Liverpool Derby (Away) Wednesday December 4th

[Sibdane]

1 hour ago, TallPaul1878 said:

I think the fans now need to wake up and realise that our squad is fucked and needs major surgery. We are going to have to play horrible football to just lerch our way through the season until the transfer windows come around and we get a new manager.

We have spent millions on a mish mash of players who just dont fit into any kind of system

We've been waiting for the surgery to stop for years now, but we just keep bleeding. When does it end? Jesus, what a terrible time to be an Evertonian. 

[Cornish Steve]

1 hour ago, MC11 said:

The players are there mate. Richarlison, Iwobi, Digne etc will run themselves into the ground. We’ve got some top plates. I think Kean the striker will come good too.

 

Keane is poor. Sigurdsson is technically a very good player but doesn’t dominate/dictate games he just floats in and out of them. We are a man down at times with him in the pitch. 

I agree completely with this. We HAVE many of the players to be a top team, but they’re hindered by two things, which are linked. First, our manager has no vision, no sense of a game, and no track record. Second, we should never again play Sigurdsson or Schneiderlin in the team. I actually think Keane is a confidence player, so he can be turned around. We should play Kean and DC-L up front together, and Richarlison should be dropped until he shows more discipline. Games are won and lost in midfield: A strong and proven leader in midfield, together with a capable manager, would turn this team and season around. 

[pete0]

4 hours ago, Btay said:

Sidibe was good last game. Back 3 worked. Keane is just a bang average player that our horrible recruiting team wasted money on.

Didn't watch the game but what once saw of him is he's positionally unaware and shocking in the tackle. Far too one footed. 

4 hours ago, plaidharper said:

I miss Zouma so much...

As much as I wanted Zouma, Mina has been just as good if not better. 

2 hours ago, TallPaul1878 said:

I think the fans now need to wake up and realise that our squad is fucked and needs major surgery. We are going to have to play horrible football to just lerch our way through the season until the transfer windows come around and we get a new manager.

We have spent millions on a mish mash of players who just dont fit into any kind of system

The manager is there to make the system. Sigurdssen blatantly isn't cut out for the role behind the striker that Silva wants as he doesn't have the pace, to then move him into the most important position in the field is a joke. He's sold Davies down the swanny trying to carry him. 

2 hours ago, nogs said:

I can't understand any Evertonian trying to make the argument that we have anything like a good enough squad to compete in the league. You probably have to go back to when Smith signed Ginola and Gazza to find a worse group of players turning out for us. 

The squads fine. Alladyce got 8th with our worst one in my lifetime. Genuinely Silva is the most enept manager ever to grace the Premier league and that includes a Stuart Pierce who played David James up front. At least there was some reasoning behind it. 5 at the back with Keane and Sigurdssen in front is the worst piece of management I've saw in my lifetime. Didn't think anyone could out do Moyes playing Neville in the semi against Wigan but here you go. 

[pete0]

1 hour ago, Peter H said:

Real relegation worries now! 

Very. I've not been keen on the manager but thought the players would be good enough to carry us. Still believe a new manager could get us top 7 but the board have to act quick. 

[Sibdane]

3 hours ago, pete0 said:

Didn't watch the game but what once saw of him is he's positionally unaware and shocking in the tackle. Far too one footed. 

As much as I wanted Zouma, Mina has been just as good if not better. 

The manager is there to make the system. Sigurdssen blatantly isn't cut out for the role behind the striker that Silva wants as he doesn't have the pace, to then move him into the most important position in the field is a joke. He's sold Davies down the swanny trying to carry him. 

The squads fine. Alladyce got 8th with our worst one in my lifetime. Genuinely Silva is the most enept manager ever to grace the Premier league and that includes a Stuart Pierce who played David James up front. At least there was some reasoning behind it. 5 at the back with Keane and Sigurdssen in front is the worst piece of management I've saw in my lifetime. Didn't think anyone could out do Moyes playing Neville in the semi against Wigan but here you go. 

Bull fucking shit. 

[nogs]

6 hours ago, pete0 said:

Didn't watch the game but what once saw of him is he's positionally unaware and shocking in the tackle. Far too one footed. 

As much as I wanted Zouma, Mina has been just as good if not better. 

The manager is there to make the system. Sigurdssen blatantly isn't cut out for the role behind the striker that Silva wants as he doesn't have the pace, to then move him into the most important position in the field is a joke. He's sold Davies down the swanny trying to carry him. 

The squads fine. Alladyce got 8th with our worst one in my lifetime. Genuinely Silva is the most enept manager ever to grace the Premier league and that includes a Stuart Pierce who played David James up front. At least there was some reasoning behind it. 5 at the back with Keane and Sigurdssen in front is the worst piece of management I've saw in my lifetime. Didn't think anyone could out do Moyes playing Neville in the semi against Wigan but here you go. 

There is nothing fine about a squad with just three CBs to pick from and three CFs that include two kids who can't buy a goal and a complete waste of money who has a worse goals to games ration than Niasse. Even in midfield, yeah we have three players injured - but look at a Liverpool or Man City, they have an embarrassment of riches to cover the 3 key positions in the centre, they can rotate, they can handle injuries. We still don't know what Gana's replacement is like and take out Gomes as well, and we're absolutely fucked. That is not a 'fine' squad. Not for £450m fucking quid. 

[pete0]

7 hours ago, Sibdane said:

Bull fucking shit. 

Which ones been worst since the 90s? Alladyce's team had no pace at all which you just can't get away with anymore. 

5 hours ago, nogs said:

There is nothing fine about a squad with just three CBs to pick from and three CFs that include two kids who can't buy a goal and a complete waste of money who has a worse goals to games ration than Niasse. Even in midfield, yeah we have three players injured - but look at a Liverpool or Man City, they have an embarrassment of riches to cover the 3 key positions in the centre, they can rotate, they can handle injuries. We still don't know what Gana's replacement is like and take out Gomes as well, and we're absolutely fucked. That is not a 'fine' squad. Not for £450m fucking quid. 

You only need to play two centre halves, and both Mina and Holgate are good enough. As rubbish as Keane is Burnley managed to survive with him. Don't know why you think the forwards are an issue, we don't get the ball to them enough to judge them this season. The Niasse shout is just stupid, as good as his goal ratio was (3rd best in Europe at one point if my memory serves me right) there's a reason DCL kept him out the side or would you rather Niasse was our first choice? 

Davies has took up Gana's role and been a step up from him. Until last week we'd barely conceded a chance through the middle. If Gana was here we'd be even more fucked, these tactics are rubbish and have well and truly been found out and Gana would add nothing going forward and just be a liability defensively. 

[nogs]

3 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Which ones been worst since the 90s? Alladyce's team had no pace at all which you just can't get away with anymore. 

You only need to play two centre halves, and both Mina and Holgate are good enough. As rubbish as Keane is Burnley managed to survive with him. Don't know why you think the forwards are an issue, we don't get the ball to them enough to judge them this season. The Niasse shout is just stupid, as good as his goal ratio was (3rd best in Europe at one point if my memory serves me right) there's a reason DCL kept him out the side or would you rather Niasse was our first choice? 

Davies has took up Gana's role and been a step up from him. Until last week we'd barely conceded a chance through the middle. If Gana was here we'd be even more fucked, these tactics are rubbish and have well and truly been found out and Gana would add nothing going forward and just be a liability defensively. 

Dunno why I bother but here goes... I wasn't comparing DCL to Niasse, I was comparing  him Tosun to Niasse. Less goals, less impact, another 20 odd million spunked up the wall. If you don't think our lack of goals from our strikers is a problem then I'm not even going to bother debating it with you because it's a glaring issue. 

We played 3 CBs on Sunday and last night, we're an injury away from having to play Keane again every game. Thats guaranteed dropped points, a direct result of having no squad depth in the position. 

Davies and Gana... Pffff. I like Davies, but he isn't close to being Gana's level. Not as mobile, doesn't read the game as well. Different player altogether for me, Davies at his best is a creative 6, maybe even an 8 with the right players around him. Gana is a superb destroyer and cover for the back 4. It's not just that we miss him, it's that we're stuck playing Sigurdsson in midfield who is just a disgrace, and even Silva realises how shite Schneiderlin is because he'd rather play Sigurdsson over him. Again, all down to no depth, no options, having to play poor and rank out of form players 

[plaidharper]

13 hours ago, pete0 said:

As much as I wanted Zouma, Mina has been just as good if not better. 

Even if.. teams play with more than one CB so my sentiment still stands.  Zouma walks right into our backline.  Unless a new manager works wonders it looks like will be looking for more defense in the January transfer window.

1 hour ago, pete0 said:

Davies has took up Gana's role and been a step up from him. 

Not so sure on that one but there is no convincing you / not interested in doing so but Gana would have started with Davies in the game if he was here.  Though I admit it would not take much for someone to get in before Siggy, we just don't have anyone fit at the moment.

[markjazzbassist]

missed the match, was at work, glad i did.  just watched highlights.  on to the next.

[Palfy]

41 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

missed the match, was at work, glad i did.  just watched highlights.  on to the next.

Some people get all the luck

[Finn balor]

I watched it wing a load of reds. Finished a job today onsite and I had 15 lads taking the piss all day. We aren’t even competition with them anymore that’s how  far we have dropped. Last nights match was nothing but an embarrassment. Silva looking clueless, players arguing with themselves it was a joke. Going forward we were ok,  created more chances in a derby at Anfield than I can remember for a long time but defending as a team was horrific. Teams when they get past our midfield on a break look certain to score every time. Put silva out of his misery because that wasn’t Everton I watched last night. Or more worrying it was 

[pete0]

3 hours ago, nogs said:

Dunno why I bother but here goes... I wasn't comparing DCL to Niasse, I was comparing  him Tosun to Niasse. Less goals, less impact, another 20 odd million spunked up the wall. If you don't think our lack of goals from our strikers is a problem then I'm not even going to bother debating it with you because it's a glaring issue. 

We played 3 CBs on Sunday and last night, we're an injury away from having to play Keane again every game. Thats guaranteed dropped points, a direct result of having no squad depth in the position. 

Davies and Gana... Pffff. I like Davies, but he isn't close to being Gana's level. Not as mobile, doesn't read the game as well. Different player altogether for me, Davies at his best is a creative 6, maybe even an 8 with the right players around him. Gana is a superb destroyer and cover for the back 4. It's not just that we miss him, it's that we're stuck playing Sigurdsson in midfield who is just a disgrace, and even Silva realises how shite Schneiderlin is because he'd rather play Sigurdsson over him. Again, all down to no depth, no options, having to play poor and rank out of form players 

Apologies read it as all three, still he's better than Niasse. Surely that's not debatable. Niasse is unpredictable mess of a footballer but very limited. Depending on the system he's a good impact player not no more. Whereas Tosun could easily lead the line for a bottom half club. Both could be useful as squad players depending. 

We could have Ronaldo up front, it wouldn't make a difference. We don't make good enough chances to criticise the forwards. 

We've played three at the back how many times? Managers should use the players the best they can and not force a system on them. All three have been fit so the squad depth problem is just hypothetical. I do agree we should have got another centre back in but I'm happy with Holgate and Mina, just would have liked an experienced player. Any how looking at last year we've only really lost Zouma but he's not been missed at all. Mina has filled his boots comfortably. 

Gana is more mobile but that's about it. Positioning, passing, decision making, leadership, and even without being very good at it shooting Davies wins hands down. Is Gana is superb cover for the back four why was he constantly out of position and why did we concede a lot more chances and goals through the middle last season with him? I agree Sigurdssen shouldn't be in the middle but the managers not forced to. There's other players who can play. Baningime held his own 2 years ago albeit stalled through injury, but he's fully fit not yet Silva chose to play Sigurdssen out of position which is stupid given him and Davies aren't the quickest. Sigurdssen isn't a disgrace, the disgrace is Silva for tasking him with an almost impossible job rather than playing to his strengths. 

What players are out of form? I wouldn't say any are out of form, Keane and Sidibe shouldn't be at a top half club not that's just based on their ability. Keane was just as poor a player last year. Other than that there's Sigurdssen but he's not out of form he's just misused, last season he played no better with most agreeing he was anonymous unless he scored or got an assist. 100% the results are on the manager not the poor form of the players, they can work their socks off but they aren't gonna get results with these tactics unless the opposition don't turn up. Even last year the only team we won when going toe to toe was Cardiff who were missing their best players. Silva and his tactics are a joke. 

[nogs]

2 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Apologies read it as all three, still he's better than Niasse. Surely that's not debatable. Niasse is unpredictable mess of a footballer but very limited. Depending on the system he's a good impact player not no more. Whereas Tosun could easily lead the line for a bottom half club. Both could be useful as squad players depending. 

We could have Ronaldo up front, it wouldn't make a difference. We don't make good enough chances to criticise the forwards. 

We've played three at the back how many times? Managers should use the players the best they can and not force a system on them. All three have been fit so the squad depth problem is just hypothetical. I do agree we should have got another centre back in but I'm happy with Holgate and Mina, just would have liked an experienced player. Any how looking at last year we've only really lost Zouma but he's not been missed at all. Mina has filled his boots comfortably. 

Gana is more mobile but that's about it. Positioning, passing, decision making, leadership, and even without being very good at it shooting Davies wins hands down. Is Gana is superb cover for the back four why was he constantly out of position and why did we concede a lot more chances and goals through the middle last season with him? I agree Sigurdssen shouldn't be in the middle but the managers not forced to. There's other players who can play. Baningime held his own 2 years ago albeit stalled through injury, but he's fully fit not yet Silva chose to play Sigurdssen out of position which is stupid given him and Davies aren't the quickest. Sigurdssen isn't a disgrace, the disgrace is Silva for tasking him with an almost impossible job rather than playing to his strengths. 

What players are out of form? I wouldn't say any are out of form, Keane and Sidibe shouldn't be at a top half club not that's just based on their ability. Keane was just as poor a player last year. Other than that there's Sigurdssen but he's not out of form he's just misused, last season he played no better with most agreeing he was anonymous unless he scored or got an assist. 100% the results are on the manager not the poor form of the players, they can work their socks off but they aren't gonna get results with these tactics unless the opposition don't turn up. Even last year the only team we won when going toe to toe was Cardiff who were missing their best players. Silva and his tactics are a joke. 

Form, not good enough, wrong system, whatever - the best we can hope for from a new manager coming in with these players is he lifts their confidence and organises then enough to steer us to safety. If we stick with the likes of Keane, Sigurdsson, Schneiderlin and Tosun, we will keep going nowhere. That's four players need replacing outright, plus adding depth elsewhere. That's still a lot of work to do on the squad whoever comes in. 

[pete0]

2 hours ago, plaidharper said:

Even if.. teams play with more than one CB so my sentiment still stands.  Zouma walks right into our backline.  Unless a new manager works wonders it looks like will be looking for more defense in the January transfer window.

Not so sure on that one but there is no convincing you / not interested in doing so but Gana would have started with Davies in the game if he was here.  Though I admit it would not take much for someone to get in before Siggy, we just don't have anyone fit at the moment.

What maths you using, next you gonna tell me how we're gonna have 50,000 more nurses? Zouma's spot has been inherited by Mina. If any thing Mina has probably been better than him as well. If we get injuries we might feel the affect but so far Zouma hasn't been missed, his spot has gone to Mina. 

Davies wouldn't have played if Gana was here unless ever senior player was injured. We'd be bottom of the league with Schneiderlin and Gana playing every week. 

[pete0]

5 minutes ago, nogs said:

Form, not good enough, wrong system, whatever - the best we can hope for from a new manager coming in with these players is he lifts their confidence and organises then enough to steer us to safety. If we stick with the likes of Keane, Sigurdsson, Schneiderlin and Tosun, we will keep going nowhere. That's four players need replacing outright, plus adding depth elsewhere. That's still a lot of work to do on the squad whoever comes in. 

Not whatever, it's two massively different things. 

Holgate and Iwobi are both better so replacements are already here. The other two are only squad players. Wouldn't he hard for a manager to come in and get this team top half even at this point. Alladyce managed it with the shambles he was left and this squad is much much better. Silva is just that bad of a manager. 

[barryj]

17 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Not whatever, it's two massively different things. 

Holgate and Iwobi are both better so replacements are already here. The other two are only squad players. Wouldn't he hard for a manager to come in and get this team top half even at this point. Alladyce managed it with the shambles he was left and this squad is much much better. Silva is just that bad of a manager. 

Don’t run out the myth that Alladyce managed to get us out of relegation. That’s what hes got people not linked with Everton to believe (due to media and if you say it enough it becomes true). He took over after Unsworth beat West Ham convincingly and we were well clear of relegation. 

[pete0]

1 hour ago, barryj said:

Don’t run out the myth that Alladyce managed to get us out of relegation. That’s what hes got people not linked with Everton to believe (due to media and if you say it enough it becomes true). He took over after Unsworth beat West Ham convincingly and we were well clear of relegation. 

No myth, I said finish top half. He/we did. 

[barryj]

13 minutes ago, pete0 said:

No myth, I said finish top half. He/we did. 

And Unsworth would have done so also. 

[pete0]

29 minutes ago, barryj said:

And Unsworth would have done so also. 

He may have, I wanted Unsworth to take over at the time (albeit I did say we should ask Alladyce to come in on a consultant basis to help him). No doubt in my mind though that Silva would have finished lower with that same squad though. 

[Shukes]

Hate having Shite supporters as friends. Fucking all I have heard.

Other than one. He said it was the best derby he has watched for a long time, and that he thought we were still in at at 4-2 and looking dangerous.

He also said he couldn’t believe the manager took DCL off when he was giving VVD a torrid time.

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, Shukes said:

Hate having Shite supporters as friends. Fucking all I have heard.

Other than one. He said it was the best derby he has watched for a long time, and that he thought we were still in at at 4-2 and looking dangerous.

He also said he couldn’t believe the manager took DCL off when he was giving VVD a torrid time.

The ones I know keep switching from sympathy to gloating. It's horrible.

[Shukes]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

The ones I know keep switching from sympathy to gloating. It's horrible.

Hate it mate. Would love to be able to give it back, just once.

[barryj]

39 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Hate it mate. Would love to be able to give it back, just once.

Let’s knock them out of the cup. 

[Palfy]

2 hours ago, barryj said:

Let’s knock them out of the cup. 

Just knock them out

[plaidharper]

23 hours ago, pete0 said:

What maths you using, next you gonna tell me how we're gonna have 50,000 more nurses? Zouma's spot has been inherited by Mina. If any thing Mina has probably been better than him as well. If we get injuries we might feel the affect but so far Zouma hasn't been missed, his spot has gone to Mina. 

Davies wouldn't have played if Gana was here unless ever senior player was injured. We'd be bottom of the league with Schneiderlin and Gana playing every week. 

Not sure what math or nurses have to do with it or if you read what I wrote but are you saying you would play Keane or Holgate with Mina over Zouma?

Also Davies would have played because you are right: We'd be bottom of the league with Schneiderlin and Gana playing every week. Morgan would sink any ship.

[pete0]

11 hours ago, Shukes said:

He also said he couldn’t believe the manager took DCL off when he was giving VVD a torrid time.

Not for the first time either but half our fans still think he's the problem...

2 hours ago, plaidharper said:

Not sure what math or nurses have to do with it or if you read what I wrote but are you saying you would play Keane or Holgate with Mina over Zouma?

Also Davies would have played because you are right: We'd be bottom of the league with Schneiderlin and Gana playing every week. Morgan would sink any ship.

Yea, I'd pick Mina over Zouma. Zouma was a good consistent player last year but so far Mina has been doing better than Zouma did.

Do you think Gana played better last year than Davies has this one? 

[Finn balor]

Please pete not gana

[Sibdane]

5 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Not for the first time either but half our fans still think he's the problem...

Yea, I'd pick Mina over Zouma. Zouma was a good consistent player last year but so far Mina has been doing better than Zouma did.

Do you think Gana played better last year than Davies has this one? 

Yep. No doubt. 

[MikeO]

8 minutes ago, pete0 said:

Do you think Gana played better last year than Davies has this one?

Losing to a freak 95th minute goal as against having our arses handed to us would suggest that, as a team, we played better last year wouldn't it?

Gana was part of that team so the likelihood is yes he did (leaving aside the opinion of the vast majority of fans and pundits who rate him highly).