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markjazzbassist

Arsenal (Away) Sunday September 23rd

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This is gonna be a tough one but thankfully we get Richarlison back.  I’m not ready to bench Tosun yet and I hope Silva plays with one defensive mid and has a go at them.  If we can get anyone healthy for the CB pair with zouma I will take them.  Jags or Mina please.

 

                    Pickford

Kenny Jags/Mina Zouma Digne

                     Morgan

             Gylfi         Bernard

Walcott          Tosun     Richarlison

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Pickford 

Kenny Holgate Zouma Digne 

Davies Schneiderlin Sigurdssen/Dowell 

Walcott Richarlison Bernard 

Or

Pickford 

Kenny Holgate Zouma Digne 

Walcott Davies Schneiderlin Bernard 

DCL Richarlison 

If Tosun starts we need to play a different system, likewise if Sigurdssen is gonna play behind the striker. Both are too slow to press from the front. Purely on Silva's pressing style, no Gana as he's not a foggy on how to press, he just chases the ball and ends up wrong side of his man, and usually made more difficult as he's out of position. 

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I would like to see us go for the win at arsenal. Can’t remember us ever going there and going at them. They are nearly as poor as us at the back and can be got at. 

                         Pickford

kenny          Mina/Holgate  Zouma     Digne

                       Gilfi       Morgan 

walcott                Bernard        Richarlison 

                              DCL 

id play Bernard in the hole behind the main striker with gilfi deeper. Hopefully Mina will be fit and can bring some leadership to the back line. We will give them a game 

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I'm ready to send Tosun back to Turkey. Fucking garbage is what he is.

Might as well start Sigurdsson as a false nine and have Walcott and Richarlison as wide strikers.

After the West Ham debacle there needs to be wholesale changes. Some of those players are not fit to wear the shirt.

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1 hour ago, Finn balor said:

I would like to see us go for the win at arsenal. Can’t remember us ever going there and going at them. They are nearly as poor as us at the back and can be got at. 

                         Pickford

kenny          Mina/Holgate  Zouma     Digne

                       Gilfi       Morgan 

walcott                Bernard        Richarlison 

                              DCL 

id play Bernard in the hole behind the main striker with gilfi deeper. Hopefully Mina will be fit and can bring some leadership to the back line. We will give them a game 

I like that bar DCL he's not good enough just yet to be up there on his own imo he'd be better playing off another striker in a system we don't deploy 

                         Pickford 

Coleman  Zouma      Mina      Digne

                         Morgan

        Sigurdsson           Bernard

Walcott                                   Lookman

                       Richarlison

 

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What i'd like to see would be....

 

                       Pickford

     Coleman Mina Zouma Digne

               McCarthy Gomes

               Walcott Sigi Bernard

                      Richarlison

 

Obviously that won't happen and we'll get served up

                        Pickford

       Kenny Holgate Zouma Digne

                     Gana Shneid

                 Walcott Sigi DCL

                           Tosun

 

And we'll get battered. 

 

Again. 

 

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5 minutes ago, Blueherts said:

What i'd like to see would be....

 

                       Pickford

     Coleman Mina Zouma Digne

               McCarthy Gomes

               Walcott Sigi Bernard

                      Richarlison

 

Obviously that won't happen and we'll get served up

                        Pickford

       Kenny Holgate Zouma Digne

                     Gana Shneid

                 Walcott Sigi DCL

                           Tosun

 

And we'll get battered. 

 

Again. 

 

Seeing as three of them are injured you’re definitely right that it won’t happen :lol: 

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Bit harsh to say we will get battered again. West Ham had 3 chances and scored every time. At different points of the game we could have turned it round if we would have scored. First time we have lost and we should be sitting on a lot more points. Let’s get Silvas first eleven on the pitch eh?

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So far this season we've looked a one man side so it will be good to have the man in form back. I don't know whether playing him at CF is a good idea or not. He does a lot of damage from the left, think the balance with Walcott on right is good. Tosun needs to find form and should be benched. I think DCL would work well centre of a front three, it's an utter waste of time asking to play out wide. Stick him in the centre and hit crosses at him, play to his strengths. 

Midfield, I have no fucking idea anymore. Neither Gana nor Schneiderlin are good enough, but if we play Davies, Sigurdsson and Barnard we'd probably get ripped to shreds. I really hope Gomes turns out to be good beyond our wildest dreams coz I just don't see us winning many football matches with the midfield as it is. 

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We do massively miss McCarthy or a player with his combative and forward style of play as Nogs says I hope Gomes can fill the glaring gap we need filling

I don't not rate the lad but I'd have rather have had Besic sat as a DM than have both Gana and Morgan together it simply doesn't work 

We'll cause Arsenal plenty of problems on either flank it's the middle of the park they will dictate and pick us to pieces if something isn'tt changed  

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On 17/09/2018 at 11:43, TallPaul1878 said:

I'm ready to send Tosun back to Turkey. Fucking garbage is what he is.

Might as well start Sigurdsson as a false nine and have Walcott and Richarlison as wide strikers.

After the West Ham debacle there needs to be wholesale changes. Some of those players are not fit to wear the shirt.

One swallow does not a summer make. Let’s not write off players based on one poor game. IMO, he’s been contributing well in many ways. I’m sure we won’t be writing off Pickford based on one subpar performance. 

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If we ever played Siggy and Bernard together centrally we would get completely roasted. Siggy offerered us very little defensive protection (albeit nor did Gana) but I also dont see Bernard having enough size about him to play centrally. He looks like he might need a bit more space that playing wide affords.

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41 minutes ago, Bailey said:

If we ever played Siggy and Bernard together centrally we would get completely roasted. Siggy offerered us very little defensive protection (albeit nor did Gana) but I also dont see Bernard having enough size about him to play centrally. He looks like he might need a bit more space that playing wide affords.

i disagree, we don't need 2 defensive mids, it hampers our ability to transition to attack and to attack well.

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12 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

i disagree, we don't need 2 defensive mids, it hampers our ability to transition to attack and to attack well.

No we dont need 2 DMs but we also dont need two 10s playing in midfield either. 

As I said in the summer, we desperately need at least 1 proper centre mid that can defend and contribute to the attack too. 

At the moment I would like to see us be hard to beat through the middle and give our attackers a platform to play from. From what I have seen that discipline comes from Davies and Schneiderlin. Id expect Gomes to come in and take that mantle over from Davies. Siggy alongside Schneiderlin might be ok too but I dont see him being disciplined enough and hopefully we never see the Gana/Siggy pairing again!

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29 minutes ago, Bailey said:

No we dont need 2 DMs but we also dont need two 10s playing in midfield either. 

As I said in the summer, we desperately need at least 1 proper centre mid that can defend and contribute to the attack too. 

At the moment I would like to see us be hard to beat through the middle and give our attackers a platform to play from. From what I have seen that discipline comes from Davies and Schneiderlin. Id expect Gomes to come in and take that mantle over from Davies. Siggy alongside Schneiderlin might be ok too but I dont see him being disciplined enough and hopefully we never see the Gana/Siggy pairing again!

why not?  barca have played that way for years with iniesta and xavi and then iniesta and rakitic.  works just fine.

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4 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

why not?  barca have played that way for years with iniesta and xavi and then iniesta and rakitic.  works just fine.

Neither of them was/are number 10s but DMs, still they are exceptional. Neither Morgan nor Gana have their passing ability, not even close. So, unless you have 2 DMs who can defend and pass the ball, it is useless.

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10 minutes ago, Sir McGiven said:

Neither of them was/are number 10s but DMs, still they are exceptional. Neither Morgan nor Gana have their passing ability, not even close. So, unless you have 2 DMs who can defend and pass the ball, it is useless.

You misunderstand me.  Busquets is the only DM for Barca. They play 2 attacking mids.  For some reason Bailey thinks this system won’t work yet Barca has won everything with it.

 

look at biesla at Leeds playing a 4141 same thing, one  sitter.  Top of the league

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10 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

why not?  barca have played that way for years with iniesta and xavi and then iniesta and rakitic.  works just fine.

Gomes is not Busquets though. We'd get taken apart playing a midfield 3 of him, Bernard and Gylfi. We simply haven't got the right kind of physical, mobile midfielders who can still play football you need in the modern game. 

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I don't see the logic behind Bernard and Sigurdsson being torn to shreds yet Davies and Morgan wouldn't 

Both slow one physically not much bigger than Bernard but technically no where near as good 

Sigurdsson is wasted in the system we've been playing he needs to sit further back where he can dictate play and make those forward runs that he used to for Swansea where he's far more effective and Bernard could be the creative spark people have banged on about for years 

He's a big physical presence we should be utilising that until we get a chance to see what Gomes has to offer imo 

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16 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

why not?  barca have played that way for years with iniesta and xavi and then iniesta and rakitic.  works just fine.

FFS... I didnt say it doesnt work ever but unless I have missed something we arent managed by Pep and we arent Barcalona. This isnt football manager. Rakitic isnt a 10 either he is an all round midfielder. 

5 hours ago, EFC-Paul said:

I don't see the logic behind Bernard and Sigurdsson being torn to shreds yet Davies and Morgan wouldn't 

Both slow one physically not much bigger than Bernard but technically no where near as good 

Sigurdsson is wasted in the system we've been playing he needs to sit further back where he can dictate play and make those forward runs that he used to for Swansea where he's far more effective and Bernard could be the creative spark people have banged on about for years 

He's a big physical presence we should be utilising that until we get a chance to see what Gomes has to offer imo 

Its about a players appetite to defend and the system they play in. We dont keep the ball well enough nor invert the full backs nor have the mobility at 6 to afford ourselves 2 attacking midfielders in the same time. Siggy showed at the weekend that he isnt disciplined and I doubt Bernard will either.

4 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

I was done when I read Davies and disciplined in the same sentence :lol: 

Gana and Siggy made Davies look like Makelele this weekend they were that all over the place. 

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Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc 

We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on 

Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies 

Also questioning a players appetite to defend when they've not been played in such a way is premature especially considering Davies and Morgan run around like headless chickens

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7 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said:

Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc 

We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on 

Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies 

Since when has Davies been considered a defensively minded midfielder? 

I agree with you though, at moment I'd be picking two of Sigurdsson, Bernard and Gomes when he's fit with Gana in front of the back four. Not because I think Gana is good enough but purely because I think he puts his foot in a lot more than Schneiderlin. I'm also hoping Gomes has something about him physically because I don't really see Bernard and Sigurdsson offering us enough defensively. 

The main issue though is we still have zero balance in the middle and we're not going to get very far until Gana and Schneiderlin are replaced by someone a lot better. 

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7 minutes ago, nogs said:

Since when has Davies been considered a defensively minded midfielder? 

I agree with you though, at moment I'd be picking two of Sigurdsson, Bernard and Gomes when he's fit with Gana in front of the back four. Not because I think Gana is good enough but purely because I think he puts his foot in a lot more than Schneiderlin. I'm also hoping Gomes has something about him physically because I don't really see Bernard and Sigurdsson offering us enough defensively. 

The main issue though is we still have zero balance in the middle and we're not going to get very far until Gana and Schneiderlin are replaced by someone a lot better. 

Never said he was I was referring to Gana and Morgan in previous posts and I think it was Bailey mentioned Davies so threw all three into the mix

In my recent reply I'm talking about a central pairing non of them work so just throwing an idea of something that "might" out there 

I'll be honest as much as I'm looking forward to seeing what Gomes can offer without getting to carried away we should have brought in a player like N'Zonzi or N'Diaye to fill the void and offer competition 

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3 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

How others play doesn't actually make him a disciplined player.

My original point was that our most disciplined midfield comes from Schneiderlin and Davies ahead of the rest of the fit players. I didnt say he was disciplined as such but I accept it may not have come across clearly!

3 hours ago, EFC-Paul said:

Not about having two attacking midfielders it's about having one as said the other two can interchange prominently Sigurdsson sitting deeper than Bernard where he's better at driving forward picking a pass etc 

We can't stick to the same system it doesn't work as seen with Gana and Davies Morgan and Gana Morgan and Davies and so on 

Gana is the best defensive midfielder out of the three the other two offer very little ATM especially Davies 

Also questioning a players appetite to defend when they've not been played in such a way is premature especially considering Davies and Morgan run around like headless chickens

This isnt Fifa. You cant just drop an attacking midfielder into deeper positions and expect them to play like a deeper midfielder should play, at least not without a lot of coaching. I would have thought that Siggy could become a deeper midfielder, he has the size and work rate but he didnt really care who ran past him at the weekend and when he did he couldnt do anything about it. I would be almost certain that Bernard is worse at his defensive responsibilities.

I accept that when we have the ball for large periods of the game the two players mentioned will enhance our chances of scoring / creating but we arent Man City and we arent going to retain 65-70+% of possession and with someone like Gueye chasing the ball you will leave a revolving door in midfield for the opposition to exploit.

Gana is the best at tackling and intercepting, not the best defensive midfielder as there is a big difference. Schneiderlin is positionally the best player we have in there. Gana is the only headless chicken, at least at the weekend, which can have its plusses and minusses because it gives him the opportunity to win the ball back more but then also leaves us exposed.

Its not premature at all. I have seen Siggy for 18 months now and Bernard doesnt have the physicality to play in central midfield in the Premier League week in week out and to be honest I think you want him find space to create rather than tie him down to defensive work.

I think we can both confidently say that the sooner Gomes / McCarthy are fit the better!

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Bailey with all due respect mate I know it's not FIFA but you quote stats and all sorts of information as if this is Football Manager that are in the main more akin to a simulated game, for me to suggest playing two midfielders in midfield in roles they have played for club and country isn'ttt in the slightest bit FIFA related mate 

Sigurdsson played behind the strikers with a fairly free rain in midfield where he's at his best that's purely what I'm suggesting he's not Flash but he's quicker and more agile than Tom and Morgan so will/could get about more and Bernard is far more technical and creative than either 

I do want Bernard to find space and create that's the type of player he is, was Countinho built like a brick shithouse did he track back and defend does Silva do it often did Mahrez and so on? They have a specific role for their skillset I see Bernard as no different he's that kind of player 

Gana is the best defensive midfielder for me he does what they are supposed to as you say tackling and intercepting but as we know there's no cohesion with having sub par midfielders to pick the ball up and move it forward. That's why I'd like to see him on his own playing deep doing what he's good at then playing it simple to someone who can carry the ball up field

Either way I hope something changes or clicks soon as we look dogshit  

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6 hours ago, Bailey said:

FFS... I didnt say it doesnt work ever but unless I have missed something we arent managed by Pep and we arent Barcalona. This isnt football manager. Rakitic isnt a 10 either he is an all round midfielder. 

Its about a players appetite to defend and the system they play in. We dont keep the ball well enough nor invert the full backs nor have the mobility at 6 to afford ourselves 2 attacking midfielders in the same time. Siggy showed at the weekend that he isnt disciplined and I doubt Bernard will either.

Gana and Siggy made Davies look like Makelele this weekend they were that all over the place. 

Have they ever been anything else when they play together, I look forward to the day when we get 2 CB who don’t need a DM sat in front of them for 90 minutes, then we can have a MF that has more freedom to be creative. 

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5 hours ago, Palfy said:

Have they ever been anything else when they play together, I look forward to the day when we get 2 CB who don’t need a DM sat in front of them for 90 minutes, then we can have a MF that has more freedom to be creative. 

That’s what I keep thinking reading all of these. A yard dog like Gana frankly shouldn’t have to be nearly as worried about his positional sense; he should be free to run around, get the ball back and pass it upfield to a creative mid.

As is, he and Schneiderlin get in each other’s way, Schneiderlin contributes not much defensively, and Gana gets constantly caught out all because our CB pairing has been consistently shit for the better part of 2 years. Not since Williams first arrived have we had any assurance at the back, and that was extremely short-lived.

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Would be surprised if he didn't tweak the midfield 3 and yank Tosun. Expecting something along the lines of this:

                         Pickford

Kenny      Zouma       Mina        Digne

                           Gueye

             Sigurdsson     Bernard

Walcott                                    Richarlison

                      Calvert-Lewin

Bench: Stekelenburg, Holgate, Baines, Schneiderlin, Lookman, Niasse, Tosun

 

Personally, I'd keep the faith with Tosun for one more match. The combination of Walcott, Tosun and Richarlison looked good up until Richarlison's red card.

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14 hours ago, Bailey said:

Gana is the best at tackling and intercepting, not the best defensive midfielder as there is a big difference. Schneiderlin is positionally the best player we have in there. Gana is the only headless chicken, at least at the weekend, which can have its plusses and minusses because it gives him the opportunity to win the ball back more but then also leaves us exposed.

Nail on the head. 

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1 hour ago, nogs said:

How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? 

lets go the whole hog roast then and try Pickford as centre forward after all it worked well for half a game with George Wood.

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4 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

honestly i hope arsenal win big so they are full of themselves and we knock them down.  i don't want them humiliated and then trying to prove themselves against us.

 

We haven’t won there for more than 20 years, so I’m not sure it’ll make a difference what they do tonight. 

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19 hours ago, nogs said:

How about Bainsey being converted into a Phillip Lahm-like midfield general from left back? 

Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily ;)

Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. 

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14 minutes ago, nogs said:

Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily ;)

Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. 

Dinosaurs too, Harry Redknapp changed Gareth Bale from a left back into a striker, stick Bainsey up front I say!

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17 minutes ago, nogs said:

Some of you lot rise to the bait way too easily ;)

Although a lot of 'progressive' managers do like converting full backs into central midfielders on the grounds that they can usually defend and pass. It's highly debatable any of our CMs at moment can do both. 

When we're in need of a powerhouse box to box midfielder, playing a scrawny, coming to the end of his career Baines isn'tt progressive. It's downright suicidal.

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