MC11 Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 The reason i'm not keen on him is that we play a possession based game, with full back who bomb on. We need a centre forward who looks after the ball - he just doesn't do this well enough. The reason i'm not keen on him is that we play a possession based game, with full back who bomb on. We need a centre forward who looks after the ball - he just doesn't do this well enough. I completely agree. I'd like Lukaku here. But I've always said it.... He needs proper competition and in that someone who offers something different (what you mention). There were to many times this season when he didn't get into the game and we were crying out for a different option. Eventually that came in Naismith. But no matter how much I rate Naismith with his movement and one on one ability. He also lacks in areas. It's a hard one because our hands are tied with money once again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 If we had at least £50m to spend then £20m would be ok.... I guess. The reality is that if we bought him we would have no other options and we need other options. If we bought Bony or Remi I would have absolute confidence that we wouldn't be substituting them for seriously off days. Lukakus off days were really really big off days. Seriously, there were games this season where I questioned if he had been drinking before playing. The lad needed the shepherds crook a good few times with a bit of a slap if i'm honest. I caught Barkley fuming with him on more than one occassion and for me that was telling. I know it sounds crazy but he has a bit of the Victor Anichebe's about him - big, poor in the air, sometimes strong, sometimes a stiff breeze knocks him over and yes - seems to infuriate team mates. To balance this out I will bring Barkley into analysis - I seen him on more than one occassion look like a championship player, poor decisions, fragile confidence and really looked lost. However, there were never games where I doubted his ability or never trusted him to take the ball. Apart from that - we aren't being asked to blow a summers transfer budget on him - he cost nothing and his game time will improve his decision making and confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sibdane Posted May 30, 2014 Popular Post Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 Seriously, there were games this season where I questioned if he had been drinking before playing. The lad needed the shepherds crook a good few times with a bit of a slap if i'm honest. I caught Barkley fuming with him on more than one occassion and for me that was telling. I know it sounds crazy but he has a bit of the Victor Anichebe's about him - big, poor in the air, sometimes strong, sometimes a stiff breeze knocks him over and yes - seems to infuriate team mates. The main difference being that Lukaku scored 15 goals in 31 games and Anichebe scored 18 in 131 games for us. Anichebe was/is terrible, and while they are the same in physical stature, Anichebe didn't know where the goal was. MikeO, Kant, Matt and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Romey 1878 Posted May 30, 2014 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 The main difference being that Lukaku scored 15 goals in 31 games and Anichebe scored 18 in 131 games for us. Anichebe was/is terrible, and while they are the same in physical stature, Anichebe didn't know where the goal was. He knew where his arse was though. He spent enough time on it. Matt, Toffee_in_LA, Sibdane and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 This looks like Anichebe? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCtlZe6mbt8 I see great dribbling, good link-up play & assists and him bagging one goal after another with service coming from the wings. The evidence seems to prove my description of Lukaku's qualities. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nikica Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 (edited) Youtube compilations are notoriously misleading though. They can make any player look like Pele. The 'middle ground' doesn't always apply, but I think it does here - the truth lies somewhere in between the two extremes (yours and hafnia's). I don't think he's as good as you are saying, and I don't think his technique and link-up play is as bad as hafnia is implying. I'd say his touch and passing are erratic but show potential to improve. Benatia is a pretty good defender btw. Edited May 30, 2014 by Nikica Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 I see great dribbling, good link-up play & assists and him bagging one goal after another with service coming from the wings. The evidence seems to prove my description of Lukaku's qualities. I just see a really annoying video....gave me a headache after two minutes so I turned it off. Somebody trying to be too clever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 YeH I knew we wouldn't get rom but I'm not bothered. Would love a poor mans aguero type striker here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kant Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 Would love a poor mans aguero type striker here. A poor Aguero version would still be a hell of a player. Any ideas of who this player would be? Aguero is pretty unique (very quick, strong, good link-up play, not selfish to be a striker, composed, good movements off the ball...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nikica Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 (edited) A poor Aguero version would still be a hell of a player. Any ideas of who this player would be? Aguero is pretty unique (very quick, strong, good link-up play, not selfish to be a striker, composed, good movements off the ball...) David Villa in his prime was pretty similar to Aguero: fast, strong, great at creating oportunites (out-assisted a prime Ronaldinho one year) and could create something from nothing. He demonstrated sublime movement and great finishing too. Villa was the best striker in Europe for a while, but Aguero is probably more talented and has surpassed Villa at his best now. As for a current 'poor Aguero' (who as you correctly say would still be of very high quality), nobody immediately stands out. That skillset is pretty unique, although I think much if not all of it applies to Suarez too - but then he's at least as good as Aguero. Very hard to say. Anyone else have any suggestions? Actually, a similar player and 'poor Aguero' could be argued to be his international team-mate Lavezzi. He's sort of similar and clearly not as good as Kun. Not really an out and out striker but they do have an eerily similar skillset and similar physical traits. However, you couldn't buy a player like him, so he's not 'poor' enough. Edited May 30, 2014 by Nikica Kant 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 A poor Aguero version would still be a hell of a player. Any ideas of who this player would be? Aguero is pretty unique (very quick, strong, good link-up play, not selfish to be a striker, composed, good movements off the ball...) I don't know to be honest. I like David villa as well, loic remy would be nice. I'm just saying that I don't think we need a big muscular type striker, for the possession play I would rather a smaller speedy guy who can make quick runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 Lukaku could make me look like a Tit by being a beast one game and bagging 4 goals and a genius the next game for looking shite. What makes him look good is not in doubt, when he has his tail up and fancies it he can be a handful. What makes him look shite is the stuff that makes him hide and withdrawn. Is he a flat track bully??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 The main difference being that Lukaku scored 15 goals in 31 games and Anichebe scored 18 in 131 games for us. Anichebe was/is terrible, and while they are the same in physical stature, Anichebe didn't know where the goal was. Victor had talent. The problem was he didn't know how to use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Victor and lukaku are very similar in stature, pace, lukaku has more of a goalscorers instinct and intelligence. Their technical flaws are very similar. Vic when he had his head on it was great, he scored some great goals rolling his man and finding the bottom corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Victor = back to goal - great On front foot not very good... Although he could be at times! Rom = back to goal not very good On front foot great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Don't abandon hope yet Matt and Toffee_in_LA 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thoward18 Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 I can see that we're back to comparing a 20-year-old Lukaku to guys five+ years older. Not that the comparison to Anichebe is logical even when disregarding age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 I can see that we're back to comparing a 20-year-old Lukaku to guys five+ years older. Not that the comparison to Anichebe is logical even when disregarding age. It's one ridiculous statement after another. We should have stopped at: good: - fast - good dribbler - consistent goalscorer - physically strong - plenty of assists bad: - first touch - turning with the ball improving on: - link-up play - positioning - insight & decisive passes - experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Romey 1878 Posted May 31, 2014 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Despite my reservations about his flaws etc I saw evidence towards the end of the season of improvements in them. Not so much his first touch and close control, but there's no doubt that in some games his link-up play, use of his size and an increase in aggression went up a notch. Which all shows that he's a capable learner and can improve. It's the fee that makes me wary but, at the same time, I'd be ecstatic if we did go for him because, in my opinion, he's the best we've been linked with. If it's a case of spending £10m on someone like Welbeck for instance, or £20m on Lukaku then Lukaku wins hands down. Mirallas, Quinn31, Matt and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 If we went and spent £20m on him then for me it's similar to the £15m we spent on felli, actually probably less risk in reality. However when we went and spent £15m on felli it was an absurd risk that never nearly paid off. The reality was with fellaini he was the towering midfielder who bossed Gerrard in the European fixture against Liverpool. Is lukaku a £20m player?, yes he is because people have paid a lot more for shite. Lukaku isn't shite, far from it. He isn't great either though - for me £20m should mean a fully rounded footballer. He's got weaknesses but his strengths in this days market will see clubs pay a daft sum for him. I've got a major beef with this whole lukaku love fest, he's great at doing things many a natural player would never be able to do, therefore it seems he's been able to neglect the fundamentals. If shit like this isn't addressed then the days of seeing an Alan Ball, George Best, type "you aren't big enough son" beat all odds because of technical, 2 footed brilliance will be gone. The saying goes "a good bigun beats a good littleun" and yes that's the case, but for me I look at lukaku and see missed development, and a player too used to getting his own way. Was zidane a great footballer because of his size? No, he was technically brilliant, but was he more technically brilliant than iniesta? For me no. If iniesta had zidanes size and athleticism he would be the best player the world had seen. Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nikica Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 (edited) Great points on both sides. I have a little bugbear though - haf, the post above seems to imply that people who rate Lukaku prefer big, strong players like some of the muppet youth coaches over the years in English football. You know I'm not like that, and neither are the rest of the people defending Lukaku here. Our overall argument is that he shows flashes of technical ability and the potential to improve in this respect. His dribbling is also good. If he was just a big clown whose second touch was a tackle all of the time, then I'd be on your side completely here, and I'd wager so would everyone else. But some of us feel you're overplaying how poor he is technically, that's all. There is some truth to what you're saying, and you have made some good points (particularly those involving the financial aspect and it being a risk to blow your budget on him). The only point we are contesting is the stuff about how poor he is technically. For many of us it's more a case of him being erratic, but with potential to improve. Where I agree with you fully is that he lacks mental development. As I have said, he's still a boy in a man's body, and seems a rather meek guy which is in stark contrast to his physically imposing appearance. Let's assume you can buy Lukaku (looks unlikely but hypothetically speaking). If I was making this decision, I'd have to ponder it for a long time because his mental and technical development is not guaranteed - it's not set in stone that these will go in an upward trajectory. At £20m he would be quite the risk. However, if he does improve in these aspects, what a player he could become. Edited May 31, 2014 by Nikica Sibdane and Bailey 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 No I just think that lukaku "gets away" with many of his weaknesses because of his size. A big compensation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 No I just think that lukaku "gets away" with many of his weaknesses because of his size. A big compensation. No he doesn't... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Interview today with Romelu Lukaku for the Belgian national television: http://sporza.be/cm/sporza/voetbal/2.33351?eid=1.1985423 Due to Benteke's injury there's hardly any doubt that Lukaku will be the Red Devils' striker in Brazil. Against Luxemburg he proved his goal-scoring form by netting 3 goals. "those 3 goals felt good" Lukaku said. "I feel better and better each time I play for the national squad. I play better, I train better. I feel good. I feel like I'm becoming a better professional." "At Everton we had 60%-65% posession of the ball last season. So you get into a situation where you have to play good combination football and keep your concentration.. I gradually learnt to handle that and that's also a good thing for the Red Devils too. The national team's manager is satisfied and I'm satisfied. I feel like I'm more complete now and my objective is to improve further in all aspects. I give instructions to my team-mates about how I like to receive passes and they quickly pick it up." "I would have loved to get the manager's trust sooner as the main striker, but the manager decided differently (referring to Benteke). Now is the time for me to play my way into the starting 11. I don't focus on goals, but rather on winning games. The goals will follow automatically." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 I still think it's pointless debating so hard about a player that isn't evertons. Surely it's a closed chapter now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted May 31, 2014 Report Share Posted May 31, 2014 Surely it's a closed chapter for now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 A comparison of Anichebe and Lukaku fuck me where did that come from it's like comparing a clapped out old Land Rover and a near top of the line Range Rover No comparison what so ever one was absolute shite the other could potentially be a top end player Mirallas 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 No need to call rom a clapped out land rover! EFC-Paul and Mirallas 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 The saying goes "a good bigun beats a good littleun" and yes that's the case, but for me I look at lukaku and see missed development, and a player too used to getting his own way Missed development? He just turned 21... I guess we better release McAlney, because he's nowhere near Lukaku's ability right now, and he is the same age. You act like Lukaku only scores lucky goals. I feel you're severely under-rating his skill-set. I'd pay the 20M for it if we had the money to spend, but the fact is we don't (at least not for one player). We need to spread that money around for depth. duncanmckenzieismagic and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted June 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/479463/Chelsea-offer-to-loan-Romelu-Lukaku-in-Diego-Costa-bargain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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