General Election/UK Politics

[Bailey]

 

[pete0]

6 hours ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

As a rule I avoid the politics section but it's just that looking around there is division everywhere and it seems that people are wanting to solve that with yet more division. The UK has been pulled out of the EU, which has caused more division in a single country than I've ever seen in my lifetime and this is met with calls to push for Scottish independence which will divide the country further? It wouldn't surprise me if in 20 years time Manchester and Liverpool are wanting independence from England as it just seems the be the way of the world at the moment (just look across the pond and see the divides in the USA for example). 

It's nothing personal (probably shouldn't have -1'ed) but in my lifetime I don't think we've ever been as far away from the ''getting along together, happy clappy'' world that everyone supposedly strives for, everyone seems to be wanting build a wall with each other and setting fire to the bridges that history has created.

It's just sad IMO.

I'd be happy for Scotland to leave. They should be allowed to be with the EU. I'd be happier if Liverpool went independent and joined them. Why should we stick with the racists and bigots?

[pete0]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/asylum-seekers-napier-barracks-home-office-b1793951.html?fbclid=IwAR145pg4DEKRf5_teqVSLyRQqAGxSpqRjem0cSldHFup6ZZEChPSb6oFFzw

[Palfy]

9 hours ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

As a rule I avoid the politics section but it's just that looking around there is division everywhere and it seems that people are wanting to solve that with yet more division. The UK has been pulled out of the EU, which has caused more division in a single country than I've ever seen in my lifetime and this is met with calls to push for Scottish independence which will divide the country further? It wouldn't surprise me if in 20 years time Manchester and Liverpool are wanting independence from England as it just seems the be the way of the world at the moment (just look across the pond and see the divides in the USA for example). 

It's nothing personal (probably shouldn't have -1'ed) but in my lifetime I don't think we've ever been as far away from the ''getting along together, happy clappy'' world that everyone supposedly strives for, everyone seems to be wanting build a wall with each other and setting fire to the bridges that history has created.

It's just sad IMO.

You are obviously a very young person Zoo but I remember Vietnam and more recently Yugoslavia, where thousands died in the quest of political beliefs or independence, I would rather division was done with discussion and at the ballot box than by the gun as we have seen on the African continent in the last few decades or the Middle East. 

[Bailey]

20 hours ago, pete0 said:

I'd be happy for Scotland to leave. They should be allowed to be with the EU. I'd be happier if Liverpool went independent and joined them. Why should we stick with the racists and bigots?

You do realise, that there will be approximately 50% of those "bigots and racists" in Liverpool too (assuming you are referring to Brexit voters)?

[MikeO]

59 minutes ago, Bailey said:

You do realise, that there will be approximately 50% of those "bigots and racists" in Liverpool too (assuming you are referring to Brexit voters)?

Liverpool was 58.2% remain so 41.8%. I don't for a moment think that all who voted leave were bigots and racists, but I do believe all bigots and racists voted leave.

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, MikeO said:

Liverpool was 58.2% remain so 41.8%. I don't for a moment think that all who voted leave were bigots and racists, but I do believe all bigots and racists voted leave.

[Palfy]

22 hours ago, pete0 said:

I'd be happy for Scotland to leave. They should be allowed to be with the EU. I'd be happier if Liverpool went independent and joined them. Why should we stick with the racists and bigots?

Pete I’d be over the moon for Scotland to get there independence EU or not, what worries me is that given another vote for independence they my lose again, what should happen is the rest of the UK get to vote on whether we want them in the Union or not that way they will definitely be out. 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Pete I’d be over the moon for Scotland to get there independence EU or not, what worries me is that given another vote for independence they my lose again, what should happen is the rest of the UK get to vote on whether we want them in the Union or not that way they will definitely be out. 

They’ll never be voted out of the union 

[Palfy]

33 minutes ago, Matt said:

They’ll never be voted out of the union 

That’s a shame 

[Bailey]

4 hours ago, MikeO said:

Liverpool was 58.2% remain so 41.8%. I don't for a moment think that all who voted leave were bigots and racists, but I do believe all bigots and racists voted leave.

Thanks for finding the right figure, but the point still remains. I don't deny there will be some but that doesn't mean even the majority of that 41.8% were either bigots or racists. 

I just don't see why people have to be so abusive to a group of people that they don't know anything about just because they disagree with them. It's not like all those that voted remain are saints. 

[pete0]

19 minutes ago, Bailey said:

Thanks for finding the right figure, but the point still remains. I don't deny there will be some but that doesn't mean even the majority of that 41.8% were either bigots or racists. 

I just don't see why people have to be so abusive to a group of people that they don't know anything about just because they disagree with them. It's not like all those that voted remain are saints. 

I'd go with the majority of the 41.8%. Although some were gullible idiots who believed the £350m a week to the NHS bullshit.

What other basis was there to vote out?

As for racism in this country just look at the prime minister. Any one who voted him is racist. People mightn't shout nigger in the pub any more but doesn't mean they've stopped being racist.

[Matt]

56 minutes ago, pete0 said:

I'd go with the majority of the 41.8%. Although some were gullible idiots who believed the £350m a week to the NHS bullshit.

What other basis was there to vote out?

As for racism in this country just look at the prime minister. Any one who voted him is racist. People mightn't shout nigger in the pub any more but doesn't mean they've stopped being racist.

This whole guilt by association thing you have going is really boring and completely ridiculous 

[pete0]

4 minutes ago, Matt said:

This whole guilt by association thing you have going is really boring and completely ridiculous 

They should feel guilty. I felt sick and angry and when I seen this billboard. If you voted leave more than likely it was because you're racist. Besides an NHS bus there was very little other reason given.

The current prime minister callied Muslims post boxes amongst a plethora of other examples. If you voted them you not only supported a racist you supported a party who you knew would decimate the NHS. You should feel guilty.

[Matt]

1 minute ago, pete0 said:

They should feel guilty. I felt sick and angry and when I seen this billboard. If you voted leave more than likely it was because you're racist. Besides an NHS bus there was very little other reason given.

The current prime minister callied Muslims post boxes amongst a plethora of other examples. If you voted them you not only supported a racist you supported a party who you knew would decimate the NHS. You should feel guilty.

You clearly don’t understand the phrase I used. 

[pete0]

5 minutes ago, Matt said:

You clearly don’t understand the phrase I used. 

No one stopping you from explaining.

[Matt]

2 minutes ago, pete0 said:

No one stopping you from explaining.

Nope, there isn’t. No one stopping you from looking it up either. 
 

[Palfy]

5 hours ago, Palfy said:

That’s a shame 

Why shouldn’t we as English have a say if we want a United Kingdom or if we want Scotland in the Union. 
I’m sick of the Scottish Nationalists their quest for independence will carry on costing us more money and time until they get what they want, the majority of Scott’s dislike the English even when they had the referendum SNP only narrowly lost because a big percentage who voted remain only did so through financial fears, not because they believe in the Union or wouldn’t prefer an independent Scotland. 
An independent England makes more sense to me than a United Kingdom, and I want a right to have my vote on the Union why should it just be the other nations who get the opportunity to have their say. 

[Matt]

10 hours ago, Palfy said:

Why shouldn’t we as English have a say if we want a United Kingdom or if we want Scotland in the Union. 
I’m sick of the Scottish Nationalists their quest for independence will carry on costing us more money and time until they get what they want, the majority of Scott’s dislike the English even when they had the referendum SNP only narrowly lost because a big percentage who voted remain only did so through financial fears, not because they believe in the Union or wouldn’t prefer an independent Scotland. 
An independent England makes more sense to me than a United Kingdom, and I want a right to have my vote on the Union why should it just be the other nations who get the opportunity to have their say. 

You do realise that’s a perfect post for a Leave voter, right?

[Bailey]

17 hours ago, pete0 said:

I'd go with the majority of the 41.8%. Although some were gullible idiots who believed the £350m a week to the NHS bullshit.

What other basis was there to vote out?

As for racism in this country just look at the prime minister. Any one who voted him is racist. People mightn't shout nigger in the pub any more but doesn't mean they've stopped being racist.

Wow... I find your way of looking at all of this complete contradiction.

I just don't understand you at all, you talk about social values and remaining an inclusive part of EU and yet you marginalise and stereotype anyone who doesn't agree with you. They are contrasting ends of the spectrum.

[Palfy]

6 hours ago, Matt said:

You do realise that’s a perfect post for a Leave voter, right?

I do but I’ve come to the conclusion that leaving the EU as put a bigger wedge between the Union with only Wales not trying to make gains out of the English for the result, the Irish want a United Ireland the Scots want independence. 
The finances don’t work for a Union anymore leaving the EU has cost the United Kingdom billions in trade and billions in penalties, the only country in the alliance to suffer the financial costs will be England, we propped up Scotland in excess of 15 billion more than there GDP I’m sure NI and Wales will have the same poor figures, when it comes to cutting the budget I bet they will receive the same funding and it will be the English who make the sacrifices. I for one am sick of the disparity between Scottish citizens and us and the last count in excess of £1,200.00 per head. 
Let’s be honest things have dramatically changed for us in Europe and the Union, look at what the EU tried to do 27 days after the Brexit deal ride all over it for their own gains.

I distrust the Scottish and N.I they would shaft the English given the opportunity, sorry mate but time to look after ourselves on this one, and yes that’s from a hardened remainer. 

[Matt]

I don’t actually know how to reply to that, I’m genuinely shocked. 

[Palfy]

11 minutes ago, Matt said:

I don’t actually know how to reply to that, I’m genuinely shocked. 

Why’s that mate ?

[pete0]

7 hours ago, Bailey said:

Wow... I find your way of looking at all of this complete contradiction.

I just don't understand you at all, you talk about social values and remaining an inclusive part of EU and yet you marginalise and stereotype anyone who doesn't agree with you. They are contrasting ends of the spectrum.

So what basis were people using to vote when they decided to vote leave? I've already posted the billboard that shows they preyed on people prejudice.

Public were well informed of the prime minister's comments. Do you think Boris Johnson's comments aren't racist? 

 

[pete0]

 

 

[pete0]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/feb/03/mi5-was-involved-in-1972-conviction-of-trade-unionists-court-told?fbclid=IwAR2LJR3pZ4bYJFuuoRTnMVuSj-mD1HHRTCHthX-NUoUwBByKUX_9wNKD1fI

[Matt]

On 02/02/2021 at 20:20, Palfy said:

Why’s that mate ?

Because you’ve been, vehemently at times, anti-Brexit but then show all the arguments of a Brexiteer. 

[Palfy]

7 hours ago, Matt said:

Because you’ve been, vehemently at times, anti-Brexit but then show all the arguments of a Brexiteer. 

I have mate and still am with all my heart and soul, but we’ve been truly shafted by the right wing in politics and those who supported their flawed ideology, your a young man Matt there is still time in your life to undo the wrong and return to how it was before, to some form of normality and a possible return to the EU, unfortunately I won’t live long enough to see or enjoy that day. My dreams and retirement plans have been dashed to a certain degree, have I thrown my dummy out the pram quite possibly, but what I’m not prepared to do now is have the Scots rob us blind and hold us to ransom over the Scottish independence as far as I’m concerned they can have there independence, so I don’t have to keep paying in more for them to take out per head whilst there sticking their fingers up to us. No Matt I’m done with this Union bollocks the majority of them don’t want it, and in a poll sometime back a majority of English didn’t want it, so let’s call it fucking day so we can all concentrate on what’s left to try and make our own country better instead of pandering to those who don’t want to be part of a flawed United Kingdom, because we are far from United. 

[MikeO]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

No Matt I’m done with this Union bollocks the majority of them don’t want it, and in a poll sometime back a majority of English didn’t want it

YouGov poll last year said 13% of English wanted rid of Scotland, not exactly a majority.

[Palfy]

3 hours ago, MikeO said:

YouGov poll last year said 13% of English wanted rid of Scotland, not exactly a majority.

Well let’s see the latest poll of Scots who want to leave the Union, and we should have a poll that asks the English whether they would like independence, but that won’t happen we are the majority being led by the minority. Instead of spending 100s of millions on the high speed railway we should be using that money to take the nuclear submarine base out of Scotland and building it in England, in readiness for their independence. 
Also Mike do you think the Union with Scotland is worth fighting for when it’s clear they want their independence, and if so on what grounds.