Longest Thread For Drivel (or the Romelu Lukaku thread)

[Blue 250]

Feel free to expand on these examples... if i hear about the Chelsea goal again I may mistake him for ricky villa and believe that he does this every week....oh you can have the arsenal cut in from the right goal too.

 

I'm all ears.

 

For fucks sake, it's 2:41 in the morning, does your hate have no time limits.Billy go get some help !

 

Everton at present are rubbish......................this little problem is far from Lukakus fault, but hey, don't let that get in the way as you troll the internet in search of Lukaku fans.

[Eric]

Literally everyone else deserves to be slated before Lukaku at the moment.

[Hafnia]

Anyhow enough has been said on him. Sick and tired of hearing about his lofty ambitions and watching a lazy player who can't retain the ball.

 

It's costing us big and virtually no one is accepting this. It's all very well scoring goals and being Johnny on the spot but unless he can limit the amount of complete fuck ups he makes on the ball then it's a false economy.

 

Essentially we need to find a way of excluding him from the build up play so that 9 other players can work together in getting the ball into the box. The most obvious way is to have a partner who will do the donkey work. Run the channels, drop, hold up play and bring the midfield in as he simply can not do this.

 

It's not ideal is it? But it's time to patch this up. I'm not going to argue the fact of whether he works hard, good at passing, holding it up.... he quite clearly isn't up to it - at all. He's shocking at it and relying on him to do this is akin to expecting phil jagielka to dribble the ball from the back. It's tantamount to handing possession to the opponents.

 

What he can do is finish - very well. So how can we get our team strong enough to allow him to operate like a modern day micky quinn?

 

First off we can't have 2 DM's. We need to find the sacrificial player which is going to allow us to play valencia next to him. For me that means Barry. Drop ross into the central role and give him responsibility with gana as his shield. Valencia can drop off for any passes and wait for ross to join in the attack. Keep lukaku on the shoulder of the last man.

 

It's got to be worth a shout cos we are screwed till January and there's alot of points to lose.

[Hafnia]

Just watched Costa give another masterclass. His goal is an example of pure desire, hardworking and yeah finishing.

 

There is absolutely no reason that Rom couldn't do that. He has the athleticism, size, surely the strength but he needs the aggression and determination to want to do that.

 

Costa is on another planet right now and fabregas said he makes it easy for him to make passes....

Edited December 11, 2016 by Hafnia

[Matt]

Where's the 'yawn' icon?

[SimonButtle]

Where's the 'yawn' icon?

It got exhausted of being posted in this thread so has gone to the pub!!

[Hafnia]

Where's the 'yawn' icon?

Rom had it and passed it to a watford player.

[Matt]

Rom had it and passed it to a watford player.

ha!

[Hafnia]

someone summarised him very well on GOT:-

 

"I am not knocking his goal scoring ability at all, its statistically up there with the best. The point you make about being isolated and the 'two v one' situation is were he badly fails. He doesn't try to make runs in the flanks, even when he pins himself to CB and a ball comes in that we need to stick to him, he doesn't do it. So many of our moves and attacking play breaks down via him, how are we meant to sustain attacks, gather momentum or bring midfielders into play when the ball doesn't stick? I don't buy into this 'not his game'. We are not playing to his strengths of what he would like, but has he got the heart for the club to change his game for the sake of the team? My answer is no he doesn't want to.
I cant have a player that contributes nothing for 3-4 games then scores a couple and so on....
I really want him to prove me so so wrong, and start putting in some shifts because right now we need him too more than ever.. I watched 3 games yesterday Costa, Rondon, Kane, Ibra, Mkhyterian, Firminho, all of them put a shift in for their team closing down etc... Please tell me what makes Lukaku exempt from doing that?? Its not a skill to work hard."

[Hafnia]

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/football/569600/Romelu-Lukaku-Diego-Costa-role-model-striker-Jamie-Redknapp

 

“There are times when he plays like a £60million centre forward and others when I would not pay £10m for him.

“Lukaku may have scored twice in the defeat by Watford on Saturday but the Belgian didn't have to work hard for those goals. There is so much more he could bring to Ronald Koeman's Everton side.

“I remember an interview with Thierry Henry in which Lukaku said how much he loves to study the likes of Lionel Messi. He should be modelling himself on Diego Costa.

“Lukaku is a battering ram of a forward who needs to be more aggressive and bully defenders.”

 

 

 

couldn't have put it better myself - the £60m player emerges once in a blue moon and yes his 2 goals on Saturday didn't kid everyone. The player that struggles to look £10m is far too often there. But I'm sure people will disagree with that...

 

oh yeah.... whilst we are at it....

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-striker-lukaku-says-blues-12305617

 

"When we work harder on the pitch we get more chances. The last 10 to 15 minutes of the game we created enough chances to equalise or win the game."

 

The last 10 or 15 minutes we had Valencia on the pitch.....

[markjazzbassist]

9 goals, 3 assists in 15 matches in a shit side. imagine if he had a payet feeding him.

[Hafnia]

9 goals, 3 assists in 15 matches in a shit side. imagine if he had a payet feeding him.

 

I would ask the question - what did he have to do to score those goals MJB? As Redknapp pointed out the two at the weekend were on a plate - he never had to work for them.

 

Payet would scream at him.

 

His hat-trick against Sunderland was on a plate - he had a dubious goal which I thought was Bolasies - 6 goals just there that are pretty much gimmes.

 

Its not a case of disputing if he can score goals - he can but he makes it abundantly clear that the team need to put them on a plate for him - they don't really come any other way.

 

The issue for me is what we need to do as a team to fit him in to get these goals.

 

1. we need to play without him as the lone front man being prepared to press or hustle the defence

2. we need to play an not expect him to win headers

3. we need to get the ball up front without expecting him to be able to hold it up to allow the midfielders to advance

4. when he does get the ball we need to expect him to lose it quite often and be ready to get back for the counter attack

5. we need to sacrifice a player so that we can play someone next to him who can do all the above.....

 

 

for me that is too much. Yes he can finish, he is composed in front of goal and finds the net. Does he do what costa did yesterday? a goal made out of sheer determination and aggression - using his size to bully the defender and score a goal. No.

 

The money we could get based on his goal stats may well get us 2 strikers who can "help the team" - not just "finish moves"

Edited December 12, 2016 by Hafnia

[Matt]

Don't care if they were on a plate, he was there and he finished. Simple as.

[markjazzbassist]

Don't care if they were on a plate, he was there and he finished. Simple as.

 

exactly

[Blue 250]

 

It's abundantly clear that having him up top alone is an absolute waste of everyone's time.

 

Very true, expecting him to win games on his own up front is a big ask.

 

If the defence and midfield had pulled their weight on Saturday.......maybe we would have won 2-0 !

[chalkpie]

He is still not closing down the backs when they are playing out the ball. Even the NBCSN commentator Graem LeSeaux said the same things, and mentioned he hadn't seen Rom do it once. I think he did more hustling this game but there is still the "laziness" aspect to his game. I love the guy, we need him big time, and he is quite talented, but if he can add this simple aspect to his game he becomes a much better player. Forcing errors out of the back even once out of say 20 times could lead to a goal. Sanchez and Ratface (Costa) are masters at this - now its time Rom puts his money where his mouth is.

[Bailey]

Rom did do it on several occasions, not anywhere near as many times as Costa would have but to say he didn't do it was a lie. Le Saux wouldn't have said it if it hadn't been a hot topic recently.

 

He even tracked back when he was playing wider.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Bailey

[Hafnia]

Rom did do it on several occasions, not anywhere near as many times as Costa would have but to say he didn't do it was a lie. Le Saux wouldn't have said it if it hadn't been a hot topic recently.

 

He even tracked back when he was playing wider.

 

A slight uplift maybe - no where near the acceptable level required.

 

You see.... all this with Haf banging his head against a brick wall calling out his laziness has had one big problem "the control element" not being there - not his inability to control but the presence of another footballer to compare the variables.

 

So.... Enner Valencia. Came on the last 20 minutes in the two previous games and we looked way more potent, more bite, the opposition more hurried on the ball. He gets 90 minutes and we look good pretty much all the way through and even when we didn't - he was the player who was trying to set the tone.

 

He's only a little thing - but blimey he's like a forward version of Idrissa Gueye - a right pain in the backside and yeah the defence hate it and our players like it.

 

Aside from the there are some really key stats - his pass completion was 75% - Lukaku's was 45%. His control and feet are very good. They both had the same percentage of headers won too.... despite there being amss of difference in height.

 

so whilst we are celebrating 3 points - lets look at why? It wasn't because we rely on one man to score the goals - more that we rely on the team to play together as a unit - "one spirit".

 

It's fair to say that Lukaku does not match this spirit on more occasions than not, and I'm not debating this - its a fact. His work rate is simply not on the scale required. If you need to see evidence of that compare him to Valencia.

 

"ah How many goals does Valencia score?" - some may ask.... fine - ask away. My answer will be "he can score zero goals if he plays like that and we concede less against a top team than a poor team whilst scoring more"... because at the end of the day its about points on the board for Everton - not having a golden boot contender wearing a blue shirt whilst we continue to allow teams to build from the back with ease and struggle to win games.

 

we won the game for more reasons than the difference between the two players, but that difference is a microcosm of the team itself.

[Matt]

 

A slight uplift maybe - no where near the acceptable level required.

 

You see.... all this with Haf banging his head against a brick wall calling out his laziness has had one big problem "the control element" not being there - not his inability to control but the presence of another footballer to compare the variables.

 

So.... Enner Valencia. Came on the last 20 minutes in the two previous games and we looked way more potent, more bite, the opposition more hurried on the ball. He gets 90 minutes and we look good pretty much all the way through and even when we didn't - he was the player who was trying to set the tone.

 

He's only a little thing - but blimey he's like a forward version of Idrissa Gueye - a right pain in the backside and yeah the defence hate it and our players like it.

 

Aside from the there are some really key stats - his pass completion was 75% - Lukaku's was 45%. His control and feet are very good. They both had the same percentage of headers won too.... despite there being amss of difference in height.

 

so whilst we are celebrating 3 points - lets look at why? It wasn't because we rely on one man to score the goals - more that we rely on the team to play together as a unit - "one spirit".

 

It's fair to say that Lukaku does not match this spirit on more occasions than not, and I'm not debating this - its a fact. His work rate is simply not on the scale required. If you need to see evidence of that compare him to Valencia.

 

"ah How many goals does Valencia score?" - some may ask.... fine - ask away. My answer will be "he can score zero goals if he plays like that and we concede less against a top team than a poor team whilst scoring more"... because at the end of the day its about points on the board for Everton - not having a golden boot contender wearing a blue shirt whilst we continue to allow teams to build from the back with ease and struggle to win games.

 

we won the game for more reasons than the difference between the two players, but that difference is a microcosm of the team itself.

I'll agree with that on one condition - you tell me where the goals that win matches come from. Because not scoring goals and meaning we concede less leads to at best more draws and less defeats IF the goals don't come from somewhere else.

 

On the whole though, I thought Valencia was fantastic.Only 2 appearences to give hope, so I won't get carried away, but the amount of space he created for Rom and Barkley (who then got really close to Rom giving him an immediate outlet and reducing the need for holding the ball up) was great.

 

I'd also challenge you on Rom's workrate yesterday, he was everywhere.

[StevO]

We won.

[Shy_Talk]

Drivel -

 

draw against spurs, city, man u, win against arsenal, bad drubbing from chelsea. chelsea game aside its almost (almost) like the squad have it in them to perform when faced with their self considered peers and go through the motions the rest of the time.

 

maybe.

[Hafnia]

I'll agree with that on one condition - you tell me where the goals that win matches come from. Because not scoring goals and meaning we concede less leads to at best more draws and less defeats IF the goals don't come from somewhere else.

 

On the whole though, I thought Valencia was fantastic.Only 2 appearences to give hope, so I won't get carried away, but the amount of space he created for Rom and Barkley (who then got really close to Rom giving him an immediate outlet and reducing the need for holding the ball up) was great.

 

I'd also challenge you on Rom's workrate yesterday, he was everywhere.

 

sorry not having it - a typical over response to any slight improvements. Its like in games where his touch is acceptable, people go on like he's suddenly turned into berbatov.

 

His work rate last night was something like "I need to run towards the keeper as he has had the ball played back to him and I need to make an effort"....instead of "the keepers got the ball, if I get there quick enough I may actually block the kick or force a mistake"

 

Its called going through the motions and he isn't kidding anyone. There's a big difference. He runs towards the player with the ball as if to say "I'm coming and you need to get rid of it now" - not "I'm gonna win this off you".

 

The question "where do goals come from - or lack of conceding them" - quite a good question cos I have the answer.

 

They come from doing the small things and the ugly things well which ensures you get more time on the ball thus avoiding the team having the ball and you getting more chance to score. The small and ugly isn't what Rom does. Idrissa typifies the typem of player who does this and certainly McCarthy and Valencia did this last night.

 

Lukaku can score goals - but he is unprepared to match the level of work that we seen last night that was the difference between a Watford result and an Arsenal result. That simple.

[Hafnia]

I've been calling for Lukaku to go out wide for quite a while now.

 

I'd argue that it is his most effective position, particularly against stronger teams. He does a lot of damage running at an isolated fullback. At the start of the match we were being told how amazing Hector Bellerin was, Lukaku ran the socks off him. He was bigger, stronger and faster.

 

Next Monday we face a Liverpool side who we know have a soft spot in defence. We could use a similar tactic with Valencia occupying the central defenders and Lukaku having a go at their fullbacks. Whoever they put out there will not be able to contain Lukaku.

 

Once he gets into his stride he is fast as they come, takes a few steps like but yeah he's away. Was it bellerin he beat in the race? I was told he's the quickest in the league?

 

I would play him out on the right for that.

 

apparently it was gabriel not bellerin which explains it - he's quick but not that quick. Bellerin is insane. but yeah, we need to see more of that.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Hafnia

[pete0]

I thought he'd be getting praised for running then ragged and winning more than his fair share of headers. Last 20 mins he's was blowing out of his arse, but still done well as a target man.

 

Barkley was the laziest player on the pitch. Doesn't move until he gets the ball, once he receives it stops and turns slowing down the attack and missing the run. Compare the heat maps, Barkley has strolled round whereas Lukaku was running on fumes at the end.

[Matt]

Overreaction, Haf? Nope, he put in a shift in both halves. You just won't give credit where it's due, surprise suprise.

[Shy_Talk]

Maybe with some legs and urgency around him the ethic to bust a gut has been rediscovered. Should be netting 20 league goals a season as a minimum and that's what'll get him his dream move.

 

Maybe playing upfront with players not instantly being booed by their own fans (Barks) has rubbed a bit of positivity off on him.

 

Maybe the bright lights of an evening game at home and the crowd demanding grim-steel and loaded-challenges inspired some gusto into the entire eleven.

 

Maybe...

[Matt]

http://m.bbc.com/sport/football/38278497

 

"Players with highest % of goals scored or assisted for their team this season"

 

About half way down, 2nd only to Defoe and way ahead of the others.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Matt

[Hafnia]

http://m.bbc.com/sport/football/38278497

 

"Players with highest % of goals scored or assisted for their team this season"

 

About half way down, 2nd only to Defoe and way ahead of the others.

Hardly a brain surgeon to work that out Matt. As I've said in numerous posts we are set up to provide him... and yes he has goals but as a team we have been poor points wise and his "footballing stats" are woeful.

 

45% pass completion?! Thats horrendous and it's rarely much better than that. Simply put - accommodating him requires alot from our team in terms of winning back balls, gambling on him retaining the ball etc.

 

It's all very well being there to put the icing on the cake. Are you saying his inability to keep the ball or work for the team isn't a problem?

 

I think it's a major problem.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Hafnia

[Matt]

Not saying anything, just pointing out how productive he is and, by contrast, how little anyone else does

[Hafnia]

Not saying anything, just pointing out how productive he is and, by contrast, how little anyone else does

Can you explain why he hasn't made an many headed clearances as jagielka or as many tackles as gana?