Tom Davies

[Romey 1878]

 This is the attitude Lookman should have. 

[Matt]

That attitude is what they should all have, and reason behind my ability to look past his short-comings. That attitude and subsequent workrate is infectious and can trump skill most of the time too

[markjazzbassist]

Still not impressed. Gave the ball away way too many times and didn’t impact the game enough for me.  He did make me realize that Morgan and Gana are a better pairing than davies and Gana.  Davies doesn’t have great passing ability whereas Morgan does.

[Romey 1878]

2 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

Still not impressed. Gave the ball away way too many times and didn’t impact the game enough for me.  He did make me realize that Morgan and Gana are a better pairing than davies and Gana.  Davies doesn’t have great passing ability whereas Morgan does.

If Davies was messing up difficult passes I wouldn't be arsed, but the lad struggles passing to someone a yard away from him. That's unacceptable.

[Palfy]

I thought him and Gana were pretty poor backed up by match scores Davies 6 Gana 5, hopefully Schneiderlin is back for the next game and the new signings get fit we’ve definitely got a big hole in the middle one injury and where struggling. 

[Bailey]

I thought they did OK together in respect of their effectiveness for the team. Nothing brilliant but they did the job, definitely too many misplaced passes in general from Davies (70.8% completion rate - compared to 87.9% the week before!) but also Gana in respect of simple passes that he should be making every time. Its not a pairing you would want to be playing week in week out but then I think we knew that already!

[Romey 1878]

The captaincy, and responsibility, seemed to give him a boost last night. I thought he was much better with the ball than he has been; looking after it and using it well.

Off the ball I thought he left us a little exposed.

[markjazzbassist]

I can’t wait till our midfielders are fit and we don’t see davies for a bit, he just doesn’t do it for me.  Poor poor match today

[EFC-Paul]

13 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

I can’t wait till our midfielders are fit and we don’t see davies for a bit, he just doesn’t do it for me.  Poor poor match today

I agree although he's been better of late for the most part but he's still not upto scratch 

[Paddock]

I just don’t see it with Davies, I’ve been patient and watched and watched him. I don’t get it, he’s not good enough 

[Bailey]

I must be in a group of one that thought he played well today bar a 10 minute spell where everything he touched turned to shit. 

[Bailey]

FWIW Davies passing accuracy was 89.7%, the second highest of all the starters behind Schneiderlin.

[barryj]

37 minutes ago, Bailey said:

FWIW Davies passing accuracy was 89.7%, the second highest of all the starters behind Schneiderlin.

That really surprises me. This though is where statics are completely skewed. As a central midfielder he makes numerous short 5 yard passes a game where there is no risk and no incision. The issue with Davies yesterday was the the relatively easy ball when there was a break on that were often misplaced. 

Stats showed yesterday that we had one shot on target to Huddersfield’s six. I felt other than there goal Pickford didn’t have a save to make and we had the best chances through DCL, Zouma, Tosun and Siggy nearly getting a foot to Lookmans cross. This is why you have to see the context and can’t look at stats alone! 

Id love to know the stat (time) of how long the ball was in play yesterday. It felt like it about 30 of the 90 mins. 

[Romey 1878]

I do not like him as a player whatsoever. I just don't see what he offers, what he does particularly well. He's just really underwhelming.

If he played for another club and we watched him there wouldn't be anyone that thought to themselves "I'd like him at Everton".

For me the only positive thing about him is that he runs about. It's slow like, and he mainly runs around leaving gaping holes, but the lad runs  Other than that, though, he's got no pace, his passing is poo, he's not strong, he's not skillful, he's not good in the air, his shooting isn'tt great, his positional sense is non-existent, he can't tackle, he doesn't even have good ball control.

I just don't get what the point of him is, what sort of role he can play for us because he's a jack of no trades and he masters it perfectly. When everyone is fit he gets nowhere near this team, he might even struggle for a place on the bench.

I've watched him and watched him, because loads think he's brilliant and just needs time but I'm seeing nothing in him and that disappoints me because I want him to be something.

[London Blue]

Schneilderlin spent most of the game getting forward, leaving Davies to act as the cover.

We didn't win yesterday because we did not create enough. That is not Davies or Schneiderlin's fault, we lacked movement, and guile against a team set on defending. 

We are still a work in progress and will take time for new signings to play and settle and the team get used to what Silva wants. 

Lets not start are usual season game of pick a youngster and then hound them till they leave or lose faith in themselves.

How about we get behind players and encourage them, we are Everton supporters after all. 

[EFC-Paul]

54 minutes ago, London Blue said:

Lets not start are usual season game of pick a youngster and then hound them till they leave or lose faith in themselves.

How about we get behind players and encourage them, we are Everton supporters after all. 

This is the type of nonsense that gets people's backs up imo 

I agree with Mark entirely he excels at absolutely nothing and to me regardless of age is a position being wasted, it isn'ttt hounding a player or picking out a youngster it's an opinion from people that are here to support primarily Everton not individual players 

He seems a good lad and has made slight improvements under Silva as I've mentioned recently but he doesn't have anything in his locker to improve upon that will make him good enough in my opinion

 

 

[markjazzbassist]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

I do not like him as a player whatsoever. I just don't see what he offers, what he does particularly well. He's just really underwhelming.

If he played for another club and we watched him there wouldn't be anyone that thought to themselves "I'd like him at Everton".

For me the only positive thing about him is that he runs about. It's slow like, and he mainly runs around leaving gaping holes, but the lad runs  Other than that, though, he's got no pace, his passing is poo, he's not strong, he's not skillful, he's not good in the air, his shooting isn'ttt great, his positional sense is non-existent, he can't tackle, he doesn't even have good ball control.

I just don't get what the point of him is, what sort of role he can play for us because he's a jack of no trades and he masters it perfectly. When everyone is fit he gets nowhere near this team, he might even struggle for a place on the bench.

I've watched him and watched him, because loads think he's brilliant and just needs time but I'm seeing nothing in him and that disappoints me because I want him to be something.

Exactly.  I realized yesterday if he was a west ham player most here would think he was shit and wouldn’t want him anywhere near our club.  

[Bailey]

3 hours ago, barryj said:

That really surprises me. This though is where statics are completely skewed. As a central midfielder he makes numerous short 5 yard passes a game where there is no risk and no incision. The issue with Davies yesterday was the the relatively easy ball when there was a break on that were often misplaced. 

Stats showed yesterday that we had one shot on target to Huddersfield’s six. I felt other than there goal Pickford didn’t have a save to make and we had the best chances through DCL, Zouma, Tosun and Siggy nearly getting a foot to Lookmans cross. This is why you have to see the context and can’t look at stats alone! 

Id love to know the stat (time) of how long the ball was in play yesterday. It felt like it about 30 of the 90 mins. 

I agree stats can skew things but the remarks from some on here suggest he barely completed a pass and yet the reality is that he is one of our more efficient passers and he also plays a lot more vertically than Schneiderlin who played most of his passes side to side. 

The problem Davies had is that he had a spell of poor play and it was at a time when the fans were starting to moan and groan and everyone remembers that. To have that bad of a spell and still come out that high suggests he did a lot right for the rest of the game but people dont remember that. There was one particular pass wide left from the inside right channel that was actually a really clever ball apart from DCL was indisciplined and made a run inside when he should have been holding his width. Everyone moaned at Davies but it should have been a really good ball if DCL had done his job properly. DCL would have been 1 v 1 with the full back and in a great crossing position. 

57 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said:

This is the type of nonsense that gets people's backs up imo 

I agree with Mark entirely he excels at absolutely nothing and to me regardless of age is a position being wasted, it isn'tttt hounding a player or picking out a youngster it's an opinion from people that are here to support primarily Everton not individual players 

He seems a good lad and has made slight improvements under Silva as I've mentioned recently but he doesn't have anything in his locker to improve upon that will make him good enough in my opinion

 

 

There were a lot worse players on the pitch than Davies yesterday and a lot of the criticism is unjustified. He is no superstar and there are lots of good premier league players that dont "excel" at something they are just well rounded footballers who come in and do a job for their team. We have been crying out for more well rounded footballers since Barry left and McCarthy handcuffed himself to the treatment table.

[Bailey]

Interestingly when you compare the stats from Davies, Gana and Schneiderlin you can unsurprisingly see that Gana excels defensively with 14 tackles (8 TD, 6 MS), 6 interceptions (TD 3, MS 4), 7 Clearances (TD 5, MS 5), 29 Duels won (TD 14, MS 15) and 3 successful 50/50s (TD 2, MS 0). Surprisingly though Davies leads them both in recoveries 18 (IG 14, MS 15) but less surprisingly he is worst in the air winning only 1 battle from 7 compared to 6 apiece from Schneiderlin and Gueye.

Schneiderlin is the only one with an assist or through ball (from a set piece) but he has completed more long balls (10) to 5 and 6 for the other two. Gana marginally completes more passes per game ahead of Davies and then Morgan. Morgan has been more accurate (92%) compared to 83% for Gana and Davies which is something I would expect as they are generally riskier passers.

[StevO]

He was good in the first half, turned the ball over well and found Gylfi a lot. 

Second half was just a nightmare. 

[EFC-Paul]

3 hours ago, Bailey said:

I agree stats can skew things but the remarks from some on here suggest he barely completed a pass and yet the reality is that he is one of our more efficient passers and he also plays a lot more vertically than Schneiderlin who played most of his passes side to side. 

The problem Davies had is that he had a spell of poor play and it was at a time when the fans were starting to moan and groan and everyone remembers that. To have that bad of a spell and still come out that high suggests he did a lot right for the rest of the game but people dont remember that. There was one particular pass wide left from the inside right channel that was actually a really clever ball apart from DCL was indisciplined and made a run inside when he should have been holding his width. Everyone moaned at Davies but it should have been a really good ball if DCL had done his job properly. DCL would have been 1 v 1 with the full back and in a great crossing position. 

There were a lot worse players on the pitch than Davies yesterday and a lot of the criticism is unjustified. He is no superstar and there are lots of good premier league players that dont "excel" at something they are just well rounded footballers who come in and do a job for their team. We have been crying out for more well rounded footballers since Barry left and McCarthy handcuffed himself to the treatment table.

I'd say he sat firmly in the very average bracket yesterday which is were he tends to always sit 

It isn'ttt a criticism it's observational opinion people aren't knocking the lad by purely saying he's not that good of a footballer it's just what we see, your right lots of teams do have players that don't excel at much but if your happy to have the likes of Gosling Rodwell and co playing for your side then that's fine but for me personally I don't want that as we'll never kick on carrying bang average players

Great lad seems to be liked by everyone but I just don't see him being anything other than a steady eddie 

Also I don't tend to look at stats to much they can be misleading and skewed to whichever way someone intends them to be

 

[markjazzbassist]

34 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said:

I'd say he sat firmly in the very average bracket yesterday which is were he tends to always sit 

It isn'tttt a criticism it's observational opinion people aren't knocking the lad by purely saying he's not that good of a footballer it's just what we see, your right lots of teams do have players that don't excel at much but if your happy to have the likes of Gosling Rodwell and co playing for your side then that's fine but for me personally I don't want that as we'll never kick in carrying bang average players

Great lad seems to be liked by everyone but I just don't see him being anything other than a steady eddie 

Also I don't tend to look at stats to much they can be misleading and skewed to whichever way someone intends them to be

 

Exactly.  We need worldies not gosling types in our side.  Honestly I expect a doucoure or similar in January or the summer and morgan Gana and the like to be off.  All action defensive mid who can pass and attack and defend.  We have guys that do one or the other.  

[Matt]

Thought he did well if I’m honest. Not brilliant, but he’s wasn’t awful. 

He’s going to be more of a Barry kind of player, by which I mean nothing spectacular but will always give his all and do a good job. Rarely brilliant, but good. He’s always going to split opinion because he does do some pointless running, but that will get better with time. A Mr Consistent in the making (queue jokes of being consistently crap!)

[EFC-Paul]

30 minutes ago, Matt said:

Thought he did well if I’m honest. Not brilliant, but he’s wasn’t awful. 

He’s going to be more of a Barry kind of player, by which I mean nothing spectacular but will always give his all and do a good job. Rarely brilliant, but good. He’s always going to split opinion because he does do some pointless running, but that will get better with time. A Mr Consistent in the making (queue jokes of being consistently crap!)

Not to keep knocking the lad but I can't see him ever being a Barry type or close to what he was 

Slightly conflicting opinion because I don't think Davies will become much more than Gosling and co have but I really rated Barry, possibly one of the best signings we've made in my time so far

I get your jist though him being a type that does stuff that mainly goes unnoticed but sadly I do notice it and it's pretty rubbish  

I'd love Barry back here now ten years younger though!!

[Matt]

22 minutes ago, EFC-Paul said:

Not to keep knocking the lad but I can't see him ever being a Barry type or close to what he was 

Slightly conflicting opinion because I don't think Davies will become much more than Gosling and co have but I really rated Barry, possibly one of the best signings we've made in my time so far

I get your jist though him being a type that does stuff that mainly goes unnoticed but sadly I do notice it and it's pretty rubbish  

I'd love Barry back here now ten years younger though!!

I don’t mean the same type of player in the way he plays, more that he’ll never be spectacular but will be consistently reliable. 

that said, he’s still only 20 so there’s plenty of learning to do 

[EFC-Paul]

11 minutes ago, Matt said:

I don’t mean the same type of player in the way he plays, more that he’ll never be spectacular but will be consistently reliable. 

that said, he’s still only 20 so there’s plenty of learning to do 

True, I do hope he does though I just can't see it

I did say somewhere else it's a shame he came through during a turbulent period and was thrown into the side as he could have done with a season or two in the Championship 

I've no problems with him being part of the squad though I just don't want to see him starting games if possible 

[Bailey]

3 hours ago, EFC-Paul said:

I'd say he sat firmly in the very average bracket yesterday which is were he tends to always sit 

It isn'tttt a criticism it's observational opinion people aren't knocking the lad by purely saying he's not that good of a footballer it's just what we see, your right lots of teams do have players that don't excel at much but if your happy to have the likes of Gosling Rodwell and co playing for your side then that's fine but for me personally I don't want that as we'll never kick on carrying bang average players

Great lad seems to be liked by everyone but I just don't see him being anything other than a steady eddie 

Also I don't tend to look at stats to much they can be misleading and skewed to whichever way someone intends them to be

 

I would say calling someone "very average" is criticism

I do agree with you generally in that he isn'tt someone I want to be starting week in week out but he is still a more than useful player for the squad. He is a far better player than Gosling and Rodwell IMO. Look across the park and they have the likes of Milner, Henderson, Wijnaldum etc that aren't "worldies" (to quote below), they are just players that can go into the team and do the job the manager asks and I see that in Davies. When we went 442 later in the game, Davies sat in a little deeper more alongside Schneiderlin and played to the plan. I am not saying that Davies is at the level of Henderson or Milner, its all relative to the team we have at the moment, plus the lad is only 20 and I can already see he is learning a lot tactically under Silva.

Stats can be misleading but so can memories. Using a combination of the two is what I am doing. From an output perspective the 3 of them are very similar so far this season. As players they are clearly very different and have different positives and I think all 3 of them have done well in the matches they have played so far. Hopefully it wont be too much longer until we have stronger players in these positions but for the time being he is just as important to the team as the other two.

 

3 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Exactly.  We need worldies not gosling types in our side.  Honestly I expect a doucoure or similar in January or the summer and morgan Gana and the like to be off.  All action defensive mid who can pass and attack and defend.  We have guys that do one or the other.  

I agree for the most part although I would say is that we will never have a squad full of "worldies" and these young lads coming through or the "do a job" types will form the backbone of the squad when the worldies get injured or pragmatism is needed over pure ability. The best example of that is Ferguson at Utd. He had some real quality players and then he had Phil Neville and Nicky Butt. Davies is our Nicky Butt

[London Blue]

11 hours ago, EFC-Paul said:

This is the type of nonsense that gets people's backs up imo 

I agree with Mark entirely he excels at absolutely nothing and to me regardless of age is a position being wasted, it isn'tttt hounding a player or picking out a youngster it's an opinion from people that are here to support primarily Everton not individual players 

He seems a good lad and has made slight improvements under Silva as I've mentioned recently but he doesn't have anything in his locker to improve upon that will make him good enough in my opinion

 

 

Nonsense, asking for a young player to be given time and support?

If that's nonsense to you well, I guess that just sums you up. I feel sorry for you, I really do.

Davies did not have a good game yesterday, most of out team did not, they were flat, it happens. We are a team with a new manager, new way of playing and we were not good enough. 

I wont be judging this team and its players until we have had a few months, maybe around Christmas, then we will know which players have adapted and grown and who has not.

 

[EFC-Paul]

8 hours ago, London Blue said:

Nonsense, asking for a young player to be given time and support?

If that's nonsense to you well, I guess that just sums you up. I feel sorry for you, I really do.

Davies did not have a good game yesterday, most of out team did not, they were flat, it happens. We are a team with a new manager, new way of playing and we were not good enough. 

I wont be judging this team and its players until we have had a few months, maybe around Christmas, then we will know which players have adapted and grown and who has not.

 

Absolutely no need to feel sorry for me LB I'm not the one who forgets what I've posted then twists an innocent reply into something personal

"Lets not start are usual season game of pick a youngster and then hound them till they leave or lose faith in themselves."

Your insinuating a great deal with the above purely on people giving an honest assessment of the lads ability and how he's fairing it isn'tt hounding him out, we praise players when they play well and critique them when they don't that's football 

 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, EFC-Paul said:

Absolutely no need to feel sorry for me LB I'm not the one who forgets what I've posted then twists an innocent reply into something personal

"Lets not start are usual season game of pick a youngster and then hound them till they leave or lose faith in themselves."

Your insinuating a great deal with the above purely on people giving an honest assessment of the lads ability and how he's fairing it isn'ttt hounding him out, we praise players when they play well and critique them when they don't that's football 

 

I get LBs initial sentiment, I’m not sure it’s directed at any one person but more of a general observation. Got a little OTT with his last post mind you.

Out of all the crap players at the game, Davies seems to be getting more stick than others, justified or not. 

I think people will stick up for him more than usual simply because of what’s happened in the past with our young, promising yet frustrating midfield talents.