Bournemouth (Home) Saturday September 23rd

[Paddock]

50 minutes ago, yamar said:

So if all your comparisons relate back to who's team they had at the time, then Koeman should be gone this week.

Why??

 

Martinez took over Moyes team that was a regular top 7 finishing team, within 2 seasons he had us finishing  11th and had brought in shite to average players in the squad. 

Koeman took over a team that had finished 11th 2 seasons running and finished 7th in his first season.

So Koeman improved on Martinez, Martinez sustained Moyes for 1 season then fell off a cliff, Koeman will be judged on this (and if he's still here) next seasons finishes. 

[Paddock]

55 minutes ago, yamar said:

Wasn't successful? Cup final and European football. The same acheivments as Moyes but in a far shorter time period.

For Christ sake, we went to wolfsberg with some top players playing for them at that time and wiped the floor with them. We now go to Atalanta and get made a show of.

We never got to a cup final under Martinez.

[MikeO]

2 hours ago, Palfy said:

On paper we do have a good set of players, but not a team, again it's what was here before his arrival that won the day, in Niasse and Davies, when will you and others realise that a team is the sum of its parts, not just the cost of the individuals, it's a blend of finding players you know will work in your equation, he hasn't done that he has gone for players that as individuals are good players, without any foresight to whether they will gel as a team, I honestly from what I've seen believe he lacks any ability as a manager to put a team together.

His parts maybe better but his sums and equation are miles off, he has done what everyone of us on here could have done, spent a shit load of money on players that the masses have heard of, then throw them altogether and fucking pray it works, clueless fucking clueless, then the I can't see no wrong in him brigade shout its not that bad, he needs more time in the next window he will put it right.

Please fifteen or sixteen months,  three windows and two hundred plus million and this is were we are, yesterday I was asked if I was real really.

I don't think there's a single person on here in that "brigade", I don't think it exists; we just have different ideas on the way to get better.

[Newty82]

4 minutes ago, Paddock said:

We never got to a cup final under Martinez.

No no no Paddy...you must remember the rules of engagement when debating on Toffeetalk, the main one being 'If in doubt, make it up'.

[Riscon]

People seem to forget that in our first 6 games of the season, we had Man City, Chelseas, Spurs and Manchester United! We have made a lot of new signings, it takes time for them to bed in and get a style that suits. The Atlanta game was not acceptable though. 

We also sold Lukaku and did not replace him, a striker should have been our number one focus in the window. I have very high hopes for DCL, he is going to be top drawer. However he needs an experienced striker alongside. 

If we can get Rooney in to form, give Davies more play time and Niasse keeps on scoring then we can go all out in January and get the striker we desperately need.

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Newty82 said:

No no no Paddy...you must remember the rules of engagement when debating on Toffeetalk, the main one being 'If in doubt, make it up'.

In my eyes it was a cup final. Get past utd and it was won.

[pete0]

1 hour ago, Newty82 said:

It's not the way I think to be honest Pete regarding his pay.

The argument that he should be getting top 4 because he earns £6mill a year doesn't work if the same rule applies to the 5 other managers who earn more than him and finished above him.

If used as a criticism of him, it doesn't stick because he's only the 6th highest paid, pretty much equal to where we finished.

There are plenty of other criticisms that carry much more weight. Stick to them...plenty of choice there!!!

Like I've said previously though, I've no doubt that if he doesn't improve us (which realistically means at least finishing much closer to the top 6), he'll lose his job. But the season is a marathon not a sprint, he's got plenty of time to prove himself. And he does need to prove himself.

I didn't say he should get top four. I said it was a realistic target and he failed miserably when you look at the points disparity between us and the rest. Last season you had a top six and we were battling with West Brom and Soton for 7th. We would have been in the mix with a better manager. 

Martinez had flaws in his Barcelona tola taka philosophy as well as his outdated fitness beliefs. When he went against his football philosophy and wasn't chatting shit there was a decent manager in there. 

With Koeman I don't even know what his philosophy is. I can't see how he thinks his team will create a goal, likewise it baffles me that he hasn't addressed the issue in the middle of the park. Too often we get caught out in the middle with ease. The team looks just as unfit as well. Other than Koeman's directness when he speaks I don't see what he does better than Martinez. 

[pete0]

1 hour ago, Paddock said:

Martinez first season was with Moyes team, Koemans first season was with Martinez teams. Not sure how you can't compare it any other way tbh.

He changed the spine. Stones,  Barry, Barkley,  Lukaku. 

[Guest]

Koeman needs time.

They need time to gel.

He's a European cup winner.

We've had a difficult start.

I believe Kenwright held back in the transfer of a striker.

We're still the only team to have taken a point off city.

He fixes his mistakes at half time.

Wow, how many other managers would get these many excuses. Also, I feel people simply post this shit just to get likes.

It's obvious to see, and I'll say it... We have regressed in creativity since Koeman took over. And the only reason Martinez regressed as a manager is because these so called supporters bio at half time when we didn't launch it up to lukaku quicker... Never mind we outplayed every team on the pitch leading up to this change. I blame our own fickle supporters for this demise.

[Newty82]

5 minutes ago, yamar said:

In my eyes it was a cup final. Get past utd and it was won.

 Behave!!! Talk about shifting the goal posts.

You nearly had me with the cup final though. I was typing thinking 'Did we? Did we? Must have been the 3rd season...Im sure we didn't?'

Haha.

[Newty82]

2 minutes ago, yamar said:

Koeman needs time.

They need time to gel.

He's a European cup winner.

We've had a difficult start.

I believe Kenwright held back in the transfer of a striker.

We're still the only team to have taken a point off city.

He fixes his mistakes at half time.

Wow, how many other managers would get these many excuses. Also, I feel people simply post this shit just to get likes.

It's obvious to see, and I'll say it... We have regressed in creativity since Koeman took over. And the only reason Martinez regressed as a manager is because these so called supporters bio at half time when we didn't launch it up to lukaku quicker... Never mind we outplayed every team on the pitch leading up to this change. I blame our own fickle supporters for this demise.

Christ. You're taking the blame game to a whole new level!

[Guest]

Just now, Newty82 said:

Christ. You're taking the blame game to a whole new level!

It's true Newty. I remember it like yesterday. It was half way through his third season. We got beat at home against a very average side but completely outplayed them. They got booed off at half time.

After this, there was an outcry for the ball to be played up to lukaku far quicker. The man buckled to pressure and we lost our whole identity as a team.

[pete0]

3 minutes ago, yamar said:

Koeman needs time.

They need time to gel.

He's a European cup winner.

We've had a difficult start.

I believe Kenwright held back in the transfer of a striker.

We're still the only team to have taken a point off city.

He fixes his mistakes at half time.

Wow, how many other managers would get these many excuses. Also, I feel people simply post this shit just to get likes.

It's obvious to see, and I'll say it... We have regressed in creativity since Koeman took over. And the only reason Martinez regressed as a manager is because these so called supporters bio at half time when we didn't launch it up to lukaku quicker... Never mind we outplayed every team on the pitch leading up to this change. I blame our own fickle supporters for this demise.

Martinez's stubborness led to his own demise. I'd have sacked him day one of the third season when he reverted back to his tippy tappy. 

[London Blue]

25 minutes ago, yamar said:

Koeman needs time.

They need time to gel.

He's a European cup winner.

We've had a difficult start.

I believe Kenwright held back in the transfer of a striker.

We're still the only team to have taken a point off city.

He fixes his mistakes at half time.

Wow, how many other managers would get these many excuses. Also, I feel people simply post this shit just to get likes.

It's obvious to see, and I'll say it... We have regressed in creativity since Koeman took over. And the only reason Martinez regressed as a manager is because these so called supporters bio at half time when we didn't launch it up to lukaku quicker... Never mind we outplayed every team on the pitch leading up to this change. I blame our own fickle supporters for this demise.

I have wondered whether you post comments above just to get attention.

[Newty82]

25 minutes ago, yamar said:

It's true Newty. I remember it like yesterday. It was half way through his third season. We got beat at home against a very average side but completely outplayed them. They got booed off at half time.

After this, there was an outcry for the ball to be played up to lukaku far quicker. The man buckled to pressure and we lost our whole identity as a team.

By half way through his 3rd season, even his most hardened supporters, of which I was one, knew his time was up.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, London Blue said:

I have wondered whether you post comments above just to get attention.

No, I post comments based on what I'm feeling about my club.

I'm not arsed about attention pal, but seeing as you based my whole post around that makes me think that this is your intention and you deflect it into me.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, London Blue said:

I have wondered whether you post comments above just to get attention.

If you read the above, Newty replies with educated responses with no bad intentions. 

You on the other hand just look for it.

I don't wanna know your thoughts on my team anyway... It's just not relevant.

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, MikeO said:

I don't think there's a single person on here in that "brigade", I don't think it exists; we just have different ideas on the way to get better.

Really are you for real, a little bit of koemanite terminology for you there Mike, shit isn't it. Just like the manager and the dick head who said it to me.

[nyblue23]

15 hours ago, Palfy said:

Like you didn't realise we had a good start last season, that's what I questioned and you call me unreal.

If you think 4 wins and draw in your first 5 game's of the season is a poor start then your off you rocker completely nuts.

Fantastic start. Give me West Brom, Stoke, Sunderland, Middlesborough and Bournemouth again in the first 5 matches of the season. Oh wait, you can't because two were relegated and two more may be this season.

Take your blinders off, buddy. Not even a comparison to be made between the competition for the first six matches of this season and last. Only comparison is that we played both Tottenham and Stoke and took less than 6 points between the two both seasons.

Garbage thinker, you are.

[Palfy]

3 minutes ago, nyblue23 said:

Fantastic start. Give me West Brom, Stoke, Sunderland, Middlesborough and Bournemouth again in the first 5 matches of the season. Oh wait, you can't because two were relegated and two more may be this season.

Take your blinders off, buddy. Not even a comparison to be made between the competition for the first six matches of this season and last. Only comparison is that we played both Tottenham and Stoke and took less than 6 points between the two both seasons.

Garbage thinker, you are.

Look at what you posted you idiot, and stop trying to find excuses for talking out your arse.

Maybe Baseball is more to your liking cause football definitely isn't bye.

[barryj]

This topics a great read 🙄 Never would have known we came back from a goal down to win! 

[London Blue]

3 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Look at what you posted you idiot, and stop trying to find excuses for talking out your arse.

Maybe Baseball is more to your liking cause football definitely isn't bye.

Hey, calm down. No excuse for being so abusive.

People have different opinions, deal with it or your spend allot of your life being angry.

I like baseball, American football and other sports so do many other people, this does not affect my love for Everton.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, barryj said:

This topics a great read 🙄 Never would have known we came back from a goal down to win! 

Keep accepting lower than mediocrity then.

[barryj]

I’ve not been involved 😳 

I have my opinions of where we are at and where we’ve been previously. I won’t accept mediocrity and haven’t said anywhere I would. FYI I was a big supporter of Martinez but in the end he needed to go (not sure how thats relevant now). 

[London Blue]

1 minute ago, yamar said:

Keep accepting lower than mediocrity then.

We are 6 games into a season, we have played 4 of the top teams in the country, with a team that has many new players and not replaced its top scorer.

Yes the manager has made mistakes and needs to learn, but he improved us  after the Martinez failure and got us into europe.

He needs time, which he should have, but if we have not started looking like a top 6 team challenging the top 4 by Christmas then he should go.

[Palfy]

4 minutes ago, London Blue said:

Hey, calm down. No excuse for being so abusive.

People have different opinions, deal with it or your spend allot of your life being angry.

I like baseball, American football and other sports so do many other people, this does not affect my love for Everton.

London scroll back to the beginning of this, and your see who started the shit when he got proven wrong, and I don't need you to tell me to calm down, I'm completely calm but thanks for the advice but not needed on this occasion.

[Bailey]

I don't care who we have played so far, it's the fact that our performances have been so poor. Even West Ham put up more fight than us. Southampton didn't roll over in the first half hour against Utd. Bournemouth didn't just sit back and let 11 man City have their way with them before conceding late. Leicester even game Chelsea a good game when we didn't even turn up against them. 

 

If we want to start competing for the top 6, let alone the top 4, we have to start performing in the big games.

 

 

[London Blue]

15 minutes ago, Palfy said:

London scroll back to the beginning of this, and your see who started the shit when he got proven wrong, and I don't need you to tell me to calm down, I'm completely calm but thanks for the advice but not needed on this occasion.

I know people get excited and emotional about this, who doesn't, its just I hoped a nights sleep may of taken the heat out of this thread but alas no. It's not you but its starting to turn into a slanging match. I saw all the posts from last night and this morning and yours struck me as a bit rough and I thought I would call you out on it.

It was the "maybe baseball is your thing" to an American blue that I thought was out of order.

I didn't mean to come over patronising. 

 

[MikeO]

47 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Really are you for real, a little bit of koemanite terminology for you there Mike, shit isn't it. Just like the manager and the dick head who said it to me.

What?

[London Blue]

4 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I don't care who we have played so far, it's the fact that our performances have been so poor. Even West Ham put up more fight than us. Southampton didn't roll over in the first half hour against Utd. Bournemouth didn't just sit back and let 11 man City have their way with them before conceding late. Leicester even game Chelsea a good game when we didn't even turn up against them. 

 

If we want to start competing for the top 6, let alone the top 4, we have to start performing in the big games.

 

 

Agreed, but we did compete against Utd, yes were were rubbish for the first 10 minutes and unlucky / rubbish in the last 10 minutes when we went gung ho for an equaliser but the rest of the game we looked quite good and the most likely to score. We got a result against City where most teams will be torn a new one. 

Spurs and Chelsea yes I completely agree we were dog shit. We do need to compete against the top 5/6 teams and if we are not doing by by Christmas then I agree he needs to go.