nogs Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Big difference between an excuse and a reason. And quote me where I said that...i dare you to try. Let me let you off, as you won't even try because you know I didn't. I love this team and for 75 minutes I thought we were in control. The manager had made good decisions that were paying off. I thought bringing Besic on was a good desicion. I also understood the Niasse sub. Lennon was goosed and we needed someone to run at them. Barry at 2-2. Agree. We were panicking and needed experience. It nearly payed off as we had a couple of good chances. We lost due to a player losing his head. Mirallas was not on the pitch when we conceded 3 in 12 minutes. Again. You said we have shit fans. I presumed you were referring to the fact that some people, myself included, were again voicing our frustration based on yet another capitulation, and lay it on the manager's head because we no longer have any faith in Martinez and see our continued run of poor results as stemming directly from his lack leadership, his tactical naivety and his apparent complete inability to set up a side to not concede from crosses. I love this club too. I don't think we have the right man managing us. I base that opinion on results. Not how well we play for 75 minutes, not on the promising, youthful squad we have. Just results. Because they are what matter in football. We should be competing for the top five or six every season, that is the benchmark our history and traditions demand, that is the expectation set under the last manager, regardless of people's opinions of him. Martinez is failing to meet those expectations, he is not good enough for this football club. That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Not having that today. Down to 10 changed the system got us to 2-0 up and missed a pen cost us. It can't be Martinez fault today however you look at it. Plus we should have had two more penalties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith B Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Roberto was actually great until the subs. He started an innovative side and had to adjust on the fly when Mirallas lost his mind. He shifted tactics at halftime and they worked...until he took of Lennon for a striker who's been with us maybe six weeks. Lennon is our most industrious player, why take him off for a striker? If Barry had come on for Lennon, I would have understood it. If Niasse would have come on for Lukaku after they leveled it, I would have understood it. But the way he did it was senseless. I would not have been happy with 2-2 or even 3-3, so I'm not all that broken up about dropping all three points. We are almost surely safe from relegation, so it's 3 points or bust for me from here on out. We have the quality to be in Europe but we are badly underachieving. It's not going to be satisfactory for me if we roll out a substantially similar squad next year with the same manager and expect different results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 It's not going to be satisfactory for me if we roll out a substantially similar squad next year with the same manager and expect different results. Exactly. I am far, far more frustrated and angry than I was last season because I saw that as a blip, part of the evolution under a new manager. I think we are now playing at our peak under him, everyone keeps talking about thr great football we play and I agree. But we don't win games. Worse, we throw victories away. It is an endemic problem. I cannot see any sense in crossing our fingers and hoping things will be fixed, if Martinez stays all the evidence is the same things will keep happening, because they do keep happening. Over and over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Mirallas was not on the pitch when we conceded 3 in 12 minutes. Again. You said we have shit fans. I presumed you were referring to the fact that some people, myself included, were again voicing our frustration based on yet another capitulation, and lay it on the manager's head because we no longer have any faith in Martinez and see our continued run of poor results as stemming directly from his lack leadership, his tactical naivety and his apparent complete inability to set up a side to not concede from crosses. I love this club too. I don't think we have the right man managing us. I base that opinion on results. Not how well we play for 75 minutes, not on the promising, youthful squad we have. Just results. Because they are what matter in football. We should be competing for the top five or six every season, that is the benchmark our history and traditions demand, that is the expectation set under the last manager, regardless of people's opinions of him. Martinez is failing to meet those expectations, he is not good enough for this football club. That is all. Good answer. I just feel different that's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Good answer. I just feel different that's all. And I accept that. I just don't get why because this is the worst I have felt as an Everton fan since Walter Smith was sending out Gazza and Ginola in their zimmerframes to try to stave off relegation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 And I accept that. I just don't get why because this is the worst I have felt as an Everton fan since Walter Smith was sending out Gazza and Ginola in their zimmerframes to try to stave off relegation! I feel like crying at this minute. I just think the game is built I'm such small margins that things could easily be a lot different. I agree that it can't just be a coincidence, we are where we are. But I really do think a good keeper and another creative player could turn our fortunes around completely. I'm just an eternal optimist.... Or just used of watching Everton and it's now become normal haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 We are maybe two good signings from seeing a huge improvement. I like Robles but I do think we need a big name international 'keeper. We also need a snide, nasty bastard to instil some fear on the pitch amongst our own players as well as theirs. There is no shortage of skill, it just needs properly managing by an on field leader imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 And those small margins often come down to mentality and nous. Winners make them work for them and win. Losers panic and concede three goals in 12 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 And those small margins often come down to mentality and nous. Winners make them work for them and win. Losers panic and concede three goals in 12 minutes. Exactly. chicagoblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted March 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 My thing is why bring on a striker, who is just getting up to speed in a new league, to help defend a lead for 25 minutes, while down to 10 men? And why bring him on for your hardest working two-way player? Bad decision. Of course, none of this would have mattered had Kev not played Greg Louganis then gone and looked like he was trying to prevent a double-play. Bow before my unabashedly American references!!! Spot on joe. For some strange reason RM loves to sub off the Motm. Happens to Lukaku and Gerry all the time when they are bossing. I loved the 343 and formation and starting tactics though and will gladly give RM his props for that. chicagoblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 We are maybe two good signings from seeing a huge improvement. I like Robles but I do think we need a big name international 'keeper. We also need a snide, nasty bastard to instil some fear on the pitch amongst our own players as well as theirs. There is no shortage of skill, it just needs properly managing by an on field leader imho.the day we give into being a snide, nasty team is the day I give up because that is not Everton Tomwin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 I think we need a winner in the middle of the park but how many are there in the modern game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 (edited) the day we give into being a snide, nasty team is the day I give up because that is not Everton Not saying we should be a snide, nasty team. But I do think we are missing one player of that ilk. A Don Hutchinson, Peter Reid type who can give those around him a kick up the arse when they need it. Edited March 5, 2016 by rusty747 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Great interview with bilic on sky sports. Interesting to hear him say how on paper we have one of the best teams in the prem. on paper? Wonder why we are not....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 We "showed an incredible tactical knowledge in the second half" apparently. Is that why we conceded 3 goals in 12 minutes? Is that why we brought a striker on instead of closing the game down? Get this man fucked off. Right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Summed up in a picture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Gutted. Must admit I swerved this game. Was a nice sunny day so took the family for a long overdue day out. But come KO, kept an eye on here and BBC app. I'm just gutted that this is happening again. Yeah, Mirallas was sent off. Yeah, Lukaku missed a penalty. Yeah, according to you guys, ref was aweful. But it's the same thing again. At Goodison Park...the Grand Lady. A once feared place for opponents. I dunno. It's just when you hear yourself saying the same thing over and over...it makes you question other things, doesn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Here's a stat for you - we've conceded the most home goals in the 5 top leagues in Europe. So despite Villa shipping 6 against the shite they've still conceded less than us. Just think about that for a moment... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Here's a stat for you - we've conceded the most home goals in the 5 top leagues in Europe. So despite Villa shipping 6 against the shite they've still conceded less than us. Just think about that for a moment... It's unacceptable. And yet people on here are still defending the cretin overseeing it. His position should be untenable by now, it shows how far expectations have fallen that we're putting up with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith B Posted March 5, 2016 Report Share Posted March 5, 2016 Still fuming, 5+ hours later. That match was ours on a silver platter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 nonsense. 2-0 isnt given up by a missed pen. There were no commas in my paragraph! It was everything I referred to that cost us ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 Dominated for all but 15mins today, with 10 men at times, against one of the few teams to recently beat Spurs......this really could have been our season.I made a prediction of a 2-1 win to West Ham half an hour before kick off, just felt we have it in us to lose like this.It is our best squad since the mid 80's, we should be above West Ham. So we finish mid-table, Martinez get's a mssive 'war chest', sure he has contacts, sure he can attract some good players (who can't with offers of big wages). Ok Martinez has proved he can drop Stones and Howard, that's a start, now he has to develop othe aspects of his game.......or he will not be the man to give the big bucks to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 Mirallas was not on the pitch when we conceded 3 in 12 minutes. Again. Exactly - had he been we might not have of conceded 3 goals in minutes. Again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 I think there are four significant aspects of this game - 3 of them negative and one positive. Negatives: 1. Mirallas. Silly boy. Enough said 2. Lukaku penalty miss and his casual attitude to it. He should have known that if he had scored we would have won. It was important but he didn't treat it as such. 3. Martinez. Initially got the 10 man game plan spot on but then blew it away with stupid subs. Post match comments blaming the ref are doing nothing for his credibility either. Positives: 1. The performance with 10 men from 35th minute to 75th minute was superb. Bill and chicagoblue 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chalkpie Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 Ped says everything I want to to say after this, but says it better. Martinez is a total joke at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 2. Lukaku penalty miss and his casual attitude to it. He should have known that if he had scored we would have won. It was important but he didn't treat it as such. He had the same attitude Barkley had when he took his second penalty against Newcastle - we're 2-0 up and in control, so I can be a bit fancy (arrogant) and even if I miss we've still got the game won. It's a dangerous way to go about things and it came off for Barkley but Lukaku fucked it up and looked like an idiot, and even more so when we went on to lose. I absolutely hate those stutter penalties. Even the ones that come off are mostly close shaves. Just leather it ffs! I'd much prefer the David Unsworth method than that shite! Lowensda and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 There were no commas in my paragraph! It was everything I referred to that cost us aaah, reads better with commas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 (edited) He had the same attitude Barkley had when he took his second penalty against Newcastle - we're 2-0 up and in control, so I can be a bit fancy (arrogant) and even if I miss we've still got the game won. It's a dangerous way to go about things and it came off for Barkley but Lukaku fucked it up and looked like an idiot, and even more so when we went on to lose. I absolutely hate those stutter penalties. Even the ones that come off are mostly close shaves. Just leather it ffs! I'd much prefer the David Unsworth method than that shite! Totally agree. I think the only thing I could say about Barkley in his defence is that, yes we were 2-0 up like you say, but we were already into injury time, still had 11 players on the pitch and were playing a crap side. In other words, there is a time and a place. Yesterday at 2-0 up with 10 men on the pitch and 20 minutes to go was neither the time nor the place imho. Edited March 6, 2016 by rusty747 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogs Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 [quote name="Blue 250" post="503987" Ok Martinez has proved he can drop Stones and Howard, that's a start, now he has to develop othe aspects of his game.......or he will not be the man to give the big bucks to. He hasn't got the time to prove he can change, we've been saying this since November, all Martinez has proved in that time is his incompetence getting the basics right. Why would any club entrust a manager with a big transfer kitty after two seasons as poor as ours have been? He's had his chance, he fucked it up. Time to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.