS Plumbing Card i had to pay 85 pound to fast track because it had already taken over 4 weeks for a 3 week service and once i had paid i had received it within the 4 day fast tracked time....

 

Also car insurance for under 25's is beyond disgusting... i got quoted over 6,000 pound for a year of insurance on a cheap run about car. Cannot even fathom that.

Fuel - You pay over double what we pay in Australia, i would love to know why...

Public transport - seems they know purchasing a car is out of the question for most people ( younger people especially ) so the public transport prices are huge here!

 

Good questions; I'd try to answer but I think I'll go back to bed in the hope that when I wake up again this will just have been a bad dream.

[Btay]

 

Good questions; I'd try to answer but I think I'll go back to bed in the hope that when I wake up again this will just have been a bad dream.

So its safe to say the wrong party looks set to get in?

[Romey 1878]

What a fucking disaster I've woken up to. People should be very worried about the next 5 years. There'll be even more deaths under this government. Moving to another country has never looked so good.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Romey 1878

[Matt]

What a fucking disaster I've woken up to. People should be very worried about the next 5 years. There'll be even more deaths under this government. Moving to another country has never looked so good.

I posted on FB; I always feel lucky to live in Switzerland. Today, I feel even luckier...

[Louis]

I was actually surprised to see Esther McVey go. She actually had more votes for her this year than she did in 2010 but a lot more people voted Labour than previously. According to the BBC it was an 8% swing.

[gethinO]

God help us for the next 5 years.

[markjazzbassist]

Looks like England is turning into America, the right wing nuts taking over. Time for us all to move to Denmark, happiest country in the world statistically. 33 hour work week sounds nice

[johnh]

Personal view - why Labour lost.

 

1. The Electorate don't like the thought of a 'geek' being Prime Minister. See also Kinnock and Michael Foot. (The fault lies with the Trade Unions who pushed for Ed over his brother.)

 

2. There were too many people in the Labour camp whose fingerprints were all over the financial crisis. (The fact that most were

'in denial' didn't help.)

 

3. Nicola Sturgeon's insistence that she would do a deal with Labour (in spite of Milliband's denial.)

 

Don't say I'm right but that's how I see it.

[markjazzbassist]

i heard a great interview today on NPR why an English "expert" believes the pollsters were so wrong in thinking Labour had a chance. He said being conservative in England is considered boring and not cool, so a lot of people vote conservative but won't admit it because English people are supposed to be progressive and all that and they don't want to not fit in.

 

thoughts?

[johnh]

i heard a great interview today on NPR why an English "expert" believes the pollsters were so wrong in thinking Labour had a chance. He said being conservative in England is considered boring and not cool, so a lot of people vote conservative but won't admit it because English people are supposed to be progressive and all that and they don't want to not fit in.

 

thoughts?

 

No, the reason the pollsters got it wrong is that most Brits like to take the piss and don't tell the pollsters the truth.

[MikeO]

Personal view - why Labour lost.

 

1. The Electorate don't like the thought of a 'geek' being Prime Minister. See also Kinnock and Michael Foot. (The fault lies with the Trade Unions who pushed for Ed over his brother.)

 

2. There were too many people in the Labour camp whose fingerprints were all over the financial crisis. (The fact that most were

'in denial' didn't help.)

 

3. Nicola Sturgeon's insistence that she would do a deal with Labour (in spite of Milliband's denial.)

 

Don't say I'm right but that's how I see it.

 

We had no need to be frightened about that though, it was only the right wing press and Tories predicting that it would be Armageddon, there's no reason why it couldn't have worked.

 

i heard a great interview today on NPR why an English "expert" believes the pollsters were so wrong in thinking Labour had a chance. He said being conservative in England is considered boring and not cool, so a lot of people vote conservative but won't admit it because English people are supposed to be progressive and all that and they don't want to not fit in.

 

thoughts?

 

Possible; when Maggie Thatcher got in for the third time it was impossible to find anyone who admitted voting for her, but millions did.

 

But if it is the case then the pollsters should know it and factor it in.

[markjazzbassist]

Possible; when Maggie Thatcher got in for the third time it was impossible to find anyone who admitted voting for her, but millions did.

 

But if it is the case then the pollsters should know it and factor it in.

 

LOL that is hilarious mike!! yes i agree you would think the pollsters would have a better grasp on things since it is their livelihood.

[MikeO]

Our electoral system (from a couple of emails I've had today from organisations I belong to)...

 

"The Tories gained 36% of a 67% voter turnout. This equates to roughly 20% of the electorate dictating policy to the other 80%."

 

"In 2011 we held a referendum that decided not to pursue a different voting system. But politics has changed since then. Multiple political parties backed up by popular vote -- but this isn't being reflected in the seats. Public outrage at such a screwed system can force the Conservatives to at least conduct a review into a new system. Which is a first step.

It’s true that a proportional representation system would lead to more seats for UKIP. But without proportional representation we will never see the growth in the smaller progressive parties that offer so much hope for Britain.

Many individuals complained of having to tactically vote or feel that their vote would be wasted, and many students were automatically taken off the ballot. This isn't a competition -- this is a democracy. There should be no such thing as a wasted vote. Call on MPs now to fix a system that is long past its use by date." Sign now:

https://secure.avaaz.org/en/uk_electoral_reform_locb/?bcwFHab&v=58070

[Cornish Steve]

Looks like England is turning into America, the right wing nuts taking over. Time for us all to move to Denmark, happiest country in the world statistically. 33 hour work week sounds nice

 

By US standards, the Tories are rather like the Democrats. US politics is way more right-wing than anything seen in Britain - even the nutty UKIP.

[Cornish Steve]

Personal view - why Labour lost.

 

1. The Electorate don't like the thought of a 'geek' being Prime Minister. See also Kinnock and Michael Foot. (The fault lies with the Trade Unions who pushed for Ed over his brother.)

 

2. There were too many people in the Labour camp whose fingerprints were all over the financial crisis. (The fact that most were

'in denial' didn't help.)

 

3. Nicola Sturgeon's insistence that she would do a deal with Labour (in spite of Milliband's denial.)

 

Don't say I'm right but that's how I see it.

 

I've heard a number of people suggest that the Labour leader was simply not competent to be leader, and, as a consequence, they were too scared to vote for his party.

[Cornish Steve]

It will take a while for Labour to recover because they no longer have any Balls.

[MikeO]

Another email (from Oxfam)...

 

"The results are in, and as I'm emailing you the Conservatives are forming the next government. Now is a crucial time to influence and we need to make sure that tax dodging is at the top of the agenda.

Act now – Tell David Cameron to take action on tax

Email Cameron to let him know:

You care about ending corporate tax dodging.

You feel strongly about making sure the world's poorest countries don't lose out on funds that could pay for education and health care.

You want the billions of pounds lost to tax dodging to be put to better use here in the UK too.

It's not fair that developing countries are currently losing out on more than $100 billion a year by multinationals dodging local taxes – money that could be used to build schools and hospitals. And it's not fair that we're missing out on £3.6 billion that could be used to tackle poverty here in the UK, either.

By putting pressure on David Cameron at this crucial time, we can get him to commit to making our tax system fairer for everyone."

[Cornish Steve]

Another email (from Oxfam)...

 

"The results are in, and as I'm emailing you the Conservatives are forming the next government. Now is a crucial time to influence and we need to make sure that tax dodging is at the top of the agenda.

 

Act now – Tell David Cameron to take action on tax

 

Email Cameron to let him know:

 

You care about ending corporate tax dodging.

 

You feel strongly about making sure the world's poorest countries don't lose out on funds that could pay for education and health care.

 

You want the billions of pounds lost to tax dodging to be put to better use here in the UK too.

 

It's not fair that developing countries are currently losing out on more than $100 billion a year by multinationals dodging local taxes – money that could be used to build schools and hospitals. And it's not fair that we're missing out on £3.6 billion that could be used to tackle poverty here in the UK, either.

 

By putting pressure on David Cameron at this crucial time, we can get him to commit to making our tax system fairer for everyone."

 

And if the government does this, can we honestly believe that the money saved would go toward fighting poverty?

[Cornish Steve]

I'll expand.... Basically my family (fathers side) have always been labour voters. My mother I thought (until recently) was a labour voter too. Found out she's always voted conservative.

 

So for me it's always been taboo to vote anything but labour. I also like Milliband.... Not sure why but he's swayed me over the last 3-4 weeks. I always considered David a better Labour candidate than Ed before hand.

 

Labour for me represents my background more than any other. However, with running my own business I've found the conservative government to be ok - as my business has done fairly well (it could do better though). The area of work I am moving into has very "well off" clientele and as someone pointed out to me today it might be in my interest to vote conservatives as it may well keep that clientele spending.

 

I always remember an electrician saying to me in the wholesalers - "you've started at the right time, it won't ever be as bad as this". I started my company at the height of the recession 2010/2011. So I'm not sure what "good" is and if I've seen it yet. Yes I'm busy but I have quiet periods too. I suppose "good" would be expanding to the point of employing more people to keep up with the workload.

 

Basically which ever government can keep my business afloat is the one I should be voting for. I hope that's labour.

 

Rereading your post, isn't it a case of either voting with your head versus voting with your heart? I'm guessing that your heart is disappointed but your head is pleased right now.

 

Looking at the results, there were only two things that really changed: the SNP wiped out Labour in Scotland (but their policies are not that different anyway - save about Scottish independence); and the Tories wiped out the LibDems in England (who were coalition partners anyway). So, things will just continue as they were - except that there's more ill will all round.

[MikeO]

 

And if the government does this, can we honestly believe that the money saved would go toward fighting poverty?

 

Absolutely not, but in the internet age it needs to be highlighted as widely as possible.

 

Josh is eighteen and voted for the first time this year based mostly on what he'd seen on social media/youtube etc (though I like to think the way we brought him up played a part too) although he asked me a lot of questions. I was happy with the way he voted.

 

There are many people/organisations trying to bring pressure/accountability on government nowadays who just didn't have the tools or the access in the past, vital for me that this used as widely as possible. I'd be saying/doing the same whoever was in power but today it became more important than ever for me because of the nature of the people we have in charge..

[markjazzbassist]

I have another questions for you guys. With the SNP doing so resoundedly well, does this mean there will be another independence vote and it is more likely to pass? I'm not sure if they are able to vote on that I imagine parliament would have to allow it and am not sure of the Tories position of Scottish independence.

 

Also another question, this whole England removed from the EU business, was that merely a election ploy to get votes or do you think it will really happen and pass?

[Cornish Steve]

I have another questions for you guys. With the SNP doing so resoundedly well, does this mean there will be another independence vote and it is more likely to pass? I'm not sure if they are able to vote on that I imagine parliament would have to allow it and am not sure of the Tories position of Scottish independence.

 

Also another question, this whole England removed from the EU business, was that merely a election ploy to get votes or do you think it will really happen and pass?

 

From the perspective of pure self-interest, Labour had to campaign against Scottish Independence - because many of its MPs were from there. No Scottish MPs in Westminster, and Labour suffers (as, ironically, they have now found out). Since Labour no longer benefits from Scotland, the cynic in me says that they probably couldn't give a flying rip any more whether Scotland is independent or not. IMO, if the SNP can repeat its success in regional elections, then there will be another vote for independence - probably in 2016. It's like other issues: They'll keep voting on it until the inevitable outcome is achieved - only then there will be no way back.

 

There's always been a split between the North and the South: The North (including Scotland) is more left-wing, whereas the South tends to be more right-wing. That is extreme right now, since SNP policies are more left-wing than even Labour's. That has to be a factor, too.

[markjazzbassist]

 

From the perspective of pure self-interest, Labour had to campaign against Scottish Independence - because many of its MPs were from there. No Scottish MPs in Westminster, and Labour suffers (as, ironically, they have now found out). Since Labour no longer benefits from Scotland, the cynic in me says that they probably couldn't give a flying rip any more whether Scotland is independent or not. IMO, if the SNP can repeat its success in regional elections, then there will be another vote for independence - probably in 2016. It's like other issues: They'll keep voting on it until the inevitable outcome is achieved - only then there will be no way back.

 

There's always been a split between the North and the South: The North (including Scotland) is more left-wing, whereas the South tends to be more right-wing. That is extreme right now, since SNP policies are more left-wing than even Labour's. That has to be a factor, too.

Thank you Steve.

 

It's funny thing, in a lot of countries the north and south don't get along and are very different. America, UK, Italy, etc. and it's the same story, northern industrial working class etc, southern lazy slow etc. being a northerner for 28 years of my life and living in the south now It fascinates me.

[Romey 1878]

Our electoral system (from a couple of emails I've had today from organisations I belong to)...

 

"The Tories gained 36% of a 67% voter turnout. This equates to roughly 20% of the electorate dictating policy to the other 80%."

 

"In 2011 we held a referendum that decided not to pursue a different voting system. But politics has changed since then. Multiple political parties backed up by popular vote -- but this isn't being reflected in the seats. Public outrage at such a screwed system can force the Conservatives to at least conduct a review into a new system. Which is a first step.

It’s true that a proportional representation system would lead to more seats for UKIP. But without proportional representation we will never see the growth in the smaller progressive parties that offer so much hope for Britain.

 

Many individuals complained of having to tactically vote or feel that their vote would be wasted, and many students were automatically taken off the ballot. This isn't a competition -- this is a democracy. There should be no such thing as a wasted vote. Call on MPs now to fix a system that is long past its use by date." Sign now:

 

https://secure.avaaz.org/en/uk_electoral_reform_locb/?bcwFHab&v=58070

 

I'm firmly behind a change to PR and have been ever since taking Government and Politics at college.

[johnh]

I read this morning that UKIP got more total votes for 1 seat than the SNP and Liberal Democrats added together got for 60 odd seats.

[MikeO]

I read this morning that UKIP got more total votes for 1 seat than the SNP and Liberal Democrats added together got for 60 odd seats.

 

Yup. I'm very happy that happened but it's not right. It's been happening (on a lesser scale) to the Liberals for my lifetime and longer but while the big parties benefit from the status quo it's not going to change. Turkeys voting for Christmas springs to mind.