Steve_E Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 (edited) How does the context change that statement? I must be missing the nuances. (Also, it isn't pete0 ) Seems like quite a generalization without any argumentation presented as "the truth" to me. Edited January 17, 2013 by Steve_E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avinalaff Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 How does the context change that statement? I must be missing the nuances. (Also, it isn't pete0 ) Seems like quite a generalization without any argumentation presented as "the truth" to me. Just quote properly Billy. Might not have been my finest sentence, but I knew what I meant and it was offered with good intentions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcus jones Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 There's been sod all wrong with the delivery into the box, Jelly is there, Felli, Peanut and various other players on the edge of the box also, so if the ball is coming into the box then what's the problem? No short passes of 5-10 yards for him to run on to to hit first time, he needs to be facing goal not away from it. Is he getting into the box to early maybe and so easily being marked? If that is the case do we need to play a more faster paced counter attacking ploy where the ball is put in front of him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoblue Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Im with this. Jelavic for me is a top class striker going through a rough patch. I would normally say we should drop players like this but Jelavic is still working hard and doing what he always has done. His head hasnt dropped once. The only time he has played crap is when the we have played crap as a team and generally hoofed it up to him. He is a striker that wants the ball on the deck, running towards goal with plenty of support. We simply havent done that enough recently. i don't get this sudden image that jelavic is shite...he's not been at his best but still got like a goal in every 3 games...he hasn't been helped by fellaini being up there cos we aren't playing to his strengths...seems mental to me...the fickleness of fans still astounds me Don't think it's per se Felli's presence up there, it's the kind of deliver we've been putting into the box. Having Felli as a target or back to goal striker should work for the team. Lobbing in crosses does not work for Jelavic though. If Jelavic was missing chance after chance then I'd understand people calling for him to be dropped. But the fact is we're not creating chances for him and he's spending too much time outside of the area in the hope of seeing the ball once every now and again. Agree. Look at how we scores. Balls into the box on the deck for a one time finish. That's his bread and butter. Even better if they're being cut back from the by-line. For all Baines' excellent deliveries, they're not what Jelly thrives on. The crosses, floated or more targeted, are much better for Vellios, Anichebe or Felli. However, Jelly is so much of a better finisher that we really should be focusing on getting the service to him that he needs to score, not simply trying to create "chances" for mediocre strikers. There's been sod all wrong with the delivery into the box, Jelly is there, Felli, Peanut and various other players on the edge of the box also, so if the ball is coming into the box then what's the problem? No short passes of 5-10 yards for him to run on to to hit first time, he needs to be facing goal not away from it. Is he getting into the box to early maybe and so easily being marked? If that is the case do we need to play a more faster paced counter attacking ploy where the ball is put in front of him? Speed on counter attack would help to an extent, maybe, but Jelly is not fast. He's also not terribly clever with the offside trap. I really don't see him as a 'shoulder of the last defender' kind of striker, but whenever we look to release him it tends to be in that situation. What we need is Baines/Pienaar or Coleman/Mirallas/shudder Nais to get down the outside and near the box to play crisp passes into Jelavic. We haven't done that b/c we've run so much of our play through Fellaini. Just look at the statistical analyses for where Jelavic gets his touches. Way too many of them are outside the box and in the channels. All that said, I agree that Vellios needs some more game time. If we're going to keep playing crosses into the box, and we will since Baines is great at that, then we need the big aerial threats to be up there, and not playing on the wing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 If we hoof it to Fellaini, he usually brings the ball under control and passes it out wide or gives a short pass back to one of the midfielders who'll play it out wide. I'm pretty sure we're still one of the teams that play through the wings most. Especially through the left. Fellaini's presence is not the reason for Jelavic's struggles. Perhaps it's more because Naismith hasn't got to the byline all season on the right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Jelavic hasn't been awful, but he hasn't done enough to justify keeping his place let alone warrant staying on the full 90 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 If we hoof it to Fellaini, he usually brings the ball under control and passes it out wide or gives a short pass back to one of the midfielders who'll play it out wide. I'm pretty sure we're still one of the teams that play through the wings most. Especially through the left. Fellaini's presence is not the reason for Jelavic's struggles. Perhaps it's more because Naismith hasn't got to the byline all season on the right. problem is it seems half the time(especially when mirallas doesn't play) jelavic is the one who is drifting out for the ball to be played to him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 If we hoof it to Fellaini, he usually brings the ball under control and passes it out wide or gives a short pass back to one of the midfielders who'll play it out wide. I'm pretty sure we're still one of the teams that play through the wings most. Especially through the left. Fellaini's presence is not the reason for Jelavic's struggles. Perhaps it's more because Naismith hasn't got to the byline all season on the right. I think it is more to do with the delivery into Jelavic in general. Firstly even with Felli up top, because of the awful aimless hoofing we have a lot of the time it goes to Jelavic (or somewhere near him) and he doesnt win it as often as he maybe should do. So while I dont think the issue isnt with Felli, the issue is with when the ball doesnt get to Felli! It might be interesting to work out whether his better performances come with Heitinga and Gibson in the team who I think are key to our passing accuracy. Secondly our final ball in recent weeks has been more dismal than normal. Pienaar, Neville and Osman especially seem to have a reluctance to thread him in on goal, or they do it too late and he is offside. Jelavic is a poacher who needs to be in the box and he is always making clever runs, always offering for a pass. We simply dont find him enough IMO and give him teh service he needs. Vic could probably do a better job for the team game at the moment, but if we are playing well then Jelavic is by far the better striker. pete0 and Romey 1878 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 Rumoured to be going on loan to Sheffield Wednesday. We'd have to bring a striker in to cover that you'd think. No, because we cannot afford a player to improve on him and who would actually play ahead of Jela, Naismith or Vic? Id rather have McAleny called up than bring in another bench warmer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 No, because we cannot afford a player to improve on him and who would actually play ahead of Jela, Naismith or Vic? Id rather have McAleny called up than bring in another bench warmer. We have money for loans, im sure we can find a non-youth loan striker available? as for the others Jelavic couldn't score an open goal at the moment, Naismith shouldn't be near the bench, let alone the team. Vic well he's just Vic, he looks like he might score a hat-trick one week, the next week he looks like Moyes has taken his Smarties from him. We have to try and bring someone in, we simply cannot operate with such a small squad, forget europe if we don't imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 We have money for loans, im sure we can find a non-youth loan striker available? as for the others Jelavic couldn't score an open goal at the moment, Naismith shouldn't be near the bench, let alone the team. Vic well he's just Vic, he looks like he might score a hat-trick one week, the next week he looks like Moyes has taken his Smarties from him. We have to try and bring someone in, we simply cannot operate with such a small squad, forget europe if we don't imo. why send a kid on loan then spend money on loans? I cant think of a single senior striker that we could bring in.... Rest is a nice explanation of our current situation mate, made me smile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoof_It_Nev Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Not sure how true this is... http://www.tribalfootball.com/articles/sheffield-wednesday-go-everton-striker-vellios-3795891?utm_source=main_feed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 I'd be all for it, Vellios isn't going to get playing time here (although I wish he would) so I'd rather he got it elsewhere in a loan period so that he has a better chance next season of getting games. I just hope that we don't let him go because I really think he could be something special. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 Done well tonight against Blackburn, scored the equaliser before McAleny grabbed a 90th min winner. Shane Duffy @ShaneDuffy34 The bigman was super tonight well done bud @tolisvellios Fearthainn and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 Not even on the bench unless we're short on numbers lately . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 Not even on the bench unless we're short on numbers lately . Strange considering Jelavic's form as well. I really hope the rumour of Moyes kicking off over him putting extra training in isn't true. Quinn31 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avinalaff Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 Why would Moyes be negative about somebody putting extra training in ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 Why would Moyes be negative about somebody putting extra training in ? Stubborn. Why would he not include his third choice striker when Anichebe has been injured and Jelavic lacking form. Very odd that he got more game time last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Avinalaff Posted March 4, 2013 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 I don't get some things with our kids. Many get a chance, play well, yet one off day and they're 'not ready', yet we see senior players who are poor week in week out keeping their place. The kids must be really unimpressive in training. Steve_E, Bailey, Quinn31 and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo Posted March 4, 2013 Report Share Posted March 4, 2013 The thing that annoys me about Vellios is you can see how good he is yet he's never played. I love the commitment Jelavic puts in but so does Vellios every time that he comes onto the field. Football is harsh business and poor performances should be punished, if you're not scoring goals which Jelavic isn't then he should be replaced with someone better. Last season Vellios scored a goal every 86 minutes which shows what he can do from the bench. The lad needs to be played before someone realises just how good he is and takes him off us next season for free. GoodisonRoad, Quinn31 and Sibdane 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 I actually haven't seen enough from him to suggest that he should be in the starting 11. He is obviously talented, no doubt about that, but good enough to put Jelavic on the bench? I dont think so. Look at the movement from Jelavic. He is on his way back. Just needs that first goal. I do however feel that he should be on the bench and perhaps get 10-15 minutes per game. Let us have a proper look at him before we can judge him. Quinn31 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideliner Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 When will Velios be good enough or rather old enough for Mr Moyes to play him ? only when they eventually sell Jelavic - which is terribly short sighted - maybe the two of them played together was the solution to our problems up front - but we will never know as Mr Moyes does not experiment with youngsters - if i was Velios i would certainly look for opportunities to further my carreer - at Everton he like many other young players go stale because of lack of pressure - what creates diamonds ? pressure not bench warming Sibdane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideliner Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 on Saturday WBA had a 16 year old on their bench - for him it was gaining experience - but beching a 20-24 year old player is ruining him in the long run Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 When will Velios be good enough or rather old enough for Mr Moyes to play him ? only when they eventually sell Jelavic - which is terribly short sighted - maybe the two of them played together was the solution to our problems up front - but we will never know as Mr Moyes does not experiment with youngsters - if i was Velios i would certainly look for opportunities to further my carreer - at Everton he like many other young players go stale because of lack of pressure - what creates diamonds ? pressure not bench warming I agree with this 100%. Playing well under pressure is one of the most valuable attributes a footballer can have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted March 5, 2013 Report Share Posted March 5, 2013 what creates diamonds ? pressure not bench warming brilliant analogy. Zoo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted September 1, 2013 Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 http://t.co/NbaqDhslLK Steve_E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted September 1, 2013 Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 Due a run in the first team, give the other lads a kick in the arse. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thoward18 Posted September 1, 2013 Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 Don't even care for Vellios but he can't be much worse than what we've had so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted September 1, 2013 Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 Don't even care for Vellios but he can't be much worse than what we've had so far. What!?!? Woah woah woah. ? How can you not care for that face? It's fucking beautiful. ? Stop it. Leave Vellios alone. Biatch. ? Sibdane and Romey 1878 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Quinn31 Posted September 1, 2013 Popular Post Report Share Posted September 1, 2013 He should either be given a chance, or sold/loaned out. He's too old to be a reserve team player. Either give him a shot since Kone and Jelavic have been woeful, or let him advance his career elsewhere. Romey 1878, pete0, Steve_E and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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