US Politics/Biden Presidency (Trump-free zone)

[MikeO]

Are Americans beginning to wise up? Is there a stand-out Democrat alternative for the next election?

[Sibdane]

52 minutes ago, MikeO said:

Are Americans beginning to wise up? Is there a stand-out Democrat alternative for the next election?

It's looking pretty bleak for him. The Market is dropping points every day, and the government shutdown won't help with that at all.

[markjazzbassist]

government is about to shutdown, his whole cabinet has been fired/resigned except 2 members, and the economy is on the verge of a recession.  the democrats meanwhile have apparently 20 people trying to vie for the spot, it will be a shit show

[Matt]

Isn’t this like the third time things have come to a halt under him? Pretty sure I remember reading him saying that I’d never happen under him and that it was just planning by the Democrats. 

[markjazzbassist]

18 minutes ago, Matt said:

Isn’t this like the third time things have come to a halt under him? Pretty sure I remember reading him saying that I’d never happen under him and that it was just planning by the Democrats. 

there's never been a shutdown under his watch, they always passed it and he gave it.  the house is going to go to democrat control come jan 1 so he knows this is his last shot with the all repub house and senate hence him pushing this issue.  trouble is he can't do math, you need 60 votes in the senate to approve a bill, there is a simple majority 51 to 49.  no dems will vote yes, so it's dead in the water in the senate.  he will try to put it on them but they will just say hey everyone (repubs included) already passed it and you said you wouldn't sign it (the bill with no border wall), it's on you.

 

come january he's fucked because he will have to work with a split congress and that means compromise, i expect him to do a whole lot of nothing.

[Matt]

10 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

there's never been a shutdown under his watch, they always passed it and he gave it.  the house is going to go to democrat control come jan 1 so he knows this is his last shot with the all repub house and senate hence him pushing this issue.  trouble is he can't do math, you need 60 votes in the senate to approve a bill, there is a simple majority 51 to 49.  no dems will vote yes, so it's dead in the water in the senate.  he will try to put it on them but they will just say hey everyone (repubs included) already passed it and you said you wouldn't sign it (the bill with no border wall), it's on you.

 

come january he's fucked because he will have to work with a split congress and that means compromise, i expect him to do a whole lot of nothing.

Could’ve sworn there was a shutdown because of budget or something. Anyway, fuck him 

[MikeO]

12 minutes ago, Matt said:

Could’ve sworn there was a shutdown because of budget or something. Anyway, fuck him 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_government_shutdowns_of_2018

[markjazzbassist]

matt you are right, thank mike.  sorry i was wrong.  trump loves the shutdowns because he thinks they will flinch and use it as a negotiation technique.  conservatives love them too because they just hate the government full stop.

[Palfy]

39 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

matt you are right, thank mike.  sorry i was wrong.  trump loves the shutdowns because he thinks they will flinch and use it as a negotiation technique.  conservatives love them too because they just hate the government full stop.

Who is likely to run for the democrats and do they have a chance of being in the hearts of the American people, also can another Republican run for the nomination against Trump and if so is there anyone who could take him on, or do we just need to brace ourselves for another term.

[markjazzbassist]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Who is likely to run for the democrats and do they have a chance of being in the hearts of the American people, also can another Republican run for the nomination against Trump and if so is there anyone who could take him on, or do we just need to brace ourselves for another term.

democrats - bernie sanders, joe biden (obamas VP), and then a bunch of up and comers.  no idea if they will win americas hearts, the party is ran by hillary types so they will want more of a neo-liberal centrist type candidate which sucks.  they screwed with sanders last election after all.  i don't have a whole lot of hope.

 

repubs - yes someone can run against him, the party won't allow it i don't think but a couple guys have said they want to.  end of the day i don't think it will happen.  

[Chach]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/21/world/europe/russia-trump-foreign-policy.html

 

[Chach]

On 22/12/2018 at 03:38, markjazzbassist said:

democrats - bernie sanders, joe biden (obamas VP), and then a bunch of up and comers.  no idea if they will win americas hearts, the party is ran by hillary types so they will want more of a neo-liberal centrist type candidate which sucks.  they screwed with sanders last election after all.  i don't have a whole lot of hope.

 

repubs - yes someone can run against him, the party won't allow it i don't think but a couple guys have said they want to.  end of the day i don't think it will happen.  

I think Beto O'Rourke could be one to watch.

[Cornish Steve]

The situation described in this report is a total disgrace. Do people realize the extent to which the president rides roughshod over the law? The restraining influences in the administration are leaving, voluntarily or being fired, and now the president is looking to abandon the independence of the Federal Reserve Bank. We're reaching a dangerous tipping point.

https://www.newsweek.com/cage-congressman-citizen-migrants-border-teargas-1269621

[Chach]

"The judges concluded that while the complaints "are serious," there is no existing authority that allows lower court judges to investigate or discipline Supreme Court justices."

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/18/678004085/federal-panel-of-judges-dismiss-all-83-ethics-complaints-against-brett-kavanaugh?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=2048&fbclid=IwAR0lMwvJAwWmXVXeJArlh4sew7Xl6dirEcBJOqAtQgvjL74MK4ZpykeQTHI

 

[Palfy]

5 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

The situation described in this report is a total disgrace. Do people realize the extent to which the president rides roughshod over the law? The restraining influences in the administration are leaving, voluntarily or being fired, and now the president is looking to abandon the independence of the Federal Reserve Bank. We're reaching a dangerous tipping point.

https://www.newsweek.com/cage-congressman-citizen-migrants-border-teargas-1269621

He has all the hallmarks of a dictator, if he was around in the late 30s he would have formed an alliance with Hitler. 

[markjazzbassist]

4 hours ago, Chach said:

"The judges concluded that while the complaints "are serious," there is no existing authority that allows lower court judges to investigate or discipline Supreme Court justices."

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/18/678004085/federal-panel-of-judges-dismiss-all-83-ethics-complaints-against-brett-kavanaugh?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=2048&fbclid=IwAR0lMwvJAwWmXVXeJArlh4sew7Xl6dirEcBJOqAtQgvjL74MK4ZpykeQTHI

 

It’s an old boys and girls club.  Look it up and you will see every one of them went to Yale or Harvard law.  

[MikeO]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46703535

If he can "..close the border.." without one why does he need a wall in the first place?

[Cornish Steve]

On 23/12/2018 at 05:34, Palfy said:

He has all the hallmarks of a dictator, if he was around in the late 30s he would have formed an alliance with Hitler. 

People think I'm overreacting, and maybe I am, but I do believe we're closer to experiencing a dictator than we realize. With just a few strategic decisions (pardoning any family or supporters who are indicted as a result of ongoing probes, appointing more and more "friendly" judges, and finding a way to limit the power of Congress), the president could assume something close to absolute power. His supporters would rally in the streets and, with so many guns in this country, wreak havoc. So far, the American system has reined him in, but he's going to push the limits as much as he can. In the end, especially if he can manufacture a crisis, he'll get away with it in the name of patriotism/nationalism, "traditional values", "the need for national security", and "getting things done".

Sadly, more of the world is beginning to embrace so-called strongmen (see India, for example), and they are becoming too paly-paly (Trump, Putin, Erdogan, etc.). This is a lesson of history we just never learn.

[Sibdane]

5 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

People think I'm overreacting, and maybe I am, but I do believe we're closer to experiencing a dictator than we realize. With just a few strategic decisions (pardoning any family or supporters who are indicted as a result of ongoing probes, appointing more and more "friendly" judges, and finding a way to limit the power of Congress), the president could assume something close to absolute power. His supporters would rally in the streets and, with so many guns in this country, wreak havoc. So far, the American system has reined him in, but he's going to push the limits as much as he can. In the end, especially if he can manufacture a crisis, he'll get away with it in the name of patriotism/nationalism, "traditional values", "the need for national security", and "getting things done".

Sadly, more of the world is beginning to embrace so-called strongmen (see India, for example), and they are becoming too paly-paly (Trump, Putin, Erdogan, etc.). This is a lesson of history we just never learn.

I wish I could say you're over-reacting. I really do.

[Chach]

 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-elizabeth-warren-running-for-president-2020-rubin-0102-20181231-story,amp.html

[Sibdane]

4 hours ago, Chach said:

 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-elizabeth-warren-running-for-president-2020-rubin-0102-20181231-story,amp.html

I don't think she has a chance, but it's probably smart on her part to announce it early. 

Anyone is better than Trump at this point though. 

[markjazzbassist]

Agreed she has no chance.  The Native American heritage thing backfired and ruined her.

[Sibdane]

5 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Agreed she has no chance.  The Native American heritage thing backfired and ruined her.

I don't even think that's it... she's just an uninspiring candidate, and she's too far left to appeal to moderates. 

[johnh]

On 13/11/2018 at 20:22, holystove said:

I am amazed at how long Macron got away with calling Trump an idiot in public (at the UN, Rememberance day, ...).  Seems Trump finally snapped; will be a huge boost for Macron in France.

Don't know why, when I clicked on the Trump thread, it put me in at this post?  However, in passing, if there was a boost in Macron's rating then it didn't last long.  I see that it is currently down to 31% which is lower than Hollande at his worst.

[Chach]

7 hours ago, sibdane said:

I don't even think that's it... she's just an uninspiring candidate, and she's too far left to appeal to moderates. 

If right wing populism that arguably has delivered nothing to the swinging voters who gave Trump the electoral college can mobilise votes, I would argue that left wing populism can do the same.

Keep in mind that Trumps numbers were pathetic, the Dems just failed to get people into the polling booths.

 

 

[markjazzbassist]

35 minutes ago, Chach said:

If right wing populism that arguably has delivered nothing to the swinging voters who gave Trump the electoral college can mobilise votes, I would argue that left wing populism can do the same.

Keep in mind that Trumps numbers were pathetic, the Dems just failed to get people into the polling booths.

 

 

I agree completely with the premise but besides my family all my relatives are conservatives and trump people. I would not say he has delivered nothing.  If anything he has delivered everything.  He’s validated hate speech and racism, he’s validated anti immigrant behavior and made that ok, he’s validated a tabloid news organization that was considered a joke (the one they all watch, Fox) and made it his mouthpiece, he’s victimized the democrats and called them un American, he has made nationalism the only way saying if you’re not nationalist your un American.  

 

All the twisted shit they thought he validates and supports and goes even further.  He will sweep the next election, vault me on it.  Middle class whites have gone trump, minorities don’t vote, there’s not enough intellectuals and liberals to cover the massive baby boomer conservative vote in the states where it counts.

 

yes I’m pessimistic, yes I’m down on left wing politics, yes I think Americans are majority stupid and racist and selfish.

[Chach]

1 hour ago, markjazzbassist said:

I agree completely with the premise but besides my family all my relatives are conservatives and trump people. I would not say he has delivered nothing.  If anything he has delivered everything.  He’s validated hate speech and racism, he’s validated anti immigrant behavior and made that ok, he’s validated a tabloid news organization that was considered a joke (the one they all watch, Fox) and made it his mouthpiece, he’s victimized the democrats and called them un American, he has made nationalism the only way saying if you’re not nationalist your un American.  

All the twisted shit they thought he validates and supports and goes even further.  He will sweep the next election, vault me on it.  Middle class whites have gone trump, minorities don’t vote, there’s not enough intellectuals and liberals to cover the massive baby boomer conservative vote in the states where it counts.

yes I’m pessimistic, yes I’m down on left wing politics, yes I think Americans are majority stupid and racist and selfish.

I can't comment on your personal situation but the Trump presidency for me is going to pay dividends for liberalism in the medium to long term

For the first time in a long time, I'm listening to and agreeing with  conservatives (real ones with a thought out conservative position) and liberals and conservatives are talking to each other which is why I think a centrist like Beto O'Rourke or Cory Brooker is the best chance to knock Trump off his perch. Warren and Sanders can play an important role and move the policy conversation to the left but I don't think they can win. I could change my mind though.

Interesting to see a lot of smear already going out about O'Rourke and his voting record which leads me to believe someone is very nervous about his potential. 

 

Edit: With regards to the bolded, Obama won twice so stupid racist and selfish would have to be in the minority

[markjazzbassist]

20 minutes ago, Chach said:

I can't comment on your personal situation but the Trump presidency for me is going to pay dividends for liberalism in the medium to long term

For the first time in a long time, I'm listening to and agreeing with  conservatives (real ones with a thought out conservative position) and liberals and conservatives are talking to each other which is why I think a centrist like Beto O'Rourke or Cory Brooker is the best chance to knock Trump off his perch. Warren and Sanders can play an important role and move the policy conversation to the left but I don't think they can win. I could change my mind though.

Interesting to see a lot of smear already going out about O'Rourke and his voting record which leads me to believe someone is very nervous about his potential. 

 

Edit: With regards to the bolded, Obama won twice so stupid racist and selfish would have to be in the minority

I really hope you are right man, my view of this country is not great at this moment in time.

[Sibdane]

4 hours ago, Chach said:

I can't comment on your personal situation but the Trump presidency for me is going to pay dividends for liberalism in the medium to long term

For the first time in a long time, I'm listening to and agreeing with  conservatives (real ones with a thought out conservative position) and liberals and conservatives are talking to each other which is why I think a centrist like Beto O'Rourke or Cory Brooker is the best chance to knock Trump off his perch. Warren and Sanders can play an important role and move the policy conversation to the left but I don't think they can win. I could change my mind though.

Interesting to see a lot of smear already going out about O'Rourke and his voting record which leads me to believe someone is very nervous about his potential. 

 

Edit: With regards to the bolded, Obama won twice so stupid racist and selfish would have to be in the minority

I think O'Rourke would be the best candidate. He was so close to winning Texas, which as a Democrat is a huge statement. If he decides to run then he would he my early first choice. I honestly think he'd be for us like Trudeau is for Canada. 

[MikeO]

Mind blowing this...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-46757179

Another woman in the university video is wearing a t-shirt with, "What will your legacy be?" on it. That's a question that a lot of Americans (along with billions of others Worldwide) need to be looking in the mirror and asking themselves at this point in history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=65&v=Qj2Xald7NYQ

Edit: Reading up on the lady I like her a lot!