MikeO Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 It's a disappointment Ferguson is being such a twat....he criticized Jason Roberts up front and now Ferdinand. I think those two are far better placed to have an informed opinion on racism and the effectiveness of "Kick it Out" than he is. It's a totally meaningless gesture if everyone wears the shirt just because they're told to.....no time for Ferdinand as a rule but fair play to him on this. Kenwyne Jones didn't wear one either I see. Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 I can't stand Rio. He has no reason to be against it (Terry and Evra both punished), and should have been banned for racism himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 He has no reason to be against it.... He's obviously not against the stated aims but he has every right (as do Roberts and Jones) to not be satisfied with the effectiveness of the organization. Terry banned for four games while a fan making racist comments is banned for life? Romey 1878 and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted October 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 What value does a message have if people are forced into representing it? noone wants racism, but dictating wont help get rid of it. A message needs believers, not sheep. Good on Rio and Roberts, raising concerns. not like theyre for racism in football is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Got to agree with Matt and Mike on this (and Rio, unfortunately). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Terry isn't a racist though (he is a massive twat), Ferdinand wound him up (about things a lot more personal than the colour of his skin) and hit the jackpot with Terry's response both as bad as each other. We had a similar discussion about Saha getting called a French cunt. Rio was racist towards Cole calling him a choc ice, and blatantly has a you and us mentality. He wore the top even though Lescott and Howard were racially abused. He's just seen a media opportunity and took it, he is against cultures mixing and it's people like him who promotes segregation. If a black and a white kid fell on the floor Rio would pick the black one up first, Terry would probably walk past both of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted October 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Terry isn't a racist though (he is a massive twat), Ferdinand wound him up (about things a lot more personal than the colour of his skin) and hit the jackpot with Terry's response both as bad as each other. We had a similar discussion about Saha getting called a French cunt. Rio was racist towards Cole calling him a choc ice, and blatantly has a you and us mentality. He wore the top even though Lescott and Howard were racially abused. He's just seen a media opportunity and took it, he is against cultures mixing and it's people like him who promotes segregation. If a black and a white kid fell on the floor Rio would pick the black one up first, Terry would probably walk past both of them. not sure where to start picking this to pieces.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Terry isn't a racist though (he is a massive twat)... "Fucking black cunt..." isn't in your vocabulary if you're not a racist. Having personal relationships with black individuals doesn't mean a thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 "Fucking black cunt..." isn't in your vocabulary if you're not a racist. Having personal relationships with black individuals doesn't mean a thing. If he'd said it without being provoked he'd be a racist. Black and cunt are in most peoples vocabularies, not that they should be used together, if he'd have said the N-bomb (as it carries the negative connotations) I'd be more inclined to agree with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 If he'd said it without being provoked he'd be a racist. Black and cunt are in most peoples vocabularies, not that they should be used together, if he'd have said the N-bomb (as it carries the negative connotations) I'd be more inclined to agree with you. To me provocation is irrelevant....you just don't say it unless it's in you. On what are you basing your opinion that he's not racist? Presumably the fact that he has black team mates he gets on with? When I lived in London I knew a guy who was high up in the (now defunct) British Movement....loads of guys at my local were NF members. Superficially they got on fine with black people....I had a black girlfriend for a while and I had no problem. Underneath it though they were what they were. Just have to disagree on this one . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 To me provocation is irrelevant....you just don't say it unless it's in you. On what are you basing your opinion that he's not racist? Presumably the fact that he has black team mates he gets on with? When I lived in London I knew a guy who was high up in the (now defunct) British Movement....loads of guys at my local were NF members. Superficially they got on fine with black people....I had a black girlfriend for a while and I had no problem. Underneath it though they were what they were. Just have to disagree on this one . Fair enough, I think we just have different definitions of racism. I tweeted this earlier on the same subject to my old house mate. Racist A) Bigots/prejudices basically old people and thick twats* People who promote segregation. A are sheep B are the shepherds Cole and Mourinho backed that Terry isn't racist, they're two of the biggest ego's in football and would have no qualms about throwing Terry in the deep end if they though he was racist. I just don't feel Terry falls in either category as it was an outburst, he doesn't hold any prejudices, but if I had to label him it would be A. Rio falls into B, which is much worst. *Added the asterix now, 140 limit so couldn't fit in influenced by the older generation. I've found racism has shifted towards xenophobic views geographically and religious, as England's ethnic population is high enough for peoples skin colour does not to stand out for being different. Largely down to the education and media, turn on most children shows and there will be a mix of people (although I think the PC brigade have went to far now, with shows getting complaints for not having different races in http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/lifestyle/2012/10/19/disneys-latina-princess-sparks-outrage-inspired-by-queen-sofia-spain/ ). Sorry to slightly digress, from personal experience whilst at uni in Manchester I found Indians and Pakistanais had a lot of bad blood (I have some friends that even said they wish they were white, especially the Indian girls), well beyond anything I've witnessed from white/black in England. Also Muslims get a lot of stick (possibly media influenced), lastly the one that most shocked me the most was how anti-Semitic people are. I'd never really heard any hatred towards Jews before, tbh I never knowingly met a Jewish person until college and even then it was only one. I'd only ever heard the standard money tight jokes (same used for Scottish people) and big-nosed ones (but used to taunt people with big noses nothing to do with the actual faith). At first I laughed at the jokes, but then I realised the people were serious and I was stunned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Lescott didn't wear the shirt either according to MOTD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Lescott didn't wear the shirt either according to MOTD. He hasn't done since the Emre incident. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Swansea and Wigan didn't wear them at all. Some players on both sides had decided not to wear them so their teammates decided not to wear them either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Rio was racist towards Cole calling him a choc ice, and blatantly has a you and us mentality. He wore the top even though Lescott and Howard were racially abused. He's just seen a media opportunity and took it. Tbh I agree with you. He might have genuine feelings about but from all the things I have seen come from Rio, I'm sure it is more of a media stunt. Although quite what it has got to do with Ferguson I am not quite sure. pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formby Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Sorry to slightly digress, from personal experience whilst at uni in Manchester I found Indians and Pakistanais had a lot of bad blood (I have some friends that even said they wish they were white, especially the Indian girls), well beyond anything I've witnessed from white/black in England. Also Muslims get a lot of stick (possibly media influenced), lastly the one that most shocked me the most was how anti-Semitic people are. I'd never really heard any hatred towards Jews before, tbh I never knowingly met a Jewish person until college and even then it was only one. I'd only ever heard the standard money tight jokes (same used for Scottish people) and big-nosed ones (but used to taunt people with big noses nothing to do with the actual faith). At first I laughed at the jokes, but then I realised the people were serious and I was stunned. As I have mentioned before, there seems to be a hierarchy of ‘isms’ in this country. Insulting a black person appears to carry far more moral condemnation than insults directed at gays or Jewish people. This may be something to do with how the latter are perceived (soft targets). Every race has its racists. Manchester, though multicultural, has very complex racial divisions. People of all races and creeds run shoulders but, scratch beneath the surface, and the prejudice leaps out. A sniggering forbearance (at best) is how I’d best describe the majority’s view on gay people. You can hear it all the time in pubs. Pakistanis (who I know a lot about) have issues with Indians from partition days (Muslim-Hindu issues), Pakistanis with Bangladeshis from the 1971 war, black Africans and black Jamaicans don’t get on, Pakistanis don’t get on with blacks and vice versa, Chinese just the same. Muslims don’t get on with Jews. Of course, you can always say you know so and so and that’s just not the case with them, but it’s a rare individual that isn’t comprised of some kind of ism (whether it be something to do with race, creed, denomination, sexuality or xenophobia). It’s horrible when it comes out but may not always reflect the totality of that person. pete0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Anichebe on why he isn't wearing the KIO shirt. http://www.dailystar.co.uk/football/view/278226/? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Bit condescending towards us but an interesting blog on Arteta.... http://blog.emiratesstadium.info/archives/25449 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avinalaff Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Anichebe on why he isn't wearing the KIO shirt. http://www.dailystar...l/view/278226/? Nobody can force politics on somebody, especially in this country, so any player who doesn't want to wear it shouldn't have to. It's a very emotional and controversial subject, and best left to individuals to decide. Racism isn't just one way either, and not only black players or people suffer it, but every culture, including whites, so I don't think the emphasys should be put upon black sportsmen in particular. Fans not only should be banned for racism, or violence, but should have to respect fellow fans, in their behaviour in the stands, yet swearing, vile chanting, abuse towards officials, etc etc all tend to go unchallenged. To expect the Neanderthal element of society that is ever present at football matches to behave, when they're allowed to turn into tribal animals as soon as they take their seat is a bit optimistic. Anybody who has been to a game has seen the ugly side of human nature, and that's the sad thing, as it is a game, not a war. Bailey and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Anichebe on why he isn't wearing the KIO shirt. http://www.dailystar...l/view/278226/? Pienaar not wearing one either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Pienaar not wearing one either. It's just a publicity stunt though. Obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Someone on talksport said some clubs only received 11 t-shirts for the starting xi so in some cases there wasn't enough t-shirts to go round when the full 18 were warming up!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted October 21, 2012 Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 This is great.......notably... The "bench" like it used to be instead of the padded seats they all have today.... The curved areas behind the goals....why did we get rid? Unique to Goodison I think? (Incidentally, for anyone confused, the "Everton are in the white shorts" intro comment is because most back then only had a black and white TV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formby Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 The curved areas behind the goals....why did we get rid? Unique to Goodison I think? Like Raquel Welch in One Million Years BC, the curves are iconic and should never have gone. I presume it had something to do with getting more fans in to the stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 is it me or is the whole heskey thing a bit boring now? not sure why people keep making these daft pictures and jokes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Respect to Campo for this, could be doing anything now he's retired, but just wants to help out Bolton. http://www.guillembalague.com/guestwriter_desp.php?id=34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 150 year FA gold crest - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2221914/FA-unveil-new-England-badge-150th-year.html I like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalziel Kane Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I could find nothing outstanding or exceptional about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeQuince Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I'll just leave this here.... Zoo and Lowensda 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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