markjazzbassist Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 agreed haf. In good with rm, but the favorites are pissing me off. Barry, Howard, Naisy. They all serve different purposes but he needs to pick and choose lineups better. Look at simeone, klopp, even mourinho. They'll throw a player on and really change the dynamic to exploit some weakness in the other team. He needs to go with that regardless of personnel and age, and just play the pace wingers when we play slow teams. I don't care if it's an u21 and mirallas, play them. Rodgers does this too, plays the young unknown because it's not that player it's the system that takes advantage of a flaw. No more Barkley on the wing. He fixes those, gets more adventurous with his subs and formations and I'm set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted February 11, 2015 Report Share Posted February 11, 2015 The biggest criticism I had of moyes was his inability to evolve. Martinez looks like he is trying to, he's had his arse handed to him a few times and I honestly think he's learning. I said all along its not the bad spell but how he handles it. Too many people have been hanging onto his words and giving him shit, I actually think he's emerging from a tough period very well. Absolutely. It's been said. And if anyone doubts that, all they need to do is look back through this topic. He's 40/41. He is in terms of Management the same place that the likes of Barkley, Lukaku, Stones are in their career. Plenty to learn. New situations. New expectations. New experiences. We'll be back to the solid defending, free flowing attacking football before long. He'll keep learning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chalkpie Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 (edited) Thanks for the warm welcome to this site. Always nice to have meaningfull conversations with likeminded fans. Welcome to TT. But are you fucking high to assume that Besic doesn't belong in the BPL?? He is a workhorse and one of the best 'take the bull by the horn players' we have. Yes he is a hot head and pays for it with yellows, but so does Barry who is like a slug on valium and holds the esteemed high honor of the most penalties in the league. Don't give up on Besic - he is still young and has things to learn but he is the real deal. That guy is going to be one of the best players we have in a few years - write that down and remember it. PS - if you watched both Besic and Hazard tonight, although they are different players with different roles and philosophies, one thing they both have in common is that they are both go-getters and they hustle 100% of the time. That to me is the sign of a great player. Edited February 12, 2015 by chalkpie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krist Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Welcome to TT. But are you fucking high to assume that Besic doesn't belong in the BPL?? He is a workhorse and one of the best 'take the bull by the horn players' we have. Yes he is a hot head and pays for it with yellows, but so does Barry who is like a slug on valium and holds the esteemed high honor of the most penalties in the league. Don't give up on Besic - he is still young and has things to learn but he is the real deal. That guy is going to be one of the best players we have in a few years - write that down and remember it. PS - if you watched both Besic and Hazard tonight, although they are different players with different roles and philosophies, one thing they both have in common is that they are both go-getters and they hustle 100% of the time. That to me is the sign of a great player. Thanks. Yeah OK ill admit my first post was a bit too provocative and I went a bit overboard saying he isn't suited for PL. He is still young and will improve. I just wanted to challenge the idea that it seems everyone thinks he is a star and I just haven't seen hes true qualities yet. He is a tough player and we need that absolutely but I think he has a lot to learn on the ball and in terms of his general understanding of the game. I think he has made to many questionable choices on the field so far. Having said that I think he has improved already, so I probably came on to strong. I just think its a bit early to play him as a regular and it might not be the best for him and the team in the long run. But I truly hope to be proved wrong. Good performance last night I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Thanks. Yeah OK ill admit my first post was a bit too provocative and I went a bit overboard saying he isn't suited for PL. He is still young and will improve. I just wanted to challenge the idea that it seems everyone thinks he is a star and I just haven't seen hes true qualities yet. He is a tough player and we need that absolutely but I think he has a lot to learn on the ball and in terms of his general understanding of the game. I think he has made to many questionable choices on the field so far. Having said that I think he has improved already, so I probably came on to strong. I just think its a bit early to play him as a regular and it might not be the best for him and the team in the long run. But I truly hope to be proved wrong. Good performance last night I agree. He's only been playing in his current position of DM since the World Cup (or maybe a bit before?). So, not even a year of playing there and this is how he's looking? I think there's a lot to look forward to. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 The biggest criticism I had of moyes was his inability to evolve. Martinez looks like he is trying to, he's had his arse handed to him a few times and I honestly think he's learning. I said all along its not the bad spell but how he handles it. Too many people have been hanging onto his words and giving him shit, I actually think he's emerging from a tough period very well. I had no doubt he would turn it around, it was his blinkered use of the media that was the most frustrating and that hasn't really changed at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Every time I read this thread I just think to myself - "he's not got it wrong, but he's getting it wrong." Or has been until recently. You could only say he's got it wrong if nothing changes and no attempts are made to rectify the problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Every time I read this thread I just think to myself - "he's not got it wrong, but he's getting it wrong." Or has been until recently. You could only say he's got it wrong if nothing changes and no attempts are made to rectify the problems. I think the only other thing he is getting wrong is his man management, which is a bit of a surprise if I'm honest. He's actually hindering development of 2 young players for off-form senior players and took too long to take Barkley out of the spotlight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 man management will always be questioned when you have big ego's at the club. Moyes haf lescott, rooney,rodwell arteta.... all big players with big ego's at the time. He wasnt able to keep them. bobby on the other hand has baines (england international) stones (england international) jags (england international) mirallas, lukaku, barry etc. praise to bobby, he is capable of tying these lot down. thats good man management in itself. i think he's doing an incredable job with the players he has at his disposal with the way he wants to play. square pegs round holes with some of these players capabilities playing this style. give him four years with hard investment and i guarantee we wont look back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 I think Gareth Barry may well have been a crucial ally of Roberto's when Eto was causing mayhem. I think he had to have players he trusted and Barry was that man. I think RM sees him as the man to employ his tactics out there. Isn't it amazing - since Eto left all the players with head down etc seems to have gone. Last night was a strong team performance - not the best perfromance but one with loads of character. Elston Gunnn, Matt and Chach 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 I think Gareth Barry may well have been a crucial ally of Roberto's when Eto was causing mayhem. I think he had to have players he trusted and Barry was that man. I think RM sees him as the man to employ his tactics out there. Isn't it amazing - since Eto left all the players with head down etc seems to have gone. Last night was a strong team performance - not the best perfromance but one with loads of character. Good point, not thought about that. Can he be the player on the sidelines instead though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted February 12, 2015 Report Share Posted February 12, 2015 Good point, not thought about that. Can he be the player on the sidelines instead though? yeah well that was always my point with Neville - it seems managers can't help throwing them in midfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted February 13, 2015 Report Share Posted February 13, 2015 With the whole eto'o saga, possible Distin bust up, and mirallas and lukaku wanting to leave, it looks like Roberto is getting an education this year on the dressing room dynamic. Hopefully he stocks it with team first players who are an asset in the locker room. Not mad at him, just hope he learns from all this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 Come on guys, don't be shy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 Come on guys, lets not be shy. Lol, good on ya Brett. We translate really well in Europe, the thing for me is how to take that approach and apply it to the more physical premier/thug league. I hope McCarthy being back and Besic showing his strength will help us to have the steel we need in the prem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 He got it right for once Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 I don't hate Besic but I think we play 20% quicker passing wise with him out the side. He holds on too much and Fucks about with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 I don't hate Besic but I think we play 20% quicker passing wise with him out the side. He holds on too much and Fucks about with it. Barry looked a lot better next to McCarthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 we were lethal in the final third tonight with first touch passing. this made rom reap the rewards. i cant believe theyve only just clicked into this now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted February 19, 2015 Report Share Posted February 19, 2015 I always said let's see how he does and give him the benefit of what he did last season. Is it a false dawn? I thimk he's been very deliberate in his changes. The draw against Liverpool was a great indicator that he has a brain and understands where we needed to show teams we aren't pushovers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 Biggest difference for me was Oviedo putting the ball in early and not feeling the need to get to the byline. Those early balls mean there is space in between the defenders and the goalkeeper. Just a mention about the offside for the second goal.......how can professional footballers and commentators not K ow that the ball has to be played forward to be offside? It was played square. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted February 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 Biggest difference for me was Oviedo putting the ball in early and not feeling the need to get to the byline. Those early balls mean there is space in between the defenders and the goalkeeper. It's also why I think Coleman and Baines have been less effective, we're scared to cross sometimes. Garbutt also showed how devastating his crosses can be. Garbutt should start at the weekend. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 It's also why I think Coleman and Baines have been less effective, we're scared to cross sometimes. Garbutt also showed how devastating his crosses can be. Garbutt should start at the weekend. I'd be giving Garbutt the home leg instead. Like Patto said, Oviedo is just ahead of him and Leicester is a more important game than YB at Goodison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted February 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 But Ovideo was injured, I presumed he'll be out of our next game. That's why I suggested Garbutt starting, as we have no choice! ha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cake Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 I repeat. This man will have us relegated, maybe not this season (just) but stick everything you have on it for next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Waring Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 too slow in build up, gives opponents to loads of time to gather their defence, definately needs to get a more consistant striker. relegation the way we are going???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 We need to play 2 wingers and stop playing Naismith or Barkley out wide. We're far too easy to play against as it is as we've only got width down one flank. Last season was built on our success down the flanks, we've got enough natural wingers to replicate this now - a must for me. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 I actually don't think it was that bad of a performance. It was very boring at times but we created chances. Missed ones and Howard's mistakes cost us. Can't blame Martinez for this game. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 I think he's trying to get the lads moving a bit quicker, but there's still some way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogsy Posted February 22, 2015 Report Share Posted February 22, 2015 We need to play 2 wingers and stop playing Naismith or Barkley out wide. We're far too easy to play against as it is as we've only got width down one flank. Last season was built on our success down the flanks, we've got enough natural wingers to replicate this now - a must for me. Definitely. Martinez needs to stop nursing mirallas and just play him, barkley and Naismith can rotate if needs be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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