Btay Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Well I'm sure we all agree regardless, that we need 6 points and convincingly done, to get a roll on before the Deby away and unite at home.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Cheers pal. One friend will do. And in the Besic thread I backed you against Cotto :shaking fist:. I don't think anyone on here blatantly gives opinions because they believe it'll make them popular, we all fall out/agree from time to time. Bit infantile to suggest otherwise I think. rubecula, Romey 1878 and Toffee_in_LA 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Ahhhh, can't we just pick sides??? I baggsy mikeo, bailey, steveo, and want to play against Matt, dunc, Brett, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Ahhhh, can't we just pick sides??? I baggsy mikeo, bailey, steveo, and want to play against Matt, dunc, Brett, Holy shit I got picked first . Never happened before . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Holy shit I got picked first . Never happened before . You're the Richard Gough of the squad. Gettin on, but still got it, can quote Shakespeare and stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 Holy shit I got picked first . Never happened before . And I'm stood by myself in the cold and rain, shivering and humiliated, hoping to catch someone's eye, without the confidence to raise my hand and feebly ask "will someone please pick me?" MikeO and Toffee_in_LA 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 And I'm stood by myself in the cold and rain, shivering and humiliated, hoping to catch someone's eye, without the confidence to raise my hand and feebly ask "will someone please pick me?" You're not alone. You have me for company. (Hold my hand you tart) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 And I'm stood by myself in the cold and rain, shivering and humiliated, hoping to catch someone's eye, without the confidence to raise my hand and feebly ask "will someone please pick me?" Rep because I've been there . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted August 30, 2014 Report Share Posted August 30, 2014 brutal match ruined my whole day. had to go to a recording session afterwards and was in a terrible mood the whole time. i hope we can turn the ship around, we have the same record as relegation favorites man united now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubecula Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Holy shit I got picked first . Never happened before . It all depends what they want to pick you for. First one into a haunted house I would pick you too. First one to get the beers in? That is yours too. First one to have the fruit pies? That would be me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcopaulo Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 still so fuckin livid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Must point out once again, I understand motd is just highlights but it showed none of our full domination in the first half only the goals then Howard stepping out of his box and decided to mention it throughout the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Ahhhh, can't we just pick sides??? I baggsy mikeo, bailey, steveo, and want to play against Matt, dunc, Brett, Thanks Haf, I needed that. I'd quite happily play along side the Brett of recent weeks, found myself agreeing with him more and more, think the punctuation helps brutal match ruined my whole day. had to go to a recording session afterwards and was in a terrible mood the whole time. i hope we can turn the ship around, we have the same record as relegation favorites man united now. Aaaaaaaand this is why I have a metal pedal. Got the SG out, detuned to C and fucking hammered it. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 To the game... Howard - despite my defence of him recently, I can't continue after that performance. He is supposed to be a good shot stopper! Not to mention he should've been sent off twice. His defence of Coleman was the best thing he did all game but otherwise really disappointed. Distin - I don't get the criticism here, he was continually exposed by the DCMs and was doing the job of 2 players at CB. No wonder he was so quiet at the end, he must've been exhausted! Jags - I do not care if he is captain, I said last year he was looking shakey and didn't deserve the armband. Maybe he left his brain at baggage claim? One of the things that Moyes did that drove me nuts was dropping his in-form "stand in" players then bringing his senior players in at their expense, who then played below par. Martinez has done the same again. Stones must start, Jags must be dropped. Stones must be there bemused how he hasn't got into our starting line up considering how well he did in the 2nd half of last season. I could go on and on here but I'm getting angry again thinking about it. Baines - Average; marking was terrible but decent going forward. Coleman - Better than average, did well to keep Hazard quiet and was incredibly unfortunate to get an OG against his name Barry - Shite, was he playing? McCarthy - Shite. Stood off Hazard for the Coleman OG, almost carbon copy from the 1st Arsenal goal last week. Mirallas - Typical Kev, maybe an improvement on his usual standards. So much good, really tried and worked hard but seemed to disappear for parts of the game McGeady - I think his defensive work has been largely ignored here. Between him and Coleman they kept Hazard very quiet. Some decent runs too but largely anonymous, assuming thats down to tracking Hazard. Lukaku - disappointing but clearly not fit. A lot of decent touches and some good hard work mixed with some shocking touches and moments of laziness. Needs to improve but needs to get fit first. Eto'o - Like Ive said, never doubted his ability and I'm hoping he continues to prove me wrong in terms of his attitude. I hold my hands up here and apologize, he showed a lot of class when he came on, no celebrations when he scored unlike that mouldy cunt nugget that took his place at Chelsea (dont get me wrong, Costa played exceptionally well but my gods what a lack of class). Let him start ahead of Rom whilst the lad gets fit. Naismith - 50m? Fuck no. This lad embodies Everton. Easily MOTM, all game long chasing the ball, fighting, creating space, scoring (again), some great solid tackles. Besic - Errrr... If there was ever a tough lesson to learn.... Apologies if I've gotten some things wrong here, there was a mental cleansing last night which involved a large helping of Talisker Storm... Again, Martinez and Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Just rewatched the goals and 4 of them we conceded are unacceptable, ball watching not closing down and just dicking about. RM needs to man up and drop Jags. Moyes had no right to make him captain, basically lumbered him on whoever the next manager would be. Sideliner 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Still don't know what to think about this game. The fact that we scored 3 goals and should have scored more against what will probably be the best defensive team in the league is a big positive. The fact that we conceded 10 in 3 games is a huge worry and more so that stupid individual errors are the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 No matter how long I lay in bed this morning and forced my eyes closed every time I woke up it still won't become just a bad dream . Bugger. Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Still don't know what to think about this game. The fact that we scored 3 goals and should have scored more against what will probably be the best defensive team in the league is a big positive. The fact that we conceded 10 in 3 games is a huge worry and more so that stupid individual errors are the issue. Thats the biggest worry for me. If Chelsea where just unstoppable yesterday (and they will be in games this season) and we just got hammered as a one off (which can happen) I wouldn't be so worried but they weren't. For large parts of that game we were on top and we conceded stupid goal after stupid goal, same at Arsenal and I can forgive Leicester. I've said all along that Martinez teams leak goals. He focuses too much on attack. There has to be a balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 We knew after Lecester and Arsenal the defence needed work, otherwise we would have 6 points from a banana skin (Liecesters first home game back in the prem) and Arsenal (a top 4 team). Midfield and attact looked pretty decent. Chelsea are probably in the top two and to give them a two goal lead after 3 mins would destroy most teams. We had a bloody good go, and when Mirallas hit the post that would have made it 5-4, I'd say that reflected the game way more than 6-3, but we fucked up at th back again and th rest is history. It looks as though when Lukaku gets his toe injury sorted we will be a massive threat going forward, Martinez is probably as good as any when it comes to sorting out some of the dodgy defending. we hit the woodwork twice, scored an own goal and conceded an off-side goal, against probably the best team at the moment, who made a dream start. Could easily have been 5-5. Man of the match for Everton, I'd give it to every man, woman and child in the crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 The fact is we need to tighten up at the back. Going forward we're great. Coleman, Baines, Jagielka, Distin, McCarthy & Barry are t doing their jobs orbits a combination of them all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gethinO Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Quite happy that there's an international break now. Good chance for some to get fitter and sharper and then we can kick on in September. Yet again though, it's taken us 3 games to get up to pace and we've only 2 points. Needs sorting. I'm not too down hearted about yesterday. We scored 3 against what looks like the best team in the league (think they'll comfortably win it this year). The difference was against Chelsea we were punished every mistake where as other teams wouldn't have been so clinical. Positive is that we look so dangerous going forward that we're going to score goals this season. Tighten up at the back and we'll be fine. Transfer wise I think we need a RB cover and a CB. If Coleman gets injured then Hibbert is not adequate cover and a left footed CB would be great. Richards on a loan (to see if he's still got it) and buy Nastasic. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Angel Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 I think the only difference between us and Chelsea (other than three goals) is that teams fear Chelsea when they play them but still don't fear us to that extent. We play better football most of the time and look more threatening but fear wins most of the games for the likes of city and Chelsea in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_E Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 (edited) I think for the first goal, the trouble starts with McCarthy and Barry being too high up the pitch. They've tried to press on, but failed to delay Chelsea playing forward and they just haven't retreated quick enough. That leaves Fabregas with lots of space to run into and without any pressure on him to deliver a through ball that Jags can see coming all the way, but he makes the godawful decision of trying to play him offside. Even casual fans know you shouldn't do that when there's no pressure on the passer, but Jags has his head up his arse. If he'd have just ran along he could have forced him wide, now he's through clear on goal. He actually produces a very weak finish and Howard probably should have done better. Second goal again had McCarthy and Barry too far up the pitch. Then when they retreated, Barry was caught ball-watching for me and should have been positioned much closer to Ramires, he might have been able to stop things there. Baines had managed to play Ivanovic offside by the time the pass came, but the ref didn't see it and he had allowed Ivanovic inside position as well. Having seen the third goal again, McCarthy should have been positioned closer to the goalline than he was relative to Hazard to force him inside as McGeady was actually back to double up against him. We had Fabregas and Costa covered, but Coleman's deflection means Hazard's cross went in straight away. Tad unlucky, but bad defensive play from McCarthy. For the fourth goal, Distin just doesn't close down Matic aggressively enough. There's no way Matic is going to dribble past him or anything like that, so he should have just went in. Unlucky with the deflection though. Fifth goal has Barry and McCarthy's stink all over it again. Can't really find a replay that starts early enough, but Barry just comes strolling into view way too late and casually follows Matic but never comes close enough to him to shut down the give and go with Ramires who has lost McCarthy who was caught ball-watching for a second. Howard probably won't like conceding from that angle either. The sixth goal is a horrible mistake from Besic who had plenty of options, but opts for a very casually executed backheel. I haven't even had to mention all of the times Jags got caught on the ball or passed it straight into the feet of a Chelsea player that led to very good opportunities for Chelsea. It's time to drop him and insert Stones in the starting line-up. He played centre back with Distin as well when we won like 6 on the trot last season. Then spend a week drilling the fundamentals of defending into the team again. Edited August 31, 2014 by Steve_E Bailey 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgianToffee Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Just watched the match for the third time. Yeah, I'm a freak. I disagree that RM focuses too much on attacking. The team just isn't balanced. Going forward we've got one of the best teams in Europe (no joke) : Naisy, Kev, big Rom, Eto'o,... and it'll only get better once Ross and Pienaar are back. I see a very exciting season coming up. BUT! We need a good central back FAST. And I read many people think ALCARAZ is an option. I can tell you this: HE ISN'T!!! Being belgian I saw him play every match for Bruges during 3 seasons and the guy has monumental fuckups. He was mediocre at best in a mediocre league like the belgian jupiler league. Way too bad for a team like Everton who should aim for top 5 position imo. A good friend of mine is a scout for Anderlecht and he said Uros Vitas and Eric Botteghin are very good options. Not the big names, but awesome defenders. He said the same about Dante when he was playing for Charleroi and now Dante plays for Bayern. There are still hidden gems on the European football fields. (sorry for my English, isn't my native tongue) chicagoblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djsunyc Posted August 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 entertaining match, frustrating but definitely entertaining. so what do i take away from this - we are just not at chelsea's level. we have to play perfect to stay in a match like yesterday while all chelsea has to do is just hold on for a bit b/c they could really score whenever they wanted to. it's ok. from what i gather, this is still a process in building this team. there will be growing pains with youth. i can't speak highly enough of naismith. my first year following the team and all i can say is that if every player had the hunger, competetiveness and drive that he has, well we would easily be the best team in the league. mirallas had a great first half and then we went to the other side of the field in the 2nd half. i'm curious as to why we did that. and the block on miralles attempt in the 2nd half was the play of the game. that ended our comeback attempt. jags had a really tough one - so many mistakes and again, alot of our players were visibly gassed. barry couldn't even run back in the final 10 mins. lukaku has bricks for feet but still manages to make some really good lead touches. and besic...well that was a hell of a way to make your debut. wow. that one play told me everything i needed to know about him - crazy young and cocky. needs to be humbled a bit. maybe lock him in a room with naismith for an hour and see what happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 Because firstly it looks like this season COULD (I'm careful to say could at this stage as it is admittedly early) be the season that time catches up on Distin. Jagielka looks like a fish out of water. He looks terrified when he has the ball at his feet and in a blind panic. Our full backs are bombing on (which is great) but it seems he's instructing the wingers not to prioritise on tracking back (especially against Arsenal and our full backs seem to be struggling for support at times. Last season was his first season here. The players were still getting used to the way he wanted them to play. That defence was a confident one that was solid under Moyes. Martinez inherited that defence but slowly as we've gone on, all the confidence they had has been sucked out of them because he's asking the centre backs to play in a way they're totally uncomfortable with. Add to this Barry now has a contract so isn't playing for one and is also another year older, as is Jags (who also had a poor world cup which has done his confidence no good) and Distin, well I've already said about him. Now the final piece of the puzzle. And that's teams are now wise to us. Managers have spotted we have to ageing centre halves who are not comfortable with the ball at their feet and they are pressing them constantly chasing them down, harrying them when they have the ball, not giving them a second to think. Teams are wise to us and our defence cannot play the kind of football we want to play unless they have all day on the ball to steady themselves and think about what they're doing. If you think that that defence is going to miraculously come good then you're in for a massive shock because if anything it's going to get shakier as the season goes on. 10 goals in 3 games and virtually every one of them either a mistake or a soft stupid goal to conceded.WOW! You reckon that after a full season under Bobby that its taken until the third game of his second season for the players to realise he is asking too much of them? Barry has now got a contract so he just stops being the player he was last year? And finally your statement of how we have been found out that opposing strikers hunt down our centre halves? How many of chelseas goals came from our centre backs giving the ball away? NONE. They were poor at playing offside, closing down and marking etc granted. To say that Martinez has sucked the confidence out of our centre halves is a joke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 So many things wrong with the above post its laughable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 So many things wrong with the above post its laughable Break it down then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted August 31, 2014 Report Share Posted August 31, 2014 WOW! You reckon that after a full season under Bobby that its taken until the third game of his second season for the players to realise he is asking too much of them? Barry has now got a contract so he just stops being the player he was last year? And finally your statement of how we have been found out that opposing strikers hunt down our centre halves? How many of chelseas goals came from our centre backs giving the ball away? NONE. They were poor at playing offside, closing down and marking etc granted. To say that Martinez has sucked the confidence out of our centre halves is a joke Sorry I see you did but you quoted it in my post. Where did I say centre forwards HUNTED down our centre halfs, if you're going to mis-quote me try not to sound so dramatic. Hunted down? It's not a nuclear submarine. I said teams are wise to the fact neither of our centre backs are comfortable on the ball and are targeting them. Also where did I say any of the Chelsea goals came from that? They never but Jagielka was pressed everytime he got the ball and shit himself and gave it away almost costing us more goals. Onto your point about it taking until the 3rd game of the season for players to realise he is asking too much of them? Again where did I say that? Have you not seen the pre season and ALL 3 games this? If you'd bothered to read my post properly (which you blatantly haven't) you would see that I said the confidence has gone from the 2 centre backs . They haven't become bad players overnight but a combination of being asked to play a way they are not entirely comfortable with coupled with teams now pressing us high and targeting them and also Barry (who I'll come to in a minute) not offering the type of protection he did last season is having an effect on them. If it's not then it's fair to say they have both just all of a sudden become shite, no? So to reiterate I never said Martinez had sucked all their confidence out I said an accumulation of factors have contributed to it. Now for Barry. I also said he's a year older and that could be a factor (which you conveniently omitted ) but as for him now having a contract, then yes it's completely feasible that now he is not in the shop window an edge can go from his game. Players do this all the time. Whether it's a subconscious thing or they plainl don't try as hard I don't know but it's entirely plausible that he could lose the drive and hunger we seen last season. Just because he's an Everton player doesn't mean it's not possible. I'm also not saying this is the case which is why I also said he's a year older as the reason we haven't so far seen the same player as last season. I'll finally go on to reiterate another point I made and that was last season that defence was off the back of being one of the tightest in the league and was full of confidence. The whole club was riding on the crest of a wave. Moyes had assembled a really good side but we were stagnant and badly in need of change. That came with Martinez and we rode our luck at times last season. How we kept so many clean sheets amazed me if I'm honest. But I think with an element of luck and the club being so high in positivity it carried us through. We over achieved, we had nothing to lose it was a transitional season and nobody would have batted an eyelid if we'd finished 8th-10th but we never. This season now the bar has been raised, peoples expectations are through the roof. This in turn puts pressure on players, players that are being asked to play in an unorthodox way to what they have done for all their career so now when the balls at their feet they have to think a lot more and so the pressure increases. Teams are wiser to us this season. Last season it was hard to second guess Martinez he was new we chopped and changed and moved the goal posts. This season managers and teams alike have had a full season to analyse us and find our soft under belly and that's the 2 centre halfs both of which are good players but playing in a system that they are not suited to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seve Posted September 1, 2014 Report Share Posted September 1, 2014 I think we have got 2 weeks to get up to speed fitness wise and re-introduce the back 5 to each other.hope bill has got a few bob left to spend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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