MikeO Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 I've been calling for his head for 12 months so far I've not been wrong (performances haven't improved as a whole). Win the cup and I still won't change my mind. And you'd have been calling for Kendall's head in 1983, only a lot louder with a lot more people on your side. You'd presumably on the basis of that post still have sacked him after the '84 Cup Final win; you can't say you've not been wrong unless you have a time machine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 On the basis of goal difference we should be sitting between 7th & 9th on par with Southampton & United. For me 7th is still not good enough Can agree there. 6 is a step forward. Anything less is a disappointing season. Our aim HAS to be top six and go all out Wednesday to get to the final. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) And you'd have been calling for Kendall's head in 1983, only a lot louder with a lot more people on your side. You'd presumably on the basis of that post still have sacked him after the '84 Cup Final win; you can't say you've not been wrong unless you have a time machine. I can because he's done nothing. Until he does something you or any other person can't say "you were wrong" until then I'm not. Edited January 16, 2016 by MC11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 I can because he's done nothing. Until he does something you or any other person can't say "you were wrong" until then I'm not. You know best x. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milesey05 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 I don't understand why it's taking so long or why it's so difficult to sort out. But I honestly enjoy watching and am much more optimistic than last year. I believe we have a better team. I believe we can compete against the top teams. I believe we have a chance of winning something. I haven't felt this way for years. That to me isn't moving backwards. You're right this is the best team we have had in years. Take a good look at it and remember this team because it's going to get torn apart in the Summer. When our team isn't as strong next season I won't moan half as much because I won't expect as much. Gwlad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) Strange... we have a manager who has us playing some of the most exciting football we have seen, and has recruited some amazing talent... but we can't defend and he should be sacked??? For me he is close to being an exceptional manager. Some work to be done but FFS we suffered moyes brand of football for so long. Isn't this a bit more interesting? Do people think there is a manager who will maintain our attacking style and turn us into a clean sheet machine. Edited January 16, 2016 by Hafnia brittoncarl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Strange... we have a manager who has us playing some of the most exciting football we have seen, and has recruited some amazing talent... but we can't defend and he should be sacked??? For me he is close to being an exceptional manager. Some work to be done but FFS we suffered moyes brand of football for so long. Isn't this a bit more interesting? Do people think there is a manager who will maintain our attacking style and turn us into a clean sheet machine. Moyes got results. The only time he didn't was when the board completely screwed him over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Strange... we have a manager who has us playing some of the most exciting football we have seen, and has recruited some amazing talent... but we can't defend and he should be sacked??? For me he is close to being an exceptional manager. Some work to be done but FFS we suffered moyes brand of football for so long. Isn't this a bit more interesting? We often disagree Haf but on this occasion thanks for the dose of sanity. Bemused that people can't see it, youth demanding instant gratification is my best guess. brittoncarl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) Moyes got results. The only time he didn't was when the board completely screwed him over. I don't see that at all. Sitting watching us hold out for 1-0 leads sometimes in the first half and drawing the game. Watching Everton play under Moyes was like driving to work knowing you needed to get petrol... you spend the whole journey wondering if you will break down instead of enjoying the music on the stereo. Semi final vs liverpool, final vs Chelsea. .. case closed. Edited January 16, 2016 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 I don't see that at all. Sitting watching us hold out for 1-0 leads sometimes in the first half and drawing the game. Watching Everton play under Moyes was like driving to work knowing you needed to get petrol... you spend the whole journey wondering if you will break down instead of enjoying the music on the stereo. Semi final vs liverpool, final vs Chelsea. .. case closed. And you really believe if Moyes took this side into them matches we'd have less of a chance than under Martinez? A 1-0 lead would have been secured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) And you really believe if Moyes took this side into them matches we'd have less of a chance than under Martinez? A 1-0 lead would have been secured.No, we would have been losing 2-0 and he would take off a striker for an extra midfielder. That's the shit he did. The 6-0 smashing by arsenal did a lot of damage to his bottle. The very fact he never got a result away from home against the traditional top 4 in 10 years supports that. Edited January 16, 2016 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 No, we would have been losing 2-0 and he would take off a striker for an extra midfielder. That's the shit he did. The very fact he never got a result away from home against the traditional top 4 in 10 years supports that. Since the first season neither has Martinez.... Who have we beat away from home under Martinez.... Arsenal? No, Chelsea? No, Liverpool? No..... So that leaves United who have had a major fall from grace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Since the first season neither has Martinez.... Who have we beat away from home under Martinez.... Arsenal? No, Chelsea? No, Liverpool? No..... So that leaves United who have had a major fall from grace. This is his 3rd season... not 10th. But yes, he's already set us up to go at the supposed better teams. And yes, he takes points off them and doesn't talk about penknives and gun fights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 This is his 3rd season... not 10th. But yes, he's already set us up to go at the supposed better teams. And yes, he takes points off them and doesn't talk about penknives and gun fights. You've put it out there that he gets wins away at the "big boys" but he's only beat one so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Not sure if he's beat Spurs or City yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 You've put it out there that he gets wins away at the "big boys" but he's only beat one so far. I never used a plural to indicate more than one victory. The traditional top 4 was a means indicating that in 40 specific games, moyes never got one victory. Martinez nailed it straight away and has only had 10 of these fixtures. I dare say we will have many more if he gets 40 fixtures worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 I never used a plural to indicate more than one victory. The traditional top 4 was a means indicating that in 40 specific games, moyes never got one victory. Martinez nailed it straight away and has only had 10 of these fixtures. I dare say we will have many more if he gets 40 fixtures worth. He also gave us our worst thumping at Anfield for years. I think we could call Spurs & City big boys these days he hasn't won there either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 He also gave us our worst thumping at Anfield for years. I think we could call Spurs & City big boys these days he hasn't won there either. Yep it's true. I hate to say it, at that time that liverpool team were in the process of winning the league... they had the best player I've seen influence anyone in the prem... Let's just hope Martinez gets half the time moyes did. After all, he's not using excuses and lowering expectations. He wants to have a go. You want moyes back by any chance??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Yep it's true. I hate to say it, at that time that liverpool team were in the process of winning the league... they had the best player I've seen influence anyone in the prem... Let's just hope Martinez gets half the time moyes did. After all, he's not using excuses and lowering expectations. He wants to have a go. You want moyes back by any chance??? He's made many excuses this season. Look at his interviews. Just be honest Hafnia ey. He hasn't broke the away duck at the big boys like you've tried to suggest. He's still struggling like Moyes. The Anfield Derby @ 4-0 could have easily been 8-0 it was embarrasing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Btay Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Can't wait to see the FA react to Roberto's comments, all of which are just. If Moyes were in charge today, he would have folded at 2-2 shitting himself trying to hold onto a point. We can't let this unfortunate result demoralise us and take away from the fact that we've just matched city twice, matched Tottenham and in your opinion outplayed chelsea ( bar 10 minutes ) at the bridge. brittoncarl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Btay Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 He's made many excuses this season. Look at his interviews. Just be honest Hafnia ey. He hasn't broke the away duck at the big boys like you've tried to suggest. He's still struggling like Moyes. The Anfield Derby @ 4-0 could have easily been 8-0 it was embarrasing. Away at United, Oviedo baby? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnh Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 JohnH: You've seen more Everton games than the rest of us. Would you fire a manager for a performance like that? No. We deserved to win and that we didn't was no fault of manager or players. We do have problems in defence and I have posted on here before that we need a hard nosed player at centre-back. We are too soft at the back. Martinez needs to get a defensive coach in who can sort out tactics, including how to 'shut up shop' in the last 10 mnutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 He's made many excuses this season. Look at his interviews. Just be honest Hafnia ey. He hasn't broke the away duck at the big boys like you've tried to suggest. He's still struggling like Moyes. The Anfield Derby @ 4-0 could have easily been 8-0 it was embarrasing. Thing is, if you grew up in the Moyes era you would forgiven for thinking that if you lose more than 2 nil you get point deductions.. I seen that man defend 2-0 potential losses like no one else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Away at United, Oviedo baby? Follow the thread from the middle mate... United win has been mentioned. Btay 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted January 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Strange... we have a manager who has us playing some of the most exciting football we have seen, and has recruited some amazing talent... but we can't defend and he should be sacked??? For me he is close to being an exceptional manager. Some work to be done but FFS we suffered moyes brand of football for so long. Isn't this a bit more interesting? Do people think there is a manager who will maintain our attacking style and turn us into a clean sheet machine. Spot on. I'm encouraged by this draw. We went to a big boy away expectin a win and are pissed we drew. Fuck me moyes we'd go expecting a loss and praying for a draw. Away we were awful. Bob gone to old trafford won, Emirates, walloped arse 3-0 day after my son born, best man city leg 1 semi final cup hopefully beat them again. We aren't scared of anyone now. Got youngsters playing first team, hell of a scouting network, homegrown Ross Barkley not ready for first team David moyes fucking future of England talent under bob. Stroking it about and playing beautiful attacking football. I'm encouraged that a Chelsea draw pisses us off, really am. Shows we have grown and have higher aspirations. Now let's win both those cups brittoncarl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adziom Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Strange... we have a manager who has us playing some of the most exciting football we have seen, and has recruited some amazing talent... but we can't defend and he should be sacked??? For me he is close to being an exceptional manager. Some work to be done but FFS we suffered moyes brand of football for so long. Isn't this a bit more interesting? Do people think there is a manager who will maintain our attacking style and turn us into a clean sheet machine. This is exactly it. The situation feels worse than it is because our ceiling is so high. Sure, we could change manager and shore things up at the back. But would the new manager get the likes of Barkley, Lukaku and Deulofeu buying into his style of play and the club's direction? 'Fraid not. I've thought since he started that he's a few tweaks from being something special, the concern is whether he's willing to make those tweaks. MikeO and Romey 1878 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Since the first season neither has Martinez.... Who have we beat away from home under Martinez.... Arsenal? No, Chelsea? No, Liverpool? No..... So that leaves United who have had a major fall from grace. As far as I'm concerned, we did just beat Chelsea. And we outplayed them, despite all the money they've spent on the team. The best David Moyes ever managed, away to Chelsea, was, ironically, 3-3 in 2009-10. Only that was a real 3-3, not a rigged one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Out of all the debates that go on...and there is always varied views that make good reading...the one I despise is all this Moyes malarkey. What's the point? 'What would Moyes have done with this team?' Fuck all...because he wouldn't have built this team in the first place. And no, it's not at all about finance, it's about style of play and preferred types of player. Why does he keep getting mentioned? He left us nearly 3 years ago.. 3 years!!! He's gone onto 2 jobs...been sacked...and is now a bit of a pundit. In terms of Martinez...he's done everything else bang on correct except the defensive part. But if his scouting and talent spotting keep getting in players like Mori, Besic, McCarthy etc, then this should level out. He does need to sort it, no doubt. I really hope he does. I've seen the goals now btw, Mori scored after the ET was announced, how much time did that celebration take up? I'd say a good 45 secs to 1 minute...so there's the extra - extra time. Forget that. The offside is the shitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 Not really wanting to get back into the Moyes/Bobby debate again but the fact of the matter is Moyes's results were far better than anything we have so far seen under Martinez There is a theory on here that Moyes only played hoofball ( absolute bollocks IMO) I also believe that there is no way we would be sitting in the bottom half of the table if Moyes had this group of players at his disposal But then there is the debate about whether or not Moyes could have attracted these players in the first place I always wanted Martinez but was somewhat sceptical about his defensive record however I still bought into his revolution in his first season . Last season saw us play the most mundane, boring shite I have ever witnessed at Goodison and so I started to have doubts. But this year some of the football going forward has been nothing short of superb. But it's come at a price ie we are woeful at the back But if you factor in that he has brought the average age of the squad down dramatically and the pool of young talent he has amassed I prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt for now and let's see how this young squad develops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted January 16, 2016 Report Share Posted January 16, 2016 (edited) For me personally, it's not that Moyes wouldn't have attracted these guys, but that he wouldn't have chosen them. I don't think he always played hoof ball (maybe more so in the early years) but he was overly restrictive and self defeating in that respect. We did play some good stuff, but at the same time he restricted the real creativity. I've nothing against him (although I was ready for change as I felt it was stale), I just don't see the point in him being mentioned every week. Edited January 16, 2016 by Newty82 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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