Board/Owners Related Stuff

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

I was under the impression that locking in the construction cost does include the materials?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/apr/13/everton-sign-contract-to-complete-new-stadium-construction

 

Fake news mate, materials in the construction industry have risen by over 40% in the last 2 years if Laing had to carry those costs they would be paying millions more than they would be invoicing. Go to www.building.co.Uk to give you an idea on material costs since early 21. 

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

16 hours ago, Palfy said:

Fake news mate, materials in the construction industry have risen by over 40% in the last 2 years if Laing had to carry those costs they would be paying millions more than they would be invoicing. Go to www.building.co.Uk to give you an idea on material costs since early 21. 

So what exactly have we locked in?

When they say the cost of the stadium is locked in are they lying? If so surely Lang would have put the record straight by now

What if Lang had already purchased the materials before agreeing to the deal?

[Shukes]

It could be locked in to original spec. They would have already had a contingency put in for rising costs. 
Like I say TP lock in prices for quotes sent out. Even if materials go up, they honour the material costs as long as the quote is fulfilled within the time limit.

What they won’t have is extra costs for unforeseen.

[Palfy]

4 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

So what exactly have we locked in?

When they say the cost of the stadium is locked in are they lying? If so surely Lang would have put the record straight by now

What if Lang had already purchased the materials before agreeing to the deal?

Labour and machinery, and Laing’s pre-Lims. You mentioned concrete and all aggregates have risen more than most materials in the last 2 years, due in most part to the Government and the H2 train line, who where trying to buy up as much concrete and other aggregates as they could get their hands on which helped inflate costs by nearly 60% in two years. Steel costs have also rocketed by 40+% in the same time. These are are two main construction materials of the Stadium, materials will equate to about 60% of the costs and Laing will be working on margins of 3-5% profit. The Stadium costs have risen from £500m to £760m as confirmed by Moshiri purely due to material costs. I’m going to say no more on this now because I have to deal with this sort of shit most days of the week, where I have to go back to clients looking for contract increases due to material costs, which is a ball ache. So you tell me why you think the stadium costs have risen so much, because if it’s not materials I’m at a complete loss. 

[StevO]

Thinking about it, we have a deal with Laing O’Rourke that’s fixed. But the steel comes from Severfield, so maybe that’s a completely different deal? One that isn’t fixed or made public. 

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

23 hours ago, Palfy said:

Labour and machinery, and Laing’s pre-Lims. You mentioned concrete and all aggregates have risen more than most materials in the last 2 years, due in most part to the Government and the H2 train line, who where trying to buy up as much concrete and other aggregates as they could get their hands on which helped inflate costs by nearly 60% in two years. Steel costs have also rocketed by 40+% in the same time. These are are two main construction materials of the Stadium, materials will equate to about 60% of the costs and Laing will be working on margins of 3-5% profit. The Stadium costs have risen from £500m to £760m as confirmed by Moshiri purely due to material costs. I’m going to say no more on this now because I have to deal with this sort of shit most days of the week, where I have to go back to clients looking for contract increases due to material costs, which is a ball ache. So you tell me why you think the stadium costs have risen so much, because if it’s not materials I’m at a complete loss. 

But the club have denied that the construction costs have increased. They are on record as saying the total cost is £760m if you include the £260m he has coughed up for all the preparatory work / surveys that were done before we even started the build

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/farhad-moshiri-makes-new-760m-25957735

[Palfy]

3 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

But Moshiri has denied that the costs have increased. He is on record as saying the total cost is £760m if you include the £260m he has coughed up for all the preparatory work / surveys that were done before we even started the build

 

Really, do you genuinely believe before we put a spade in the ground we had already spent £260m. Remember the filling of the dock is part of build costs and would have been included in the original £500m, Civil Engineering costs aren’t a separate entity from super structure costs they both form part of the original build costs. I don’t understand why you can’t accept that contracts of this size are effected by raw material costs. As an example read why the H2 high speed train line more than doubled. You can’t expect a main contractor to give you their best estimate and still cover all costs out of their control. I work on fixed rate contracts that are fixed from 1 year, 18 months, or to end of build. I have to fix my Labour rates, my own pre-lims, any hire costs on hire rates in my case that is fully managed Crane Hire, and also no extras will considered by the client if they can prove your extra costs are due to lack of knowledge. But I do get paid for material increases plus a 10% handling fee. 

[Matt]

16 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Really, do you genuinely believe before we put a spade in the ground we had already spent £260m. Remember the filling of the dock is part of build costs and would have been included in the original £500m, Civil Engineering costs aren’t a separate entity from super structure costs they both form part of the original build costs. I don’t understand why you can’t accept that contracts of this size are effected by raw material costs. As an example read why the H2 high speed train line more than doubled. You can’t expect a main contractor to give you their best estimate and still cover all costs out of their control. I work on fixed rate contracts that are fixed from 1 year, 18 months, or to end of build. I have to fix my Labour rates, my own pre-lims, any hire costs on hire rates in my case that is fully managed Crane Hire, and also no extras will considered by the client if they can prove your extra costs are due to lack of knowledge. But I do get paid for material increases plus a 10% handling fee. 

Buying the land, surveys, legal fees, pre-contract payments... yeah I can see £200m+ 

[Palfy]

25 minutes ago, Matt said:

Buying the land, surveys, legal fees, pre-contract payments... yeah I can see £200m+ 

I don’t know what the land cost are or whether that was factored in the total cost of the build, all I can refer to is in the housing sector the cost of the land is factored into the budget, because if not all costs are accounted for you wouldn’t know if it was a viable investment. But would be interested to know what the land cost was, I do know that land costs in my area are around £1m an acre for land turned over to housing, and that land designated for commercial projects and brown fields sites are are a fraction of the cost of land for housing. 

[Matt]

7 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I don’t know what the land cost are or whether that was factored in the total cost of the build, all I can refer to is in the housing sector the cost of the land is factored into the budget, because if not all costs are accounted for you wouldn’t know if it was a viable investment. But would be interested to know what the land cost was, I do know that land costs in my area are around £1m an acre for land turned over to housing, and that land designated for commercial projects and brown fields sites are are a fraction of the cost of land for housing. 

I know construction is your industry, so I'm calling on my experience of a greenfield factory which I think is a better comparison than the housing market. 

Correct me where I am wrong, which might be all the below, but housing is, in general, quite standardised (by which I mean you can reuse layouts, parts and materials etc.) Whereas a stadium is a luxury, custom build with a lot more specialities, especially one being built in many centuries old dock on a riverbank. Specialities cost significantly more, regardless of industry. 

[Palfy]

4 hours ago, Matt said:

I know construction is your industry, so I'm calling on my experience of a greenfield factory which I think is a better comparison than the housing market. 

Correct me where I am wrong, which might be all the below, but housing is, in general, quite standardised (by which I mean you can reuse layouts, parts and materials etc.) Whereas a stadium is a luxury, custom build with a lot more specialities, especially one being built in many centuries old dock on a riverbank. Specialities cost significantly more, regardless of industry. 

I would agree with you housing is more generic when talking about design most big players have a portfolio of 30 designs that they repeat nationwide. 

[StevO]

15 hours ago, Matt said:

Buying the land, surveys, legal fees, pre-contract payments... yeah I can see £200m+ 

The cost of the ships for the infill too, filtering the shit from the dock, exploding the bombs they found, and the actual infill. 

[Goodison Glory]

Should all this stuff not be in the stadium thread??

#ClassicTT

[Newty82]

29 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

Should all this stuff not be in the stadium thread??

#ClassicTT

Tut. Have a word.

This is the stadium thread. Clearly.

[Goodison Glory]

2 hours ago, Newty82 said:

Tut. Have a word.

This is the stadium thread. Clearly.

The All Kenwright/Board Stuff thread is the Stadium Thread? 
 

forgive me for thinking the new stadium thread was the place to discuss the new stadium. 

[Matt]

21 minutes ago, Goodison Glory said:

The All Kenwright/Board Stuff thread is the Stadium Thread? 
 

forgive me for thinking the new stadium thread was the place to discuss the new stadium. 

Just make sure you don't do it again

[London Blue]

1 hour ago, Goodison Glory said:

The All Kenwright/Board Stuff thread is the Stadium Thread? 
 

forgive me for thinking the new stadium thread was the place to discuss the new stadium. 

This is Toffee Talk, independent thought is not encouraged!!

[Matt]

Just now, London Blue said:

This is Toffee Talk, independent thought is not encouraged!!

Did you get approval before posting this? Or do we need to prep the gulag?

[London Blue]

1 minute ago, Matt said:

Did you get approval before posting this? Or do we need to prep the gulag?

I thought the gulag was always ready commissar Matt.

Oh bugger I just thought.

Send me down 

[Newty82]

12 hours ago, Goodison Glory said:

The All Kenwright/Board Stuff thread is the Stadium Thread? 
 

forgive me for thinking the new stadium thread was the place to discuss the new stadium. 

Yes. You are correct. Both times.

I do, and will, forgive you  

[Heath]

Hopefully, Bill Kenwright will decide to attend the City game. Looking up and seeing the great man taking his seat would give the players such a much-needed boost and help drive them on to get something from this match.

[Newty82]

2 hours ago, Heath said:

Hopefully, Bill Kenwright will decide to attend the City game. Looking up and seeing the great man taking his seat would give the players such a much-needed boost and help drive them on to get something from this match.

Erm...read the room

[Palfy]

47 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

Erm...read the room

Newty where are you getting your happy pills from mate, I don’t think I’ve witnessed you being so jovial before. Reminds me of when my brother got divorced

[Newty82]

14 hours ago, Palfy said:

Newty where are you getting your happy pills from mate, I don’t think I’ve witnessed you being so jovial before. Reminds me of when my brother got divorced

I'm just a happy cunt these days. Used to come on here and be to argumentative for whatever reason, which wasn't really me. Think it was just a release.

Plus, I quit my job last year. After 13 horrendous years Managing for Boots. Went self employed as a Personal Coach...had fuck all clients, no income, extra £900 monthly overheads ontop of normal outgoings.

Best thing I've ever done (been hard graft though hence I went missing for ages!).

[Palfy]

10 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

I'm just a happy cunt these days. Used to come on here and be to argumentative for whatever reason, which wasn't really me. Think it was just a release.

Plus, I quit my job last year. After 13 horrendous years Managing for Boots. Went self employed as a Personal Coach...had fuck all clients, no income, extra £900 monthly overheads ontop of normal outgoings.

Best thing I've ever done (been hard graft though hence I went missing for ages!).

good on you mate, takes balls to make the jump when you have been in steady employment for so long, pleased it’s working out if you know what I mean

[Romey 1878]

10 hours ago, Newty82 said:

I'm just a happy cunt these days. Used to come on here and be to argumentative for whatever reason, which wasn't really me. Think it was just a release.

Plus, I quit my job last year. After 13 horrendous years Managing for Boots. Went self employed as a Personal Coach...had fuck all clients, no income, extra £900 monthly overheads ontop of normal outgoings.

Best thing I've ever done (been hard graft though hence I went missing for ages!).

So you're not a fat cunt then? I'm going to have to change the image I have in my mind when reading your posts from now on.

[Newty82]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

So you're not a fat cunt then? I'm going to have to change the image I have in my mind when reading your posts from now on.

Just a cunt really. A lego legged, balding, Yorkshire Tea stained toothed cunt.

[Romey 1878]

5 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

Just a cunt really. A lego legged, balding, Yorkshire Tea stained toothed cunt.

My kind of person then .

[Matt]

8 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

Just a cunt really. A lego legged, balding, Yorkshire Tea stained toothed cunt.

 

 

[Newty82]

51 minutes ago, Matt said:

 

 

You dick!!!