Aston Villa (Away) 13th August

[Shukes]

Thought Holgate did well again. Full backs were ok. Iwobi was good, but a little negative. Forward line we’re shit.

Other defenders and mids were a little meh!

[RuffRob]

With DCL injured did we know before kick off we need a striker? yes, so no real surprises.  Rondon did help show we are much better with a proper striker on. Lampard said before the game Rondon not fit enough for full game, so in this heat he would have been done by half time. I am guessing as we almost stole a point at the end - Rondon was more effective coming on later in the game than he would have been if he'd have started - could maybe argue 10-15mins earlier should have been the call.

The club are working on bring in another striker, so the part of the pitch is going to improve. 

Defensively we are much much better already this season even though we have still had to chop and change the CB in our first two game. 

Last season we would have lost this game 3 or 4 to nil. This season we where ultimately unlucky not to nick a point in the last 10mins. So green shoots of improvement for me.  

Given all the changes this summer, I am not yet expecting us to go away and beat better squads of player just yet. So no need for any sort of inquisition or panic buttons.

 

 

 

 

[Tonsta]

Again like last week, a big improvement on last season, our problems are obvious the solution not so.

Who do we sign upfront in our price range, we have lost a 60mil striker, and are looking for a 15mil replacement, won't work. Looked at both left backs today, and i don't think we lost anything in the deal, if anything gained a few mill.

Very disappointed with AG today thought he went home at half time, and returned for the last 2 mins, but maybe we expect too much from the young lad, i think he needs taken out of firring line, and used as an impact player for a while.

Our passing around the final third need a lot of work, im sure frank will address it given time.

On the plus side we are talking improvemnts here and there, and not lack of effort, or cock ups.

 

[dunlopp9987]

34 minutes ago, Tonsta said:

Again like last week, a big improvement on last season, our problems are obvious the solution not so.

Who do we sign upfront in our price range, we have lost a 60mil striker, and are looking for a 15mil replacement, won't work. Looked at both left backs today, and i don't think we lost anything in the deal, if anything gained a few mill.

Very disappointed with AG today thought he went home at half time, and returned for the last 2 mins, but maybe we expect too much from the young lad, i think he needs taken out of firring line, and used as an impact player for a while.

Our passing around the final third need a lot of work, im sure frank will address it given time.

On the plus side we are talking improvemnts here and there, and not lack of effort, or cock ups.

 

I mentioned this point earlier as well, but the problem is, we lack the depth to replace him. Gray hasn't looked much better, McNeil needs time. 

Gordon's poor play might be down to the fact that he knows he's undroppable at this point.

[London Blue]

25 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

I mentioned this point earlier as well, but the problem is, we lack the depth to replace him. Gray hasn't looked much better, McNeil needs time. 

Gordon's poor play might be down to the fact that he knows he's undroppable at this point.

Gordon played well once he was back in his position, he is not a forward but is playing that role for the team. He never stopped running and trying. 

[dunlopp9987]

15 minutes ago, London Blue said:

Gordon played well once he was back in his position, he is not a forward but is playing that role for the team. He never stopped running and trying. 

He also didn't look good all pre-season, so.

[Palfy]

I thought Davies gave it a decent go considering how long he’s been out, didn’t start to well when he came on but once he got into his stride he played really well a proper Evertonian puts it all on the line. 

[Cornish Steve]

4 hours ago, Palfy said:

Shouldn’t have sent Simms out on loan bad timing, just saying. 

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[London Blue]

7 minutes ago, dunlopp9987 said:

He also didn't look good all pre-season, so.

He looked fine, it was pre season.

[Cornish Steve]

The potential is there. Without a striker, though (and Rondon doesn't count), we're going to struggle. I'm sure we'll be playing with a new striker next weekend, and maybe another midfielder. I remain very optimistic for the season.

[Cornish Steve]

4 hours ago, Palfy said:

Shouldn’t have sent Simms out on loan bad timing, just saying. 

More seriously, I was a big proponent last season of giving both Simms and Dobbin some meaningful playing time. It's become evident to me, though, that neither is yet ready for the Prem. It's all well and good to point to Simms scoring (and it's excellent that he's developing), but the quality of defence and goalkeeping linked to those goals has been abysmal. Let's trust our management team on this: They're paid to take the tough decisions. We're no more than armchair critics.

[Palfy]

Just now, Cornish Steve said:

More seriously, I was a big proponent last season of giving both Simms and Dobbin some meaningful playing time. It's become evident to me, though, that neither is yet ready for the Prem. It's all well and good to point to Simms scoring (and it's excellent that he's developing), but the quality of defence and goalkeeping linked to those goals has been abysmal. Let's trust our management team on this: They're paid to take the tough decisions. We're no more than armchair critics.

No Steve get your argument right you banged on and on and on and on and on and on for the last 18 months that we should be playing the younger players, clearly completely done a U turn on that belief, what’s told you or what have you seen that tells you that Simms is not ready to be back up or 3rd choice in this Everton team. 

[Cornish Steve]

12 minutes ago, Palfy said:

No Steve get your argument right you banged on and on and on and on and on and on for the last 18 months that we should be playing the younger players, clearly completely done a U turn on that belief, what’s told you or what have you seen that tells you that Simms is not ready to be back up or 3rd choice in this Everton team. 

Now we're getting to see him play, I don't see the ruthlessness that's needed in the Premier League. Did he pounce in front of goal? No. Would his shots have gone in against a Prem keeper? No. Maybe this will change over time, which is what we all hope, but now I see him being given meaningful playing time, I can see what's missing in his game. Hopefully I'm teachable and willing to learn. I must confess now that others were right in claiming he's too raw yet to play in the big league,

[Palfy]

9 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

Now we're getting to see him play, I don't see the ruthlessness that's needed in the Premier League. Did he pounce in front of goal? No. Would his shots have gone in against a Prem keeper? No. Maybe this will change over time, which is what we all hope, but now I see him being given meaningful playing time, I can see what's missing in his game. Hopefully I'm teachable and willing to learn. I must confess now that others were right in claiming he's too raw yet to play in the big league,

Pounce in front of goal not sure what you mean by that and in all the years I’ve been involved in football from playing and coaching never once have I heard that expression, what he did to get his goals at Hearts and Sunderland was to work hard and use a strikers natural instinct to get himself in the right place at the right time and then made sure his attempts at goal hit the target, to say he only scored because the keepers were poor is an insult to his ability of scoring goals where ever he’s gone, his finishing is natural. Ruthlessness is there you don’t score at the rate he does if you are not ruthless, he is also a hardworking player with strength, the fans and coaches at Hearts and Sunderland can’t praise him enough for his willingness to fight for the team, and trust me Mackem’s aren’t idiots when it comes to spotting a talented player they are knowledgeable about their football and they rave about him.

[Bailey]

3 hours ago, London Blue said:

Its difficult to judge because we spent 70 minutes without a striker, so the ball just kept coming back at us. Plus its another new back 5 which will take time to gel properly. 

Once we had a striker on we looked so much more dangerous. Gordon and Grey could make runs beyond Rondon.

I thought everyone played ok considering, McNeil struggled, but its hard playing in a new team with no striker.

Plenty of positives.

We were crap when Rondon came on too. That was probably our worst spell. In fact it was only when we scored against the run of play that we looked ok. That was what 86 or so minutes.

3 hours ago, London Blue said:

Mykolenko played ok, he is a good defender, I have no problems about him playing in a back 4, especially as his experience in the premier league grows.

I am not sure he is a good defender. He is weak and not that quick. He gets sucked in a lot too. He will improve on that though.

3 hours ago, London Blue said:

He is s defensive midfielder, does not have the pace to get up and down the pitch.

He isn't a defensive midfielder at all, but I agree, he also shouldnt be played to go box to box.

[badaids]

We looked much more dangerous with a proper striker on, even Rondon. He at least knows how to play the position, and others played off to him.

I hope Onana will start the next game.

[Romey 1878]

I'm going to single out our front three for criticism today because that was an embarrassing performance by all of them.

McNeil cost us a goal and was completely anonymous other that that. Gray and Gordon may have at least got on the ball and then tried to do something but neither of them could beat a fucking egg, never mind their man. Thick. As. Pig. Shit.

So that meant the few times we did actually manage to string a few passes together and get in their half Villa usually had the ball back pretty quickly. They caused zero problems for the Villa defence and they could have gone to the beach for the afternoon and got a tan.

[Hafnia]

For the record I watched the Sunderland game for a bit. Simms will do well there, the mackem fan next to me said it’s miles off the standard in the prem. he looks good though, hopefully he kicks on. 

[London Blue]

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

We were crap when Rondon came on too. That was probably our worst spell. In fact it was only when we scored against the run of play that we looked ok. That was what 86 or so minutes.

I am not sure he is a good defender. He is weak and not that quick. He gets sucked in a lot too. He will improve on that though.

He isn't a defensive midfielder at all, but I agree, he also shouldnt be played to go box to box.

We had more of a focal point when Rondon came on, which improved our attacking play, it was not great but it did improve. Rondon won some headers and Grey and Gordon were able to run past him.

Mykolenko is a good defender, you can have your opinion, its just one I disagree with.

Tom Davies is a defensive midfielder as he does not have the speed to be anything else. For a defensive midfielder he does have a good range of passing. He was not played as a box to box, so I'm not sure what your point about him being played as box to box is about.

 

[chicagoblue]

Had to watch on delay as it was at 4:30 am my time. Glad I didn't wake up for that. Have to say I think Frank got it wrong. That front three is useless. 

[Bailey]

1 hour ago, London Blue said:

We had more of a focal point when Rondon came on, which improved our attacking play, it was not great but it did improve. Rondon won some headers and Grey and Gordon were able to run past him.

Mykolenko is a good defender, you can have your opinion, its just one I disagree with.

Tom Davies is a defensive midfielder as he does not have the speed to be anything else. For a defensive midfielder he does have a good range of passing. He was not played as a box to box, so I'm not sure what your point about him being played as box to box is about.

 

I don't agree about Rondon. IMO that only happened in the last 10 mins. Before that he offered nothing more than the rest before him.

He isn't a defensive midfielder IMO. He doesn't do the defensive stuff anywhere near good enough. I completely disagree about his passing too. 

He was played to be box-to-box just as Doucoure was before him. When you have just two players in midfield they need to do a bit of everything. One might do more defensive work than the other but during the game they need to attack and defend. He doesn't do either very well, albeit I agree about the points you made on the other thread that he made a couple of key defensive actions. He was also still a problem for us when they counter attacked too though. He just isn't good enough and hopefully he will be moved on at some stage.

[Gwlad]

I was disappointed with Doucoure, he's not the dominant player we had when he signed and I think he could have done better against Ings.

[London Blue]

18 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I don't agree about Rondon. IMO that only happened in the last 10 mins. Before that he offered nothing more than the rest before him.

He isn't a defensive midfielder IMO. He doesn't do the defensive stuff anywhere near good enough. I completely disagree about his passing too. 

He was played to be box-to-box just as Doucoure was before him. When you have just two players in midfield they need to do a bit of everything. One might do more defensive work than the other but during the game they need to attack and defend. He doesn't do either very well, albeit I agree about the points you made on the other thread that he made a couple of key defensive actions. He was also still a problem for us when they counter attacked too though. He just isn't good enough and hopefully he will be moved on at some stage.

Davies made 3 really good defensive tackles, and read the game very well, which he demonstrated by getting back to our penalty area, and positioning himself to intercept the ball and stop a dangerous Villa counterattack.

He is a good player, just not a top one.

He played well, he passed, he tackled, he read the game and he closed down well. 

[Palfy]

6 hours ago, London Blue said:

Davies made 3 really good defensive tackles, and read the game very well, which he demonstrated by getting back to our penalty area, and positioning himself to intercept the ball and stop a dangerous Villa counterattack.

He is a good player, just not a top one.

He played well, he passed, he tackled, he read the game and he closed down well. 

He played very well defensively in and around the area I thought much better than Coady, but he lacks that little bit of vision when he has possession of the ball, but if you want someone to break up the opposition’s play and defend with his life in and around the box he is definitely 100% your man. A very very impressive return to the team. 

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, RPG said:

Agree with this. I admit to being concerned when he came on, especially when he was quickly booked, but his defensive work was very good. But only having two bodies in midfield supported by wing backs is never really going to suit Tom Davies I think. Could he actually be the 'Gueye' that we feel we have been missing though?

I’m happy with your views but I feel I must point out to you that I haven’t been missing Gona

[Bailey]

14 hours ago, London Blue said:

Davies made 3 really good defensive tackles, and read the game very well, which he demonstrated by getting back to our penalty area, and positioning himself to intercept the ball and stop a dangerous Villa counterattack.

He is a good player, just not a top one.

He played well, he passed, he tackled, he read the game and he closed down well. 

If he did his defensive work well he would have stuck with Buendia for the second goal and cut it out. Instead he gave up. There was another chance, where he was too far off the man he should have been marking and that player was able to play the ball into our box under no pressure. 

In my opinion he largely did the work of a player you would expect. That is a start with him but its nothing to get excited about. He is not a Premier League player. There isn't one attribute that I would rate at this level, and certainly not if we are going to progress anywhere. His passing is below average, his tackling all depends on how close he can get to his man because a lot of the time he can't (especially in open play - see the 2nd goal and the booking), his reading of the game is OK but he certainly doesn't anticipate and appreciate space like Iwobi does and again I don't think he is good at closing down because as soon as the player shifts the ball, he can't keep up with them. 

If you want to play Davies at this level you have to sit deep and protect him with lots of bodies around him to help him out. He is a liability in open play because he simply doesn't have the tools to stop players at this level.