What Are You Watching?

[dunlopp9987]

He did win, but it wasn't one of the major 12 acting categories.

[Palfy]

6 hours ago, MikeO said:

Fair question. Not seen any of it so difficult to comment. Thing that annoys me though over here is the MOBO awards, if anyone suggested having a MOWO ceremony everyone's head would fall off.

Fair point would people of Black origin feel racially abused if whites had their own award ceremony in a chosen field that excluded blacks. I am very much against racism and very much for equal opportunities so I don’t believe you can have one rule for some and another rule for others. And also no one should have a given right to an award because of the colour of their skin. But I do agree that mathematics has a part to play in it surely the law of averages is a proven law, I would be questioning the judge’s and what the split of whites to blacks on the panel was, also to see what percentage of white judges voted for a black actor against their votes for white actors, and vice versa with black judges, and run this over so many years to see if there’s a common denominator as to why such a high percentage of whites win the awards against blacks Again maths has a part to play in finding if there is a proportionate difference when all the evidence as been collated. 

[dunlopp9987]

17 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Fair point would people of Black origin feel racially abused if whites had their own award ceremony in a chosen field that excluded blacks. I am very much against racism and very much for equal opportunities so I don’t believe you can have one rule for some and another rule for others. And also no one should have a given right to an award because of the colour of their skin. But I do agree that mathematics has a part to play in it surely the law of averages is a proven law, I would be questioning the judge’s and what the split of whites to blacks on the panel was, also to see what percentage of white judges voted for a black actor against their votes for white actors, and vice versa with black judges, and run this over so many years to see if there’s a common denominator as to why such a high percentage of whites win the awards against blacks Again maths has a part to play in finding if there is a proportionate difference when all the evidence as been collated. 

Ultimately, the biggest issue I have is the absolute hypocrisy of it all. It's all lip service.

This year they had 49 people of color recognized as nominees, a record. Almost every presenter was a PoC. The director of the academy or whatever his title is, made a speech about how we've never had as many diverse shows and talent on TV as we have now. Which of course is true.

But when it came time to recognize and reward these non-white creatives, that was apparently too far for the Emmy's. And this is not the first time this has happened. It happened in 2019, and a few years prior to that. #Emmyssowhite has become a trending hashtag almost every year.

One huge thing I learned last year was that, obviously representation matters, but that it has to start happening from the very top. Sure you can pat yourself on the back for hiring people of color, or donating to charities, or casting people of color. But until the people doing the hiring, and doing the donating, and doing the casting start to look like the more diverse world we live in, nothing has changed.

It's a white supremacist world, and we need to start knocking that down. From the very top down.

[Palfy]

Just now, patto said:

isn't it just down to good acting that you win awards and nothing to do with race 

Evidently it isn’t, I think it goes a lot deeper than that, the disparity between white winners and blacks every year is far too big to be just coincidence, unless of course white actors make better actors than blacks, but I don’t hold with that theory so I wish someone could enlighten me as to why the gap is so huge every year. 

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, dunlopp9987 said:

@Romey 1878 this tweet perfectly sums up my thoughts.

 

Like I said, I don't care about these awards (or any awards) so I don't pay attention to the nominees and I probably haven't watched many of the shows (or movies?) to have an opinion on whether the "right" nominees won.

Whites shouldn't be winning just because they're white and blacks shouldn't win to tick a box (which is what you know the racists would be screaming), it should only be based on who did the job better. I don't know how you go about making it happen, wiser people than me are going to have to figure that out.

[MikeO]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

Like I said, I don't care about these awards (or any awards) so I don't pay attention to the nominees and I probably haven't watched many of the shows (or movies?) to have an opinion on whether the "right" nominees won.

Whites shouldn't be winning just because they're white and blacks shouldn't win to tick a box (which is what you know the racists would be screaming), it should only be based on who did the job better. I don't know how you go about making it happen, wiser people than me are going to have to figure that out.

There are people wiser than you Mark? Find that hard to believe

[MikeO]

3 hours ago, Palfy said:

Fair point would people of Black origin feel racially abused if whites had their own award ceremony in a chosen field that excluded blacks. I am very much against racism and very much for equal opportunities so I don’t believe you can have one rule for some and another rule for others. And also no one should have a given right to an award because of the colour of their skin. But I do agree that mathematics has a part to play in it surely the law of averages is a proven law, I would be questioning the judge’s and what the split of whites to blacks on the panel was, also to see what percentage of white judges voted for a black actor against their votes for white actors, and vice versa with black judges, and run this over so many years to see if there’s a common denominator as to why such a high percentage of whites win the awards against blacks Again maths has a part to play in finding if there is a proportionate difference when all the evidence as been collated. 

Totally clolour blind me (I like to think), I just can't get the sense in any of it. Your skin colour is down to where your ancesters were bought up, if they were from a sunny place they'd have dark skin, if they weren't they'd be white. Madness.

[pete0]

18 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Well the show is almost over, and this most certainly will be a major story tomorrow.

I genuinely feel ill watching this.

You think any of the actors won purely because they're white? 

Just had a quick look and most the awards have gone to period dramas which will have a less diverse cast.

If anything the bigger disparity is in having black presenters. There's three times as many Latinos in America and they've been for the most part ignored completely.

[Romey 1878]

3 hours ago, MikeO said:

There are people wiser than you Mark? Find that hard to believe

So did I tbh but I can’t always toot my own horn. A bit of humility is needed at times. 

[dunlopp9987]

10 hours ago, patto said:

isn't it just down to good acting that you win awards and nothing to do with race 

 

6 hours ago, pete0 said:

You think any of the actors won purely because they're white? 

Just had a quick look and most the awards have gone to period dramas which will have a less diverse cast.

If anything the bigger disparity is in having black presenters. There's three times as many Latinos in America and they've been for the most part ignored completely.

The links provided below show the ethnic makeup of the members of the Hollywood Foreign Press (who vote for the Golden Globes) and the voters for the Oscars. For the Oscars, it is 84% white. For the HFP, the LA Times unearthed that there are zero Black journalists among the 87 voting members. 

Again, equity and inclusion has to start from the top down. Otherwise it's just veneer and lip service that they're "creating a more inclusive environment that mirrors our society." If what the head of the TV academy says is true, that right now we have the most diverse selection of tv in history, why are the winners of awards still overwhelmingly white? Are we to believe that white people just make better art and that people of color don't?

Golden Globes

Academy Awards

[pete0]

3 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

 

The links provided below show the ethnic makeup of the members of the Hollywood Foreign Press (who vote for the Golden Globes) and the voters for the Oscars. For the Oscars, it is 84% white. For the HFP, the LA Times unearthed that there are zero Black journalists among the 87 voting members. 

Again, equity and inclusion has to start from the top down. Otherwise it's just veneer and lip service that they're "creating a more inclusive environment that mirrors our society." If what the head of the TV academy says is true, that right now we have the most diverse selection of tv in history, why are the winners of awards still overwhelmingly white? Are we to believe that white people just make better art and that people of color don't?

Golden Globes

Academy Awards

3 winners out of 27 is 11.1%, which is in line with the US demographics 13.4%. 

 

[MikeO]

2 hours ago, pete0 said:

3 winners out of 27 is 11.1%, which is in line with the US demographics 13.4%. 

24 white winners out of 27 is very nearly 90% though, and the US is around 60% white. Perspective.

[dunlopp9987]

3 hours ago, MikeO said:

24 white winners out of 27 is very nearly 90% though, and the US is around 60% white. Perspective.

Thanks for that, Mike.

3 hours ago, patto said:

Sidney Poitier won numerous awards in his career and he won them for being a brilliant Actor in times of high racism.

And this is what we call Black Exceptionalism. It's the notion of "Look, it can be done, just like Obama did!" Yes, he was a brilliant actor winning awards in times that were far less rewarding than they are now. But that's the exception, not the rule.
 

Sidney was also well aware of how he presented himself to white audiences. He was what white audiences wanted to see if they saw a Black man on screen. Now I'm not saying that that version of himself might not have been who he actually was at all times, but there's this tendency for Black performers to have to be palatable for white audiences, and constantly code-switching. Thankfully it feels like we're slowly moving away from that, as we're seeing artists now like Lil Nas X and Lizzo who are unapologetically themselves, Black, and not confirming to what they think a white audience will tolerate in order to gain success.

[pete0]

16 hours ago, pete0 said:

There's three times as many Latinos in America and they've been for the most part ignored completely.

 

3 hours ago, MikeO said:

24 white winners out of 27 is very nearly 90% though, and the US is around 60% white. Perspective.

Unsure how to swap the quotes around. 

Dunlopp is suggesting it's black people who have been discriminated against and the awards show over compensated by getting black presenters.

Yet the awards winners would correlate with racism towards Latinos. Whereas the people getting to present would correlate to racism against white and Latino. (Personally don't think there was any prejudice, although I do think most period dramas are shite).

Asians and "other" for lack of a better word would be expected to get only one. With that probability there's no reason to suggest racism.

[dunlopp9987]

29 minutes ago, pete0 said:

 

Unsure how to swap the quotes around. 

Dunlopp is suggesting it's black people who have been discriminated against and the awards show over compensated by getting black presenters.

Yet the awards winners would correlate with racism towards Latinos. Whereas the people getting to present would correlate to racism against white and Latino. (Personally don't think there was any prejudice, although I do think most period dramas are shite).

Asians and "other" for lack of a better word would be expected to get only one. With that probability there's no reason to suggest racism.

Ultimately what I'm saying is that the awards skew heavily towards white people. There were presenters who were Black, Asian, Latinx, Indigenous American. So the Academy was putting on a show of how diverse their industry is, but when it comes time to reward PoC, that doesn't happen. And I can't imagine it's a coincidence that the majority of voters are white.

According to the 2020 census, non-Hispanic white Americans make up 57.8% of the population. Of the 75 Emmy nominations in the 12 acting categories this year, 45 were white and 30 were people of color. So while not exactly in line with the racial demographics of the US, it's close. But then none of the PoC win an award? It just makes absolutely no sense.

[MikeO]

This made me laugh a lot..

 

[MikeO]

Part two...

 

[Matt]

Yeah that's a classic.  His shows are brilliant but not for the fainthearted 

[MikeO]

2 hours ago, Matt said:

Yeah that's a classic.  His shows are brilliant but not for the fainthearted 

Just so clever, my brother showed it to me last night and I was rolling on the floor (figuratively, not literally).

[Bailey]

3 hours ago, Matt said:

Yeah that's a classic.  His shows are brilliant but not for the fainthearted 

I watched two of his stand-ups on the way back from New York and I must have looked crazy. I was trying to hold back laughs so much that it was hurting!

[StevO]

I saw this a few weeks ago, and with the discussion going on the last few days I think it’s a great excuse to show something deep from a truly great actor. 
 

  

[StevO]

22 hours ago, Matt said:

Yeah that's a classic.  His shows are brilliant but not for the fainthearted 

He is funny and brutal.
My wife made me turn off one of his shows a few years ago that was a bit close to the bone for a recent issue. We watched the same show about probably a year later and found it hilarious. 

[dunlopp9987]

31 minutes ago, StevO said:

I saw this a few weeks ago, and with the discussion going on the last few days I think it’s a great excuse to show something deep from a truly great actor. 
 

  

This loss really hit me. I've watched him on The Wire, Boardwalk Empire and Lovecraft Country. He was one of the finest actors of this generation. He has such a nuance and subtlety to the way he approaches his work. His portrayal of Omar on The Wire will go down as one of the top TV performances of all time. And that's not just my opinion, that's widely regarded as fact.

[StevO]

9 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

This loss really hit me. I've watched him on The Wire, Boardwalk Empire and Lovecraft Country. He was one of the finest actors of this generation. He has such a nuance and subtlety to the way he approaches his work. His portrayal of Omar on The Wire will go down as one of the top TV performances of all time. And that's not just my opinion, that's widely regarded as fact.

Loved him in Boardwalk, but still not managed to see The Wire yet. I’ve got all of Lovecraft Country recorded but after the first episode I was a bit take it or leave it so not gone back to it yet. 
He was good in The Night Off too. 

[dunlopp9987]

6 minutes ago, StevO said:

Loved him in Boardwalk, but still not managed to see The Wire yet. I’ve got all of Lovecraft Country recorded but after the first episode I was a bit take it or leave it so not gone back to it yet. 
He was good in The Night Off too. 

Oh Steve, watch The Wire. One of the best American TV series' I've watched.

And I totally get that about Lovecraft. It's a bit of a strange one. I wasn't raving about it, but I definitely enjoyed it.

[StevO]

4 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Oh Steve, watch The Wire. One of the best American TV series' I've watched.

And I totally get that about Lovecraft. It's a bit of a strange one. I wasn't raving about it, but I definitely enjoyed it.

I can’t seem to find The Wire. I have Netflix, Disney+ and Prime. I might just have to buy the box set on blu ray. 
 

The trailer for Lovecraft had me very excited and then the first episode left me flat. I’m sure I’ll go back to it in winter when it’s cold and got nothing else to do. 

[dunlopp9987]

1 minute ago, StevO said:

I can’t seem to find The Wire. I have Netflix, Disney+ and Prime. I might just have to buy the box set on blu ray. 
 

The trailer for Lovecraft had me very excited and then the first episode left me flat. I’m sure I’ll go back to it in winter when it’s cold and got nothing else to do. 

Yeah, Wire is HBO. I assumed since you had access to Lovecraft that you got HBO.

[StevO]

5 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Yeah, Wire is HBO. I assumed since you had access to Lovecraft that you got HBO.

No, Lovecraft was on Sky. That’s like our biggest TV provider over here, probably like your cable supplier. They have a lot of HBO shows. 

[Sibdane]

On 22/09/2021 at 12:02, StevO said:

I can’t seem to find The Wire. I have Netflix, Disney+ and Prime. I might just have to buy the box set on blu ray. 
 

The trailer for Lovecraft had me very excited and then the first episode left me flat. I’m sure I’ll go back to it in winter when it’s cold and got nothing else to do. 

It definitely got more interesting as the season went on. 

[dunlopp9987]

Watching season 3 of Sex Education on Netflix. One thing this show has always been so great at is addressing issues that are current and relevant to what teenagers are facing right now.

For example, in this season, there's a new character who is non-binary, and is struggling to see where they fit in a traditional British school system.

Which made me think, anyone on here who has kids that are that age: is this something that is being addressed in schools today? We don't have things like head girls or head boys over here in the states, so I'm wondering how things are being addressed with something like a non-binary student who doesn't fit into either category.