Jonny Z Cars Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 Vitor Periera gone from 25/ to 6/1 today. Id be happy with him or Martinez. Id even take Rafa! Anyone other than Neil fucking lennon!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 I'd say right now that Martinez is a better manager than moyes. Why? He's won a trophy on far less budget, has no internationals yet sets his teams to play like Barcelona. He has a tactical brain, an eye for a player, can get the best out of his squad using a variety of formations. He is a better manager in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 I'd say right now that Martinez is a better manager than moyes. Why? He's won a trophy on far less budget, has no internationals yet sets his teams to play like Barcelona. He has a tactical brain, an eye for a player, can get the best out of his squad using a variety of formations. He is a better manager in my opinion. And I will contest that argument by stating that Moyes brought top-7 finish continuitity, whereas Wigan is a team who is relegating. A delicate team like EFC needs continuity and stability, not extreme ups and downs. EFC doesn't need to become the new Newcastle United. Quinn31 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 And I will contest that argument by stating that Moyes brought top-7 finish continuitity, whereas Wigan is a team who is relegating. A delicate team like EFC needs continuity and stability, not extreme ups and downs. EFC doesn't need to become the new Newcastle United. I'd contest that to make a true judgement you don't look at league finishes alone - take into account salary budget, transfer budget, player appeal. Moyes has been able to put players like arteta and Fellini on £70k a week. Keep internationals like jags and baines on £50k a week. Martinez has the majority of his players earning less than £20k a week! Yet there he was standing toe to toe against man city in a final and showoling no gear. Good for you Roberto, class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 And I will contest that argument by stating that Moyes brought top-7 finish continuitity, whereas Wigan is a team who is relegating. A delicate team like EFC needs continuity and stability, not extreme ups and downs. EFC doesn't need to become the new Newcastle United. We've also had top 7 quality every year, Wigan has had bottom three quality without the money to do anything about that and he's won an FA Cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 Some people make judgements in football based on match of the day or headlines alone. Martinez may take Wigan down, the fact that he hadn't done so already is a credit to him. The way he gets his team to play speaks volumes about the man. He could get us into the top 4 and get us playing well in Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalziel Kane Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 What the hell, Wigan won the FA cup ? Been out all day and busy and even forgot it was cup final day in my defense, never got used to playing the fucking FA cup final before end of season, so mistakes can be excused, but what an achievement for them, what a surprise that was, most people will doubtless be whooping and hollering that Manchester City lost, but can't give bring myself to criticize or make fun. That is one damn surprise result, probably the biggest final upset since 1988 with Wimbledon, but maybe today - that should have been us. Take nothing away, it's an outstanding thing for Martinez and the team. Lo and behold everyone surges forward and declares Martinez the biggest thing since electricity, but can't quite buy into that thinking. Ok he did a surprise today, pulled off a real shock with a club team in fourth division soccer only a few years ago, but look at the league. Still in a relegation battle, and other names such as Laudrup have done well this season with less recognized club names. He did well today. A great achievement, but it's still not enough to want me seeing Martinez as next team manager. Nobody get too carried away by today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 it's a partly valid opinion but iI's like comparing apple's and oranges you'd never really know unless the roles where reversed which will never happen. I really do rate Martinez and I'd like to see him appointed but I have a feeling he will stay on at Wigan even more so if they do stay up. I hope I'm wrong as from the names touted he's the one who realistically could do well here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 (edited) Some people make judgements in football based on match of the day or headlines alone. Martinez may take Wigan down, the fact that he hadn't done so already is a credit to him. The way he gets his team to play speaks volumes about the man. He could get us into the top 4 and get us playing well in Europe. I don't think any manager is going to get us top 4 until we get investment, unless we get really lucky and definitely not consistently. However, I still want someone (Martinez for example) who'll change the way we play. I want to enjoy our football on match days more. I didn't do that enough under Moyes. I always loved the intensity and adrenaline against the top sides, but when that wasn't there in the regular games, our football itself was often really stale. When thinking back on this season about the best games, it's mostly games against the top sides (there was a very good one against Fulham as well I can remember). But that's mostly because of pride of the work rate and grit showcased, not because of our "good football". Edited May 11, 2013 by Steve_E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 (edited) We've also had top 7 quality every year, Wigan has had bottom three quality without the money to do anything about that and he's won an FA Cup. You think? I mean I don't want to offend anyone here, but this is the English Premier League. Baines, Fellaini... those are guys you can expect to reach top 4-7 each year like EFC did the past few years. I'm not saying the rest is bad, definitely not. But I may have hurt people's feelings on here by stating only those 2 lads plus Coleman in his good run of form and maybe Mirallas would be the only players at EFC to be starting lineup material for a team like Tottenham, but I'd gladly invite you to contradict that statement. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think I am. Moyes did a fantastic job helping the lads reach 4th to 7th places back to back since years. He is a really good manager you know, you see the lads playing in a very well structured system, that is more than you can say about most teams. I rate EFC at about the quality same level as NUFC, and those guys go up and down in extremes. They're now near the bottom of the league table. That's cause they don't have the same sense of continuity that Everton has. Sure, we have better players than West Brom, West Ham and Swansea... But so does NUFC and they're below these teams in the rankings, because even good teams don't always have good seasons. But Everton DOES and that's my point. It's the merit of Moyes ans that's why ManU want him. Again, I don't wish to effend anyone with these statements, I'm just trying to have a well balanced discussion with my mate Steve. Edited May 11, 2013 by Mirallas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 The thing we need to remember is that we need someone to come in and manage the club not just the playing squad. Moyes ran Everton from top to bottom and we need someone else who can do that. We need that consistency and we dont want someone to come in and make drastic changes. We need a manager to come in and maintain what Moyes did right and improve upon what Moyes did wrong. For me, that is why Martinez should be the number one domestic candidate. Wigan have a similar set up to us (albeit on a smaller scale), we have a squad that Martinez could easily make his own (I imagine he would lick his lips at having two wing backs with the energy and quality of Baines & Coleman!) and he has worked wonders on a small transfer and wage budget. He is trying to build the club at Wigan like Moyes has done with us and slowly he is improving the quality of the side, selling on his stars and bringing in unearthed gems. Martinez is also a bright and enthusiastic individual. He doesnt rest on his laurels and he doesnt sulk. Straight after the Swansea game which must have been a heart wrencher for him, he was gutted but still upbeat and ready for the challenge ahead. He was keen for the players and himself to learn from the mistakes of that game emotionally and tactically. Even after today's win, he had his feet firmly on the ground and whilst he was enjoying the moment you could hear from his comments that the Arsenal game was at the forefront of his mind. If you actually look closer at that game today Wigan had 2 CB's, 1 FB and 2 CM's in their back 5, not to mention a young on loan keeper behind them and they still restricted City to one good chance. I dont think its entirely unreasonable to say that McArthur, Boyce, Espinoza and Gomez arent really Premiership level (although Gomez has his moments) and bar maybe Boyce I dont think any of them would make their starting 11 if everyone was fit. Matt and StevO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 You think? I mean I don't want to offend anyone here, but this is the English Premier League. Baines, Fellaini... those are guys you can expect to reach top 4-7 each year like EFC did the past few years. I'm not saying the rest is bad, definitely not. But I may have hurt people's feelings on here by stating only those 2 lads plus Coleman in his good run of form and maybe Mirallas would be the only players at EFC to be starting lineup material for a team like Tottenham, but I'd gladly invite you to contradict that statement. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think I am. Moyes did a fantastic job helping the lads reach 4th to 7th places back to back since years. He is a really good manager you know, you see the lads playing in a very well structured system, that is more than you can say about most teams. I rate EFC at about the quality same level as NUFC, and those guys go up and down in extremes. They're now near the bottom of the league table. That's cause they don't have the same sense of continuity that Everton has. Sure, we have better players than West Brom, West Ham and Swansea... But so does NUFC and they're below these teams in the rankings, because even good teams don't always have good seasons. But Everton DOES and that's my point. It's the merit of Moyes ans that's why ManU want him. Again, I don't wish to effend anyone with these statements, I'm just trying to have a well balanced discussion with my mate Steve. I said we have top 7 quality in those years and I stand by that, I'm convinced that we have the 6th best squad in the league at the moment. I rate Spurs as top 5 right now. Mainly because they have a bigger squad and one world class player in a position that wins football games (Bale). I don't think there's much difference in the starting XI's. I'm sure Jagielka would start ahead of Dawson for example as well. Lloris; Coleman, Jagielka, Vertonghen, Baines; Lennon, Fellaini, Dembélé, Bale; Mirallas, Adebayor would probably be my starting XI of a Spurs/Everton-team. I think we're better than Liverpool as well. They've got two fantastic players: Suarez is world class, Coutinho has the potential to be. The rest of them are very average. Newcastle have a decent team, they should have done better than they have, but they have a bad manager (signed till 2090 I believe?) and have had some injuries, a major one to their best player for example (Ben Arfa). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 You think? I mean I don't want to offend anyone here, but this is the English Premier League. Baines, Fellaini... those are guys you can expect to reach top 4-7 each year like EFC did the past few years. I'm not saying the rest is bad, definitely not. But I may have hurt people's feelings on here by stating only those 2 lads plus Coleman in his good run of form and maybe Mirallas would be the only players at EFC to be starting lineup material for a team like Tottenham, but I'd gladly invite you to contradict that statement. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think I am. Moyes did a fantastic job helping the lads reach 4th to 7th places back to back since years. He is a really good manager you know, you see the lads playing in a very well structured system, that is more than you can say about most teams. I rate EFC at about the quality same level as NUFC, and those guys go up and down in extremes. They're now near the bottom of the league table. That's cause they don't have the same sense of continuity that Everton has. Sure, we have better players than West Brom, West Ham and Swansea... But so does NUFC and they're below these teams in the rankings, because even good teams don't always have good seasons. But Everton DOES and that's my point. It's the merit of Moyes ans that's why ManU want him. Again, I don't wish to effend anyone with these statements, I'm just trying to have a well balanced discussion with my mate Steve. I think we are a top 7 team. We might not have the individuals that some clubs have but we have a well balanced squad that is capable of matching anyone. Not everyone has been on form this season but when you think we have Jagielka, Heitinga, Baines, Coleman, Fellaini, Mirallas and Jelavic. At the end of last season Heits and Jelavic were two of our best players, they havent done well this year but that doesnt mean they arent capable of finding that form in the future. Man City & Chelsea are clearly squads filled with talent but they play like mercenaries. Spurs have some great individuals in Bale, Dembele, Defoe, Vertonghen and Lloris but Im not sure I would be too bothered about any of their other players tbh. Man Utd dont have the greatest individuals (bar RVP) but they too are a great 'team'. Newcastle have good players but aside from Cisse, Ben Arfa, Cabaye and to an extent Tiote they certainly arent any better than our squad. Arsenal have done well to be where they are because I dont think they have the strongest team sheet any more. Liverpool have a decent squad as well but after that I cant think of any teams that have more than one or two top players. Put it this way, I certainly think you would be doing us a disservice to say that we don't have one of the strongest starting 11's in the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Droobie Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 All the front runners and/or our top 5 favourites are in Europe next season - why would any of them leave for us? I just saw an article how DM leaving frees up some wages that can equate to extra transfer funds. I'm open to promoting from within. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 Ok, Top 7 finish for EFC would definitely be logical, but managing to reach top 7 year in year out is a whole other story. That's what i think is remarkable. Quinn31 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 Martinez dodged the Everton question big time - he's coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted May 11, 2013 Report Share Posted May 11, 2013 Lets not forget what Martinez did at Swansea. He made them into the club they are today and along with Sousa is responsible for the attractive football Swansea still play now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 I've seen Luis Plaza get mentioned somewhere, that would be a left field choice, which could be a really good appointment actually. Not got the top level management experience but worked wonders at Getafe so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drs08 Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 (edited) I was just mulling over all this, reading all your posts & it hit me, if we actually believe Moyes (is a good manager for what he's done with us, budget wise, constraints etc...) & that he can go on and work with better / improved resources with Manc Utd and succeed that logic applies to Martinez if he came to us ie. a more superior (stable) club like EfC (Vs Wigan)???The more I think about it the more I think Martinez could actually do a decent job for us, assuming we get him.He gets his team to play proper football, something we've always craved at EfC + if we can keep the spine of our squad + the incoming £ from probably a couple of sales (Felli & Hopefully not Baines) start playing the youth we have got coming through which Moyes consistently ignored the likes of Barkley, Green etc, then I think we could actually continue to be a force next season & onward.+ hes got a couple of decent players he could bring with Mcmnamananananananan (+ he's a bluensoe) and the other Mc's (not Ronald) before anyone says anything IMO, COYB Edited May 12, 2013 by drs08 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 Martinez really put the cat amongst the pigeons for me. From their game against us and the final, he is clearly a class act. He carries himself well in the media and never says the wrong thing. The way he works his budget with his chairman, I'd be very surprised if he wasn't kenwrights first choice. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troy8 Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 http://www.teamtalk.com/premier-league/8708137/Fulham-boss-Martin-Jol-is-staying-coy-about-a-possible-move-to-Everton Martin Jol no thanks! Steve_E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 http://www.teamtalk.com/premier-league/8708137/Fulham-boss-Martin-Jol-is-staying-coy-about-a-possible-move-to-Everton Martin Jol no thanks! oh crap.... mind you, of course managers will not rule out the possibility. We just have to hope the board dont make (another) massive mistake... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 http://www.teamtalk.com/premier-league/8708137/Fulham-boss-Martin-Jol-is-staying-coy-about-a-possible-move-to-Everton Martin Jol no thanks! Jol's always surprisingly humble after we play them, saying we're an inspiration for a lot of clubs etc. I hope that isn't because he's close to Moyes or something, as Davie's apparently advising Kenwright in the search for a new manager. Really don't want Jol either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 I actually rate Jol as a manager, buys good players - did a good job at spurs and signed many of the players in the team that are now challenging for the champions league. He's done well at Fulham too in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 Jol is a better alterative than MoN, Hughes, Lennon etc Saw the FA cup final yesterday. Martinez did an amazing job against chelsea in the tactics. Id be very mad if we didnt offer him an arm and a leg to come to Everton. He seems to have everything good that DM had, along with a winners attitude. Tactically astute to. Please Everton, sign him up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 Jol is a better alterative than MoN, Hughes, Lennon etc Saw the FA cup final yesterday. Martinez did an amazing job against chelsea in the tactics. Id be very mad if we didnt offer him an arm and a leg to come to Everton. He seems to have everything good that DM had, along with a winners attitude. Tactically astute to. Please Everton, sign him up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 Man city. Soz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 I actually rate Jol as a manager, buys good players - did a good job at spurs and signed many of the players in the team that are now challenging for the champions league. He's done well at Fulham too in my opinion. He did a bad job at Ajax though. Their fans really wanted him out as they weren't playing the Ajax way under him, which is very important to their fans. He also didn't win the league with them, which means you didn't do good enough of a job. He also signed one of his former players at Hamburg, Thimothée Atouba, for €1.4m a year. That made him one of Ajax' highest paid players and he was incredibly shit. At Fulham he's also signed Manolev, who is frequently ridiculed on Dutch television, and Enoh, who's a brainless fitness enthusiast without any footballing ability, and Frimpong, who's basically the English Enoh. I don't rate Kieran Richardson at all either. And he's only been able to sign Berbatov because they knew each other from their time at Tottenham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 Everton fans respond to West Ham chants of 'Where's your Moysie gone?' with 'We want Sam Allardyce, we want Sam Allardyce.' @BenSmithBBC 2 minutes ago no we fuckin dont! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalziel Kane Posted May 12, 2013 Report Share Posted May 12, 2013 They can keep Allardyce. Did well at Bolton for a few years but just turned to shit once he went elsewhere. One name that hasn't been mentioned is Gordon Strachan, and you can be sure it'll be berated, but there's plenty of other names being talked of, so why not him. He has some managerial achievements to his name, knows the game inside out, and seems a plausible candidate to throw in, but you just know most won't take to him. Felt it only fair to offer an inclusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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