London Blue Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 On a totally unrelated note, from his twitter he seems to be very supportive of the squad and a team man. Lets just hope he comes back successfully then we can sit back and watch. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 On a totally unrelated note, from his twitter he seems to be very supportive of the squad and a team man. Lets just hope he comes back successfully then we can sit back and watch.there we can agree London Blue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 i don't dislike the guy, I just don't think he's very good and we overpaid in order to make a statement I also said I looked forward to being proven wrong and for 2-3 games I was willing to hold my hands up. But then the good 2-3 moments a game became negated by the waste he created. You have a man crush on him so won't see the bad because you don't want to, admit that I've heard the suggestion "spend to make a statement" a few times in recent months, and here's an example of why that's like flushing money down the toilet. It's never right to overspend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 the money has nothing to do with it, it's the market now bailey give it a rest. if he had cost 2m pounds everyone would think he's the bee's knees, but since he was 20m people think he should be Messi. Fickle. No one has said that have they MJB? Mirallas 20 / 3 / 22 / 62% / 83% Barkley 19 / 3 / 47 / 52% / 83% Bolasie 13 / 1 / 20 / 30% / 73% Gerry 11 / 0 / 9 / 60% / 72% (mainly a sub) This is apps, goals, chances created, shot accuracy and passing accuracy. After his first 4 games Bolasie was: 4 / 0 / 9 / 29% / 80% I haven't included Lennon as we both know he is useless! Bolasie 1052 mins = 52 mins per chance Mirallas 1190 (roughly) = 54 per chance Gerry 450 (roughly) = chance every 50 mins Ross 1478 mins = 33 mins per chance As I mentioned before Bolasie started brightly but dropped quite significantly after that honeymoon period as backed up by his average on chances created and his passing stats. Both of those two categories are the combined worst against the other players noted and he was starting every week whereas the others were getting relegated to the bench every other game, or not even in the squad in Gerry's case. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Bolasie is terrible or anything like that but I think it is a fair comment to say that our performances have improved since he got injured, and we have kept the ball better further up the pitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 His stats for the 2 previous years at Palace are dreadful, at least he has shown definite improvement in that area for us and may suggest that he will do more for us than he did for them unlike Matt suggests (ish). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 No one has said that have they MJB? Mirallas 20 / 3 / 22 / 62% / 83% Barkley 19 / 3 / 47 / 52% / 83% Bolasie 13 / 1 / 20 / 30% / 73% Gerry 11 / 0 / 9 / 60% / 72% (mainly a sub) This is apps, goals, chances created, shot accuracy and passing accuracy. After his first 4 games Bolasie was: 4 / 0 / 9 / 29% / 80% I haven't included Lennon as we both know he is useless! Bolasie 1052 mins = 52 mins per chance Mirallas 1190 (roughly) = 54 per chance Gerry 450 (roughly) = chance every 50 mins Ross 1478 mins = 33 mins per chance As I mentioned before Bolasie started brightly but dropped quite significantly after that honeymoon period as backed up by his average on chances created and his passing stats. Both of those two categories are the combined worst against the other players noted and he was starting every week whereas the others were getting relegated to the bench every other game, or not even in the squad in Gerry's case. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Bolasie is terrible or anything like that but I think it is a fair comment to say that our performances have improved since he got injured, and we have kept the ball better further up the pitch. the stats are cherry picked, you forgot assists where he leads them all. also the stats don't show work rate of which he beats all of those as well. agree to disagree on this one mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 the stats are cherry picked, you forgot assists where he leads them all. also the stats don't show work rate of which he beats all of those as well. agree to disagree on this one mate. Basically "I'll agree to back down as you've completely proved me wrong!" Well played Bailey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 His stats for the 2 previous years at Palace are dreadful, at least he has shown definite improvement in that area for us and may suggest that he will do more for us than he did for them unlike Matt suggests (ish).well he won't for a while unfortunately, and like I said when he signed; I look forward to being proven wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 17, 2017 Report Share Posted January 17, 2017 (edited) I'm sorry I tried to respect your opinion Bailey I really did, but how can you say that a winger who was quite good was responsible for us playing shit? Did he cause Jags and Barry to finally let age catch up with them and play poorly? Did he cause Steck to have brain farts? Did he cause our midfield to be lethargic and lifeless? Did he cause injury to McCarthy? If the answer to these questions is no, then M'lord it cant be Bolasie's fault. If you think the answer is yes, then clearly Bolasie has super powers and should be hunted down by the Justice League. Edited January 18, 2017 by London Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shy_Talk Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Post hoc ergo proptor hoc. Are you seriously saying that the reason for our poor form against Bournemouth, Palace, Burnley, Chelsea, Swansea, Southampton was down to Yannick Bolasie playing for us? Have you seen the dross that: Lennon (tries hard, runs allot but no end product), Mirallas (one great game in 10 the rest have us wishing he had left 2 years ago) or Jerry (One good game then dons the cloak of invisibility for 3 matches before getting injured) Have served up for us? At least Bolasie can cross and beat his man. Hahahahahahaha Yea, err, anyway! Had to chip in on the rest, Bolasie showed up in games where we were being over ran, that he featured so much was not a case of a matter of him being so poor but that at the time the rest of the side were so bad he was simply involved that much more for fans to focus upon and the current ire in the bowels of blues has to go somewhere.... It'd be great to see Bolasie in a midfield of maniacal rate pressing with legs on the bench to sub on with 30 to go to turn the oppo into dust, sadly, being a big lad and a speedster, i'll be amazed if medical science can bring him back to the physical standard he was at. (PS. I like Lennon cos he works back, and if the luxury player is a winger like Deulofeu that has difficulty tracking back then the other winger has to cover his (own) fullback so the midfield can try to plug the gap left for the counter(the gap being that of deulofeu)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 the stats are cherry picked, you forgot assists where he leads them all. also the stats don't show work rate of which he beats all of those as well. agree to disagree on this one mate. No they're not numb nuts. Assists require the striker to finish the chance whereas chances created shows exactly what it says. What if Mirallas had put 20 chances on a plate for Lukaku but he missed them all? Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 No they're not numb nuts. Assists require the striker to finish the chance whereas chances created shows exactly what it says. What if Mirallas had put 20 chances on a plate for Lukaku but he missed them all? The stats show that Bolasie is better at creating potential and actual chances than Mirallas - no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Hahahahahahaha Yea, err, anyway! Had to chip in on the rest, Bolasie showed up in games where we were being over ran, that he featured so much was not a case of a matter of him being so poor but that at the time the rest of the side were so bad he was simply involved that much more for fans to focus upon and the current ire in the bowels of blues has to go somewhere.... It'd be great to see Bolasie in a midfield of maniacal rate pressing with legs on the bench to sub on with 30 to go to turn the oppo into dust, sadly, being a big lad and a speedster, i'll be amazed if medical science can bring him back to the physical standard he was at. (PS. I like Lennon cos he works back, and if the luxury player is a winger like Deulofeu that has difficulty tracking back then the other winger has to cover his (own) fullback so the midfield can try to plug the gap left for the counter(the gap being that of deulofeu)) I like Lennon too, his energy and covering are great, its just that his job is to create and score goals, which he just cant do. He is more like a wing back than a winger and still not very creative. I love Kevin, on his day he is an amazing player, creative, direct a real goal threat. The trouble is he has never been consistent and took 2014/15 and 2015/16 off. If he can improve his consistency then he will be a valuable part of the squad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Lennon has no end product for me. He tries and you can't fault his work ethic but there is very rarely any end quality with him. Romey 1878, Lowensda, Sibdane and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 I'm sorry I tried to respect your opinion Bailey I really did, but how can you say that a winger who was quite good was responsible for us playing shit? Did he cause Jags and Barry to finally let age catch up with them and play poorly? Did he cause Steck to have brain farts? Did he cause our midfield to be lethargic and lifeless? Did he cause injury to McCarthy? If the answer to these questions is no, then M'lord it cant be Bolasie's fault. If you think the answer is yes, then clearly Bolasie has super powers and should be hunted down by the Justice League. I haven't said that though have I? The stats show that his performances dipped from a bright start, which supports what I have said. I don't deny that part of that will reflect the overall failings of the team at that time but the others mentioned haven't seen that same dip and I think have improved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 The stats show that Bolasie is better at creating potential and actual chances than Mirallas - no? Yep they are creating at the same level, albeit the formers dipped. Bolasie pass percentage dipped dramatically, which is my main criticism ( of giving the ball away). Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlblue Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 'Mirallas on his day' or 'Bolasie on his day' - problem with both players is they are both inconsistent. I have never been a fan of Bolasie, i was quite gutted tbh when we signed him but ill support him now he is an Everton player. I'd choose Mirallas all day though, he is the better finisher out of the two by far. Koeman seems to have got him going again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makis Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Bolasie works harder and is much more unpredictable. And he's much better at creating something out of nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 (edited) Bolasie and Mirallas are very different type of players. Mirallas is by far the better footballer, is more controlled on the ball, is a better finisher and can play in different positions. Bolasie is odd for a winger, he big boned and strong, he's quicker than Mirallas and much more unpredictable and also works much harder. Bolasie never goes missing either, he always shows for the ball no matter what type of game he'shaving, Mirallas can go missing at times. I seea place for both of them on our wings. One side skillful, direct and scores goals, the other lighting quick (hopefully after the injury) direct, never stops running and unpredictable. Put Ross in a deeper roll with those 2 either side of Lukaku with Gana and Schneiderlin in front of the defence Edited January 18, 2017 by Paddock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 A wide player who produces game after game? is there one? - maybe robben, ribery, Ronaldo, bale..... so yeah essentially you are talking mega money. wide players are notoriously hot and cold - George Best was the ultimate for that. On their day a defenders nightmare and the fans hero - off their day a sub waiting to happen. So lets not get carried away with the criticism of Bolassie - one thing is for sure he never hid - not once. To me that is a massive plus in a player. Unorthodox but effective I thought. His crosses never got the responses they deserved - his ability to hit a deep dipping ball that looked like it was going out but came back in was brilliant, no one tended to read them though. Given time they probably would and his effectiveness increased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 A wide player who produces game after game? is there one? - maybe robben, ribery, Ronaldo, bale..... so yeah essentially you are talking mega money. wide players are notoriously hot and cold - George Best was the ultimate for that. On their day a defenders nightmare and the fans hero - off their day a sub waiting to happen. So lets not get carried away with the criticism of Bolassie - one thing is for sure he never hid - not once. To me that is a massive plus in a player. Unorthodox but effective I thought. His crosses never got the responses they deserved - his ability to hit a deep dipping ball that looked like it was going out but came back in was brilliant, no one tended to read them though. Given time they probably would and his effectiveness increased. I agree with a lot of this and I'm not fishing here or on the wind up but he reminds me a bit of Lukaku in the way he never looks like he's got the ball completely under control, it bounces off his shins and ping pongs about a lot around both of them. I'm not saying it's a bad thing just probably part of why he's unpredictable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlblue Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 A wide player who produces game after game? is there one? - maybe robben, ribery, Ronaldo, bale..... so yeah essentially you are talking mega money. wide players are notoriously hot and cold - George Best was the ultimate for that. On their day a defenders nightmare and the fans hero - off their day a sub waiting to happen. So lets not get carried away with the criticism of Bolassie - one thing is for sure he never hid - not once. To me that is a massive plus in a player. Unorthodox but effective I thought. His crosses never got the responses they deserved - his ability to hit a deep dipping ball that looked like it was going out but came back in was brilliant, no one tended to read them though. Given time they probably would and his effectiveness increased. I dont think anyone was? bit ironic though? there is a 200+ page discussion about how much you dont like Lukaku Lowensda and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 I dont think anyone was? bit ironic though? there is a 200+ page discussion about how much you dont like Lukaku well he has had a fair few more games than Bolassie hasn't he? Bolassie was still bedding in. London Blue and dlblue 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shy_Talk Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Bolasie and Mirallas are very different type of players. Mirallas is by far the better footballer, is more controlled on the ball, is a better finisher and can play in different positions. Bolasie is odd for a winger, he big boned and strong, he's quicker than Mirallas and much more unpredictable and also works much harder. Bolasie never goes missing either, he always shows for the ball no matter what type of game he'shaving, Mirallas can go missing at times. I seea place for both of them on our wings. One side skillful, direct and scores goals, the other lighting quick (hopefully after the injury) direct, never stops running and unpredictable. Put Ross in a deeper roll with those 2 either side of Lukaku with Gana and Schneiderlin in front of the defence Nearly there for me, though you missed out that Bolasie wins his headers, theres an obvious question mark over kevs attitude and application, a lot boils down to that penalty miss (team orders, but thats a different story). We'll see a different side to players once the shackles of the nightmare we've dumped are forgotten and the new style is primary in their minds as well as the rest of the side is settled and comfortable. Expecting consistency from creative players is a far ask in a side so inconsistent as a whole. If Koeman fancies keeping three at the back and utilising Baines and Colemanfor the flanks, they need covering players in front or they cant get forward to work so easily. It also raises a question about how to play Rom and who plays off him or supplies him. I don't think the Belfodil deal is dead just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Nearly there for me, though you missed out that Bolasie wins his headers, theres an obvious question mark over kevs attitude and application, a lot boils down to that penalty miss (team orders, but thats a different story). We'll see a different side to players once the shackles of the nightmare we've dumped are forgotten and the new style is primary in their minds as well as the rest of the side is settled and comfortable. Expecting consistency from creative players is a far ask in a side so inconsistent as a whole. If Koeman fancies keeping three at the back and utilising Baines and Colemanfor the flanks, they need covering players in front or they cant get forward to work so easily. It also raises a question about how to play Rom and who plays off him or supplies him. I don't think the Belfodil deal is dead just yet. Kev proved that it is he who should be playing off Rom. To quote Koeman directly "Kevin Mirallas played well" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 About 2 or 3 pages here that could quite easily be moved to the Bolasie thread. What were we talking about again?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Koeman. Does he have final say on transfers or does walsh? weigh in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 I would imagine Walsh presents possible signings based on his knowledge and Koemans requirements and Koeman has the final say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 I would imagine Walsh, with Koeman and some others having veto power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 18, 2017 Report Share Posted January 18, 2017 Koeman has always said he leaves it to Walsh and co. He would definitely identify the type of player he wants and the Walsh would find a player. I suspect they then have a discussion and make a decision on whether they want him or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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