Romey 1878 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Advice on corner kicks!...........just whack it back to Howard, we can do more damage from there I'm starting to think we don't practice defending or attacking corners. We're woeful at both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 If one of McCarthy or Barry is to be sacrificed for a more attacking player it should only ever be Barry, IMO. While Barry has been fantastic for us, if he's having an off game, like last night, he has zero effect on our play. At least if McCarhy is below par you still get his energy in the middle of the park, and energy there is vital to the way we play. Barry was a disgrace last night. He was passing the ball and walking round like he didn't want to be there. It's players with his experience that we need in this crucial run in. Let's hope he looks at that performance and steps up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toffee_in_LA Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 I was really salty after the game, even a friend of mine that doesn't know about football at all asked me why I was upset and she laughed when I told her. A couple of points I need to make Think the one mistake RM made was dropping McCarthy. Most of us were singing his praise when we saw we had attacking wingers starting (the amount of times people have complained about Osman starting on one of them can't be stressed enough) and I was one of the people happy to see Kev McGeady and Deulofeu playing. I underestimated the importance of having wingers tracking back on defense. I saw RM's post game interview and he admitted that the mistake he made was moving away from what made us effective, which is having McCarthy/Barry as our DM's and not having all out attackers above them. Hope he learns from this and doesn't do it again. I saw a couple of posts about people ragging on Lukaku and his game. Did anyone take a moment to think that he picked up a knock very early into the game? I am not completely defending his performance by any means (if it was bothering him so much, he should've asked to come off but then again, we don't have too many attacking options other than Naisy) but maybe that knock prevented him from being completey effective and having a poor touch etc etc Overall, I continued mentioning that we needed to play better than we did against Sunderland to beat this team that had momentum and we didn't. This is a test of character for our lads as we haven't been playing at our best for a couple of games now but continued picking up wins. Will we shake this off and rise up for the next couple of big games starting this weekend or will we bottle the rest of the season? I believe we'll shake it off and come out with a rocket in our ass against Man U. COYB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kant Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Let's not forget the players were quite tired. I've read somewhere that McCarthy and Osman were having muscular issues and they were not fully fit. This team is a very good one, with a solid defense and a reliable pair of CMs, but it's not good enough to win every game when the opposition packs the box just yet. The 4 players upfront need to move the ball quicker when they have more space, instead of packing their own final third with attackers, overlapping fullbacks and only one striker in the box against 2 CBs. Unless you have a team that is as good as the good Barcelona was (see 2009 version), with an exquisite one-touch tiki-taka that allows the team to open very packed spaces, you'll get nothing from it. The team looks awesome with spaces and counter-attacking because they can run fast with the ball, they are all quite quick and good at dribbling. But the forwards are not good enough at basic one-twos in close spaces. Lukaku does not have the close control required, Deulofeu and Mirallas lack the vision and Naismith, while sometimes able to do it, is usually not precise enough. I hope that RM realises this team is quite a good one to play faster football (like another team we all know), or that he needs a new set of winger forwards to match what he wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 17, 2014 Report Share Posted April 17, 2014 Let's not forget the players were quite tired. I've read somewhere that McCarthy and Osman were having muscular issues and they were not fully fit. This team is a very good one, with a solid defense and a reliable pair of CMs, but it's not good enough to win every game when the opposition packs the box just yet. The 4 players upfront need to move the ball quicker when they have more space, instead of packing their own final third with attackers, overlapping fullbacks and only one striker in the box against 2 CBs. Unless you have a team that is as good as the good Barcelona was (see 2009 version), with an exquisite one-touch tiki-taka that allows the team to open very packed spaces, you'll get nothing from it. The team looks awesome with spaces and counter-attacking because they can run fast with the ball, they are all quite quick and good at dribbling. But the forwards are not good enough at basic one-twos in close spaces. Lukaku does not have the close control required, Deulofeu and Mirallas lack the vision and Naismith, while sometimes able to do it, is usually not precise enough. I hope that RM realises this team is quite a good one to play faster football (like another team we all know), or that he needs a new set of winger forwards to match what he wants. Your quite correct McCarthy not starting wasn't a tactical decision he was indeed carrying a muscle injury The eleven that were selected should have had enough about them to get a result but we totally bottled it Palace wanted it more and were physically stronger in every department Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearso Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 [*]I saw a couple of posts about people ragging on Lukaku and his game. Did anyone take a moment to think that he picked up a knock very early into the game? I am not completely defending his performance by any means (if it was bothering him so much, he should've asked to come off but then again, we don't have too many attacking options other than Naisy) but maybe that knock prevented him from being completey effective and having a poor touch etc etc If you're referring to the one that had him down on his haunches for a few minutes, he just took a hit in the jatz crackers. The commentators were going about how he took a knock as well but the replay showed he just copped it in the nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 Bailey, I don't know how you get away with it at times. He got the lineup completely wrong! Hence the defeat and awful performance. McCarthy should have played. Either Mcgeady or Deulofeu on the bench. After timing at its best really, especially considering that you have been the one calling for McCarthy to be dropped for Barkley in exactly these type of games. We didnt lose the game through the starting 11, we lost the game by not taking our chances and allowing Palace to take theirs. Not sure about the criticism of Howard, the Puncheon and Jerome's finishes were clinical and perfectly placed, they took paint off the posts as the went in. The header, well what is he supposed to do in that situation? Some very frustrating things surfaced from todays game: - Martinez still seems to struggle to have an answer for teams packing the box. Palace did this exact thing at Selhurst Park, except this time they picked up goals as well. I'm not having a go at Martinez, it's just become pretty blatant to me at the moment that with our squad he hasn't found the best way to combat a team sitting back. We look boss countering teams, but when we build up from the back and pressure teams we're toothless in the final third. - We may as well just give our corner kicks to the opposition to take as goal kicks. We are so, so, so bad at getting a decent head on the ball to challenge the keeper. The last time I can recall us scoring directly from a corner (Naismith's deflected effort recently doesn't count) was Lukaku's header at Gladys Street end against Liverpool. That was like 6 months ago now. I don't think the race for fourth is over. I have no doubt Arsenal will drop points in their last four games, so it's up to the blues to get as many points as they can to keep the pressure on Arsenal. They can start by bending Moyes over and embarrassing him at a hostile Goodison Park on Sunday. Howard definitely deserves some criticism tbh. Looking back at the goals, he is far too slow to react to the first, the second he doesnt move his feet and even the 3rd he might have been able to stop on another day. If Robles had played that game everyone would be up in arms. You say Martinez struggles to break down teams with 10 men behind the ball but I think you will find a lot of teams struggle to win games against teams like that. Barca struggled at Celtic a couple years back and their is a far greater difference in ability between those two teams that their were on Weds night. Dont forget we pretty much got 4th place under Moyes by doing the exact same thing. We actually did pretty well to score two goals and create enough chances to win the game. The way we lost the game was by conceeding 3 sloppy goals from 4 Palace attacks. Regarding corners, we were no better under Moyes towards the end of his tenure (scoring wise). We have had chances (even Lukaku got on the end of one wednesday and should have done better) but I do agree that it is such an important part of the game that we have to be a little creative and work on more set moves. I dont really know what is happening defensively at corners because each time it is someone losing their man. You can work on them as much as you like in training but if an individual switches off and the delivery is right, there isnt much Martinez can do about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badaids Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 I had a sense of foreboding when I was that McCarthy wasn’t playing that we’d fuck this one up. We were poor, but fair play to Palace, and we must remember that since Pulis has taken over, they’ve actually turned into a pretty effective side. Whether McCarthy is injured or not aside, RM got it wrong tonight, but we are still in with a chance of CL football because he has got it so right for most of this season. I too would have laughed if you had told my that we would be pushing hard for 4th place at the fag end of the season. The players did look fucking knackered in the match. Here’s hoping that we stuff Man United. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londoner Posted April 18, 2014 Report Share Posted April 18, 2014 Only got back from your nice city this afternoon (good beer, nice ppl and 3 points (as I wanted)) Whay a great day (few) as a Palace fan, I think I mentioned Mile Jedinak ( Squawka Football @Squawka 2h Mile Jedinak has made 128 interceptions in the league this season, that's 20 more than any other player across Europe's top five leagues.) I said he would fill that hole, you had the better of the ball, but as a few on here have said, no point crossing it without looking up or getting players in the box, thanks for more or less making sure we stay up, I hope you beat Arsenal to 4th spot, at least your fans try to sing unlike the "Library" in North London, thought the atmosphere could have been better (from your point of view) but I think the occasion & nerves got to you more than us, it was a no lose game for us (we expected to get nothing from you) as we will against Man City & our last home game vs Liverp**l, we may yet to have a big say who wins the title, anyway wish you all well, great City & people and I WILL be back next season pete0 and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 ...and I WILL be back next season Just don't expect the same result. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 http://footyscene.com/smell-football-david-downie/ Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 Dunc - do you think that's a fair assessment? While some have written that Martinez is doing well because he's benefiting from what Moyes left, this article concludes that the team fails in the spotlight because Moyes left a legacy of fear. Maybe both statements are true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 Dunc - do you think that's a fair assessment? While some have written that Martinez is doing well because he's benefiting from what Moyes left, this article concludes that the team fails in the spotlight because Moyes left a legacy of fear. Maybe both statements are true. It's plausible. As the article says most of the squad are Moyse players and they played under him for a long time so it's entirely possible that he has left a lasting influence on them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nikica Posted April 19, 2014 Report Share Posted April 19, 2014 It's plausible. As the article says most of the squad are Moyse players and they played under him for a long time so it's entirely possible that he has left a lasting influence on them That 'influence' hasn't been noticeable in your style of play for the majority of the season. This just seems like a way to glorify Moyes. You expect that from the Man United media machine, but not on here. He's an average manager who has outdated, archaic views about football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 20, 2014 Report Share Posted April 20, 2014 That 'influence' hasn't been noticeable in your style of play for the majority of the season. This just seems like a way to glorify Moyes. You expect that from the Man United media machine, but not on here. He's an average manager who has outdated, archaic views about football. How exactly is blaming Moyes' negativity for a defeat long after he has gone glorifying him? Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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