Shukes Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 It does feel like I've just watched Wigan then... That does worry me. That's fucking out of order.... Don't insult Wigan like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 But its the same thing that made us successful last season. Its high pressure, you have to trust your players to make the right decisions, unfortunately we aren't. I do think we are carrying too many players who arent pulling their weight and thats something we cant afford. May well be, might be 2nd season blues. People have worked us out, and when that happens you need to mix things up. Moyes was slated for it relentlessly, Martinez is fast tracking his way to a verbal assault. He is the one to be held responsible here, something has to change quick. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blueboy122 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Matt its all and we looking for positives such as playing a 5 yards pass and defending corners. He has conceded possession a ridiculous number of times even by his standards. Its not even a joke anymore, he's 6ft 4 and 14 stone and is getting bullied. I'm too pissed off with others to be too hard on him. None more so than Martinez. What is he coaching them. There you go. Fucking shite. Matt please read and read and read. That's my point about Eto at least he doesn't give away possession every time he touches the ball! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 They haven't in this game. They've let us have it, knowing we've done fuck all with it, wait for the inevitable mistakes and break. Like that. From what I have seen, they have tried to but arent doing it very well and we are winning the ball back in the midfield. Its not like they are making lots of runs in behind etc in a true counter attacking sense. We do the same thing a lot of the time to, especially when we are leading. Either way it doesnt matter. Its a bad, bad loss but from what I saw of the 2nd half we certainly didnt play badly enough to be 2 nil down. Atsu, Besic, Alcaraz and Garbutt all showed promise, Gibson & Lukaku were hot and cold, McGeady & Hibbert were a waste of space and Distin wasnt a great deal better. I thought Osman did OK when he came on. We really need to buck our ideas up by Saturday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gusto181 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'm at work, so only able to read the board. Did ANYTHING good happen? Sounds like a real downer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I feel sick. The sickness is only going to get worse the closer the derby comes. I'm worried, very worried. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) Matt please read and read and read. That's my point about Eto at least he doesn't give away possession every time he touches the ball! Yeah, Etoo set the world alight tonight with his amazing touches, holding up the ball... He got no service either. The ball was lumped up from the back and the strikers were asked to hold up play whilst our "midfield" trotted along. Please read this again - I have said he had a bad game, I have never said Lukakus touch is amazing, ever. Bad day in the office, move on. Edited September 23, 2014 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rusty747 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 To be honest it looks like most of the players are playing in a system that they are not comfortable with. Lukaku can trap the ball further than I can kick it, there is no creativity from centre midfield, the centre defenders look uncomfortable playing the ball out from the back, Hibbert and Osman have been great servants for Everton but their time is over, Pienaar has lost his pace, and generally we just look disorganised with no belief in our own game plan. Tonight, I think only Garbutt and, possibly, Besic come out with any credit. Eto'o was disappointing as was Lukaku, and we just dont carry athreat going forward while looking very shaky at the back. I am now very worried. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blueboy122 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'm at work, so only able to read the board. Did ANYTHING good happen? Sounds like a real downer. To be honest we played ok in the first half. Got no idea what happened after that.. Shambles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Martinez: "we showed INCREDIBLE INTENSITY in continually losing possession and gave a PHENOMENAL display of how to defend like cunts" chicagoblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blueboy122 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Yeah, Etoo set the world alight tonight with his amazing touches, holding up the ball... He got no service either. The ball was lumped up from the back and the strikers were asked to hold up play whilst our "midfield" trotted along. Please read this again - I have said he had a bad game, I have never said Lukakus touch is amazing, ever. Matt Etoo didn't set the world alight but he gave a good solid performance didn't lose the ball chose the right options apart from the shot. Held the ball up, enabled us to build or attempt to build rather. Are you blinded by your hatred of Eto..... When my £28M striker comes off the bench I want him to do the basics right as a very minimum not lose possession time after time..... But hey let's get off his back he made 3 yards sideways passes once or twice and defended a corner. He needs a boot up the arse (how many times has that been said) maybe it's not going to happen for him as I don't see any signs of improvement. He should be grabbing the game by the scruff of the neck and taking the game to them. He's not good enough for me Matt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Actual comments: Everton manager Roberto Martinez: "The scoreline reflects the team that took the chances. During long spells we stopped Swansea from playing. It was an important game for us - for players who haven't played many minutes and to see where they are. "If you analyse the chances Swansea had, they were few and far between. We had two or three very good situations. In many aspects, I was fairly pleased with that." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I do indeed. But they are clearly doing something different, and thats pressurising on the ball. Something we don't do, we back off or are not in shape to get the loose balls. We have no discipline. We normally do pressure the ball but like I have said in previous games we have dropped off too much after the initial burst and normally after we concede a goal. I do think there are issues with our shape too, once again, when we drop off because its almost as if the players get caught between pressuring the ball and sitting back. May well be, might be 2nd season blues. People have worked us out, and when that happens you need to mix things up. Moyes was slated for it relentlessly, Martinez is fast tracking his way to a verbal assault. He is the one to be held responsible here, something has to change quick. I dont think they have. Managers wont be setting their team up to say 'lets wait for them to make a mistake and then we will get them'. We have taken the lead in most of the games we have played. Moyes was slated for his one dimensional play. It was sit back, play for a point and hope we can nick a win. We arent one dimensional under Martinez, we have play some truely excellent football in patches for most of the games we have played this season. We have dominated the ball and generally created enough chances to put teams away before conceding absolute shockers. There are some clear issues and of course Martinez has to take some stick, in my opinion for team selection and in game substitutions, but there isnt much he can do about some of the goals we have conceded this season. I have never seen anything like it, even Wigan didnt fuck up this much! Its not like we are all over the place, we have been in position, done the right thing and then fucked it up. What can you do about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milesey05 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) Besic, Gibson, Hibbo, Atsu, Baby, Alcaraz, Eto , garbutt, with hardly any playing time between them this season is it such a shock we lost? I don't like losing any game but with the shit with have that's called depth of squad I can't think of anything worse than playing more games in this cup. I'm not going to lose any sleep over this game nor will the players rested for Saturday fearing for their places if certain individuals played a blinder. A derby win on Sat and all this Howard and lukaku shit will be hopefully be forgotten about....... For at least 5 days anyway. Edited September 23, 2014 by milesey05 Cornish Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Matt Etoo didn't set the world alight but he gave a good solid performance didn't lose the ball chose the right options apart from the shot. Held the ball up, enabled us to build or attempt to build rather. Are you blinded by your hatred of Eto..... When my £28M striker comes off the bench I want him to do the basics right as a very minimum not lose possession time after time..... But hey let's get off his back he made 3 yards sideways passes once or twice and defended a corner. He needs a boot up the arse (how many times has that been said) maybe it's not going to happen for him as I don't see any signs of improvement. He should be grabbing the game by the scruff of the neck and taking the game to them. He's not good enough for me Matt. What hatred of Etoo? I said I had doubts about his attitude, serious doubts, when we were linked. Doubts diminished when I heard he took a big pay cut to join us, turning down other better (richer) offers. Diminished further in his first 2 cameos, his work rate was excellent. Palace and today, he wasn't good enough and did no better or worse than Lukaku did. Thats not a defence of either of them, they were both poor. Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'm at work, so only able to read the board. Did ANYTHING good happen? Sounds like a real downer. Garbutt and Besic both looked promising, nothing beyond that, Romey 1878 and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueBlood81 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Martinez is fast tracking his way to a verbal assault. He is the one to be held responsible here, something has to change quick. With you on that Matt. I dread the Derby at the best of times but this ones fucking massive. If we somehow pull something out of our arses & get a result it could change our season. If as I suspect we play like we have been & get spanked its a long way back. Romey 1878, Steve_E and Matt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoof_It_Nev Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Tbh, we were never going to win the league cup, we can't win that, fa cup, Europa and the premiership. That'd just be greedy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith B Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 What the fuck was wrong with West Brom in that they couldn't score a goal on us? The defense would let in two goals against a youth team at this point. I don't know what is going on with this team but I'm starting to worry about relegation and it is September. Shit needs to get fixed quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 I dont think Martinez' comments are that far off from what I saw of the 2nd half. They didnt really threaten at all, made the most of Distin's mistake and then scored against tired legs while we were pressing for a goal. We didnt create much but Lukaku should have scored and the way that move came was through excellent work from McCarthy. We created a couple of half chances when Osman came on which were worked quite nicely but they defended well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 We normally do pressure the ball but like I have said in previous games we have dropped off too much after the initial burst and normally after we concede a goal. I do think there are issues with our shape too, once again, when we drop off because its almost as if the players get caught between pressuring the ball and sitting back. I dont think they have. Managers wont be setting their team up to say 'lets wait for them to make a mistake and then we will get them'. We have taken the lead in most of the games we have played. Moyes was slated for his one dimensional play. It was sit back, play for a point and hope we can nick a win. We arent one dimensional under Martinez, we have play some truely excellent football in patches for most of the games we have played this season. We have dominated the ball and generally created enough chances to put teams away before conceding absolute shockers. There are some clear issues and of course Martinez has to take some stick, in my opinion for team selection and in game substitutions, but there isnt much he can do about some of the goals we have conceded this season. I have never seen anything like it, even Wigan didnt fuck up this much! Its not like we are all over the place, we have been in position, done the right thing and then fucked it up. What can you do about that? Wish I knew mate. You're being very harsh on Moyes. We played some excellent stuff under him too, but that seems to have been quickly forgotten. 1 dimensional football seems to have simply changed shape. Pass it about almost aimlessly then occasionally hoof it up field and hope whoever is there can make something of it. At least under Moyes when we had to scrap a point or defend with backs to the wall we could do it, even if it was ugly and frustrating. There needs to be a balance. Moyes had discipline which sacrificed being adventurous. Martinez has attacking flair that leaves us undisciplined and exposed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Oh come on. Is anybody really surprised? Swansea at near full strength are not at all a bad team. And play some tasty football. If we were anywhere near full strength I'd be a bit more pissed. But look at our starting line up...Alcaraz, Hibbert, Gibson, Oviedo...4 players who have had no real football in 6-12 months. Then you have Garbett, Atsu, Besic and Eto'o newbies of differing qualities, experience etc. Only 3 regular players started tonight...Howard, Distin & McGeady. This isn't a team put out to win. It's a team put out to get some competitive game time. Gain some match fitness. Rest regular players ahead of the Derby on Saturday afternoon...you know it's the Derby this Saturday right? I know most of the anger is a combination of the season so far. But really? Some of the comments. Yes...I'll get flamed. But hey. Chach and Cornish Steve 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 To be honest it looks like most of the players are playing in a system that they are not comfortable with. Lukaku can trap the ball further than I can kick it, there is no creativity from centre midfield, the centre defenders look uncomfortable playing the ball out from the back, Hibbert and Osman have been great servants for Everton but their time is over, Pienaar has lost his pace, and generally we just look disorganised with no belief in our own game plan. Tonight, I think only Garbutt and, possibly, Besic come out with any credit. Eto'o was disappointing as was Lukaku, and we just dont carry athreat going forward while looking very shaky at the back. I am now very worried. To be honest it looks like most of the players are playing in a system that they are not comfortable with. Lukaku can trap the ball further than I can kick it, there is no creativity from centre midfield, the centre defenders look uncomfortable playing the ball out from the back, Hibbert and Osman have been great servants for Everton but their time is over, Pienaar has lost his pace, and generally we just look disorganised with no belief in our own game plan. Tonight, I think only Garbutt and, possibly, Besic come out with any credit. Eto'o was disappointing as was Lukaku, and we just dont carry athreat going forward while looking very shaky at the back. I am now very worried. Did Pienaar even play? I guarantee when he comes back along with Barkley we'll be a better side. Bailey and Steve_E 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Did Pienaar even play? I guarantee when he comes back along with Barkley we'll be a better side. nope yup (at least I hope so!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gethinO Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Just coming back from the match. Don't think we had a shot on target did we? Shocking. If ever I needed reassurance that Hibbert is finished, tonight was it. Absolutely dreadful. I'm dreading Saturday. It's gonna be another 4-0 me thinks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Wish I knew mate. You're being very harsh on Moyes. We played some excellent stuff under him too, but that seems to have been quickly forgotten. 1 dimensional football seems to have simply changed shape. Pass it about almost aimlessly then occasionally hoof it up field and hope whoever is there can make something of it. At least under Moyes when we had to scrap a point or defend with backs to the wall we could do it, even if it was ugly and frustrating. There needs to be a balance. Moyes had discipline which sacrificed being adventurous. Martinez has attacking flair that leaves us undisciplined and exposed. I dont think I am. We did play some great stuff at times but when things got serious we went into our shell. We defended, and we looked for a point and built our game plan on that. Ok we havent scored today but we have scored plenty of goals this season and that doesnt come from 1 dimensional football. There does need to be balance, I completely agree and we havent got that right, but yet again, I will add that we havent conceded many chances on the counter. Its not like we have been caught out attacking (Chelsea aside), we have been back in a defensive shape and the mistakes have kicked in. Its not as black and white as some of you want to make out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Just coming back from the match. Don't think we had a shot on target did we? Shocking. If ever I needed reassurance that Hibbert is finished, tonight was it. Absolutely dreadful. I'm dreading Saturday. It's gonna be another 4-0 me thinks! I feel for you I dont think I am. We did play some great stuff at times but when things got serious we went into our shell. We defended, and we looked for a point and built our game plan on that. Ok we havent scored today but we have scored plenty of goals this season and that doesnt come from 1 dimensional football. There does need to be balance, I completely agree and we havent got that right, but yet again, I will add that we havent conceded many chances on the counter. Its not like we have been caught out attacking (Chelsea aside), we have been back in a defensive shape and the mistakes have kicked in. Its not as black and white as some of you want to make out. Not sure I've said it's black and white? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 If we look at the positives.... Besic really looks special, though a little naive Garbutt looks very promising too Oviedo is back! Decent 45mins, nothing great, nothing bad. Alcaraz looked quite assured again, though that might because of captain slow and lieutenant brainfart. In all serious, his movement and reading of the game is so natural, but his distribution was rusty Thats about it.... Cornish Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Not sure I've said it's black and white? Everyone keeps saying its the defence, its Martinez, its this, its that whilst completely ignoring a lot of what has actually gone on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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