Lowensda Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Makes me so angry to see our players cheating like that! It's awful. Retrospective action for him. Needs to stop. One thing I usually like about of team, is the honesty of our players. Don't want to see it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodisonRoad Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Gotta be constructive here gents, bit OTT bringing Moyes up (fuck sake, is moyes the only manager we have had in our history?!) and I see the Martinez bashers will jump on this one (Martinez has cost us majorly in the race for 4th?! Have a word pal...its because of RM that we are in that race to start with!!!) But, anyway, lets be honest...we were shite! Really frustrated watching that. We have all got use to a particular style of play in a short period of time. However, credit to WBA...they pressed hard, tackled hard, found space, looked sharp, passed and moved with pace. And we did none of that. We just looked empty today. Too many long balls upto lukaku, who won very few. We were basically the opposite of wba. Lets not go overboard with criticism, it was poor all round...players and martinez... Bring on the kopshites!!! Im not a "Martinez basher" at all "pal" But like i said, if he takes the plaudits, he has to take the blame for things like tonight. It was blatantly obvious to everyone that Osman was dead on his feet (again) and we needed some fresh legs on. Even Naismith to come and run around like a headless chicken and pressure them. Today was a major chance to seize on the opportunity of Liverpool slipping up and Martinez bottled it for me. Im not going overboard with the criticism. I think Martinez is a great manager and he's been immense since he came but he's let a lot of blue's down today IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoblue Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 2nd half was probably the worst I've seen us play this year. We were abysmal, not even in the game until the 80th minute. Shocked we didn't lose in fact. Bad as the result is I'm far more disappointed in how we went about our business, and where were the subs. Was dead obvious from 50th minute until they scored that we were being dominated and needed to change things. On that performance who would you have, Lukaku or Anichebe. Think I'd be taking Vic. We just can't play our football without a skilled midfielder and that was clearly lacking today. Shame really, going to have to be much better for the Derby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Jags looked fat as fuck in that shirt tonight..... Too many paella's in Tenerife me thinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolton Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Hi Evertonians, well I'm pleased with a point, you have a fine side this season, you will do well, not top 4 maybe but top 6 I hope. Thought we could have won the game at the end, but overall, a draw was fair so honours even this season. Lukaku had games like that for us as well! Best of luck for the rest of the season, hopefully we will be around to play you next term. regards Zolton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I dont think Martinez bottled it. Its not like he had game changing subs, he just had subs that had more energy & drive. Whatever he did, it would have been like for like so its not like he bottled a decision. I think it would have helped and given us a chance of holding on but we would have been on the ropes no matter what. The players themselves have to shoulder a lot of blame today. Too many easy misplaced passes, too many poor touches, too many slow pea roller passes, too many long aimless balls and not enough movement and endeavour to make things happen. We constantly sat deeper and Jags wanted to give Vic the freedom of The Hawthornes. I wouldnt disagree if you said that the players might not have been motivated/focussed enough and blaming Martinez for his part in that, but in no way did he bottle it IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 2nd half was probably the worst I've seen us play this year. We were abysmal, not even in the game until the 80th minute. Shocked we didn't lose in fact. Bad as the result is I'm far more disappointed in how we went about our business, and where were the subs. Was dead obvious from 50th minute until they scored that we were being dominated and needed to change things. On that performance who would you have, Lukaku or Anichebe. Think I'd be taking Vic. We just can't play our football without a skilled midfielder and that was clearly lacking today. Shame really, going to have to be much better for the Derby. Lukaku everytime. We played into Vics hands whereas WBA (Lugano) kicked lumps... I mean defended against Lukaku quite. well. Put it this way Lukaku will create and score you more goals/oppurtinities than Vic will throughout the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodisonRoad Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I dont think Martinez bottled it. Its not like he had game changing subs, he just had subs that had more energy & drive. Whatever he did, it would have been like for like so its not like he bottled a decision. I think it would have helped and given us a chance of holding on but we would have been on the ropes no matter what. The players themselves have to shoulder a lot of blame today. Too many easy misplaced passes, too many poor touches, too many slow pea roller passes, too many long aimless balls and not enough movement and endeavour to make things happen. We constantly sat deeper and Jags wanted to give Vic the freedom of The Hawthornes. I wouldnt disagree if you said that the players might not have been motivated/focussed enough and blaming Martinez for his part in that, but in no way did he bottle it IMO. Taking Osman off and bringing on Mcgeady at around 50 mins could have turned the whole game on its head. Isnt it the roberto way to make the other team worry about us rather than us worrying about them? thats what that sub would have done. Mirallas behind the striker and oviedo/mcgeady on the wings. Even Naismith would have been a better option. Osman was a passenger for the entire second half, he gave the ball away and didnt press because he was blowing out his arse. IMO that sub is the bottled decision that COULD have changed the game IMO. Like you say, we sat deeper because we werent able to press. They had 3 pairs of fresh legs on the field by the time we made our first change and even that was forced because of the injury to coleman. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Very, very bad game. Probably not a good time to meet them considering they'll have been at their most energetic under the new manager and it showed as we didn't manage to string two passes together in the first ten minutes of the game. They kept harrassing us the entire game and we just kept collecting bad passes and touches. Martinez' adjustments didn't work out either. One of the central midfielders started to drop in between the centre backs when we had the ball in that area which should have allowed us to play it out from the back again, but all it did in practice was free one of the centre backs up for a long ball not threatened to be blocked by a defender while they should have ran the ball into midfield and passed it forward. When they did manage to pass it forward though, they always had pressure on our first touch and if we didn't lose it immediately it was because we passed it backwards straight away. Still, we managed to get a couple of chances in the remainder of the first half and even scored a route 1 goal. But the second half was straight up abysmal with just the same issues as in the first half but just ten times worse as we seemed to tire much faster than they did. If we're really gonna make a top 4 push we're gonna need a couple of players in of genuine quality as Martinez obviously didn't trust his bench today. Hopefully McGeady will be one once he gets some match fitness, but we're going to need a striker and a central midfielder as well, and I wouldn't mind another wingman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Taking Osman off and bringing on Mcgeady at around 50 mins could have turned the whole game on its head. Isnt it the roberto way to make the other team worry about us rather than us worrying about them? thats what that sub would have done. Mirallas behind the striker and oviedo/mcgeady on the wings. Even Naismith would have been a better option. Osman was a passenger for the entire second half, he gave the ball away and didnt press because he was blowing out his arse. IMO that sub is the bottled decision that COULD have changed the game IMO. Like you say, we sat deeper because we werent able to press. They had 3 pairs of fresh legs on the field by the time we made our first change and even that was forced because of the injury to coleman. McGeady isnt fit and will be well off the pace of the Prem and his team mates. As you saw in his cameo his defensive work isnt postionally as good as it ahould be either but thats no surprise given he has only been here a week. I do think Osman should have been subbed first but Oviedo was just as anonymous IMO albeit he didnt look like he was running in treacle. We might have held on but it wasnt a game changer IMO and I dont think it would have changed the pattern of play. That also isnt the reason we couldnt keep hold of the ball. If anything we needed an extra body in the middle to create another passing option but we didnt have that option available. If anything I would have considered moving Osman centrally and using pace on the winga to support Lukaku but Osman was that off the pace Im not sure that would have helped either. There are a lot of things you could label that performance with but I dont think saying Martinez bottled it is one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodisonRoad Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 McGeady isnt fit and will be well off the pace of the Prem and his team mates. As you saw in his cameo his defensive work isnt postionally as good as it ahould be either but thats no surprise given he has only been here a week. I do think Osman should have been subbed first but Oviedo was just as anonymous IMO albeit he didnt look like he was running in treacle. We might have held on but it wasnt a game changer IMO and I dont think it would have changed the pattern of play. That also isnt the reason we couldnt keep hold of the ball. If anything we needed an extra body in the middle to create another passing option but we didnt have that option available. If anything I would have considered moving Osman centrally and using pace on the winga to support Lukaku but Osman was that off the pace Im not sure that would have helped either. There are a lot of things you could label that performance with but I dont think saying Martinez bottled it is one of them. Each to their own i guess. The Osman was sub was so important in my eyes because they were obviously targeting that side and saw that he was dead on his feet (not the first time a team has done that to us) and i said at around the 50 min mark, it will cost us, Berahino went straight over to the right as soon as he came on and he was put there to go one on one with Baines and try to double up on him. Baines was being left out to dry because ossie couldnt give him any cover. Mcgeady may not have been 100% but he is fresh and wants to impress his new manager (like much of the West Brom team did) and im pretty sure would/could have lasted 30-40 mins. I agree our ball retention was terrible as both Barry and Lukaku had absolute mare's but like i said, if we give them something to worry about on the counter with McGeady or dare i say it Naismith... then we give ourselves a better chance of getting a win. The reason i use the term "bottled" is because it was such a good opportunity for us. And unfortunately, we stuck with what we know (tried and tested Ossie on the left) instead of throwing caution to the wind like we are so accustomed to seeing with Martinez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Im not a "Martinez basher" at all "pal" But like i said, if he takes the plaudits, he has to take the blame for things like tonight. It was blatantly obvious to everyone that Osman was dead on his feet (again) and we needed some fresh legs on. Even Naismith to come and run around like a headless chicken and pressure them. Today was a major chance to seize on the opportunity of Liverpool slipping up and Martinez bottled it for me. Im not going overboard with the criticism. I think Martinez is a great manager and he's been immense since he came but he's let a lot of blue's down today IMO. Well, as you like to use IMO quite a lot, kinda makes it hard to argue against, its your opinion. Fair enough. I agree that RM has to take some flack when it goes wrong...as do all the players tonight. Its a bit funny to say you aint going overboard with criticism but also say (mind if I use some of your " " here?!) "he has cost us largely in race for 4th", "he bottled it" and "he let a lot of blues down". IMO, bit over the top...!!!! Also, in your post further down, you pinpoint everything, In your opinion, Martinez should have done that would have won the game. Bit arrogant, IMO. Anyway, we'll wildely disagree on our opinions I think...no hard feelings, each to their own and all that. Where I think we all have some common ground is the feeling of dissapointment. I think we fell into the same trap as our players, we expected a win. But all in all, it aint too bad. It doesnt matter too much where we sit right now in the table, theres so much back n forth going on. We need to remember that 5th would be an achievement, 4th would be....gobsmacking! Bring on the kopshites!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodisonRoad Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) Well, as you like to use IMO quite a lot, kinda makes it hard to argue against, its your opinion. Fair enough. I agree that RM has to take some flack when it goes wrong...as do all the players tonight. Its a bit funny to say you aint going overboard with criticism but also say (mind if I use some of your " " here?!) "he has cost us largely in race for 4th", "he bottled it" and "he let a lot of blues down". IMO, bit over the top...!!!! Also, in your post further down, you pinpoint everything, In your opinion, Martinez should have done that would have won the game. Bit arrogant, IMO. Anyway, we'll wildely disagree on our opinions I think...no hard feelings, each to their own and all that. Where I think we all have some common ground is the feeling of dissapointment. I think we fell into the same trap as our players, we expected a win. But all in all, it aint too bad. It doesnt matter too much where we sit right now in the table, theres so much back n forth going on. We need to remember that 5th would be an achievement, 4th would be....gobsmacking! Bring on the kopshites!!! How is that arrogant exactly? Its my idea of what we should have done because it makes sense. Frustrastes the hell out of me that you seem to accept a draw at West Brom....No disrespect to them but we should be wiping the floor with them. 5th wouldnt be an achievement, because you get sweet Fuck All for finishing 5th. 4th is what we need financially to keep competing and make ourselves better and we missed a big opportunity here. It just seems to me that you dont want to criticise Martinez at all because of how good he has been. Nobody denies that, but he has made some errors today and it could be costly. Edited January 20, 2014 by GoodisonRoad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Frustrastes the hell out of me that you seem to accept a draw at West Brom....No disrespect to them but we should be wiping the floor with them. 5th wouldnt be an achievement, because you get sweet Fuck All for finishing 5th. 4th is what we need financially to keep competing and make ourselves better and we missed a big opportunity here. It just seems to me that you dont want to criticise Martinez at all because of how good he has been. Nobody denies that, but he has made some errors today and it could be costly. I don't think anybody wanted a draw, but we have to accept that playing away from home against a team who were desperate to impress their new manager was never going to be a walk in the park. Yes we didn't play as well as we could. I think we missed somebody to link up with Lukaku and drive us forward, Osman is not that man, he is too slow and lightweight. But he is better at passing the ball than Naismith, and a better finisher so I understand why he started. Also the pitch was poor and made passing difficult. Where I think Martinez made a mistake was not replacing Osman sooner. Naismith would have offered more hustle, which we needed. I would have done this as soon as it was apparent we were struggling to impose ourselves, about 55 - 60 mins. In future I would like to see Mirallas operate behind Lukaku when Barkley is not playing there, with McGready on the wing. On the whole we need another center midfield to cover / competition for Barry and McCarthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Well the warm weather training seemed to work a treat! We did what Everton always seem to do and bottled it when it matters, totally inept performance and in the end we were probably licky to take a point. Seemed slightly ironic chanting about Moyes being negative then defending a 1-0 lead on the edge of our own area for 45 minutes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearso Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Bright side blues: averaging 2 points per game would have earned you 3rd place last season. We're 42 points from 22 games, only 2 points off that '2-a-game' average. If we can keep winning at home and pick up at least draws away, performances like these won't be so bad in the scheme of things come the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Well IMO fourth place is gone now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Fucking miserable bastards. We played poorly tonight and didn't get beaten away (good sign)...... Just shows the level if expectancy RM has created....... The only downside I can see is that if we sign Baines to a three year contract, then we better do the same with pienaar cause Baines doesn't seem to want to go past the half way line if he isn't there....ends up making Coleman become predictable and start tackling himself on the right. Pearso 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Well IMO fourth place is gone now. Ridiculous.....one point off it with sixteen games left and it's gone ? Get a grip! Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolton Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Wow, some very over the top views there. (some realistic ones as well). May be you were due a reality check, Lukaku has given you the goals to get you to the fringes of the Champions League places (is a £5million loan fee really a long term viability), much as he assisted us in our highest finish for years, a club of your size will always struggle to make the Champions League places, its just about the money and frankly, you don't have it, you don't have a wealthy fairy godmother like Chelsea or man City or the backing of Manure or Arsenal, even Liverpool and Tottenham have a massive financial advantage. You have a very good team, but the lack of strength in depth will always be your Achilles heel, squad depth costs more than you have, we prevented you from playing your A game last night, don't become like some of the big 4 arseholes and think you will steam roller every team in the league. Enjoy your team, they are enjoyable to watch, you will have great results, but you will have poor days as well, I think Champions League is beyond your financial capabilities and unfortunately, its all about the money. regards Zolton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodisonRoad Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Ridiculous.....one point off it with sixteen games left and it's gone ? Get a grip! By no means gone. But last night was a great oportunity to narrow the gap with the Liverpool and we didnt take it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluenosetoffee Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Said to Josh at the time that I hope we don't score from the free kick. Yeah it was a dive, so was Suarez against Villa on Saturday. Everybody is coming out saying it was a penalty. I have watched it time and time again and can't see any contact just Suarez thought there would be by the looks of it. It is the same situation as Baines he thought there would be contact there wasn't and went down far to easy. Mirallas also won us a free kick on the edge of the area in the second half which to me wasn't a free kick. He went straight into their defender and he wasn't obstructing him he just jumped into him. The game on a full - what a disappointment. Unfortunately Martinez got his tactics wrong on this game but that is understandable. You are playing against a team with a new manager and you won't know how they play. Yes you can watch the previous games he has managed but they were in Spain. Totally different to manage in Spain that the EPL. I noticed that Martinez must have said to the team to stand off opponents and let them play their game and trust your defenders. Everytime West Brom had it we stood back and let them pick out a pass, get a cross in. Also there was no urgency in Evertons play either, trying to pass the ball around slowly but couldn't do it as every time we did have the ball WBA were over us like a rash and didn't give us any time to play our game. The Everton I watched last night was one under Moyes era not Martinez. Distin and Jags hoofing the ball up field to try and get it to Lukaku. Where have we seen that before....Fellaini... WBA will feel hard done by, they were the better team the whole game. We scored against the run of play in the first half. Yes we had a couple of chances, Oviedo, Mirallas near post and McCarthy half volley but we didn't look like scoring when going forward. The difference when WBA went forward they looked like they could play. I think Anelka played a blinder with his passing and his presence in the team. Saying that Pepe Mel's substitution at half time. Putting Anichebe changed the game. His strength in the box. He would back into Jags and Distin hold the ball up and pass it on the wing. Something Lukaku couldn't do all night as he had no space. Overall disappointing performance and lucky to finish with a draw. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 I watched the match when I got in from work and couldn't believe how bad we were. With no peanuts or Ross we had nobody to come deep and start moves. We just lumped it all night long. The pitch was crap but that's no excuse. I've got to say west brom are a poor poor team an will go down. The shite or spurs would have won that by three or four. Dystin and Osman were awful and a subs should have made and we should have one 4-4-2 and ground out the result. So so dissapointng but a derby win would solve everything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolton Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 (edited) We play Spurs only a few weeks ago and we drew with them as well, the pitch was not bad at all, its a pitch in winter, you played as well as we let you, get over yourself Tricky Trev. Edited January 21, 2014 by Zolton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 We play Spurs only a few weeks ago and we drew with them as well, the pitch was not bad at all, its a pitch in winter, you played as well as we let you, get over yourself Tricky Trev. Have to say the pitch looked very poor, even some WBA forums were complaining about it (apparently reserves and youth teams are also using it) With respect, we were poor / average and played you off the park in the first half. Second half you wanted it more and several of our players tired (Osman, Barry). You played well in the second half and showed spirit, I think you will be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Well IMO fourth place is gone now. For this week yes. For the rest of the season? Dont make me laugh. Still upset about the performance last night. Yes we can lose points now and then but it did not even look like we wanted to win. Injuries are a worry. We are lacking in squad depth. We need a fit Pienaar and Barkley. Thats obvious to us all. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vranny Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 I think in hindsight, apart from a need to get fresh legs on earlier, Martinez probably dropped the ball in persisting with our 4-4-2 for so long in the second half. West Brom really pressed us hard all game and an extra number in midfield certainly would've helped us in stringing more than a pass or two together after the early part of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolton Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 The pitch is only used by the first team, its a pitch in January, not at its best, but its fine, I think a few people are picking up on the comment by Neville and using it as an excuse. One think I noticed when we had Lukaku, because he is such a presence there can be a tendency to overplay to him regardless, our results with him second half of last season were not great, love the guy though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 The pitch is only used by the first team, its a pitch in January, not at its best, but its fine, I think a few people are picking up on the comment by Neville and using it as an excuse. One think I noticed when we had Lukaku, because he is such a presence there can be a tendency to overplay to him regardless, our results with him second half of last season were not great, love the guy though! You guys deserved your point for a second half battle. Your game play was executed well and stopped us from playing. I can't remember us having many real efforts in the second half. We're all just frustrated because we had a chance to take advantage if the others dropping points. Must say I thought Vic changed the game when he came on for you. He was a pain in the arse for us. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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