Sibdane Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Chris Wood... 2 in 2... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 47 minutes ago, tonkaroost said: I can't tell what's happening and I didn't watch the game. Likewise, impossible to judge from that still. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 19 hours ago, Bailey said: He is pointing his toe down, its just that when your leg is at that angle thats what pointing your toe down looks like (well it does for me). If you went for a traditional studs up challenge, his toes would be pointing in the air. He is trying to toe the ball ahead of the keeper. Thats how you can tell he didnt mean in because if he wanted to hurt him he would have gone with a stamping action and his toes would have been in the air. I presume you have played footy so you should know what I mean. Stills will always make it look bad and as I can said I can see why he was sent off, but at the same time, its one of these where he hasn't meant it, but he has got there late and I have sympathy for those challenges (probably because I am generally late into a challenge!). How is his toe pointing down! ? If he could point his foot upwards as you put it he would be staring in the Nutcracker not flying kicking opposition players Definite red regardless if intent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 17 minutes ago, MikeO said: Likewise, impossible to judge from that still. 1 hour ago, tonkaroost said: I can't tell what's happening and I didn't watch the game. Does it matter... one player is going to head the ball, the other has his foot raise trying to get a toe on the ball. If it helps, the ball has been whipped in from the right, first guy misses the header and it also bypasses the two mentioned above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Hmm. See what you're saying now with the high boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 1 minute ago, EFC-Paul said: How is his toe pointing down! ? If he could point his foot upwards as you put it he would be staring in the Nutcracker not flying kicking opposition players Definite red regardless if intent Try it, it's about 45 difference angle. Its actually easier to point the toes up than down. The point I am trying to make is that because of the angle of his foot he hasn't gone in to do him, he has gone to win the ball. It's exactly the same as my other post which wasn't even given as a free kick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 33 minutes ago, Bailey said: Try it, it's about 45 difference angle. Its actually easier to point the toes up than down. The point I am trying to make is that because of the angle of his foot he hasn't gone in to do him, he has gone to win the ball. It's exactly the same as my other post which wasn't even given as a free kick. But he's got no right to go with his boot, the ball's near 6ft in the air and he knows the keeper is going in with his head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 I must be going mad because it looks to me like Mane's toes are pointing towards the sky Matt and markjazzbassist 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Awful dive from Merino in the Swansea vs Newcastle game... what a wool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 31 minutes ago, pete0 said: But he's got no right to go with his boot, the ball's near 6ft in the air and he knows the keeper is going in with his head. But what if he doesn't know the keeper is going with his head? Does that make a difference? Would they both be sent off if they both went with their foot? 28 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: I must be going mad because it looks to me like Mane's toes are pointing towards the sky FFS you lot are awkward! ? It's almost impossible for his toes to be any further 'down' unless he is a ballerina behind the scenes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 2 hours ago, Bailey said: Sending off or not a sending off?https://twitter.com/BeggersBailey/status/906867626156142592 No red as the player is dipping to the ball. nyblue23, Lowensda and Matt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 5 minutes ago, Bailey said: But what if he doesn't know the keeper is going with his head? Does that make a difference? Would they both be sent off if they both went with their foot? FFS you lot are awkward! ? It's almost impossible for his toes to be any further 'down' unless he is a ballerina behind the scenes. I must be a ballerina then because I can do it. The sole of his foot is in the keepers face, his heel points at the floor, and his toes point towards the sky. That's really not difficult for a person to do, ballerina or not. Lowensda and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 4 minutes ago, Bailey said: But what if he doesn't know the keeper is going with his head? Does that make a difference? Would they both be sent off if they both went with their foot? FFS you lot are awkward! ? It's almost impossible for his toes to be any further 'down' unless he is a ballerina behind the scenes. There's clearly no intention and Mane may not be aware of the presence of Ederson but when the foot is that high and makes any contact with the opponent it's a red for dangerous play regardless of intent. MikeO, Lowensda and Matt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 5 minutes ago, c1982 said: No red as the player is dipping to the ball. So a ball that's 4ft in the air is OK, but one that's 5ft ish isn't? Is that challenge any less dangerous? What about if both players go with their feet? Is it still dangerous play as one of them could have tried heading the ball? Ps I'm only playing devil's advocate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 6 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: I must be a ballerina then because I can do it. The sole of his foot is in the keepers face, his heel points at the floor, and his toes point towards the sky. That's really not difficult for a person to do, ballerina or not. Prove it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, Bailey said: Prove it ? Prove it?! Any idiot can stick their leg in the air and point their toes towards the sky. I really don't see how anyone could see that as a difficult thing to do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Just now, Romey 1878 said: Prove it?! Any idiot can stick their leg in the air and point their toes towards the sky. I really don't see how anyone could see that as a difficult thing to do I'm arguing the opposite. To the sky is easy, pointing the toe down is difficult, hence why it looks like he is going 'studs up' when in reality he can do much more to keep them down. Interestingly where do you stand if both players went with their boot, not knowing if the other was going with their head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 4 minutes ago, Bailey said: I'm arguing the opposite. To the sky is easy, pointing the toe down is difficult, hence why it looks like he is going 'studs up' when in reality he can do much more to keep them down. Interestingly where do you stand if both players went with their boot, not knowing if the other was going with their head? I'm fucking confused now . I haven't even said which side of the argument I'm on, Bailey, I just didn't get how you were saying it only looks like he's going studs up. That's exactly what he does, whether he knows the keeper is there or not. As it happens, I can see why he was sent off but I could've also understood if the ref had decided just to book him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Literally just happened again in the Swansea game. Ritchie only got booked. Probably the worst of the 3! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 9 minutes ago, Bailey said: So a ball that's 4ft in the air is OK, but one that's 5ft ish isn't? Is that challenge any less dangerous? What about if both players go with their feet? Is it still dangerous play as one of them could have tried heading the ball? Ps I'm only playing devil's advocate. Depends if the players are 4ft. Point is the ball is head height. Mane knows he's second best and goes in with the boot to intimate the keeper. If someone speeds up when a person is crossing the road too slow to scare them to cross faster, if they then hit that person should they not be punished as they never meant to hurt them? nyblue23 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 1 minute ago, Bailey said: Literally just happened again in the Swansea game. Ritchie only got booked. Probably the worst of the 3! You're just highlighting the inconsistency and shitness of refs, rather than showing that he was wrong to be sent off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 10 minutes ago, Bailey said: Literally just happened again in the Swansea game. Ritchie only got booked. Probably the worst of the 3! No contact made though. It's a red if contact is made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 3 minutes ago, pete0 said: Depends if the players are 4ft. Point is the ball is head height. Mane knows he's second best and goes in with the boot to intimate the keeper. If someone speeds up when a person is crossing the road too slow to scare them to cross faster, if they then hit that person should they not be punished as they never meant to hurt them? So if the challenge is against Shaqiri the punishment is different to it beingo against Crouch? What if the perpetrator doesn't know if he is challenging Shaqiri or Crouch? 3 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: I'm fucking confused now . I haven't even said which side of the argument I'm on, Bailey, I just didn't get how you were saying it only looks like he's going studs up. That's exactly what he does, whether he knows the keeper is there or not. As it happens, I can see why he was sent off but I could've also understood if the ref had decided just to book him. I probably didn't elaborate properly to start with. Yes Mane did have his studs up but my argument is that there wasn't much he could do about it physically. I've agreed it's dangerous, and that that's why he was sent off. 1 minute ago, Romey 1878 said: You're just highlighting the inconsistency and shitness of refs, rather than showing that he was wrong to be sent off. I'm just highlighting how complicated it is. People were raging on social media about how dangerous it is but as you can see from some responses and reactions on here, on TV and by the refs, almost an identical situation has received a different response regardless of the challenge being equally reckless. I've still not had a response from one of the 'off' men as to whether both players with their foot high is a sending off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 4 minutes ago, c1982 said: No contact made though. It's a red if contact is made. Really? So if a player jumps two footed into a challenge at knee height but misses it changes the punishment compared to if he did connect? In the Ritchie incident I think he did catch him but only very slight contact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 6 minutes ago, Bailey said: So if the challenge is against Shaqiri the punishment is different to it beingo against Crouch? What if the perpetrator doesn't know if he is challenging Shaqiri or Crouch? It depends were the ball is. Is it head height or chest? He shouldn't be making a challenge if he'd got no awareness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnh Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 Photo on the front page of Sunday-Times Sport shows a close-up of the contact. Mane's toes are pointing up and he clearly catches Ederson in the face with his studs. Straight red, no excuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 On 09/09/2017 at 14:00, Bailey said: I can see why he was sent off but Mane is only ever going to go with his foot. Studs aren't up and he is only trying to play the ball. As a keeper he knows what he is about to take and he does really well. Liverpool were ripping City to shreds at times. There isn't much between the squads but they were better than City whereas we bent down and asked for a good Rodgering against 10 men. Just lucky they were as wasteful then as Liverpool were in that first half. B - Are you not the one being awkward Intent should always be peosecuted. So should dangerous play. I'll say it again, I don't believe that there's any malice in Mane's action but he was running at an onrushing keeper (which he knew as that's the reason he's trying the knock the ball around the keeper) with his foot (studs up) at around the 6ft mark. That's dangerous. If a player dips his head toward a football around waist height and another players accidentally kicks him in the head going for the reasonable ball, then no-one is really at fault. The defender would understand that the risk of being kicked in the head (when you put your head that close to the ground) is quite likely. Ederson would never had expected a foot to be that high when he choose to rush the attacker. It was dangerous play and it was deserving of a red card. (I can't talk of the other 2 as I haven't seen them). Here's Ederson post hospital visit. (Sorry about the image source). Imo, He got off lightly and no major head trauma was caused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted September 10, 2017 Report Share Posted September 10, 2017 3 hours ago, Bailey said: Really? So if a player jumps two footed into a challenge at knee height but misses it changes the punishment compared to if he did connect? In the Ritchie incident I think he did catch him but only very slight contact. No, completely different though. None of these high foot incidents have the intent of kicking someone in the head whereas the intent is there with a 2 footed challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 11, 2017 Report Share Posted September 11, 2017 Thank God Mane's toes were pointing up, Can you imagine the damage if his studs caught him Check out @DirtyFootbaIIer’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/DirtyFootbaIIer/status/907284200302239746?s=09 Romey 1878, markjazzbassist and pete0 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 11, 2017 Report Share Posted September 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Lowensda said: Thank God Mane's toes were pointing up, Can you imagine the damage if his studs caught him Check out @DirtyFootbaIIer’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/DirtyFootbaIIer/status/907284200302239746?s=09 The shite are appealing the length of the ban... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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