Jordan Pickford

[Hafnia]

51 minutes ago, Matt said:

Isnt that the goal though? To work towards a world class team? Why replace him with someone who’s a bit better? Can’t remember who made the point, but Liverpool and City went and bought the “best” keepers to help them step up, that should be our goal next season. 

Someone also mentioned Joe Hart somewhere and now that’s in my head, the parallels are very very clear  

At the moment Pickford is the goalkeeping equivalent of having Davies and Siggy as a centre midfield.... Generally just not good enough, the odd decent moment but you will lose too many games with them 

We didn't need to go and sign Kevin debruyne and busquets for £300m to sort it out - Allan and Decoure for £40m did the job and we look superb. 

That's my point... Get in a keeper who doesn't have to be 10/10 in every area. 7/10 in every area will do.   

If you asked me to score Pickford he would be 2/10 for reliability 1/10 for concentration, 9/10 for shot stopping, 8/10 kicking, 4/10 command of area.  

[Matt]

2 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

At the moment Pickford is the goalkeeping equivalent of having Davies and Siggy as a centre midfield.... Generally just not good enough, the odd decent moment but you will lose too many games with them 

We didn't need to go and sign Kevin debruyne and busquets for £300m to sort it out - Allan and Decoure for £40m did the job and we look superb. 

That's my point... Get in a keeper who doesn't have to be 10/10 in every area. 7/10 in every area will do.   

If you asked me to score Pickford he would be 2/10 for reliability 1/10 for concentration, 9/10 for shot stopping, 8/10 kicking, 4/10 command of area.  

Fair enough. But going back to original point, who are we going to get in a couple of days time? It’s something for next summer to sort out 

[Wiggytop]

I’m as concerned as everyone else at Pickford form, but just to balance the discussion, did we all see Edison and Popes performances yesterday, both made howlers, bad punches etc. DeGea is full of errors. I think being England’s no 1 puts more pressure from the press on Pickford, he needs to find a way to deal with it, and stop the silly mistakes.

[Shukes]

2 hours ago, Palfy said:

I did my FA coaching through Swindon Town hardly the wrong people, are you having a Homer moment doh Is Pickford not part of the team then, you teach players to look after each other, Glen Hoddle use to say his mistake is your mistake, if you have to cover for someone you cover, if someone makes a mistake a team fights to correct that mistake, you will never or shouldn’t hear a player criticising another player for a mistake, but you will often hear players defend team mates for making mistakes as individuals, and as a coach you should be telling your lads that. 
An example that I used to use was that let’s say anyone of you here make a bad judgment that cost us a game, how are you going to feel as an individual walking off that pitch and for the next few days, you are going to feel like shit you are going to shrink as a person, so when that happens I want you as a team to fight to fight to cancel out that mistake, because I don’t want any of you walking off that pitch feeling like shit, and most importantly you don’t want one of your team mates feeling like that after a game because if you don’t fight for your team mates then one day it might be you coming off that pitch feeling like shit. 
Other great examples you see on the pitch of players supporting individuals is when a player has made a howler and cost his team the lead, then the team fight back a regain the lead team mates around the individual who made the howler will go to him and celebrate because they are just as happy for him as taking the lead, also penalties in a shoot out you don’t knife the player in the back who has missed the last pen that has cost you the game, you go and commiserate with them give them a hug as an individual you should know what there going through. 
Supporters criticise and stab the players in the back of the teams they follow not the coaches or players of that team they protect and fight for each other on and off the pitch, good coaching promotes good harmony and team work with each other as a team and individuals. 
I was working with Swindon from 90-93 I did 2 weekly courses at Lilleshall, I gave up being involved in football to concentrate on my family and business and I’ll be honest with you not necessarily in that order, which was a mistake but I cannot turn the clock back so you learn to live with your mistakes. 
Anyway to sum up individuals are important in a team players and coaches learn to look after individuals, and all the individuals make the team strong. 

 

A team should be about a team. Coaches make sure individuals play as a team and not an individual. 
Im shocked you don’t understand this, and even more shocked you can’t see that your points are arguing for me... not against me.

If Swindon town taught you to teach players to be individuals on a pitch... then they were 100% the wrong people to train you. 
 

Your Glen Hoddle point for example, supports exactly what I’m saying.  His mistake is your mistake..... because we are a TEAM! We fill holes for each other because we are a TEAM, not an individual.

I was taught totally different from you mate.

We win as a team, lose as a team, draw as a team, battle as a team.... we do everything as a team. 
But it doesn’t excuse players of making mistakes. This is why managers drop players. 
 

We are just different, I get that. But there is no way I am going to change my philosophy on the game. I’ll continue to teach my kids to play as a team, as I 100% believe that’s how football should be.

 

 

edit: just read back to make sure as I’m confused about your point. The original point was that Pickford was ok to make mistakes as they haven’t cost us points yet. 
I said this was a weak argument as the only reason he hasn’t cost us points is that we have scored more. It can’t go on like that, that’s not what a top manager like Carlo will be thinking. 

I also pointed out that I play for the team not the individual.... and somehow your trying to turn it into something else? Not sure why?

But let’s make something clear, each and every player should be playing for the badge,  not themselves or their mate. They should be playing as a team  and fighting for each and every player in that team, not because they like or befriend them.... but because they play for the TEAM!

If you have ever heard Roy Keane speak, he mentioned players in the team who he personally hated, but would bleed on the pitch for them, because they played for the TEAM.

[Zoo 2.0]

4 minutes ago, Wiggytop said:

I’m as concerned as everyone else at Pickford form, but just to balance the discussion, did we all see Edison and Popes performances yesterday, both made howlers, bad punches etc. DeGea is full of errors. I think being England’s no 1 puts more pressure from the press on Pickford, he needs to find a way to deal with it, and stop the silly mistakes.

I totally get what you're saying, but I want the best for Everton Football Club, I'm not really interested in what Manchester City, United or Burnley are doing with their goalkeepers. 

We should strive for the best, regardless of what other teams are doing - in a way the fact that the other "top" teams (ignore Burnley) are having trouble should spur us on to be even better and capitalise. 

[StevO]

Can anyone think of any replacements that are realistic and an upgrade? Not necessarily for this window as time is pretty much up, but for next year?

Not trying to be funny or anything, just trying to make discussion. I don’t know enough other keepers around, the only one I would really rate is Henderson but I’m certain by next season he’s Uniteds number one. 

[Matt]

16 minutes ago, StevO said:

Can anyone think of any replacements that are realistic and an upgrade? Not necessarily for this window as time is pretty much up, but for next year?

Not trying to be funny or anything, just trying to make discussion. I don’t know enough other keepers around, the only one I would really rate is Henderson but I’m certain by next season he’s Uniteds number one. 

Zoo mentioned the guy from Ajax who apparently has a release fee and wants to move, but he’s not tested here. The Milan lad is never going to happen, nor the Inter guy, neither is Ter Stegen, don’t see Oblak happening... these are the type of keeper I want us linked with, but unless we get Europe it’s never going to happen and certainly not this window. 

[Shukes]

21 minutes ago, StevO said:

Can anyone think of any replacements that are realistic and an upgrade? Not necessarily for this window as time is pretty much up, but for next year?

Not trying to be funny or anything, just trying to make discussion. I don’t know enough other keepers around, the only one I would really rate is Henderson but I’m certain by next season he’s Uniteds number one. 

I can’t. I am not sure it’s that important either really. He is making mistakes and I am not excusing him for it at all.

But one thing I did like, was seeing how angry he was with himself. This could be the point where he realises and starts working hard to rectify it.

[Palfy]

36 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I also pointed out that I play for the team not the individual.... and somehow your trying to turn it into something else? Not sure why?

And this is the point that I disagree with, when you play for a team you also play for every individual in that team you can’t do one without the other, or you are just playing for yourself and as I said not a good team player, so I’m saying that mistakes are team mistakes not just that individuals mistake, as Hoddle told us. 
Just to say you play for the team or badge can’t be done if you aren’t playing for the individuals in the team, when a team walks off the pitch they are all responsible for the result win lose or draw, as Ancelotti said yesterday he hasn’t cost us anything when asked, that’s a wise man who understands the bigger picture of what constitutes a team. 
Or you could be an Allardyce who constantly attacked individuals for mistakes, to mainly absolve himself from any blame, you may not stand by Pickford but ask his manager coaches and any player in the squad, and I bet you everyone to a man would, that’s what team’s do they rally around individuals having a tough time on or off the pitch, they don’t hang them out to dry, as fat Sam did that’s shit coaching (cough cough )

When you coach your kids do you treat them all the same?

[Shukes]

1 minute ago, Palfy said:

And this is the point that I disagree with, when you play for a team you also play for every individual in that team you can’t do one without the other, or you are just playing for yourself and as I said not a good team player, so I’m saying that mistakes are team mistakes not just that individuals mistake, as Hoddle told us. 
Just to say you play for the team or badge can’t be done if you aren’t playing for the individuals in the team, when a team walks off the pitch they are all responsible for the result win lose or draw, as Ancelotti said yesterday he hasn’t cost us anything when asked, that’s a wise man who understands the bigger picture of what constitutes a team. 
Or you could be an Allardyce who constantly attacked individuals for mistakes, to mainly absolve himself from any blame, you may not stand by Pickford but ask his manager coaches and any player in the squad, and I bet you everyone to a man would, that’s what team’s do they rally around individuals having a tough time on or off the pitch, they don’t hang them out to dry, as fat Sam did that’s shit coaching (cough cough )

When you coach your kids do you treat them all the same?

Mate I think your arguing the same point as me. Your trying to hard to look for something that’s not there

No I don’t treat the kids all the same, I manage and coach them as needed, to their strengths and weaknesses. But I certainly make sure I teach  them to play together as a team. 

[Hafnia]

16 minutes ago, StevO said:

Can anyone think of any replacements that are realistic and an upgrade? Not necessarily for this window as time is pretty much up, but for next year?

Not trying to be funny or anything, just trying to make discussion. I don’t know enough other keepers around, the only one I would really rate is Henderson but I’m certain by next season he’s Uniteds number one. 

I think we are in a prime situation to get a top signing over the line.  Top of the league.... Carlo in charge, James Rodriguez a star attraction. 

Donnarumma looks the likely star signing. 1 year left on his contract that he won't sign. .. an Italian legend as our manager. Been a first team keeper for AC Milan since 16, he's only 22 now. 

[Hafnia]

1 hour ago, Matt said:

Fair enough. But going back to original point, who are we going to get in a couple of days time? It’s something for next summer to sort out 

I'd imagine the search for a keeper has been ongoing for a while and contacts will have been made.  There's a lot we can do before close of business, remember the Fellaini deal .. that was nuts. 

[London Blue]

7 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

I think we are in a prime situation to get a top signing over the line.  Top of the league.... Carlo in charge, James Rodriguez a star attraction. 

Donnarumma looks the likely star signing. 1 year left on his contract that he won't sign. .. an Italian legend as our manager. Been a first team keeper for AC Milan since 16, he's only 22 now. 

https://sempremilan.com/journalist-expects-a-skirmish-with-raiola-for-milan-over-donnarummas-renewal

https://acmilan.theoffside.com/2020/10/2/21498352/ac-milan-looking-to-open-contract-renewal-talks-for-star-goalkeeper-donnarumma-gianluigi-news-raiola

[StevO]

Just now, London Blue said:

https://sempremilan.com/journalist-expects-a-skirmish-with-raiola-for-milan-over-donnarummas-renewal

https://acmilan.theoffside.com/2020/10/2/21498352/ac-milan-looking-to-open-contract-renewal-talks-for-star-goalkeeper-donnarumma-gianluigi-news-raiola

Don’t we still have a good relationship with Raiola? Make a quick move. 

[London Blue]

Just now, StevO said:

Don’t we still have a good relationship with Raiola? Make a quick move. 

I think we just bent over to him for the Kean loan to PSG, but the limited research I have done indicates that both he and the club want the contract extended.

[Aidan]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8803401/Jordan-Pickford-errors-leading-goals-keeper-arrived-Everton.html

[Hafnia]

4 minutes ago, London Blue said:

I think we just bent over to him for the Kean loan to PSG, but the limited research I have done indicates that both he and the club want the contract extended.

A player doesn't let his contract run down to 10 months without looking to leave.  It's a huge risk financially if they get injured. 

If looks to be one of those "come and get me now if you want me" signals. 

[Palfy]

6 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Mate I think your arguing the same point as me. Your trying to hard to look for something that’s not there

No I don’t treat the kids all the same, I manage and coach them as needed, to their strengths and weaknesses. But I certainly make sure I teach  them to play together as a team. 

I do think we are saying the same thing but coming at it from a different view point. 
Im pleased with your response to your kids, when you become a manager in every walk of life you need to become a care worker a good man manager, you treat the team as collective all the same, but as individuals on there own they all have different needs and you have to learn how to respond to those needs, so helping the individual helps the businesses or in this case the team. 
 

[Hafnia]

11 minutes ago, Aidan said:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8803401/Jordan-Pickford-errors-leading-goals-keeper-arrived-Everton.html

But but but but how many points has he cost us? 

 

[Matt]

20 minutes ago, StevO said:

Don’t we still have a good relationship with Raiola? Make a quick move. 

Think so, especially with the Lukaku and Kean moves. But this would simply be too good to be true, I’d genuinely start to doubt my reality. 

[Shukes]

11 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I do think we are saying the same thing but coming at it from a different view point. 
Im pleased with your response to your kids, when you become a manager in every walk of life you need to become a care worker a good man manager, you treat the team as collective all the same, but as individuals on there own they all have different needs and you have to learn how to respond to those needs, so helping the individual helps the businesses or in this case the team. 
 

It’s the best part of my life mate. Makes me so proud to see these kids slowly turning into young boys. 

[Palfy]

We are throwing and banding names around like alcoholics in a brewery, fucking clueless let Ancelotti sort it out if he feels we need another keeper he will get one, if he feels Pickford should be dropped he will drop him leave it to the man who knows, I’m sure he doesn’t need your advice on who or what he should be doing. 
Unfortunately we love a witch hunt or kangaroo court on TT when Pickford’s turn is over there be someone else to fill the board.

Fuck me boys we’ve had the best start to a league season since 1969 and we won the league that season, get a grip it’s like dealing with a load of women

[Palfy]

2 minutes ago, Shukes said:

It’s the best part of my life mate. Makes me so proud to see these kids slowly turning into young boys. 

Quality Shukester

[Hafnia]

1 minute ago, Matt said:

Think so, especially with the Lukaku and Kean moves. But this would simply be too good to be true, I’d genuinely start to doubt my reality. 

Carlo and Brands seem to be on the same page.

Ebbrell told me as much - weeks ago,  I don't know if he knew something but he said he hoped we would spend a good chunk of money in the depressed market. 

It's not like the committee type transfer shenanigans under Koeman etc. 

Got a fair bit of deadwood to shift... Has anyone else noticed Carlo is a bit more "serious"....  It's as though he took the reigns last year like he was babysitting someone else's kids.  Now he's acting like they are his kids ... He's taking no shit. 

[Palfy]

10 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

But but but but how many points has he cost us? 

 

In 3 seasons  he’s made 1 mistake a year more than Hugo Lloris, fuck me that’s a hanging offence if I’ve ever seen one, how many points have those goals cost us?, I can help you out with the 2 this season they cost us  nothing, as the Don pointed out

[Hafnia]

7 minutes ago, Palfy said:

We are throwing and banding names around like alcoholics in a brewery, fucking clueless let Ancelotti sort it out if he feels we need another keeper he will get one, if he feels Pickford should be dropped he will drop him leave it to the man who knows, I’m sure he doesn’t need your advice on who or what he should be doing. 
Unfortunately we love a witch hunt or kangaroo court on TT when Pickford’s turn is over there be someone else to fill the board.

Fuck me boys we’ve had the best start to a league season since 1969 and we won the league that season, get a grip it’s like dealing with a load of women

Blood hell Palf this is what a forum is all about.

Whether you like it of not we've got a weak link in the side and we are at the end of a transfer window ... You may need to duck out of the Pickford thread till midnight tomorrow. 

It's like having a flood in your house and expecting your wife not to be looking online for new carpets 

[Hafnia]

10 minutes ago, Palfy said:

In 3 seasons  he’s made 1 mistake a year more than Hugo Lloris, fuck me that’s a hanging offence if I’ve ever seen one, how many points have those goals cost us?, I can help you out with the 2 this season they cost us  nothing, as the Don pointed out

They didn't cost us because we sorted out the glaring weaknesses in the side... A midfield that can support an attack.  Coleman has stepped up at right back which leaves goalkeeper as the only room in the house that looks a mess. 

We aren't going to play palace and Brighton every week.  

The comparison with Lloris doesn't fly with me.... Pickford makes 33% more errors leading to goals is how I read it. 

I'd also be interested to see what the errors look like. 

[Palfy]

Just now, Hafnia said:

Blood hell Palf this is what a forum is all about.

Whether you like it of not we've got a weak link in the side and we are at the end of a transfer window ... You may need to duck out of the Pickford thread till midnight tomorrow. 

It's like having a flood in your house and expecting your wife not to be looking online for new carpets 

We don’t do carpets in this house mate underfloor heating is better with hard surfaces. 
He was man of the match against Spurs fuck me mate through gritted teeth you even gave it him, 2 mistakes later that cost us goals but nothing else and possibly spurred the team on.

I can’t say for sure but I think he will be playing in the derby in a couple of weeks, and if he is he 100% has my support whilst he’s wearing the shirt. 

[StevO]

20 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

It's like having a flood in your house and expecting your wife not to be looking online for new carpets 

Id rather she was looking for a plumber. 

[Palfy]

11 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

The comparison with Lloris doesn't fly with me.... Pickford makes 33% more errors leading to goals is how I read it. 

I'd also be interested to see what the errors look like. 

You can’t just cherry pick the stats that suit your agenda mate, whether it doesn’t fly with you or not that’s a fact on the article you were responding your post to, Jesus Haf cake and eat it mate you greedy fucker