Hafnia Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Every team needs a 20-25 goal striker - problem is that they don't all have them. The reason we're not as good against the top teams is that we're not good enough yet. A point many find themselves repeating is building with Lukaku is easier than building without Lukaku. Put better players with and around him and we'll do better against the teams above us - seems simple. Only 46 per cent (26) of Premier League sides to finish in the top four since 2001-02, (as at 2016) when four Champions League places were awarded to England, have had a player who scored 20 or more league goals during the campaign. Only half the teams to have won the league since 2002 gave had a 20+ goal a season player. It really is not a necessity.... Does it help? Absolutely. If lukaku had the type of game that meant he was a 90 minute hindrance to defenders - that he pressured them into clearing balls opposed to allowing them to walk it out or pick a pass... where he was able to win out balls or long kicks from the keeper and hold up the ball to allow us to get camped in their half he would be invaluable. The truth is that he can't do this - we need a player to do that. Id sooner have a player who was less prolific but more rounded as it would bring out the best in the likes of Rom and mirallas. If lukaku was only worth £30m then I wouldn't sell because his goals are more valuable than that but £60m plus? Thats a lot of money for him and would buy us quality replacements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Only 46 per cent (26) of Premier League sides to finish in the top four since 2001-02, (as at 2016) when four Champions League places were awarded to England, have had a player who scored 20 or more league goals during the campaign. Only half the teams to have won the league since 2002 gave had a 20+ goal a season player. It really is not a necessity.... Does it help? Absolutely. If lukaku had the type of game that meant he was a 90 minute hindrance to defenders - that he pressured them into clearing balls opposed to allowing them to walk it out or pick a pass... where he was able to win out balls or long kicks from the keeper and hold up the ball to allow us to get camped in their half he would be invaluable. The truth is that he can't do this - we need a player to do that. Id sooner have a player who was less prolific but more rounded as it would bring out the best in the likes of Rom and mirallas. If lukaku was only worth £30m then I wouldn't sell because his goals are more valuable than that but £60m plus? Thats a lot of money for him and would buy us quality replacements. This highlights the players behind him not doing enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 If lukaku was only worth £30m then I wouldn't sell because his goals are more valuable than that but £60m plus? Thats a lot of money for him and would buy us quality replacements. We don't need money though - of course, every player has his price - but we'll spend big regardless. If we can build around a 20+ goal a season striker then I'd rather do that as no obvious replacement stands out. Pre-Moshiri and the ridiculous tv deals, I'd be inclined to sell for the greater gains but the fact is we'll spend big this summer regardless - having a player like Lukaku makes us more attractive to potential targets. Romey 1878 and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 So he's staying now? I can't keep up haha. Valencia is doing a great job for us. I would happily pay ten for him. Keep him and bring in a prospect and a good fifteen to twenty striker and we would be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 This highlights the players behind him not doing enough.me too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 This highlights the players behind him not doing enough. How does he score all these goals? It's not by taking it all on himself - he relies on his team mates to provide the ammo. He is the total focal point for our attacking play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 I'd take Valencia for 10 million, as long as he is content on being an impact sub. If we could somehow negotiate for that I would too. Great impact sub and pace jockey, great for sitting back and countering lineups against man city and the like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 We don't need money though - of course, every player has his price - but we'll spend big regardless. If we can build around a 20+ goal a season striker then I'd rather do that as no obvious replacement stands out. Pre-Moshiri and the ridiculous tv deals, I'd be inclined to sell for the greater gains but the fact is we'll spend big this summer regardless - having a player like Lukaku makes us more attractive to potential targets. We do need the money. FFP - transfer spends need to be generated by revenue. Essentially player trading and TV rights is our only source. All other teams get the same tv rights give or take a few million. It's the buying and selling of players that will enable us to remodel our squad. Second important fact to consider is this :- lukaku wants to leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 How does he score all these goals? It's not by taking it all on himself - he relies on his team mates to provide the ammo. He is the total focal point for our attacking play. Because he's a lot better than you give him credit for. Look at Spurs midfield and the amount of chances they make. Lukaku who has scraps in comparison has still scored more. Phenomenal as our old manager would say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibdane Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Valencia is a good squad player for sure. Also, at this point, I don't think 60mil is enough for Rom in today's market, especially if he keeps scoring until the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Because he's a lot better than you give him credit for. Look at Spurs midfield and the amount of chances they make. Lukaku who has scraps in comparison has still scored more. Phenomenal as our old manager would say. Yeah and spurs create these chances for alli as well as kane which is why both are going to have 20+ goals this season... lukaku gets the lone focus. He doesn't get fed scraps - absolute bollocks. Look at every one of his goals - bar a couple he gets them passed to him. If anything with better movement he could get more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Yeah and spurs create these chances for alli as well as kane which is why both are going to have 20+ goals this season... lukaku gets the lone focus. He doesn't get fed scraps - absolute bollocks. Look at every one of his goals - bar a couple he gets them passed to him. If anything with better movement he could get more. Eriksen has 16 assists. Barkley has 11 (of which one was for the og yesterday). Before the New Year he had 3. Boss service that,completely the same .only reason we're not second is Lukaku not scoring then... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 It's bad enough having my head kettled about Lukaku in the Lukaku thread. Please keep it to that thread for everyone's sanity or I'm just going to go on a deleting rampage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 (edited) Yeah and spurs create these chances for alli as well as kane which is why both are going to have 20+ goals this season... lukaku gets the lone focus. He doesn't get fed scraps - absolute bollocks. Look at every one of his goals - bar a couple he gets them passed to him. If anything with better movement he could get more. he could, but I'm more interested in the Ali statement. Surely Ross should be chipping in too, giving us a different threat? If he shot half the time he drove forward instead of running into dead ends, he might just score as many as Alli, which would give us a different attacking option and mean Rom isn't the sole focus. Anyway, Valencia has blown hot and cold so far, but certainly best off the bench where his pace and movement has created space for both Rom and Ross. We've lacked a real supporting striker and he might be a "cheap" answer to that. Certainly an improvement on Kone and Niasse, and decent competition to DCL and Lookman. Another thing is the fluid movement he offers behind Rom, forcing Ross and Kev to float around a bit more too. Not sure if that was planned or not but it's worked well each time as the opposition are never really sure who to be marking. Edited April 16, 2017 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 (edited) We do need the money. FFP - transfer spends need to be generated by revenue. Essentially player trading and TV rights is our only source. All other teams get the same tv rights give or take a few million. It's the buying and selling of players that will enable us to remodel our squad. Second important fact to consider is this :- lukaku wants to leave. We do need to generate income but that's where USM sponsorship of Finch Farm and improved shirt sponsor deals need to help out rather than selling our best players. As for wanting to leave - it doesn't matter - he's got 2 years on his contract which says otherwise - he may go if it's right for us because we hold all the cards here. Anyway, back to Valencia... Edited April 16, 2017 by c1982 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Good squad player, offers energy, direct running and is a threat. Would like him for about 8 million as long as we keep playing and developing talent like Lookman and DCL. He cant be the sole back-up to Lukaku so if he stays and Lukaku does we still need a striker in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Very capable player. Not really a starter, but could be great in the Europa league against weaker opposition. Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 It's bad enough having my head kettled about Lukaku in the Lukaku thread. Please keep it to that thread for everyone's sanity or I'm just going to go on a deleting rampage. THIS!!! For fuck sake lads...!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Valencia has been a useful player. Used to like him when he first came on the scene at West ham. It's a difficult one. He'd be useful for next season as we enter into Europe and have more games to play. But I would shy away from paying more than £10mill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcirony Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Does anyone know how long he has left on his WH contract? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Does anyone know how long he has left on his WH contract? July 2019, if you believe Wikipedia. 2 years left, surly they can't demand 14 million. They won't get that for him off another club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 He has done a good enough job but we are talking about a player who basically just brings energy, movement and good close control who isn't a particularly good passer and can't cross and will only score once a blue moon. Son costs Spurs 22mil. For just 8mil extra the gulf in class is huge. We should be buying players that mean Kev drops to the bench and not buying a bench player who isn't good enough to play every week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 July 2019, if you believe Wikipedia. 2 years left, surly they can't demand 14 million. They won't get that for him off another club. The fee was agreed with the loan. If we want we pay that, if not we don't get him. Unless we can say no and then negotiate for less and they just want rid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 The fee was agreed with the loan. If we want we pay that, if not we don't get him. Unless we can say no and then negotiate for less and they just want rid Fair enough, first I've head of that clause. Even so, we can tell WHU that x- million is our offer. Take it or leave it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Fair enough, first I've head of that clause. Even so, we can tell WHU that x- million is our offer. Take it or leave it. Yeah it was mentioned with the loan and already agreed since it's a loan to buy. No sure we can say no and then negotiate again. Maybe say no and buy him in the winter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Yeah it was mentioned with the loan and already agreed since it's a loan to buy. No sure we can say no and then negotiate again. Maybe say no and buy him in the winter? Still though 14 million seems excessive? Maybe it's an arse cover incase he had a blinding season. I think they will be flexible on the price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 July 2019, if you believe Wikipedia. 2 years left, surly they can't demand 14 million. They won't get that for him off another club. They can demand what they like tbh mate it's whether us or anyone else is willing to pay it. Personally I wouldn't pay more than 6 million for him. He can't finish and is a headless chicken for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Eriksen has 16 assists. Barkley has 11 (of which one was for the og yesterday). Before the New Year he had 3. Boss service that,completely the same .only reason we're not second is Lukaku not scoring then... But haven't Kane and Ali also scored a lot more than Rom? Didn't someone post goals v chances for Kane and Rom....and they were pretty similar? Doesn't seem like Spurs create more statistically speaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 THIS!!! For fuck sake lads...!!!!! Bloody hell, got fooled into thinking it was the Rom thread too haha. Sorry all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smeghead1 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 More games next year Europe hopefully and a good cup run so yeah I think he'd get more game time definitely. The price depends upon how badly West Ham want him off the wage bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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