US Politics/Biden Presidency (Trump-free zone)

[Sibdane]

3 minutes ago, MikeO said:

Very possible, he'll claim the vote was rigged.

The best thing that could happen would be for Trump to lose by a landslide. If it's anywhere near close we're going to have some issues. 

[Matt]

Biden is spineless. His ineptitude is nearly as scary as Trump staying on. 

[Sibdane]

39 minutes ago, Matt said:

Biden is spineless. His ineptitude is nearly as scary as Trump staying on. 

I also have more confidence in Biden surrounding himself with better people than Trump. Not that I like Biden, just saying. 

[Matt]

41 minutes ago, Sibdane said:

I also have more confidence in Biden surrounding himself with better people than Trump. Not that I like Biden, just saying. 

Honestly I don’t see it. He’s playing a blatant game and fucking up the basics. If he gets to choose his peers, they’ll be in it for themselves just like the spineless republicans who are propping the tangerine thundercunt who’s currently in “control” 

[markjazzbassist]

23 minutes ago, Matt said:

Honestly I don’t see it. He’s playing a blatant game and fucking up the basics. If he gets to choose his peers, they’ll be in it for themselves just like the spineless republicans who are propping the tangerine thundercunt who’s currently in “control” 

You know nothing about Biden then.  He’s a career politician from a poor rust belt city that is a shadow of what it used to be (a steel town).  He grew up blue collar working class and has worked in the senate for decades.  I’m not his biggest fan but I will give him respect on 3 fronts.  He knows politics and how the government works inside and out and can actually get stuff done.  To that effect he has worked with republicans before and was best buds with John McCain and other repubs.  Lastly, he is not overly selfish ala Trump where he would seek to improve himself.  This is a guy that can work with moderate Republicans and has the legacy of Obama with him.  He’s not ghandi or Jesus no, but he’s better than trump full stop.

[Palfy]

2 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

but he’s better than trump full stop.

That’s not hard, who isn’t

[Sibdane]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

That’s not hard, who isn’t

Palfy gets it! 

[Elston Gunnn]

15 hours ago, Matt said:

Biden is spineless. His ineptitude is nearly as scary as Trump staying on. 

Matt, I don’t agree with you at all here.  I genuinely hope to begin to persuade you — right now, in this post — that there is no comparison whatsoever between these 2 men, in terms of character and political ability.

Trump’s election was largely an historical fluke.  It took a “perfect storm” combination of underlying, contextual, and campaign incidents for Trump to win.  It wasn’t one thing, it was many.  I won’t here detail the dozen or more factors.  Suffice it to say that Trump’s accession  to the American presidency through the electoral college was a world historical mistake — repeat: World Historical Mistake — of enormous consequences, both for Americans and people nearly the world over.  Those consequences are now magnified by his total incompetence to deal with the pandemic.

Among other things — the list below is nowhere near complete — Trump is:

1. A sociopath.  This is the single most important thing to understand about him.  Not quite more important than all his other truly despicable characteristics combined, but the most important single thing.  He is incapable of normal human empathy.  He is incapable of admitting error.  He is incapable of accepting responsibility.  He lacks a conscience, and thus cannot feel guilt, shame, or remorse.  He has an insatiable need to dominate others.  He is delusional.

2. An extreme narcissist, totally self-absorbed and self-obsessed.  Every waking minute of every day.

3. A pathological liar.  He lies outrageously and matter-of-factly, every day.

4. Uninformed, lazy, and utterly uninterested in becoming informed about our Constitution, laws, political system.  He does not read, will not read even pared-down papers on essential matters.  He is not interested in learning about much of anything.

5. A scofflaw.  He does not believe in the western world’s classical liberal (and therefore practically conservative) tradition of the rule of law.  He knows absolutely nothing of this tradition.  

6. A cheat.  He has cheated people — banks, associates, workers — all his adult life.  As a failed businessman — with a “reality TV” reputation as a brilliantly successful businessman — he has defaulted on loans over and over and over.  He was “mentored” as a rising young man in New York by a vicious mob-thug named Roy Cohn (who was 2 decades earlier Joe McCarthy’s right-hand man).  A couple of years ago Trump famously moaned, “Where’s my Roy Cohn?”  He has found his modern Roy Cohn in none other than his Attorney General, William Barr.  We now witness the astounding spectacle of the chief law enforcement officer of the US acting as a cultural warrior/mob-enforcer for a man who has neither understanding of nor respect for the law.

7. A racist.  Trump was a leading proponent of “Birtherism,” re Obama’s place of birth.  He offers up “dog whistles” regularly, the latest of which is his planned rally on June 19 in Tulsa.  Both that date and that place resonate with powerful racial memories.  For good reason, racists around the world think he’s one of them.

8. A fascist.  He ran a fascist-themed campaign in 2016.  Including: great nation in historical decline, national humiliation, fear of insidious Others (e.g., immigrants, Muslims), national rebirth project led by a strongman-leader.  For good reason, fascists and neo-Nazis think he’s one of them.

9. An incompetent phony.  He wants to play being the President.  After more than 3 years in office, he has little idea of what leading entails.

10. An emotional toddler.  We already know this from several inside accounts of his presidency.  (Heck, we see it daily in his tweets.)  We will learn more once he leaves office, in multiple forthcoming accounts of how multitudes of White House staff tried to anticipate and mollify his daily tantrums.

11. The list goes on and on.....

By contrast, Joe Biden.  Biden is neither spineless nor inept.  His greatest flaw is not a matter of character, but of personality.  He’s sometimes an embarrassing “foot-in-motor-mouth,” unable to shut up.  His gaffes are many.  He screws up, says dumb, awkward things.  Famously, or if you prefer, infamously so.

But he’s knowledgeable, competent, fair-minded, personable, empathic, genuinely warm-hearted.

To be clear, I so wish he were not the Democratic nominee.  His floundering campaign was rescued by a single, influential black leader from South Carolina, and then propelled, near miraculously, by black voters in that state’s primary.  Biden lucked out because of our strange, front-loaded primary system.  I think very few Democrats think he’s best equipped to defeat Trump.  But we’re stuck with him.

His foot-in-motor-mouth makes him, occasionally, seem inept, but he’s actually been an often-effective Senator for decades, works easily with colleagues across most of the political spectrum, has few enemies.  Few, if any, of them think him spineless.

Indeed, in terms of character, personality, knowledge, experience, competence, stability, and trustworthiness, one could hardly find a more thoroughgoing contrast to that cretinous slug, our calamitous World Historical Mistake.

[Matt]

I’m happy to be proven wrong lads. He just seems very opportunistic based on his latest actions.  

[markjazzbassist]

4 hours ago, Matt said:

I’m happy to be proven wrong lads. He just seems very opportunistic based on his latest actions.  

not at all he's always been very popular with blacks because he was obama's VP for 8 years and he and Obama were/are genuine friends.  The tabloids churned out bromance stories during their time in the white house.  He has always had strong support from blacks.  He was pretty much always going to choose a black woman as his VP.  Where he is weak is with Latinos and women, which Bernie and Warren were strong with.  He needs to win over the suburban mothers, i think the latinos will give him their vote over trump, the issue is they might not be as motivated to vote for him as they would bernie.

[Matt]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53118721
 

will be interesting to hear what comes from the walrus. 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Matt said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53118721
 

will be interesting to hear what comes from the walrus. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53089609
 

Number 5, called it as soon as he was announced the “winner”

[Matt]

US President Donald Trump has told a rally in Oklahoma that he asked officials to slow down testing for coronavirus because so many cases were being detected in the country.

"Here is the bad part: When you do testing to that extent, you are going to find more people, you will find more cases," he told the cheering crowd. "So I said 'slow the testing down'. They test and they test."

 

what’s the term for that kind of reasoning other than utterly stupid?

[Palfy]

He is a 100% dickhead, and I don’t wish to say what the cheering lambs to slaughter are, for fear of upsetting our American friends who far from being what they and he is. 

[Sibdane]

It drives me crazy seeing the cheers and applause he got last night after every ridiculous statement he made. It really is a cult, and I don’t understand it at all. 

[Elston Gunnn]

On 21/06/2020 at 10:07, Sibdane said:

It drives me crazy seeing the cheers and applause he got last night after every ridiculous statement he made. It really is a cult, and I don’t understand it at all. 

Your word “cult” is appropriate.  I have no expertise in explaining cult mindsets, but it strikes me as ironic that Trump supporters claim that Trump opponents are afflicted with “Trump Derangement Syndrome.”  By which they mean, Trump just drives his opponents crazy.  The irony is that, by multiple objective measures, it is Trump supporters themselves who suffer from actual “Trump Derangement Syndrome.”  Trump’s most avid, boisterous supporters are deranged, militant members of a Trump cult.  The most extreme of the extreme are the nutty conspiracy theorists who advance the QAnon nonsense.  

My working motto, for some years now but especially these days, is: “Willful ignorance is dangerously stupid.”  Trump’s most avid supporters are willfully ignorant; e.g., like Trump, they refuse to “believe” expert medical and scientific evidence, and thus refuse to wear masks or socially distance.  Whenever a vaccine becomes available, many of them will refuse it.  Their willful ignorance is truly, literally, dangerously stupid.  Their cultish, willful ignorance endangers the rest of us.  If the scientific evidence says, “My mask protects you, and your mask protects me,” their smug, but dangerously stupid, response is “FU.”

Although relatively few Trump supporters wear masks, not quite all of them are necessarily totally committed to his reëlection.  Political and cultural commentators commonly refer to “Trump’s base,” but this is an oversimplification.  Understanding why this is too simplistic is one key to thinking about the 2020 election.  Trump’s “base” is actually 3, sometimes overlapping but nevertheless distinct, bases.  Think of a Venn diagram.

(1) White evangelical Christians.  I was raised in this tradition, but left it some years ago.  Their fealty to Trump is shocking, as he epitomizes values antithetical to historical, mainstream Christianity.  As one wag rhetorically asked, “Remind me, which of the Beatitudes does Mr. Trump exemplify?”  Many of Trump’s evangelical enthusiasts are sensible enough to be embarrassed by Trump, but they see him as useful to ending abortion and immigration.  In order to justify supporting a man whose character and personality are so patently un-Christian, they have glommed onto a psuedo-theory that “God uses awful men to advance His purposes.”  It’s pathetic, hypocritical, doesn’t pass the laugh test.  But they desperately need some justification, however ludicrous, for supporting someone whom they would otherwise be blasting non-stop.  Their hypocrisy is astounding.

(2) White working class.  Because neither of our 2 major parties has seriously addressed class issues such as decades-developing income inequality, these people were desperate enough in 2016 to vote for a vague slogan — Make America Great Again.  Millions of this group, too, harbor significant resentment over issues of “political correctness.”  Although Trump promised to help them economically — including building that wall to keep out economic competition from Mexicans — he has generally made things worse for them.

(3) Come-home-to-Trump-traditional-Republicans.  In the early stages (2015-early 2016) of Trump’s candidacy, most traditional Republicans didn’t take Trump seriously because, as various Republican candidates and leaders openly stated, he was a racist, homophobe, serial sexual predator, reality-tv charlatan, etc.  But as traditionalists were shocked to see Trump’s popularity rise among groups 1 and 2 above, they found themselves fretting that he might somehow win the nomination.  After many months of making fun of him, they shut up, voted for him as the lesser of two evils, assumed he’d lose, focused on the House and Senate.  His minority win via the electoral college stunned them.  They turned to the hope that a man they knew as a liar, narcissist, and fraud would “grow in office.”  The Presidency would surely make Trump presidential.  As Trump destroyed this hope (literally) day after day, month after month, Republican politicians — especially Republican Senators — have mostly withdrawn into their shells, avoiding reporters.  They fear Trump voters and value their own reëlection more than our Constitution, democratic norms, and the rule of law.  

An important, articulate minority of these longstanding Republicans, though, has become vocal in its criticism of the several ways in which Trump is destroying the Republican Party.  They are actual conservatives, as opposed to the conspiracy-theory mindset of the reactionary right-wingers who dominate the evangelicals.  They retain their self-respect, unlike Senate Republicans.  The most famous of these actual-conservative voices is the (wisely-named) Lincoln Project group, producing an ongoing series of maybe effective anti-Trump ads.  They’ve shown it’s pretty easy to ridicule a ridiculous fraud.

As to what all this means for the election of 2020, there is some evidence that Trump has lost support — at the margins — of 2 of his 3-part base.  To overgeneralize, in group 2, some elderly white folks think Trump’s handling of the pandemic is killing them, a few years before they’re ready to die.  And Trump’s pathological lying and daily displays of “manly” boorishness seem to have especially offended suburban white women, lots of them.

No way of knowing about the pandemic by next Fall.  Nor the economy.  Nor whether Biden will look competent.  Nor where Black Lives Matter/defund the police/Confederate flag issues will impact which states.  All indications are that in various swing states now under Republican control, voter suppression will be real.  It is commonly assumed, further, that Russia, China, maybe Iran, who knows who else, will attempt to hack our election.

Presumably Democrats will hope to run on decency/end the chaos/make America good again.  Trump will run on a revived economy (if it’s revived) and keeping America out of the clutches of atheistic communists (i.e., Democrats).

 

[Palfy]

What’s the truth in the Republican’s claims that the Democrats are the original confederate’s, responsible for trying to hold on to slavery during the Civil War, and they are the ones that fought to abolish it. 
I’ve read and heard this said by Trump supporters. 

[Matt]

49 minutes ago, Elston Gunnn said:

Your word “cult” is appropriate.  I have no expertise in explaining cult mindsets, but it strikes me as ironic that Trump supporters claim that Trump opponents are afflicted with “Trump Derangement Syndrome.”  By which they mean, Trump just drives his opponents crazy.  The irony is that, by multiple objective measures, it is Trump supporters themselves who suffer from actual “Trump Derangement Syndrome.”  Trump’s most avid, boisterous supporters are deranged, militant members of a Trump cult.  The most extreme of the extreme are the nutty conspiracy theorists who advance the QAnon nonsense.  

My working motto, for some years now but especially these days, is: “Willful ignorance is dangerously stupid.”  Trump’s most avid supporters are willfully ignorant; e.g., like Trump, they refuse to “believe” expert medical and scientific evidence, and thus refuse to wear masks or socially distance.  Whenever a vaccine becomes available, many of them will refuse it.  Their willful ignorance is truly, literally, dangerously stupid.  Their cultish, willful ignorance endangers the rest of us.  If the scientific evidence says, “My mask protects you, and your mask protects me,” their smug, but dangerously stupid, response is “FU.”

Although relatively few Trump supporters wear masks, not quite all of them are necessarily totally committed to his reëlection.  Political and cultural commentators commonly refer to “Trump’s base,” but this is an oversimplification.  Understanding why this is too simplistic is one key to thinking about the 2020 election.  Trump’s “base” is actually 3, sometimes overlapping but nevertheless distinct, bases.  Think of a Venn diagram.

(1) White evangelical Christians.  I was raised in this tradition, but left it some years ago.  Their fealty to Trump is shocking, as he epitomizes values antithetical to historical, mainstream Christianity.  As one wag rhetorically asked, “Remind me, which of the Beatitudes does Mr. Trump exemplify?”  Many of Trump’s evangelical enthusiasts are sensible enough to be embarrassed by Trump, but they see him as useful to ending abortion and immigration.  In order to justify supporting a man whose character and personality are so patently un-Christian, they have glommed onto a psuedo-theory that “God uses awful men to advance His purposes.”  It’s pathetic, hypocritical, doesn’t pass the laugh test.  But they desperately need some justification, however ludicrous, for supporting someone whom they would otherwise be blasting non-stop.  Their hypocrisy is astounding.

(2) White working class.  Because neither of our 2 major parties has seriously addressed class issues such as decades-developing income inequality, these people were desperate enough in 2016 to vote for a vague slogan — Make America Great Again.  Millions of this group, too, harbor significant resentment over issues of “political correctness.”  Although Trump promised to help them economically — including building that wall to keep out economic competition from Mexicans — he has generally made things worse for them.

(3) Come-home-to-Trump-traditional-Republicans.  In the early stages (2015-early 2016) of Trump’s candidacy, most traditional Republicans didn’t take Trump seriously because, as various Republican candidates and leaders openly stated, he was a racist, homophobe, serial sexual predator, reality-tv charlatan, etc.  But as traditionalists were shocked to see Trump’s popularity rise among groups 1 and 2 above, they found themselves fretting that he might somehow win the nomination.  After many months of making fun of him, they shut up, voted for him as the lesser of two evils, assumed he’d lose, focused on the House and Senate.  His minority win via the electoral college stunned them.  They turned to the hope that a man they knew as a liar, narcissist, and fraud would “grow in office.”  The Presidency would surely make Trump presidential.  As Trump destroyed this hope (literally) day after day, month after month, Republican politicians — especially Republican Senators — have mostly withdrawn into their shells, avoiding reporters.  They fear Trump voters and value their own reëlection more than our Constitution, democratic norms, and the rule of law.  

An important, articulate minority of these longstanding Republicans, though, has become vocal in its criticism of the several ways in which Trump is destroying the Republican Party.  They are actual conservatives, as opposed to the conspiracy-theory mindset of the reactionary right-wingers who dominate the evangelicals.  They retain their self-respect, unlike Senate Republicans.  The most famous of these actual-conservative voices is the (wisely-named) Lincoln Project group, producing an ongoing series of maybe effective anti-Trump ads.  They’ve shown it’s pretty easy to ridicule a ridiculous fraud.

As to what all this means for the election of 2020, there is some evidence that Trump has lost support — at the margins — of 2 of his 3-part base.  To overgeneralize, in group 2, some elderly white folks think Trump’s handling of the pandemic is killing them, a few years before they’re ready to die.  And Trump’s pathological lying and daily displays of “manly” boorishness seem to have especially offended suburban white women, lots of them.

No way of knowing about the pandemic by next Fall.  Nor the economy.  Nor whether Biden will look competent.  Nor where Black Lives Matter/defund the police/Confederate flag issues will impact which states.  All indications are that in various swing states now under Republican control, voter suppression will be real.  It is commonly assumed, further, that Russia, China, maybe Iran, who knows who else, will attempt to hack our election.

Presumably Democrats will hope to run on decency/end the chaos/make America good again.  Trump will run on a revived economy (if it’s revived) and keeping America out of the clutches of atheistic communists (i.e., Democrats).

 

Fucking yes. The most sense I’ve ever read  online. 

[Elston Gunnn]

10 minutes ago, Palfy said:

What’s the truth in the Republican’s claims that the Democrats are the original confederate’s, responsible for trying to hold on to slavery during the Civil War, and they are the ones that fought to abolish it. 
I’ve read and heard this said by Trump supporters. 

It’s accurate, but misleading.  I’d have to write a post as long as the one above to explain it fully, and nobody wants that!  So I’ll (try to) be brief.

Our 2 main political parties have essentially switched their conservative/liberal ideologies in the decades after the Civil War.  The Republican Party was founded in the 1850s as an antislavery (not quite the same as abolitionist) party.  The Democratic Party was, yes, a proslavery party.  Over the decades, into the 20th century, the Republicans became a more conservative, business-oriented party, and essentially allowed Southern Democrats to institutionalize Jim Crow segregation from the 1890s to the 1960s.

But Northern Democrats, especially under Franklin Roosevelt (1930s) became the party of labor, hence more liberal on some issues.  By the 1960s, Dems were full-on liberal, but with a segregationist wing in the South.  With the Civil Rights revolution, end of (legal) segregation, and black voting rights, Southern Dems gradually left the Dem party and became Republicans.

[Palfy]

9 minutes ago, Elston Gunnn said:

It’s accurate, but misleading.  I’d have to write a post as long as the one above to explain it fully, and nobody wants that!  So I’ll (try to) be brief.

Our 2 main political parties have essentially switched their conservative/liberal ideologies in the decades after the Civil War.  The Republican Party was founded in the 1850s as an antislavery (not quite the same as abolitionist) party.  The Democratic Party was, yes, a proslavery party.  Over the decades, into the 20th century, the Republicans became a more conservative, business-oriented party, and essentially allowed Southern Democrats to institutionalize Jim Crow segregation from the 1890s to the 1960s.

But Northern Democrats, especially under Franklin Roosevelt (1930s) became the party of labor, hence more liberal on some issues.  By the 1960s, Dems were full-on liberal, but with a segregationist wing in the South.  With the Civil Rights revolution, end of (legal) segregation, and black voting rights, Southern Dems gradually left the Dem party and became Republicans.

Thanks mate I get that, nearly 180 degree turn around.

That maybe because the shift in financial wealth shifted from the South to the North, or am I ready to much into what happened to the Southern states after the war. 

[Elston Gunnn]

15 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Thanks mate I get that, nearly 180 degree turn around.

That maybe because the shift in financial wealth shifted from the South to the North, or am I ready to much into what happened to the Southern states after the war. 

Yes, that’s part of the very gradual party transition.  The South was left behind economically for more than a hundred years.  Lost the war, economically and physically devastated, etc.  As the Republican Party became the “party of business,” it abandoned its black voters in the South to their horrible new fate — segregation, lynching, disfranchisement, various forms of terrorism and subjugation.  Northern Dems still needed white Southern Dem votes in Congress, and so until the 1950s-60s did not regularly or forcefully demand that discrimination be ended.  Truly shameful, both parties, really.

But a full-on liberal Dem party changed in the 1960s, to at least pass laws to end legal discrimination.  Over the last 50 years, Southern whites left the Dem Party and became Repubs.  Southern blacks are overwhelmingly Dems — yes, the “party of slavery,” but 150 years ago.

So when current Repubs claim the legacy of Lincoln, they’re fudging 150 years of complicated history.  They’re stating a single, if important, fact, to tell a much more insidious lie about the next 150 years, and especially about 2020.

[Palfy]

2 minutes ago, Elston Gunnn said:

Yes, that’s part of the very gradual party transition.  The South was left behind economically for more than a hundred years.  Lost the war, economically and physically devastated, etc.  As the Republican Party became the “party of business,” it abandoned its black voters in the South to their horrible new fate — segregation, lynching, disfranchisement, various forms of terrorism and subjugation.  Northern Dems still needed white Southern Dem votes in Congress, and so until the 1950s-60s did not regularly or forcefully demand that discrimination be ended.  Truly shameful, both parties, really.

But a full-on liberal Dem party changed in the 1960s, to at least pass laws to end legal discrimination.  Over the last 50 years, Southern whites left the Dem Party and became Repubs.  Southern blacks are overwhelmingly Dems — yes, the “party of slavery,” but 150 years ago.

So when current Repubs claim the legacy of Lincoln, they’re fudging 150 years of complicated history.  They’re stating a single, if important, fact, to tell a much more insidious lie about the next 150 years, and especially about 2020.

Enjoyed reading your posts Elston very insightful mate. 

[Sibdane]

48 minutes ago, Elston Gunnn said:

Yes, that’s part of the very gradual party transition.  The South was left behind economically for more than a hundred years.  Lost the war, economically and physically devastated, etc.  As the Republican Party became the “party of business,” it abandoned its black voters in the South to their horrible new fate — segregation, lynching, disfranchisement, various forms of terrorism and subjugation.  Northern Dems still needed white Southern Dem votes in Congress, and so until the 1950s-60s did not regularly or forcefully demand that discrimination be ended.  Truly shameful, both parties, really.

But a full-on liberal Dem party changed in the 1960s, to at least pass laws to end legal discrimination.  Over the last 50 years, Southern whites left the Dem Party and became Repubs.  Southern blacks are overwhelmingly Dems — yes, the “party of slavery,” but 150 years ago.

So when current Repubs claim the legacy of Lincoln, they’re fudging 150 years of complicated history.  They’re stating a single, if important, fact, to tell a much more insidious lie about the next 150 years, and especially about 2020.

It's extremely annoying/frustrating when today's Republicans claim this.

[nutmegwolf203]

On 13/06/2020 at 07:00, Matt said:

I’m happy to be proven wrong lads. He just seems very opportunistic based on his latest actions.  

Thanks for mentioning this Matt. Biden is most certainly opportunistic. He's been pandering to Black voters since he was in the White House and from my perspective his appointment as a VP was an effort to bring more moderate white voters over to the Obama campaign. Biden is a liberal good ol boy; but once again the lesser of two evils in a political race.

On 13/06/2020 at 11:04, markjazzbassist said:

not at all he's always been very popular with blacks because he was obama's VP for 8 years and he and Obama were/are genuine friends.  The tabloids churned out bromance stories during their time in the white house.  He has always had strong support from blacks.  He was pretty much always going to choose a black woman as his VP.  Where he is weak is with Latinos and women, which Bernie and Warren were strong with.  He needs to win over the suburban mothers, i think the latinos will give him their vote over trump, the issue is they might not be as motivated to vote for him as they would bernie.

He's riding his proximity to Obama//blackness in the same way that de Blasio used his family as talking points during his mayoral campaign or the way Bloomberg tried to downplay his very intentional implementation of stop & frisk policies during his own tenure. These men are entrepreneurs first and their idea of success almost always involves someone else losing. 

 

[markjazzbassist]

8 hours ago, nutmegwolf203 said:

Thanks for mentioning this Matt. Biden is most certainly opportunistic. He's been pandering to Black voters since he was in the White House and from my perspective his appointment as a VP was an effort to bring more moderate white voters over to the Obama campaign. Biden is a liberal good ol boy; but once again the lesser of two evils in a political race.

He's riding his proximity to Obama//blackness in the same way that de Blasio used his family as talking points during his mayoral campaign or the way Bloomberg tried to downplay his very intentional implementation of stop & frisk policies during his own tenure. These men are entrepreneurs first and their idea of success almost always involves someone else losing. 

 

no doubt.  but the frustration i have is with my minority friends (read black) who are saying biden isn't good enough so they are just gonna vote for ________ or not vote at all.  which is throwing away a vote.  it's something i've noticed of many minorities.  the blacks turned out bigtime for Obama, but when it's the lesser of 2 evils (read white) they dont' show up.  The latinos similarly aren't very motivated unless it's texas and it's one of their own running.  while i appreciate everyone can vote however they want.  it upsets me a bit.  the conservatives always come together around the repub candidate (see trump win, etc), but for some reason the "dem" voters feel like "lesser of two evils" is beneath them so they either don't vote or vote for someone else (mickey mouse, the rock, etc).  this pisses me off.  i get that biden is not white, he's not a great candidate, yeah i get that.  but FFS he's a hell of a lot better than Trump!  especially for minorities!  For starters he condemns white supremacists, something Trump just will not do.  It just pisses me off, because if the latinos and blacks would vote this country would never go repub ever again.  then we could start working on getting more minorities on the tickets and in goverment period.  instead we yo-yo back and forth with the dem/repub and the country is stuck in 1955 socially and culturally.  it's a fucking travesty.  and yes i understand there are barriers to voting for blacks and latinos, i'm not obtuse, but if the ones that weren't being impeded would actually vote i think we could get somewhere.  mobilizing the vote is the way forward for me, not trying to win demographics.  usa usually is some pitiful 33% or something vote.  FFS people get out and vote!  stop the social media BS and fucking vote.  instead i get people telling me at parties and the like how they feel politically and i ask "do you vote" and i get some BS reason for no.  honestly i'm getting fed up with the excuses,  you want change?  then vote.

 

apologies as i am a few sheets to the wind right now.  i will revisit upon sobriety

[dunlopp9987]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election/trump-2020-us-election-drop-out-fox-news-republican-a9592036.html?utm_source=reddit.com

OH PLEASE OH PLEASE OH PLEASE

 

[Matt]

7 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election/trump-2020-us-election-drop-out-fox-news-republican-a9592036.html?utm_source=reddit.com

OH PLEASE OH PLEASE OH PLEASE

 

Don’t rely on anything this site posts. Growing up it was something to be trusted but it’s become a Fox News for the left 

when I get to a computer I’ll explain why I’m scared by opportunistic  

[pete0]

 

[MikeO]

Checking this https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president on a daily basis now. Current position according to their figures is 343/195 win for Biden and a Biden win overall chance of 89%. I'm hoping it's an unbiased source, sure one of you yanks will put me right if not.

And I know polls are unreliable and he wasn't expected to win last time but I need hope.

[Sibdane]

1 hour ago, MikeO said:

Checking this https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president on a daily basis now. Current position according to their figures is 343/195 win for Biden and a Biden win overall chance of 89%. I'm hoping it's an unbiased source, sure one of you yanks will put me right if not.

And I know polls are unreliable and he wasn't expected to win last time but I need hope.

It's not looking good for him. His responses to COVID-19 and the BLM/Defund Police movement hasn't been received well. It doesn't help him that the economy isn't doing as well as he claimed it would be at this time.