Longest Thread! for Everton Discussion

[MikeO]

Taking a small snippet there but why is debt good in business? Other than loaning money to buy something that's going to make you more money I can't see how any debt is good? especially in football. For example you could spend a £150m loan on superstars and project champions league football for the next 4 years. But in reality that might not happen so its a high risk.

 

I don't know that it's actually "good" (Steve may well prove me wrong) but for a club/company in our position needing money to play with it's better (cheaper) than the alternative which is selling equity.

[Newty82]

Most companies run with a degree of debt...its another tax dodge...the interest paid on the debt is tax deductible. Real business is a dirty filthy world.

 

It's not a universal good idea to have debt. You still need to have cash flow to service that debt. The level of debt has to be controlled. You have to show that you can cover that debt, otherwise you are in the shit. For example, if you are the director of a Limited Company and continue to trade with debt you can't service, you'll get banned as a director.

 

And a case to prove MC11 is right with his trail of thinking is Leeds United. Remember them going he'll for leather for Champions League football? Peter Risedale (Chairman) lent a tonne of money flow the promise of CL footy year after year...but they failed to qualify and it went tits up because they couldn't pay the loans. Players got sold.. and we know where they ended up.

 

And Steve...its not that the TV money is being dismissed. It's that Bill and Bob where putting themselves in the limelight and media hype as if they had pulled off some masterstroke to make our turnover grow to record levels. But they haven't. And as you say, the plan seems so shallow. That's why there is criticism towards them.

 

As I have said, I'm no expert here (although I do like looking at numbers and business info!) so excuse me if I have gone beyond myself!!!

[Cornish Steve]

Most companies run with a degree of debt...its another tax dodge...

 

It's not a tax dodge. It's just the way that taxes work in business. There are two ways to generate cash: debt and equity. Each has its cost, and, depending on company, business, and environment, there is a certain balance that allows you to minimize the cost. So many moan about the owners, but they put money in to make a profit, and that's a cost to the business. Likewise, banks don't lend money for fun, and they charge interest, which is a cost. The government taxes some things, allows you to write off some costs against taxes, and so on. This is why financiers make the big bucks.

[Cornish Steve]

Taking a small snippet there but why is debt good in business? Other than loaning money to buy something that's going to make you more money I can't see how any debt is good? especially in football. For example you could spend a £150m loan on superstars and project champions league football for the next 4 years. But in reality that might not happen so its a high risk.

 

The right balance depends on many factors, and these factors change all the time, but this article gets the main points across.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/baltimore/stories/2005/04/25/focus3.html?page=all

Edited November 4, 2014 by Cornish Steve

[markjazzbassist]

 

With a couple of caveats up front:

• I'm not a finance guy or a senior exec, just a veteran of business with an MBA (for whatever that's worth) and experience defining company strategy
• Like the rest of us, I don't see the complete picture - and probably not even most of it - so it's dangerous to draw too many conclusions

But, I do have several observations and suggestions if I was running the show.

1. Contrary to what most people believe, debt is actually good in business. There is an optimal level, though, which probably explains the pay-off of some debt. I'm also guessing that preparations are being made for a stadium initiative, and the finances must be in good shape for that.
2. Too many are being dismissive of the TV money. It's extra revenue, and it's an important factor, not something to be dismissed. It's no different than landing a huge advertising deal to replace the current mediocre deals. Don't discount it. Using it to pay off debt, and not allowing it to sidetrack us, is wise. Otherwise, we become like a lottery winner that's bankrupt a few years later.
3. Invest in the youth program. Maybe 10% of them will make it to the first team, but we can sell the rest for a profit. View it as a P&L venture.
4. Once the brand is stronger, buy out the Kitbag deal, which is a disgrace. There's a lot of money for the taking in this area.

The single biggest thing, though, is to have a clear business strategy. RIght now, there's a bit of this and a bit of that, but no clear definition of what defines Everton and makes us different. Another way of putting this is that the brand is weak. Focus on a strategy and use that to filter and justify all decisions made by the club.

 

For example, I'd play Tim Howard for all he's worth and pounce on the meme he inspired during the World Cup. Become "America's team" in the Prem. Bring in a couple of other American players, do summer tours, have Roberto continue with ESPN, play the history angle (Americans love that) and the underdog status (they love that too), link up with an MLS team, set up a couple of US-based development centres for youth players, and generally raise the team's profile. Play on the colour blue - and work with Jet Blue, Citibank, IBM ("Big Blue"), Twitter, and other popular US brands that are blue. Link up with the New Orleans Saints and have them "sing the blues." Be creative. That will generate a larger international fan base that will attract the Nike's of the world. And drop Chang, because Asia brings us nothing right now, and flying the team there just exhausts everyone.

 

Of course, this is just one invented strategy, and it won't be everyone's cup of tea. It's almost doesn't matter what the strategy is, as long as we have one!

 

 

Elstone out, Cornish Steve In!! Great stuff steve, i agree with taking advantage of all the american stuff, as evidenced with the small sample size here, there are a good number of US Evertonians, and nothing is being done to increase or take advantage of that. It's the wild west over here where Football/soccer is a relative unknown just waiting to be pimped, Man U is starting to do it with all the tours here and the Chevy sponsor etc. we need to follow suit.

[Newty82]

 

It's not a tax dodge. It's just the way that taxes work in business. There are two ways to generate cash: debt and equity. Each has its cost, and, depending on company, business, and environment, there is a certain balance that allows you to minimize the cost. So many moan about the owners, but they put money in to make a profit, and that's a cost to the business. Likewise, banks don't lend money for fun, and they charge interest, which is a cost. The government taxes some things, allows you to write off some costs against taxes, and so on. This is why financiers make the big bucks.

Fair play!!!

[Matt]

 

It's not a tax dodge. It's just the way that taxes work in business. There are two ways to generate cash: debt and equity. Each has its cost, and, depending on company, business, and environment, there is a certain balance that allows you to minimize the cost. So many moan about the owners, but they put money in to make a profit, and that's a cost to the business. Likewise, banks don't lend money for fun, and they charge interest, which is a cost. The government taxes some things, allows you to write off some costs against taxes, and so on. This is why financiers make the big bucks.

Doesn't having debt also improve your financial rating with the banks? Provided, of course, you manage your debts well. Or am I going nuts?

[Cornish Steve]

Doesn't having debt also improve your financial rating with the banks? Provided, of course, you manage your debts well. Or am I going nuts?

 

As long as you have the cash flow needed to pay it off - yes!

 

My guess is that debt is being managed well right now as a prelude to stadium financing - as well as simply being good business.

[Newty82]

There's the problem with 'new world' economics...its good to have debt. Advantageous to have debt. It's kind of corruption in disguise...you come and lend a load of cash off us, pay us a load of interest to support our fat bonuses, high salaries and exclusive holidays and we'll give you a good credit rating! Anyway, a whole new subject that one...

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/11/07/pienaar-and-etoo-star-in-bizarre-everton-christmas-advert/

 

This years Christmas video

[Paddock]

The more I see ofEto'o the moreI'm convinced we should just sign him for life . He's the type of person who will always bring something to the table no matter what.

[MC11]

His name alone builds the clubs name.

Edited November 8, 2014 by MC11

[Lowensda]

Thoughts?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/article-2828027/Aiden-McGeady-James-McCarthy-given-horrible-reception-against-Scotland-claims-Gordon-McQueen.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

[Romey 1878]

Thoughts?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/article-2828027/Aiden-McGeady-James-McCarthy-given-horrible-reception-against-Scotland-claims-Gordon-McQueen.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Not arsed about the choice they made. They've done nothing that's against the rules.

[Matt]

Thoughts?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/article-2828027/Aiden-McGeady-James-McCarthy-given-horrible-reception-against-Scotland-claims-Gordon-McQueen.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

Another Scot being bitter

[Louis]

https://vine.co/v/OiwBlbv3bzh

[MC11]

https://vine.co/v/OiwBlbv3bzh

Lol

[MikeO]

https://vine.co/v/OiwBlbv3bzh

 

Looks to me like he scratches his nose and then gets the attention of someone he knows; she turns round to look at him, if the vid went on for another two seconds you'd see them saying hello.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

http://www.evertonfc.com/news/2014/11/12/season-ticket-holders-shopping-event

 

Season ticket holder 20% off shopping event

[Matt]

My sister got her photo taken with Roberto at the meal last night. Nice that he took the time, I know my sister was made up

[Matt]

My sister got her photo taken with Roberto at the meal last night. Nice that he took the time, I know my sister was made up

Scratch that, she jumped in front of him on his way out and caught him (and security) by surprise

[MikeO]

Scratch that, she jumped in front of him on his way out and caught him (and security) by surprise

 

Is that the sister that came to the pub with you pre Southampton Matt (my memory's shot so I don't remember her name)? Can imagine her doing something like that .

[Matt]

Is that the sister that came to the pub with you pre Southampton Matt (my memory's shot so I don't remember her name)? Can imagine her doing something like that .

Sure is

[MikeO]

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/famous-football-clubs-in-training-no-7-everton/query/everton

 

Lovely "center" 1.53 in; it seems Bainsey is just keeping up the tradition of Everton style corners .

[Paddock]

My sister got her photo taken with Roberto at the meal last night. Nice that he took the time, I know my sister was made up

Pics (of the sister not Martinez)

[Matt]

Pics (of the sister not Martinez)

Dirty ol' git!

[Paddock]

Dirty ol' git!

[Romey 1878]

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/five-minutes-hell-everton-fc-8106218

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/11/14/tim-howard-reveals-who-brings-the-everton-dressing-room-together/

[markjazzbassist]

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/11/14/tim-howard-reveals-who-brings-the-everton-dressing-room-together/

 

i figured it was Jags and Baines, great to hear about Lukaku though, glad he's just enjoying himself. I remember seeing an interview last year with Jags or Coleman and behind them Distin started walking and Rom jumped on his back and piggy back rode him into the locker room. All 3 were having a laugh, it was cool to see they are having a good time.