Hafnia Posted April 21, 2015 Report Share Posted April 21, 2015 They still wont finish twelfth you can vault me on that. I think you had us being relegated if Martinez stayed. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoof_It_Nev Posted April 24, 2015 Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 I'm bored so here we go: Between 18th September (our first Europa match v Wolfsburg) and 19th March (our last Europa match v Dynamo Kiev) we have earned an average of 1.07 points per Prem match. Outside of this period (before and after Europa & cups) we have earned an average of 1.64 points per match. 1.64 points per match so far would see us 3 points off 5th place. Is it a coincidence that since bombing out of Europa we have suddenly found form - WWDW? I kow the opposition hasn't been of the highest standard in recent fixtures but we were getting turned over by the likes of Stoke and Hull earlier on in the season. Food for thought? Maybe missing out on Europa next season will be a blessing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 24, 2015 Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 There is not even an argument against our form post Europa league. We are not a financially stable enough club to cope with the demands of both. A Europe free season without should shoot us up the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted April 24, 2015 Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) The problem with your synopsis (which I do agree with) is that without further significant investment we become a European 'yo yo' team. We have a season in Europe which affects our league form and we fail to qualify for Europe the next year - which allows us to have a good next league season and qualify for Europe etc etc. Either we have to bite the bullet and find the funds to be successful in Europe and the league at the same time or we have to have a Euro season where we are lucky with injuries and everyone plays out of their skin and actually win some serious prize money. It's not easy and we have to guard against overspending and going the way of Leeds Utd and others. But that's why Roberto gets paid what he does - to balance those conflicting demands. Blue Bill has backed Roberto this far and I think we need another marquee signing this year too - plus a few stocking fillers! Edited April 24, 2015 by rusty747 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 28, 2015 Report Share Posted April 28, 2015 Given the form of the two teams right now, the answer could well be "one place below Liverpool." Now, it would be better to be one place above Liverpool, but that's still an achievement few would have thought a month or two ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted April 28, 2015 Report Share Posted April 28, 2015 I'm bored so here we go: Between 18th September (our first Europa match v Wolfsburg) and 19th March (our last Europa match v Dynamo Kiev) we have earned an average of 1.07 points per Prem match. Outside of this period (before and after Europa & cups) we have earned an average of 1.64 points per match. 1.64 points per match so far would see us 3 points off 5th place. Is it a coincidence that since bombing out of Europa we have suddenly found form - WWDW? I kow the opposition hasn't been of the highest standard in recent fixtures but we were getting turned over by the likes of Stoke and Hull earlier on in the season. Food for thought? Maybe missing out on Europa next season will be a blessing? Personally I don't buy this theory that the Europa League has effected our League form. We are where we are because of poor tactics and because weve been shite nothing more nothing less Ok so weve played a few extra games in Europe, but weve also had no domestic cup games so the players should have been able to cope easily enough Romey 1878, MikeO, Toffee_in_LA and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Personally I don't buy this theory that the Europa League has effected our League form. We are where we are because of poor tactics and because weve been shite nothing more nothing less Ok so weve played a few extra games in Europe, but weve also had no domestic cup games so the players should have been able to cope easily enough That's not what statistics reveal of the impact of the Europa League. I read something the other day that shows just how much league form is affecting all clubs in that tournament. At the start of the season, I thought it was a good thing to be playing in Europe. After this year, I've changed my mind. While playing in the Champions league is good, playing in the Europa league is a negative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith B Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I have seen a lot of twitter talk about how Everton's form has improved so much since they got eliminated from Europa. And it is literally true. They've played much better since. But I thought and think our goal is to get into European competition every year. So might we think about being able to do both (that is play well in the EPL and in Europe)? The top teams in every league manage it. I know it is it hard, but it requires a deep bench and a bunch of resilliant players. That's what I think we as fans should be asking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 While playing in the Champions league is good, playing in the Europa league is a negative. Strange logic? Both competitions would have the same drain and effect on any side that's not numerically cut out for them the only difference is that generally the sides that qualify for the Europa have smaller and weaker squads than those who regularly make it into the CL It's definitely had an effect but isn't the sole purpose we had a piss poor pre season and it went on from there it's no excuse to play how badly we have for the most part the season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Play Tuesday/Wednesday in champs league meaning you can play Saturday and indeed Sunday with an extra days rest. Playing Thursday as Souness said - most players have it in their heads to take the wife out for a meal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Strange logic? Both competitions would have the same drain and effect on any side that's not numerically cut out for them the only difference is that generally the sides that qualify for the Europa have smaller and weaker squads than those who regularly make it into the CL It's definitely had an effect but isn't the sole purpose we had a piss poor pre season and it went on from there it's no excuse to play how badly we have for the most part the season I think he means the financial rewards of the cl as opposed to peanuts for Europa. Cl money means you can buy a better calibre of player and pay better wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Personally I don't buy this theory that the Europa League has effected our League form. We are where we are because of poor tactics and because weve been shite nothing more nothing less Ok so weve played a few extra games in Europe, but weve also had no domestic cup games so the players should have been able to cope easily enough agreed. I get that the extra travel can be tiring but it didn't seem to affect us traveling to the destinations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I think he means the financial rewards of the cl as opposed to peanuts for Europa. Cl money [means you can buy a better calibre of player and pay better wages. This part. Not just better calibre but more quantity. Allowing good solid rotation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Play Tuesday/Wednesday in champs league meaning you can play Saturday and indeed Sunday with an extra days rest. Playing Thursday as Souness said - most players have it in their heads to take the wife out for a meal. But there's no difference at all in playing Wed/Sat to playing Thurs/Sun. Tues/Sat maybe helpful for the league but then you've got twenty-fours hours less to prepare for the Euro game. Swings and roundabouts. The stats may say it's bad but as far as I recall we thrived on it in our last two UEFA runs, didn't affect our league form at all. Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 If the authorities wanted to help out teams in Europe they could move the game after an away leg to Monday night. It wouldn't be that much of a problem to do and give an English team a better chance of winning it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 This part. Not just better calibre but more quantity. Allowing good solid rotation Yep exacty. You can have a deeper squad of better players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) I think he means the financial rewards of the cl as opposed to peanuts for Europa. Cl money means you can buy a better calibre of player and pay better wages. Fully agree financially mate it but holds very little baring to clubs such as ourselves as you have to constantly qualify to see the benefits like the current top four have always done We've been in both in recent years and seen very little difference to what was put back into the squad I agree it has an effect injuries small squads etc but the whole tired players malarkey is a drum beaten to often for me they are athletes with possibly the best nutritional fitness and aftercare around its an easy excuse for both players and especially managers to throw out there The buck stops with the manager poor pre season poor tactics and selections playing players out if form etc for me have had the biggest effect Edited April 29, 2015 by EFC-Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Strange logic? Both competitions would have the same drain and effect on any side that's not numerically cut out for them the only difference is that generally the sides that qualify for the Europa have smaller and weaker squads than those who regularly make it into the CL It's definitely had an effect but isn't the sole purpose we had a piss poor pre season and it went on from there it's no excuse to play how badly we have for the most part the season The strain on the team is greater in the Europa, especially with the qualifying rounds, and the financial rewards are simply not there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 But there's no difference at all in playing Wed/Sat to playing Thurs/Sun. Tues/Sat maybe helpful for the league but then you've got twenty-fours hours less to prepare for the Euro game. Swings and roundabouts. The stats may say it's bad but as far as I recall we thrived on it in our last two UEFA runs, didn't affect our league form at all. But Mike, I seem to remember that the UEFA was a straight knockout tournament. Now there are qualifying rounds, then group tables, and then two-leg knockout. The number of games in the Europa exceed the number played in the UEFA cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) The strain on the team is greater in the Europa, especially with the qualifying rounds, and the financial rewards are simply not there. We wouldn't finish second or third in the league so we'd have to play a qualifier over two legs for the CL. Whereas this time around in the Europa we didn't have to play a qualifying round. Edited April 29, 2015 by Romey 1878 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I agree it has an effect injuries small squads etc but the whole tired players malarkey is a drum beaten to often for me they are athletes with possibly the best nutritional fitness and aftercare around its an easy excuse for both players and especially managers to throw out there I've had the good fortune or misfortune, whichever you prefer, of having traveled the world extensively. (I'm a 4 million miler on Delta and have flown over 6 million miles in total.) You'd think that the 10- or 12-hour time differences would get you the most, but that's not the case. For me, the 2- or 3-hour differences are the worst. Your body seems to hold on to the old time zone, and you feel constantly tired and lethargic. As a rule of thumb, they say it takes one day to recover for each hour's difference in time zone, but those 2- and 3-hour differences always seemed worse to me. So, it's not just the travel: It's adjusting to two time zone changes in quick succession. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 But Mike, I seem to remember that the UEFA was a straight knockout tournament. Now there are qualifying rounds, then group tables, and then two-leg knockout. The number of games in the Europa exceed the number played in the UEFA cup. Last two times we were in it there were qualifying, groups and two-legged knock-out games, not so different from today's format. We beat Zenit in the groups the year they won it, though that season there were just four group games in a league of five; you didn't play home and away, just one game against each other, two home and two away. We won the group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Last two times we were in it there were qualifying, groups and two-legged knock-out games, not so different from today's format. We beat Zenit in the groups the year they won it, though that season there were just four group games in a league of five; you didn't play home and away, just one game against each other, two home and two away. We won the group. Then I'm plain too old. I'm remembering the UEFA Cup from the days I lived in Britain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Then I'm plain too old. I'm remembering the UEFA Cup from the days I lived in Britain. All three European competitions used to be plain knock-out. European Cup (for league champions), Cup Winners Cup (for domestic cup winners) and the UEFA Cup, previously called the Inter Cities Fairs Cup (for those who came close). No groups, little financial reward, all played for the glory rather than the financial gain. But we've made a lot of progress since then . Now the teams who finish 2nd, 3rd & 4th get into the "Champions League". Makes sense to me . Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elston Gunnn Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 Update -- 9. WHam, 47, +1, @Villa, Everton, @Newcastle 10. Stoke, 47, -5, Spurs, @Burnley, Liverpool 11. Everton, 44, 0, Sunderland, @WHam, Spurs 12. Palace, 42, -6, ManU, @Liverpool, Swansea 13. WBrom, 40, -13, @Newcastle, Chelsea, @Arsenal I include the 2 below us mostly in irritation at our performance against Villa. Both Palace and WBrom have more challenging run-ins than Everton, so 11th should be our floor. Unless our squad are already on vacation. Will we catch Stoke and/or WHam? Goal difference with Stoke may see us into 10th. Match @WHam gives us real chance at 9th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted May 4, 2015 Report Share Posted May 4, 2015 if we can win 3 on the bounce i think we can get 9th, west ham doesn't look great, and stoke has spurs and liverpool. i fancy us at 9th or 10th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elston Gunnn Posted May 7, 2015 Report Share Posted May 7, 2015 In the Europa League? July 1. Too weird? http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-west-ham-fair-play-9194228 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted May 8, 2015 Report Share Posted May 8, 2015 http://www.espnfc.us/club/everton/368/blog/post/2439993/everton-europa-league-dilemma-at-issue-in-west-ham-match Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoof_It_Nev Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 11th locked in now I reckon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 11th locked in now I reckon That's probably about where we deserve to finish, and a lot higher than I thought we would Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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