veedublin Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Not just what's going wrong this year, but what do you think is the biggest difference between this season and last? (I'm sure it's a combination of a bunch of things, but what stands out?) 2013-14 was simply good luck. The ball went our way, and we got goals when we needed them. 2014-15 is simply bad luck. We're not getting the breaks. A save here or a goal there, and it would be a different season. Whatever was fresh in 2013-14 has been sussed out by the other EPL teams. Martinez had a good system, but it needs to evolve. He's not creative enough (or he's too stubborn) to grow. A middling start eroded player confidence, so really, it's all mental. Martinez didn't work the team hard enough in the off-season. (Players are not fit enough, so we've conceded late goals.) Injuries. Martinez is but a figurehead and a cheerleader. Things went well last year, but he doesn't know how to inspire his players to do their best in the face of adversity. (He's panicking.) There is mutiny among the ranks, the players want Martinez gone, and a win would affirm his ability to coach. Our players don't like each other, so it's subconscious sabotage. It's [NAME A PLAYER]. He was effective last year, but he's dreck this year. Goalkeeping, plain and simple. Last year, Howard was serviceable enough. but this year, glaring mistakes have resulted in opposing goals and have put us on the defensive. A save here might result in a goal there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Speed in passing. Direct service to the forwards. Preseason fuck up so we're not fit. Martinez trying to change too much too quickly but at the same time, not changing things when they need to be. We always have bad luck, its no different this season. I don't buy that anyway; you make your own luck on the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Balance. We have stopped playing with 2 wingers and have no balance as a result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 a mix of:- Not being fit Manager being too soft Certain players having a negative impact on the dressing room Complacency Tim Howard and Gareth Barry being finished Lukaku and Barkley supposedly poromising a big season and failing miserably Poor tactics Players not taking accountability on the pitch Poor atmosphere (cause and effect) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Overrated players, overrated manager. Moyes boys are disillusioned No Deulofeu from the bench. AMEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 a mix of:- Not being fit Manager being too soft Certain players having a negative impact on the dressing room Complacency Tim Howard and Gareth Barry being finished Lukaku and Barkley supposedly poromising a big season and failing miserably Poor tactics Players not taking accountability on the pitch Poor atmosphere (cause and effect) And how would you know that Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 A cluster fuck plain and simple but the buck stops with Martinez he's been well below par in to many areas for me not to seriously question his all round ability at this level Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Attitude. I read that as "altitude" . *Phones Specsavers* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Moyes mentality being trained out of them and Martinez way of thinking and playing now being in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Chances created. We were constantly in double figures last year. We had Mirralas firing. This year he has been dissapointing. We had Barkley firing. This year he is trying too hard not to make a mistake. We had Baines looking world class...this year he is just good. We need our players to start performing. It's not just the manager. The start of the season we had Seamus believing the newspapers...He is just starting to get his form back now. Hopefully we will see others follow suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Confidence, at the start of the season we looked like we didn't believe we could replicate the success of last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubecula Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Last season we were carried forward by the memory of DM, this season we are simply shite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 A balanced squad as well, players like Pienaar, Distan, Osman, Hibbert and Deulofeu needed replacing and were not, as we spent the budget on Rom. We have missed having 2 fit wingers for the wing backs to play off, and a reliable center back to cover for Jags and Stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 A balanced squad as well, players like Pienaar, Distan, Osman, Hibbert and Deulofeu needed replacing and were not, as we spent the budget on Rom. We have missed having 2 fit wingers for the wing backs to play off, and a reliable center back to cover for Jags and Stones. This is looking more and more the truth by the week. Big mistake. Far too much money paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted March 10, 2015 Report Share Posted March 10, 2015 Depends on how its structured. Last season Rom looked immense and most people were desperate to sign him, me included. But Rom is young and will (has) make mistakes, as he gets more experience he will get better. Last season he had better service from a team playing with confidence, this season the service has been poor, the team lacking confidence, and Rom does not have the experience to manufacture goals like an experience striker would. I still back him and Martinez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 (edited) And how would you know that BillyOh sorry didnt realise you behave like a prize tit on this forum whilst watching the match at Goodison - trying to ruin every match day thread with your attention seeking bullshit. Bar a few games you may have gone to you are a keyboard warrior just happy being a wum. Hence your post above. You took a photo of one match stub.... Sad. Do a few years of being season ticket holder, watch us win leagues and survive last day relegation scraps before challenging my commitment. Been to more games than you make contradictions, that's a lot. Edited March 11, 2015 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 The "supporters" Lowensda 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 The "supporters" Yeah. Been shit them. Selling out at Every away game, over purchasing allocations in Europe. Fucking Terrible those supporters. Might have something to do with the 6 months of dross they've had to endure whilst remortgaging their house just to keep up the 'support'. Proper shite them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Yeah. Been shit them. Selling out at Every away game, over purchasing allocations in Europe. Fucking Terrible those supporters. Might have something to do with the 6 months of dross they've had to endure whilst remortgaging their house just to keep up the 'support'. Proper shite them. As I said in my post before MC did his usual stunt. "Cause and Effect" - the players are responsible for the atmosphere. The odd hefty tackle, high tempo attack, shot from distance can raise the crowd and then there is a feel of momentum. The players do nothing to get the crowd behind them. I will call out the fact that Barkley is the victim of some stick which is unacceptable. There is a disconnect between the players and the fans. The reason fans like Besic is that he at least shows some passion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Yeah. Been shit them. Selling out at Every away game, over purchasing allocations in Europe. Fucking Terrible those supporters. Might have something to do with the 6 months of dross they've had to endure whilst remortgaging their house just to keep up the 'support'. Proper shite them. This a million billion percent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Depends on how its structured. Last season Rom looked immense and most people were desperate to sign him, me included. But Rom is young and will (has) make mistakes, as he gets more experience he will get better. Last season he had better service from a team playing with confidence, this season the service has been poor, the team lacking confidence, and Rom does not have the experience to manufacture goals like an experience striker would. I still back him and Martinez. 24m over 4 years with add ons was what I heard. 6m a year for a double-figure-a-season striker with huge potential. I'm stopping there before this descends into what we all know it will... I don't buy the idea of blowing the budget on one player is to blame in the slightest. The squad is more or less the same as last year, how spending money on 1 player affects the performances of our key players (Howard, Jags, Barry, McCarthy, Barkley, Mirallas, etc) is a mystery to me. Ok, we might've brought in more bodies, but again, how would that have affected the performances of our under-performing players? Even if we had bought more players, who's to say they would've played ahead of the favourites, or in their preferred position. The motivation, confidence, attitude, etc. comes down to the manager fucking up. Not money spent on 1 player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Testicular fortitude last year, the lack there of this year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Depends on how its structured. Last season Rom looked immense and most people were desperate to sign him, me included. But Rom is young and will (has) make mistakes, as he gets more experience he will get better. Last season he had better service from a team playing with confidence, this season the service has been poor, the team lacking confidence, and Rom does not have the experience to manufacture goals like an experience striker would. I still back him and Martinez. Whichever way anyone viewed him, he's here now. It all depends on what your view is of a footballer and what they need to bring to a game. Personally I would sacrifice the odd moment of inspiration from Rom for a more continued and consistant ability to give the team what they expect. Football these days allows very little margin for error, being able to look after the ball is an absolute must, teams wait for an error and punish any mistakes, and quite frankly Rom can not look after the football. He gives it away so much its a liability having him anywhere near our half or having players commit forward - it really is a tipping point. I have said before, if a team could afford to blow £20m for a player to come off the bench against tired legs for the last 20 minutes then he is your man. After 40 minutes of playing you can noticalbly see a more laboured player in Rom, unfit, overweight, lack of natural stamina - whatever. I have played in the same team as Sean Thornton - scored a screamer for Sunderland vs Chelsea a few years back. Blew his talent really. However, the difference between him and anyone else at thet considerably lower level was touch. Everytime the ball was hit at him its stuck - chest, thigh, feet. He said it was the biggest difference between pros and amateurs and is the reason some will make it and some won't. It wasn't practice for him as a pro, it was what he did as a kid that brought that ability. Not that it did him any good, he liked to party too much. Rom scored the majority of his WBA goals as a sub on the counter against tired legs. Most their fans said he was an impact player and I believe its true. I just think that £13m on Welbeck and £15m on others would have been smarter at the stage we are at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 (edited) Oh sorry didnt realise you behave like a prize tit on this forum whilst watching the match at Goodison - trying to ruin every match day thread with your attention seeking bullshit. Bar a few games you may have gone to you are a keyboard warrior just happy being a wum. Hence your post above. You took a photo of one match stub.... Sad. Do a few years of being season ticket holder, watch us win leagues and survive last day relegation scraps before challenging my commitment. Been to more games than you make contradictions, that's a lot. Oh sorry didnt realise you behave like a prize tit on this forum whilst watching the match at Goodison - trying to ruin every match day thread with your attention seeking bullshit. Bar a few games you may have gone to you are a keyboard warrior just happy being a wum. Hence your post above. You took a photo of one match stub.... Sad. Do a few years of being season ticket holder, watch us win leagues and survive last day relegation scraps before challenging my commitment. Been to more games than you make contradictions, that's a lot. That's how much you know. "One match stub" that was my season ticket you bellend. But you wouldn't have seen one of them would you? You still think you get a book of stubs don't you? Edited March 11, 2015 by MC11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Everyone wants me to not repsond to you and to their detriment I do. You can't help yourself, like a little child trying to get noticed. Since you have come on this forum you try and mix the atmosphere - when you have had your fun by starting stuff with your snide remarks - you try and play mr nice guy for a bit as you know people get bored. I need to have a word with myself for even retorting to your stuff, a few of the other posters just don't bother and to a degree its worked for them. I'm gonna do the forum a big favour and you and your little play mate Blue are on ignore - properly. Some decent posters don't bother on here any more and it has coincided with you using this thread to troll and get your fun. Well done you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Whichever way anyone viewed him, he's here now. It all depends on what your view is of a footballer and what they need to bring to a game. Personally I would sacrifice the odd moment of inspiration from Rom for a more continued and consistant ability to give the team what they expect. Football these days allows very little margin for error, being able to look after the ball is an absolute must, teams wait for an error and punish any mistakes, and quite frankly Rom can not look after the football. He gives it away so much its a liability having him anywhere near our half or having players commit forward - it really is a tipping point. I have said before, if a team could afford to blow £20m for a player to come off the bench against tired legs for the last 20 minutes then he is your man. After 40 minutes of playing you can noticalbly see a more laboured player in Rom, unfit, overweight, lack of natural stamina - whatever. I have played in the same team as Sean Thornton - scored a screamer for Sunderland vs Chelsea a few years back. Blew his talent really. However, the difference between him and anyone else at thet considerably lower level was touch. Everytime the ball was hit at him its stuck - chest, thigh, feet. He said it was the biggest difference between pros and amateurs and is the reason some will make it and some won't. It wasn't practice for him as a pro, it was what he did as a kid that brought that ability. Not that it did him any good, he liked to party too much. Rom scored the majority of his WBA goals as a sub on the counter against tired legs. Most their fans said he was an impact player and I believe its true. I just think that £13m on Welbeck and £15m on others would have been smarter at the stage we are at. He went for 16m in the end, and transfers aren't all paid up front so saying we'd have 12m leftover isn't correct either. Anyway, minor details. I would've liked him too, I remember us agreeing on that (despite the fact that he does pretty much the same things that Rom does which annoy you, minus the goal return) but this season he's been non-existent. I only remembered him after reading the Utd vs Arsenal match report. Anyway, again don't want this to go down the pan.... Can someone explain the idea of spending money on 1 player affects the performances of the majority of the team? I really can't get my head around it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 He went for 16m in the end, and transfers aren't all paid up front so saying we'd have 12m leftover isn't correct either. Anyway, minor details. I would've liked him too, I remember us agreeing on that (despite the fact that he does pretty much the same things that Rom does which annoy you, minus the goal return) but this season he's been non-existent. I only remembered him after reading the Utd vs Arsenal match report. Anyway, again don't want this to go down the pan.... Can someone explain the idea of spending money on 1 player affects the performances of the majority of the team? I really can't get my head around it. I don't think the money spent on that player, more to how that player affects the team Matt. Rom needs to have a second striker alongside him - 100% certain. Under the system we play he is responsible for running onto a pass or challenging for a ball and allowing his team mates to advance up the pitch "knowing full well that he is going to have it under control". The reality is that they don't bomb up, they have seen play break down too many times. They are tentative in their commitment to join the fray. Watch how it was when Newcastle had Shearer - the ball stuck, it was controlled, held up, laid off and he would hit the box for the cross. Its strange watching Rom, he may as well be 5ft 8 and quite skinny - as his supposed attributes just aren't what you associate with a 6ft 4 player built like a tank. He wants to play his game like Inzaghi but lacks the natural movement and intelligence - his offside are criminal. He is a puzzling problem. We really need to get the best out of him but how? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 As I said in my post before MC did his usual stunt. "Cause and Effect" - the players are responsible for the atmosphere. The odd hefty tackle, high tempo attack, shot from distance can raise the crowd and then there is a feel of momentum. The players do nothing to get the crowd behind them. I will call out the fact that Barkley is the victim of some stick which is unacceptable. There is a disconnect between the players and the fans. The reason fans like Besic is that he at least shows some passion. I think its more a case of Roberto is responsible for the atmosphere. I said the same last season when results were going in our favour , there is no atmosphere because the football is boring. Watching Stones and Jags pass the ball back and forth to each other all game hardly gets you on the edge of your seat Matt, MC11 and Blue 250 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwlad Posted March 11, 2015 Report Share Posted March 11, 2015 Obviously tactics but low player morale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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