Mason Holgate

[c1982]

Keane will get a lot of stick, and rightfully so, but Holgate was dire again tonight. When’s Mina back? We’re so bad without him!

[StevO]

1 minute ago, c1982 said:

Keane will get a lot of stick, and rightfully so, but Holgate was dire again tonight. When’s Mina back? We’re so bad without him!

Just plays into trouble all of the time doesn’t he? Second half when he tried to ping a ball from inside of his six yard box to Mykolenko, and just played us into pressure. Typical of his game. 

[c1982]

I did fear 8 or 9 tonight for most of the 2nd half but thankfully Spurs settled for 5.

[MC11]

21 minutes ago, StevO said:

Just plays into trouble all of the time doesn’t he? Second half when he tried to ping a ball from inside of his six yard box to Mykolenko, and just played us into pressure. Typical of his game. 

Absolutely finished at the top level. 
 

At Fault for the 1st and gave the ball away fir the 4th. Utter utter garbage. Please put him out of his misery.

[StevO]

8 minutes ago, MC11 said:

Absolutely finished at the top level. 
 

At Fault for the 1st and gave the ball away fir the 4th. Utter utter garbage. Please put him out of his misery.

Ironically if we go down he’ll be the only centre half who might stay, and probably be the best centre half in the Championship. 

[Btay]

19 minutes ago, MC11 said:

Absolutely finished at the top level. 
 

At Fault for the 1st and gave the ball away fir the 4th. Utter utter garbage. Please put him out of his misery.

Are you talking about Holgate or Keane?

[MC11]

8 minutes ago, Btay said:

Are you talking about Holgate or Keane?

Coleman lol 

[Btay]

6 minutes ago, MC11 said:

Coleman lol 

I think Steve is talking about holgate where you have quoted referring to coleman. Its a cluster fuck but not nearly as bad as our defence

[MC11]

26 minutes ago, Btay said:

I think Steve is talking about holgate where you have quoted referring to coleman. Its a cluster fuck but not nearly as bad as our defence

Yeh I got confused. Thought I was in Coleman thread. 

[Bailey]

I have never seen anything like what I saw from Holgate today. 

Every single goal you can just look at him and question where is he. As an example that first goal, doesnt cover Coleman and doesnt cover the front post. The first Kane goal, Keane gets bullied but why is he yards away from his man, letting him bring the ball down. He should be crunching into that challenge too. The second Kane goal he just ball watches and loses one of the best strikers in the league in a controlled situation. 

I don't want this to sound like a roundabout way to excuse Keane because its not, he was fucking atrocious, but at least he tried to do the right things before he fucked them up royally. Holgate was just in his own little world playing his own little game and just completely all over the shop. 

I do think they were both hung out to dry a bit by Lampard's tactics though. I don't think you could play to their weaknesses any more than we did today.

[Bailey]

https://www.goodisonnews.com/2022/04/02/everton-defender-mason-holgate-makes-embarrassing-relegation-call/

 

I think the headline is a little misleading, however it is a strange comment from Holgate. 

He may as well say, if we win all our remaining games then we will look back and say we were never in a relegation fight. 

We are very much in a relegation scrap and the sooner the players realise it the better!

[Shukes]

All depends on our form from now. If we could turn games in hand to points… then we’re close to top half of the table.

Thats a big if obviously as we haven’t been able to to turn games into points recently. Our saving grace is our home form is improving.

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, Bailey said:

https://www.goodisonnews.com/2022/04/02/everton-defender-mason-holgate-makes-embarrassing-relegation-call/

 

I think the headline is a little misleading, however it is a strange comment from Holgate. 

He may as well say, if we win all our remaining games then we will look back and say we were never in a relegation fight. 

We are very much in a relegation scrap and the sooner the players realise it the better!

That’s the problem to many players have the wrong attitude, they think they are to good to go down, whilst we worry they are not good enough to keep us up. 

[Matt]

That site has quoted lots of things as of late, but always out of context and feels much more of a blog spot than any "reporting".

If at the end of the season we've got those extra 9 points and the current 5 points or so we have now, then it will not look like we were in a relegation fight because we will likely be mid table. But what Holgate also says is concentrating on the here and now to get us out of trouble, indicating that he does understand the danger we're in. But that basic reasoning doesn't get reactions I guess. 

[Hafnia]

Holgate is spewing absolute shite.  “If we win our games in hand”.  That’s the big “if” isn’t it Mason… the arrogance of him.  It’s as if he’s insulted that we are where we are and it’s just because of other teams playing more matches. Wrong!  We are absolutely shite and his attitude personifies the lack of urgency and realisation of where we are heading. 

”if” you could bother your arse doing your job properly in the last game then you would have a semi final at Wembley to look forward to.

Games in hand count for fuck all when you are conceding goals at a rate that see the team wilt in confidence. Points on the board is what matters.

if we do end up safe and one of these fuckers comes out and gives it the “we weren’t worried, we were never in a battle” I will see my arse.  I already am.  These bastards have created a stress among our fan base with their bipolar insipid shitty performances. 
 

embarrassing. 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Hafnia said:

Holgate is spewing absolute shite.  “If we win our games in hand”.  That’s the big “if” isn’t it Mason… the arrogance of him.  It’s as if he’s insulted that we are where we are and it’s just because of other teams playing more matches. Wrong!  We are absolutely shite and his attitude personifies the lack of urgency and realisation of where we are heading. 

”if” you could bother your arse doing your job properly in the last game then you would have a semi final at Wembley to look forward to.

Games in hand count for fuck all when you are conceding goals at a rate that see the team wilt in confidence. Points on the board is what matters.

if we do end up safe and one of these fuckers comes out and gives it the “we weren’t worried, we were never in a battle” I will see my arse.  I already am.  These bastards have created a stress among our fan base with their bipolar insipid shitty performances. 
 

embarrassing. 

Well, yes it is a big IF. But that's what he's getting at. IF we win our games in hand, we'll finish mid-table, but for now we need to focus on the here and now. He's not wrong. 

[Hafnia]

4 minutes ago, Matt said:

Well, yes it is a big IF. But that's what he's getting at. IF we win our games in hand, we'll finish mid-table, but for now we need to focus on the here and now. He's not wrong. 

It’s completely the wrong message and I can’t believe the club put it on its site. well yeah I can believe it actually, our communications insult intelligence. 

He spoke about the Newcastle game being a big boost but they go and do that shit show against palace where many fans were up at 4am travelling down and getting back just before midnight. 
 

To me it reads like a “too good to go down” message.  He has been quoted saying he is aiming for an England call up…… words fail me. I could name 20 centre halves ahead of him.

[Bailey]

8 minutes ago, Matt said:

Well, yes it is a big IF. But that's what he's getting at. IF we win our games in hand, we'll finish mid-table, but for now we need to focus on the here and now. He's not wrong. 

And if we win every game from now we will be more than safe but it doesnt mean we arent in a relegation scrap here and now. 

The "perception" will absolutely be that we were in a relegation fight. That is the absolute reality. To say or suggest otherwise, even at the end of the season, is a complete load of rubbish. 

[Shukes]

Well, if we finish ten points ahead of the relegation zone at the end of the season…then we’re in more of a mid table battle than relegation. 
 

Im 100% sure that the top four teams are still battling to win the premier league, rather than fight for fourth. And I can’t see Leicester telling their players they are in a battle for 8/9th….. because games in hand mean nothing? They will be looking at top six and aiming to win their games in hand and compete.

If we’re not looking up and at those teams above us, then we have more serious problems than players at our club.

[Matt]

33 minutes ago, Bailey said:

And if we win every game from now we will be more than safe but it doesnt mean we arent in a relegation scrap here and now. 

The "perception" will absolutely be that we were in a relegation fight. That is the absolute reality. To say or suggest otherwise, even at the end of the season, is a complete load of rubbish. 

Which is exactly what he says. 

“In the immediate future, however, the complete focus – individually and collectively – is on earning the points to pull us clear of trouble.

“We can look at the table and see the likely impact of winning our games in hand and getting on a positive run: come to the end of the season, the perception would be that we were never really in danger."

So, acknowledges were in immediate trouble, but that if we pull our act together it will look at the end of the season that we werent in trouble, using conditional wording such as "would", "likely". Not "will" or "will be". He acknowledges that the team and team members need to get their collective and individual shit together and if that happens, we could be fine.

Both statements are 100% correct fact. If anything it shows calm maturity but that's not as sensational and easy to lambast. 

I'm not interested in what's led us to this point in my post here, I'm purely looking at what was said. 

[Hafnia]

24 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Well, if we finish ten points ahead of the relegation zone at the end of the season…then we’re in more of a mid table battle than relegation. 
 

Im 100% sure that the top four teams are still battling to win the premier league, rather than fight for fourth. And I can’t see Leicester telling their players they are in a battle for 8/9th….. because games in hand mean nothing? They will be looking at top six and aiming to win their games in hand and compete.

If we’re not looking up and at those teams above us, then we have more serious problems than players at our club.

Shukes, looking up at teams we want to catch in October didn’t do us any good….. we went from European places to relegation threatened whilst thinking the good results would come.

The team need to realise that they are where they are because the league doesn’t lie. We slept walked into the situation we are in whilst players came out giving the shit drivel that Holgate is trying to do. 

[Shukes]

Just now, Hafnia said:

Shukes, looking up at teams we want to catch in October didn’t do us any good….. we went from European places to relegation threatened whilst thinking the good results would come.

The team need to realise that they are where they are because the league doesn’t lie. We slept walked into the situation we are in whilst players came out giving the shit drivel that Holgate is trying to do. 

I’m not talking about his comments mate. Only my own views on where we are. I’m an old school type player.

Team mates used to ask me who we have next week… reply was always the same. Doesn’t matter, they should be worrying about us.

Now I know that is a million miles away from this level and the modern game, but I’m a big believer in you have to trust your own ability. You have to believe you are good enough to beat your next opponents, you have to believe you are good enough to catch the team above you. Win your personal battles, fight for your team mates, fight for every ball.

[Bailey]

5 minutes ago, Matt said:

Which is exactly what he says. 

“In the immediate future, however, the complete focus – individually and collectively – is on earning the points to pull us clear of trouble.

“We can look at the table and see the likely impact of winning our games in hand and getting on a positive run: come to the end of the season, the perception would be that we were never really in danger."

So, acknowledges were in immediate trouble, but that if we pull our act together it will look at the end of the season that we werent in trouble, using conditional wording such as "would", "likely". Not "will" or "will be". He acknowledges that the team and team members need to get their collective and individual shit together and if that happens, we could be fine.

Both statements are 100% correct fact. If anything it shows calm maturity but that's not as sensational and easy to lambast. 

I'm not interested in what's led us to this point in my post here, I'm purely looking at what was said. 

They aren't factually correct IMO. Even if we win every game from now on, the perception will absolutely be that we are/were in a relegation battle. There is no getting away from that. 

If the other teams around us do the same and drag themselves out of trouble that doesn't stop them being in a relegation battle for most of the season.

I do agree that you could look at it a couple of ways. I certainly dont agree with the headline attributed to the article, but I do there is something a little blase about the second part of his response. It wouldn't surprise me if his media training had something to do with it either.

 

[Matt]

3 minutes ago, Bailey said:

They aren't factually correct IMO. Even if we win every game from now on, the perception will absolutely be that we are/were in a relegation battle. There is no getting away from that. 

If the other teams around us do the same and drag themselves out of trouble that doesn't stop them being in a relegation battle for most of the season.

I do agree that you could look at it a couple of ways. I certainly dont agree with the headline attributed to the article, but I do there is something a little blase about the second part of his response. It wouldn't surprise me if his media training had something to do with it either.

 

That's the good thing about facts being correct, it's not open to opinion

If, at the end of the season we finish 12th, for example, someone looking at the table will see a mid-table finish and not what led up to it. That simple really, and that's exactly what he's said. 

[Shukes]

The table never lies. Fact.

If you finish last, your the worst team in the league. Finish top and your the best.

Finish 12th…. Your the 12th best ect ect.

[Hafnia]

Donny ruled out. Holgate in midfield 

[Shukes]

4 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Donny ruled out. Holgate in midfield 

Ffs. But that could be a good thing against their middle maybe?

[Bailey]

1 hour ago, Matt said:

That's the good thing about facts being correct, it's not open to opinion

If, at the end of the season we finish 12th, for example, someone looking at the table will see a mid-table finish and not what led up to it. That simple really, and that's exactly what he's said. 

Ah ok. 

So you think that if someone watched the whole season, saw us somehow finish 12th, will perceive us as not being in a relegation battle?

 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Bailey said:

Ah ok. 

So you think that if someone watched the whole season, saw us somehow finish 12th, will perceive us as not being in a relegation battle?

 

But that's not what he said. 

[Hafnia]

17 minutes ago, Matt said:

But that's not what he said. 

Whichever way you read it - it points to the fact that he thinks if you win the games in hand then don’t look like we are in relegation battle.  It’s like he’s offended by the fact we are in a dogfight. 
 

it’s absolute madness that he is coming out with that shit at this stage of the season. It sends a message that he’s not taking this as seriously as he should. I’ve been watching the game long enough to see how teams like sheff wed, forest etc lost their league status cos their players were like this. 
 

you only need to look at how it’s registered with many fans on twitter and other forums.  The fans need to feel that the players understand the criticality of the situation….. when you see dom stroll round for 70 minutes and Keane make brainless challenges then it doesn’t help.