General Election/UK Politics

[Chach]

Got some hearty lols out of this "Labour's in a shambles, UKIP on the brink of death and the Lib Dems looking like a EU remain tribute act"

 

[Palfy]

My poll came out as follows.

1) Labour

2) Plaid Gymru

3) Lib Dems

Well I'm definitely not voting Labour Corbyn needs to go and the party needs to pull away from their extreme left position.

At a guess don't think that Welsh party would have a candidate in my constituency.

So that leaves me with Lib Dem which I been championing in previous post.

So this is my party political broadcast on behalf of TTF,if you feel disenfranchised with Labour, can't stand the Tories, then join me in voting Lib Dem and take control back from the far right extremist government.

[Guest rusty747]

Mine was Conservative followed by UKIP

[Chach]

[johnh]

Labour: Corbyn - 'nuff said.

Liberal: Nickname 'The bronze party' because they usually come third', third will be out of reach in June.

UKIP: Farage -'nuff said

Greens: Single issue party (The North Korean Army are half-way across the channel. Sorry we can't bomb them as it will have an adverse effect on the climate.)

Monster Raving Loony Party: Possible, improvement on first four.

Now, whose left?

 

[Matt]

Labour: Corbyn - 'nuff said.

Liberal: Nickname 'The bronze party' because they usually come third', third will be out of reach in June.

UKIP: Farage -'nuff said

Greens: Single issue party (The North Korean Army are half-way across the channel. Sorry we can't bomb them as it will have an adverse effect on the climate.)

Monster Raving Loony Party: Possible, improvement on first four.

Now, whose left?

 

SNP

[Lowensda]

Labour: Corbyn - 'nuff said.

Liberal: Nickname 'The bronze party' because they usually come third', third will be out of reach in June.

UKIP: Farage -'nuff said

Greens: Single issue party (The North Korean Army are half-way across the channel. Sorry we can't bomb them as it will have an adverse effect on the climate.)

Monster Raving Loony Party: Possible, improvement on first four.

Now, whose left?

 

 

And here is my issue with politics as a whole.

 

There's not one party that I can get behind and if I do, it's undone by the fact most of the influential figures are either wet or corrupt.

 

We need someone to step from the shadows and just be great at everything. Support everything that is morally right and protect the vulnerable. Tax the large corporate companies and use that money to support local businesses and causes. A party to be sensible with decisions on the NHS, education and International issues. Stand for what's right.

 

They're all selfish and blinded by their own personal gains.

 

I wish I understood politics enough to do something about it.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Lowensda

[Bailey]

Corbyn trying to bring down the country, especially businesses, with his manifesto.

 

Increase corporation tax (models shows this actually decreases tax revenue received rather than increase it as the big companies go elsewhere - just what we need for Brexit).

 

Increase the minimum wage - All well and good but it will ruin small to medium sized businesses, increasing unemployment and therefore also increasing benefits.

[Chach]

 

And here is my issue with politics as a whole.

 

There's not one party that I can get behind and if I do, it's undone by the fact most of the influential figures are either wet or corrupt.

 

We need someone to step from the shadows and just be great at everything. Support everything that is morally right and protect the vulnerable. Tax the large corporate companies and use that money to support local businesses and causes. A party to be sensible with decisions on the NHS, education and International issues. Stand for what's right.

 

They're all selfish and blinded by their own personal gains.

 

I wish I understood politics enough to do something about it.

 

 

Has Congleton ever had anything other than a Tory?

[Matt]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bbc-itv-general-election-debate-2017-theresa-may_uk_58f772afe4b029063d35a543?w7p

 

Good.

[Guest rusty747]

I have to say, I have read more sensible opinions on this thread than I have heard from most politicians in a long time.

 

I think May will win big and, in the short term, it might be no bad thing. Post brexit and post 2022 election, Labour will hopefully be able to mount more of a credible opposition and post brexit common sense will start to prevail.

[Lowensda]

 

 

Has Congleton ever had anything other than a Tory?

 

Doesn't look like it?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congleton_(UK_Parliament_constituency)

[Matt]

I have to say, I have read more sensible opinions on this thread than I have heard from most politicians in a long time.

 

I think May will win big and, in the short term, it might be no bad thing. Post brexit and post 2022 election, Labour will hopefully be able to mount more of a credible opposition and post brexit common sense will start to prevail.

there's nothing common about sense....

[Matt]

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html

 

Interesting to see the parallels between Conservatives and increase in national debt...

[Lowensda]

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html

 

Interesting to see the parallels between Conservatives and increase in national debt...

 

These are the guys who were tasked with lowering national debts and running the country "properly" in their eyes.

[markjazzbassist]

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html

 

Interesting to see the parallels between Conservatives and increase in national debt...

 

same thing in america. the "we cut taxes and reduce debt" is a farce, actually the ones that want to spend it more reduce the debt somehow, Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. Not sure how the conservative we cut debt myth still exists.

[Matt]

 

These are the guys who were tasked with lowering national debts and running the country "properly" in their eyes.

It's the EU's fault, Ten. You should know that

[Chach]

Come on gents you have to be even handed, that debt relates to the GFC and without it a lot of people would have suffered (more than they already have)

[johnh]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bbc-itv-general-election-debate-2017-theresa-may_uk_58f772afe4b029063d35a543?w7p

 

Good.

Well you can't blame her, the BBC have form when it comes to selecting audiences.

[Matt]

Come on gents you have to be even handed, that debt relates to the GFC and without it a lot of people would have suffered (more than they already have)

Very true, it does. But nearly 8 years later, it's still rising despite the global markets stabilizing and improving.

[Matt]

Well you can't blame her, the BBC have form when it comes to selecting audiences.

I assume the same with ITV too? Your defence of the Tories is matched only by my hatred of them

 

Either way, she can't just call an election with 6 weeks possible preparation time and not debate with the other parties. Its a few hours of TV with, theoretically, the same preparation as if she was going out on the campaign trail. So why is she avoiding a public, televised debate? I think it's because she knows that's her biggest weakness so she's actively avoiding any potential slip-ups.

[Chach]

Very true, it does. But nearly 8 years later, it's still rising despite the global markets stabilizing and improving.

 

As it is in most countries with progressive governments, it's a situation not getting turned around quickly. Japan had their similar financial crisis in 1990 and they're still a basket case.

 

 

Edit: That wont stop tory governments taking the opportunity to reduce taxes and shrink services/welfare though.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Chach

[MikeO]

Well you can't blame her, the BBC have form when it comes to selecting audiences.

 

So she shouldn't go on in case she's asked some difficult questions?

 

Plus the "left wing biased" BBC is a handy myth popularised by the majority of the media (which is firmly "right") imo. I've been in a Question Time audience and it was very balanced; had to fill in a long application form and have a phone conversation with a researcher before I was selected, there plenty of Tories there as well as few real far right fruit-loops.

[MikeO]

i found these guides very helpful

 

https://uk.isidewith.com/political-quiz

 

Green 67%

Labour 67%

LIbDem 62%

SNP 60%

Plaid Cymru 46%

Sinn Féin 40%

UKIP 31% (WTF?)

Conservative 29%

[Lowensda]

My results are quite clear cut!

 

73%Liberal Democrat

72%Labour

71%SNP

69%Plaid Cymru

65%Democratic Unionist

61%Conservative

58%Green

58%UKIP

56%Sinn Féin

55%British National

 

Edited April 20, 2017 by Lowensda

[Matt]

Green 67%

Labour 67%

LIbDem 62%

SNP 60%

Plaid Cymru 46%

Sinn Féin 40%

UKIP 31% (WTF?)

Conservative 29%

not far off mine

[Cornish Steve]

As always, I'm rather a complex mix, supporting some policies and not others of every party.

LIbDem 68%

SNP 64%

Green 63%

Labour 63%

Plaid Cymru 61%

Conservative 54%

UKIP 51%

Sinn Féin 49%

Democratic Unionist: 40%

British National: 29%

Edited April 20, 2017 by Cornish Steve

[markjazzbassist]

 

As always, I'm rather a complex mix, supporting some policies and not others of every party.

LIbDem 68%

SNP 64%

Green 63%

Labour 63%

Plaid Cymru 61%

Conservative 54%

UKIP 51%

Sinn Féin 49%

Democratic Unionist: 40%

British National: 29%

 

 

you may be irish, welsh, scottish, progressive, conservative, but you sure as hell are NOT british

[MikeO]

 

you may be irish, welsh, scottish, progressive, conservative, but you sure as hell are NOT british

 

I was down as 20% odd British and DU while having zero issues aligned with them so I left them off my list. I'm horrified that I agree with UKIP and the tories on anything, need to reassess my values .

[Palfy]

I was down as 20% odd British and DU while having zero issues aligned with them so I left them off my list. I'm horrified that I agree with UKIP and the tories on anything, need to reassess my values .

I think you do at the moment your a tree hugger, come on Mike get with the program a west country resident you must have Lib Dem coursing through your veins.

[MikeO]

I think you do at the moment your a tree hugger, come on Mike get with the program a west country resident you must have Lib Dem coursing through your veins.

 

Since the LibDems will be second in my constituency, albeit miles behind the Tory, I shall definitely be voting for them. UKIP came second here in 2015 but the libdems dropped 22.9% in line with the national rout, confident they'll have a lot more than nine MPs this time though they won't get close to the 62 they had in 2010. Thirty would be my estimate.

[Palfy]

Since the LibDems will be second in my constituency, albeit miles behind the Tory, I shall definitely be voting for them. UKIP came second here in 2015 but the libdems dropped 22.9% in line with the national rout, confident they'll have a lot more than nine MPs this time though they won't get close to the 62 they had in 2010. Thirty would be my estimate.

I know what you mean the constituency I live in is staunch conservative, so unless I become the world's biggest mass murderer by some 6,000 or so people they will romp it.

When I lived 15 minutes away in Swindon East it was always marginal seat swinging between Labour and Conservative, wish I still lived in a marginal seat where your vote can make a difference.

[Bailey]

In some parallel universe David Milliband became Labour leader, won the last general election, there was no EU referendum and we were all quietly content with our lives and more than likely better off for it.

[Cornish Steve]

In some parallel universe David Milliband became Labour leader, won the last general election, there was no EU referendum and we were all quietly content with our lives and more than likely better off for it.

 

While those outdoors strive to avoid flying pigs and those in Hell enjoy a snowball fight.

[holystove]

question from an outsider: seeing how hugely unpopular Corbyn is, is it possible he will loose his seat? If so, can he continue as leader or is it not necessary the leader of the party is also an MP?

 

Apparently a lot of people on here don't want to vote for a certain party based on who's the leader of that party. Personally I would vote for the most capable politician in my constituency. For example, if I were to live in Rushcliffe I'd vote for the Conservative candidate, but if I lived in the East Midlands I'd vote Lib Dem, etc.

(I have, in past elections, voted for the Green Party, the Liberal party and even the eurosceptic party.)

[MikeO]

question from an outsider: seeing how hugely unpopular Corbyn is, is it possible he will loose his seat? If so, can he continue as leader or is it not necessary the leader of the party is also an MP?

 

Apparently a lot of people on here don't want to vote for a certain party based on who's the leader of that party. Personally I would vote for the most capable politician in my constituency. For example, if I were to live in Rushcliffe I'd vote for the Conservative candidate, but if I lived in the East Midlands I'd vote Lib Dem, etc.

(I have, in past elections, voted for the Green Party, the Liberal party and even the eurosceptic party.)

 

Not a chance in hell he'll lose his seat, had a twenty thousand plus majority in 2015 in Islington North (29,659 v 8,465 for second place). He's not hugely unpopular with everyone which is why he won the Labour leadership vote (twice) by a landslide, voted for by party members. Unfortunately he's a throwback to old fashioned Labour who became unelectable hence the move to "new Labour" and the Tony Blair era in the nineties. New Labour were really "moderate" Tories 2,0 and the two main parties became virtually indistinguishable. Lib Dems became the most left minded mainstream party (even left wing luminaries like Billy Bragg were telling people to vote for them).

 

Corbyn may be greatly unpopular with the majority but there are hundreds of thousands, possibly millions, of people with traditional old fashioned and unfashionable Labour views still who are fiercely loyal and delighted to see the party go back to what it always stood for (in their opinion). I agree with a huge amount of what Corbyn says and I think he's honest and a truly conviction politician who's not going to compromise his opinions to gain power.

 

Having said that the way the country is currently (unless the World tilts on its axis) he's totally unelectable.

[johnh]

 

Since the LibDems will be second in my constituency, albeit miles behind the Tory, I shall definitely be voting for them. UKIP came second here in 2015 but the libdems dropped 22.9% in line with the national rout, confident they'll have a lot more than nine MPs this time though they won't get close to the 62 they had in 2010. Thirty would be my estimate.

 

Currently, the LibDems can fit their MP's into a Renault Espace. After June, I think they will maybe need another Espace.

[MikeO]

 

Currently, the LibDems can fit their MP's into a Renault Espace. After June, I think they will maybe need another Espace.

 

And once again, due to our absurd electoral system, they won't have the representation their share of the vote warrants. But neither will UKIP so it's not all bad news.

[johnh]

 

And once again, due to our absurd electoral system, they won't have the representation their share of the vote warrants. But neither will UKIP so it's not all bad news.

It will be better when the boundary changes are implemented.

[MikeO]

May on the foreign aid budget...

 

"Let's be clear, the 0.7% commitment remains and will remain."

 

So that's that gone then.

[Matt]

Surely she's committing to 1.4% then?

[MikeO]

Surely she's committing to 1.4% then?

 

Either that or free supplies of magnolia paint for every UK citizen under the age of four or subsidised manicures for everyone whose middle name begins with T, could be anything.

[Bailey]

 

Not a chance in hell he'll lose his seat, had a twenty thousand plus majority in 2015 in Islington North (29,659 v 8,465 for second place). He's not hugely unpopular with everyone which is why he won the Labour leadership vote (twice) by a landslide, voted for by party members. Unfortunately he's a throwback to old fashioned Labour who became unelectable hence the move to "new Labour" and the Tony Blair era in the nineties. New Labour were really "moderate" Tories 2,0 and the two main parties became virtually indistinguishable. Lib Dems became the most left minded mainstream party (even left wing luminaries like Billy Bragg were telling people to vote for them).

 

Corbyn may be greatly unpopular with the majority but there are hundreds of thousands, possibly millions, of people with traditional old fashioned and unfashionable Labour views still who are fiercely loyal and delighted to see the party go back to what it always stood for (in their opinion). I agree with a huge amount of what Corbyn says and I think he's honest and a truly conviction politician who's not going to compromise his opinions to gain power.

 

Having said that the way the country is currently (unless the World tilts on its axis) he's totally unelectable.

He seems to have quite a cultish following of hardcore supporters.

 

Corbyn misses the boat in my opinion. The country is crying out for a leader to represent the working and middle classes, something the name of his party suggests they should be. I have looked at some of his pledges and they seem to be anti business. Increase corporation task, increase minimum wage, increase employee collective bargaining powers, remove zero hours contracts etc. If labour get into power even more businesses will struggle or move abroad and if that happens more people will be out of work or they will be on less hours and that in turn will require the govt to pay more in benefits.

 

If businesses are successful, employees have more choice, the govt gets more in taxes and people have more disposable income to spend at other businesses.

[pete0]

He seems to have quite a cultish following of hardcore supporters.

 

Corbyn misses the boat in my opinion. The country is crying out for a leader to represent the working and middle classes, something the name of his party suggests they should be. I have looked at some of his pledges and they seem to be anti business. Increase corporation task, increase minimum wage, increase employee collective bargaining powers, remove zero hours contracts etc. If labour get into power even more businesses will struggle or move abroad and if that happens more people will be out of work or they will be on less hours and that in turn will require the govt to pay more in benefits.

 

If businesses are successful, employees have more choice, the govt gets more in taxes and people have more disposable income to spend at other businesses.

In this country businesses were prioritised over the people during the recession. Workers rights and wages were savaged, and the benefits system squeezed the poorest even more. Now the businesses are booming more than ever yet, the workers aren't being compensated. It all stays at the top, and doesn't get spent in this country. We have a shit house corrupt government only looking out for themselves. One more tory turn and there will be anarchy.

[markjazzbassist]

He seems to have quite a cultish following of hardcore supporters.

 

Corbyn misses the boat in my opinion. The country is crying out for a leader to represent the working and middle classes, something the name of his party suggests they should be. I have looked at some of his pledges and they seem to be anti business. Increase corporation task, increase minimum wage, increase employee collective bargaining powers, remove zero hours contracts etc. If labour get into power even more businesses will struggle or move abroad and if that happens more people will be out of work or they will be on less hours and that in turn will require the govt to pay more in benefits.

 

If businesses are successful, employees have more choice, the govt gets more in taxes and people have more disposable income to spend at other businesses.

 

this is a fallacy. if the businesses leave, others will start to fill their place. the cost of domestic products/services is always cheaper than an import.

[Cornish Steve]

 

this is a fallacy. if the businesses leave, others will start to fill their place. the cost of domestic products/services is always cheaper than an import.

Not true, Mark. Companies that have outsourced overseas have, on the whole, thrived. Those that refused to do so are mostly struggling or defunct. Yes, other companies may step in, but their costs will be out of step, which means exports will also plummet.

 

Georgia used to be a Mecca for clothing manufacturers. Now there are none left because the cost of outsourcing manufacturing is so much less. It's the same for service industries. Most accountants outsource a majority of work overseas. If they didn't, their prices would soar and they'd be out of business.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Cornish Steve

[markjazzbassist]

the demand doesn't change Steve simple economics. If people live there and need a product there is demand. You leave someone else will open or move there to take advantage of the demand.

[Bailey]

the demand doesn't change Steve simple economics. If people live there and need a product there is demand. You leave someone else will open or move there to take advantage of the demand.

 

 

 

this is a fallacy. if the businesses leave, others will start to fill their place. the cost of domestic products/services is always cheaper than an import.

 

Its not fallacy at all, maybe more so historically but not anymore given the way you can access global markets much easier.

 

We used to be a largely industrious country but there are barely any left now. If you start tightening regulations or taxing the services industry more than other countries they will also leave.

[Bailey]

In this country businesses were prioritised over the people during the recession. Workers rights and wages were savaged, and the benefits system squeezed the poorest even more. Now the businesses are booming more than ever yet, the workers aren't being compensated. It all stays at the top, and doesn't get spent in this country. We have a shit house corrupt government only looking out for themselves. One more tory turn and there will be anarchy.

 

Without business, people will struggle. The recessions screwed everyone, businesses failed, people lost their jobs and with less money, of course benefits were squeezed, especially when a lot of people were receiving benefits when they shouldn't have been.

 

Benefits should be there for the people that need them when shit hits the fan. Unfortunately the system had been abused for so long that people were milking it and taking money from those who worked all their life, lost their job and want to work but cant get a new job.

 

Whether its Tory/Labour/Lib Dem, the government will always be crooked as greed seems to count for more than doing whats right by yourself and the country. Unfortunately this also applies to people in every walk of life, too many people are out for an easy buck, instead of working hard and grafting for it.

[MikeO]

 

Without business, people will struggle. The recessions screwed everyone, businesses failed, people lost their jobs and with less money, of course benefits were squeezed, especially when a lot of people were receiving benefits when they shouldn't have been.

 

Benefits should be there for the people that need them when shit hits the fan. Unfortunately the system had been abused for so long that people were milking it and taking money from those who worked all their life, lost their job and want to work but cant get a new job.

 

Whether its Tory/Labour/Lib Dem, the government will always be crooked as greed seems to count for more than doing whats right by yourself and the country. Unfortunately this also applies to people in every walk of life, too many people are out for an easy buck, instead of working hard and grafting for it.

 

Benefit fraud is massively exaggerated by the media and the government.

 

From personal experience, living as a carer to a disabled wife, the change from DLA to PIP by IDS wanting to "target money where it's really needed" was complete bullshit. The governments stated aim was to remove 20% of DLA claimants, thus reducing the benefit bill by taking people who by the existing rules qualified but by the new ones didn't and telling them they were now all better. Their own figures at the time put fraud at less than 0.5% of claims, and I don't know how the fuck those 0.5% managed it because you have such a huge and detailed form to fill in plus you need the evidence of medical professionals; it's a complete and utter nightmare I assure you. PIP is worse, and much harder to get and people are assessed face to face by non medical professionals and even if a raft of doctors and specialists say one thing if a non-pro (from a private company who are tasked with reducing the number of claimants for which they'll be rewarded) then you're stuffed. Unless you get the right advice and appeal where most negative decisions are overturned.

 

We're OK because I'm not daft and know how to go about stuff, many (particularly people with mental health issues) just give in. Very many cases of suicide on record as a result.

 

I'm not saying benefit fraud doesn't exist, but I will say with absolute certainty that it costs the country a fraction of what tax avoidance by the rich and large corporations does.

[pete0]

 

Without business, people will struggle. The recessions screwed everyone, businesses failed, people lost their jobs and with less money, of course benefits were squeezed, especially when a lot of people were receiving benefits when they shouldn't have been.

 

Benefits should be there for the people that need them when shit hits the fan. Unfortunately the system had been abused for so long that people were milking it and taking money from those who worked all their life, lost their job and want to work but cant get a new job.

 

Whether its Tory/Labour/Lib Dem, the government will always be crooked as greed seems to count for more than doing whats right by yourself and the country. Unfortunately this also applies to people in every walk of life, too many people are out for an easy buck, instead of working hard and grafting for it.

There is give and take, and now it's time for the businesses to start giving back. Not everyone had to lose their jobs. Businesses abused the new employment laws and used it to boost profits. Mike has covered benefits better than I could.

Tories won't. May had a great speech when first standing in. All facts show she has done the opposite though.

[pete0]

http://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.co.uk/2017/04/how-many-of-jeremy-corbyns-policies-do.html?m=1

[EFC-Paul]

What are the chances of Diane Abbott being launched into space and never to be seen again can we have an election on that? Please!!

[Romey 1878]

What are the chances of Diane Abbott being launched into space and never to be seen again can we have an election on that? Please!!

 

She been playing the racist card again?

[EFC-Paul]

 

She been playing the racist card again?

 

Probably, I came across a clip of her on social media were she was put on the spot by a bloke regarding some of her past comments and every time the woman opens her trap utter contradictive nonsense spills out

 

How she's even involved with politics and paid to do so is beyond me, I can't bare the daft cunt

[MikeO]

Not often I quote the Fail but this is interesting!

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4436044/Tory-lead-slashed-half-tax-U-turn.html

[Romey 1878]

Probably, I came across a clip of her on social media were she was put on the spot by a bloke regarding some of her past comments and every time the woman opens her trap utter contradictive nonsense spills out

 

How she's even involved with politics and paid to do so is beyond me, I can't bare the daft cunt

 

It's funny because she's one of the biggest racists there is - it's clear that she despises whites.

[Matt]

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2016/03/13/the-conservatives-have-been-the-biggest-borrowers-over-the-last-70-years/

[Louis]

Not often I quote the Fail but this is interesting!

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4436044/Tory-lead-slashed-half-tax-U-turn.html

On Channel 4's The Last Leg, they referred to a source that suggested this would happen. They reckon that Labour will be talking up how Conservatives will win to encourage Labour voters to vote while Conservatives will be talking down their chances to encourage Conservatives to vote.

[Matt]

http://www.filmsforaction.org/watch/mark-steel-on-conservative-doublespeak/