Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Didn't get past that's a fact. Go look at Karen Brady's comments. I said rumour regarding Juve. Don't know if you trolling, or just that egotistical to think your opinions are facts. Fact is, I suspect the latter but that's just my opinion. Are you joking? Lukaku was valued at £75m by us.... we bought him for £28m 3 years ago and west hams transfer record was made last season at £20m. Karen Brady's comments drew widespread pisstakes from west ham fans yet to support an argument you are giving credibility to west ham approach us for a near world record fee player? Her comments reminded me of our bid for Alan shearer.... absolute fantasy to appease pissed off fans. Lukaku to west ham.... only you would give that credibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Donald Trump would be proud of that logic. Exactly like creative force who's lack of creativity is the reason we never broke the top six. His performances didn't warrant a payrise. Aggrieved? He's underperformed and asked for a payrise! Any other job you'd be laughed out the door. ONE of the most creative players in the premier league last year.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 He hesitates too long on the ball so the quality of chance has diminished by the time the other player gets the ball. Davies first time passes were much more dangerous. I don't want Barkley to leave but this is so true. He frustrates on so many occasions when he wants an extra touch or two allowing defenders to get back into position or wasting a teammate's run. He's another one whose stats are massively swollen by his domination versus the 'lesser' clubs as I can't recall a game he's dominated (bar thrashing Man C) against the 'big 6'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Unless we have line of sight as to how much of the other players dwell on the ball etc then we have to take the stats as they are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Koeman has pushed the lad out. Simple for me. Not up for discussion. He's made it very clear from the beginning he's not his type of player. I think this bit is right, I think Koeman wants hard working players. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 He hesitates too long on the ball so the quality of chance has diminished by the time the other player gets the ball. Davies first time passes were much more dangerous. I'm talking about his actual stats mate not my opinion of them. The stats say that the passes he completed were key passes that got to where they needed to be. All I'm saying is that he didn't have a poor season when viewed by neautral sources. In Everton fans eyes it was poor as we see him every week and know what he is capable of. This diminishes our opinions on him as there is expectancy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Unless we have line of sight as to how much of the other players dwell on the ball etc then we have to take the stats as they are Or just watch him every game and state the glaringly obvious - he often slows the pace of attacks down. Under instruction? Maybe but I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Before Christmas, he was shite. After Christmas, he was blistering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Lukaku thread 2.0 this. He probably wont speak out now as he is still under contract and risks: 1. a heafty fine from the club 2. he's still a blue, he will still care for the club and maybe doesn't want to hurt the fans by coming out saying "oh the manager has fucked me off" 3. if he speaks out it could put other teams off, they could be like "oh he's being a snakey bellend, swerve buying him" lets see what he says when he finally goes. If he is about for the season then he'll have my support, as soon as he fucks off I wont give a shit about him. Has he officially handed in a transfer request, if he has said he wants to go but fell short of handing in a transfer request then he is a money grabbing snake. Rooney aside, all of our "own" players who have left to try find greener grass you could say have failed. Jeffers, Rodwell, Ball, Vaughan, Anichebe (well maybe not the last 3 as much)... not one of them went on to be great. I suspect Barkley to be the same. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) Unless we have line of sight as to how much of the other players dwell on the ball etc then we have to take the stats as they are this did make me laugh Haf. You were willing to ignore positive stats about Lukaku in favour of trusting your own eyes. Edited July 27, 2017 by Romey 1878 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnh Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Headline: Telegraph Sport today. BARKLEY'S 'CAREER WITH US IS 100 PER CENT OVER' (Koeman) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 this did make me laugh Haf. You were willing to ignore positive stats about Lukaku in favour of trusting your own eyes. Ditto... I purposely avoided the L word though!!! Bless him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Or just watch him every game and state the glaringly obvious - he often slows the pace of attacks down. Under instruction? Maybe but I doubt it. I'm not disputing that - I'm stating that unless we can clarify that all the other players he is compared with don't do that then we have to take the stat that he is one of the most creative in the league. By the way.... can I also state whilst we are at it that I lost count of the times he had to hold off a pass because our striker was offside or had ran away from Barkley which allowed the defender to step into the pass line. Man United game prime example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) this did make me laugh Haf. You were willing to ignore positive stats about Lukaku in favour of trusting your own eyes. Not really. If you notice I didn't dispute that he dwells on the ball. Just like I didn't dispute that lukaku scored goals. There was only one stat that lukaku showed his worth - goals scored. The other stats such as pass completion, aerial duels, balls given away, defensive actions showed him as being poor. Unfortunately that one doesn't stick Romey. Good try though. Edited July 27, 2017 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Koeman has pushed the lad out. Simple for me. Not up for discussion. He's made it very clear from the beginning he's not his type of player. Yet he offered him a contract and played him week in week out. Funny way of showing you don't want someone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I recall the boyhood blue Gary Speed keeping a dignified silence when he was "sold" to Newcastle. Many fans took 2+2 and made 18 and he got unfair stick... fact is the lad had dignity and made the move and kept quiet whilst our club was being mismanaged. Lesson learned. There is more to this than meets the eye IMO. I said last year that if Barkley was related to me I would be telling him to find another club. Why? Because I think the verbal abuse he was getting off fans was impacting him. Never have I known a player get so much stick as Barkley. It was reminiscent of the awful treatment naismith for in his early days at the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Not really. If you notice I didn't dispute that he dwells on the ball. Just like I didn't dispute that lukaku scored goals. There was only one stat that lukaku showed his worth - goals scored. The other stats such as pass completion, aerial duels, balls given away, defensive actions showed him as being poor. Unfortunately that one doesn't stick Romey. Good try though. Oh but it does stick, Haf. His stats for his assists were pretty good, but you maintained that he offered absolutely nothing but goals. Mike showed you stats showing that Lukaku's goals scored with his left foot was decent, but you again maintained that his left foot was shit due to what you see with your eyes. Matt, Elston Gunnn, Sibdane and 2 others 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) Oh but it does stick, Haf. His stats for his assists were pretty good, but you maintained that he offered absolutely nothing but goals. Mike showed you stats showing that Lukaku's goals scored with his left foot was decent, but you again maintained that his left foot was shit due to what you see with your eyes. Lukakus assists... I keep hearing this but to me they were bang average nothing out the ordinary. His left foot was great Romey... didn't have an issue with that. His goals with his right foot came from an average of 8 yards I think I correctly read. He scored 1 goal from a distance further than 18 yards with his right foot (west brom) So the stats will say he scores goals with his right foot.... but the stats also say he can't use his right foot from distance. I think most players can use their weaker foot from close range even when it's a proper swinger. Back to my point... barkley does dwell on the ball at times. However unless we are able to decipher if this is true of the likes of sigurdson etc then his stats remain comparable... which brings me back to the original point that we put ourselves in a position to lose a player 9n the cheap because we never secured his fee by me and of contract. Edited July 27, 2017 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 What a muppet I am! I meant his weaker foot, which would obviously be his right and not his left. Must have more caffeine . Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I sit somewhere in the middle. I don't want Barkley to leave but it's clearly obvious he will. I don't know if he's being forced out of the club (offered a poor contract extension) or whether he's just being greedy. What I can't fault is RK played him most of last season and therefore clearly rated / trusted him. I've always been an admirer of his but do concede he's not improved as much as I'd have wanted. I'm different to most football fans in that a player signs a contract and I can't blame a player for seeing that contract through. What I am most annoyed about is we won't get the full value of money for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Ffs can we just leave it now? (Lukaku) Yes he was lazy at times, yes he had a horrible first touch but he scored goals! Who the fuck cares if they come from 8 yrds or 18 yrds from his weak foot? Sod his assists, his touch, his running. He scored goals. He is also a Man Utd player now. End of story! Sibdane, Lowensda, rubecula and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I think the time is right for both parties for him to move on. I don't think koeman wants him personally. Not now he's got klassen, Rooney sandro and looking at gylfi... all those players can do Barkleys role - 2 of them specialise at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elston Gunnn Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I think the time is right for both parties for him to move on. I don't think koeman wants him personally. Not now he's got klassen, Rooney sandro and looking at gylfi... all those players can do Barkleys role - 2 of them specialise at it. I will guess that this is a fair summary of what must be the overwhelming consensus on TT. Perhaps one or two might cavil at the not totally provable assertion that RK doesn't want him, but overall, we (nearly) all agree with Hafnia. And thank him for bringing us together as we prepare for our exciting opening to our Europa campaign! rubecula 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 ONE of the most creative players in the premier league last year....You're one of the most creative people on here when it comes to statistics. Doesn't mean they're any good. Ross dawdles on the ball and the chance goes away from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I'm not disputing that - I'm stating that unless we can clarify that all the other players he is compared with don't do that then we have to take the stat that he is one of the most creative in the league. By the way.... can I also state whilst we are at it that I lost count of the times he had to hold off a pass because our striker was offside or had ran away from Barkley which allowed the defender to step into the pass line. Man United game prime example. I'd look at his assists for that. Which is has a fair amount, but should have made many more given his role and talent. Flip it on its head, how many times was there an off side because the pass was delayed by Ross going through the motions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I'm sorry to see him go in a way but the horrible bastard in me can't wait to watch him fail. That's just me I guess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I'm sorry to see him go in a way but the horrible bastard in me can't wait to watch him fail. That's just me I guess Bitter git! ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 Oh yeah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted July 27, 2017 Report Share Posted July 27, 2017 I really don't think Koeman has pushed the lad out in the bullish fashion some are making out I think he's been told he has to do more and work harder and iron out his obvious flaws which we all know he has and he's seen his arse and doesn't have the balls or desire to step up to the plate I really can't see Koeman saying what he has recently without it being very close to the truth as Barkley will at some point have his say and could have by now Shame he hasn't the bottle to give his all but it is what it is we sell him and move on Romey 1878 and markjazzbassist 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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