Matt Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 5 hours ago, hafnia said: And another commentator who fails to see that they too follow the same pattern of behaviour as other forum posters.... because everyone bar myself makes comments and backtracks on the don't they? Like I said to matt.... it's like walking into a bar and a bloke stood there with a pint tries to tell you how often you are in here .... It's a forum.... it's full of fuckin know all's!!!!! I was wondering who was going to join me in the pub analogy. It’s one of your better ones too, but there’s one correction to make... steve and I are always in the bar because we’re helping in running it, along with Romey, under the managers supervision and for the landlord. We’ll join in with the locals, debate/argue with them, have laughs with them and if people get rowdy, try to quieten them down so the others don’t get pissed off with the distractions and leave. I’m honestly curious, which pub-type do you see yourself as? Anyway, cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 21 minutes ago, StevO said: Exactly, Keane should be covering Rashford, leaving Coleman to still pick up his own man. No. At that phase of play he needs to mark the space for the killer pass/clear shot which is 5 yards right off rashford. Remove Keane from that location and it's a certain goal. The same one that Owen scored against man city in last minute for the mancs with the pass from giggs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 3 minutes ago, Matt said: I was wondering who was going to join me in the pub analogy. It’s one of your better ones too, but there’s one correction to make... steve and I are always in the bar because we’re helping in running it, along with Romey, under the managers supervision and for the landlord. We’ll join in with the locals, debate/argue with them, have laughs with them and if people get rowdy, try to quieten them down so the others don’t get pissed off with the distractions and leave. I’m honestly curious, which pub-type do you see yourself as? Anyway, cheers! I'd have said you were doormen.... stood flexing and posturing.... Telling the locals to behave themselves when all they are doing is having a lovely debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 7 minutes ago, hafnia said: I'd have said you were doormen.... stood flexing and posturing.... Telling the locals to behave themselves when all they are doing is having a lovely debate. if it’s a debate, we’ve got no issue. When it descends into bickering, we do. There’s no posturing going on, just doing the role of keeping the place running for everyone. you didn’t answer my question by the way, I am honestly curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 24 minutes ago, hafnia said: No. At that phase of play he needs to mark the space for the killer pass/clear shot which is 5 yards right off rashford. Remove Keane from that location and it's a certain goal. The same one that Owen scored against man city in last minute for the mancs with the pass from giggs Fuck me just hold your hand up. You saw the other angle where Walcott was jogging back you jumped to the wrong conclusions that he was lazy and lost his man. Mark the space. He's a centre back, go mark the centre forward and stay goal side. Only thing Keane done was remove himself from the play. Whenever you defend you hear people shouting grab a man or words to that affect. Make sure you're marking someone because if you're not that means they have a spare man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 5 hours ago, hafnia said: See here.... Coleman shifts to cover ball to rashford which was a prime ball for pogba after zouma had cleared. Walcott absolutely no urgency. You cant see what happens when the ball is up the field to know why the players are where they are but I wouldnt rush to blame Walcott. Everyone looks in a decent position when the cross is put in the box. You wouldnt be unhappy with that shape given how the game has unfolded. Unfortunately for us, Zoumas clearance falls straight to Pogba. Gomes could and probably should have closed Pogba down quicker. Coleman comes across which he should (no communication I can see) and Walcotts eyes never leave the ball. He doesnt have a clue where Martial is but he also doesnt know Coleman has moved across but even if he had, Im still not sure he would have got into position to stop the goal. It would be a bit of guesswork. Upon review I wouldnt therefore really blame anyone. Zouma couldnt do much else about the clearance, Gomes could have got closer to Pogba but it probably wouldnt have made much difference and Walcott could have paid more attention but it happens in a matter of seconds and when you factor in the time to look, process and react the ball would probably have been in the back of the net anyway. Edit: I also dont see how Keane can be getting some flak. There is good space between all of the defenders. If Keane is out of that line there would be a massive space for someone else to move into. Its easy to forget that these things develop in a matter of seconds. StevO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 18 minutes ago, Bailey said: You cant see what happens when the ball is up the field to know why the players are where they are but I wouldnt rush to blame Walcott. Everyone looks in a decent position when the cross is put in the box. You wouldnt be unhappy with that shape given how the game has unfolded. Unfortunately for us, Zoumas clearance falls straight to Pogba. Gomes could and probably should have closed Pogba down quicker. Coleman comes across which he should (no communication I can see) and Walcotts eyes never leave the ball. He doesnt have a clue where Martial is but he also doesnt know Coleman has moved across but even if he had, Im still not sure he would have got into position to stop the goal. It would be a bit of guesswork. Upon review I wouldnt therefore really blame anyone. Zouma couldnt do much else about the clearance, Gomes could have got closer to Pogba but it probably wouldnt have made much difference and Walcott could have paid more attention but it happens in a matter of seconds and when you factor in the time to look, process and react the ball would probably have been in the back of the net anyway. Edit: I also dont see how Keane can be getting some flak. There is good space between all of the defenders. If Keane is out of that line there would be a massive space for someone else to move into. Its easy to forget that these things develop in a matter of seconds. For .me Coleman points at martial to Walcott. I'm gonna leave it at this.... the attack started cos of Walcott.... he should have been busting his arse to get back. He was instead the laziest one in the team. His fault imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 Come on lads, is this really such an important issue that you have to go on and on and people end up losing the will to live? Everyone has a view on the incident, obviously, but it’s all just opinion really. I think Walcott is a major part of why we conceded that goal. Others think it was Coleman to blame. Others think Keane had a role to play. Or Gomes could’ve done more. No one is going to change their mind, but I don’t see why some have to get aggressive about it towards opposing views on it and then do it death. It is what it is, move on. Please. aaron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, StevO said: From that clip Pogba has 20 yards of space all around him, that’s the issue for me. Players with a bit of aggression like McCarthy and Barry wouldn’t leave a hole that size on the edge of the box, to a player who has all kinds of ability. He needs to be under pressure on that ball. We also have a back four against a front three, but we expect a forward to be picking up one of that front three. Yes Walcott is the closest to him, but it shouldn’t even be him, one of the back four should be picking him up. As Rashford has come across the spare centre half should be picking him up, leaving Digne as the spare man in the back four. But I’ve said before and I’ll say again, the reason that ball is in the back of the net is because Martial is a damn good footballer. That post could open up where was Gana when Pogba picked the ball up wasn’t he the man who was watching him during the game. StevO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 4 hours ago, Cornish Steve said: The day we stop being critical of our own players is the day we stop improving. Agreed but there's a difference between criticising plyers and hating on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 He had a poor game he was lazy in covering Coleman at times who himself had a worse game out of the two He's a great player who does a lot of good things and bar the last two games I'd say he's been one of our best players this season but he does need a kick up the arse We conceded a shite pen via a poor decision we lost the game we move on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 hour ago, Matt said: I was wondering who was going to join me in the pub analogy. It’s one of your better ones too, but there’s one correction to make... steve and I are always in the bar because we’re helping in running it, along with Romey, under the managers supervision and for the landlord. We’ll join in with the locals, debate/argue with them, have laughs with them and if people get rowdy, try to quieten them down so the others don’t get pissed off with the distractions and leave. I’m honestly curious, which pub-type do you see yourself as? Anyway, cheers! There are definitely some Cliffs in the room. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 1 minute ago, EFC-Paul said: He had a poor game he was lazy in covering Coleman at times who himself had a worse game out of the two He's a great player who does a lot of good things and bar the last two games I'd say he's been one of our best players this season but he does need a kick up the arse We conceded a shite pen via a poor decision we lost the game we move on You made some good points there for me particularly the points he has been one of our better players this season and he has. Then you go on to mention Coleman who was probably the worst player on the pitch and he has been poor since he got his place back in the team, so to me it’s no coincidence that since Coleman came back Walcotts game has suffered, Coleman is the player who is responsible he has to pick up Martial Kenny would have and when Kenny was there doing a better job than Coleman Walcott wasn’t getting the criticism because the defender was defending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 47 minutes ago, London Blue said: Agreed but there's a difference between criticising plyers and hating on them. Who hates which players? Name them and lets get them banned. No place for hate.... a strong dislike of someone isn'tt good. It's important this place respects footballers who wear the shirt. Name the posters who hate the players? Me personally I love any player who has a great game in an Everton shirt and shows loyalty to the club. It makes me annoyed when they don't. Hates a very negative thing... no place for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 52 minutes ago, Palfy said: You made some good points there for me particularly the points he has been one of our better players this season and he has. Then you go on to mention Coleman who was probably the worst player on the pitch and he has been poor since he got his place back in the team, so to me it’s no coincidence that since Coleman came back Walcotts game has suffered, Coleman is the player who is responsible he has to pick up Martial Kenny would have and when Kenny was there doing a better job than Coleman Walcott wasn’t getting the criticism because the defender was defending. He's been awful Palfy I fully agree and it pains me to say it but the lad looks completely shot at times I'd play Kenny tbh not as quick but his end product is better and positionally although he isn'tt great is better than what Coleman's has been Definitely a position we need to look at adding to in the near future Cornish Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 2 hours ago, hafnia said: For .me Coleman points at martial to Walcott. I'm gonna leave it at this.... the attack started cos of Walcott.... he should have been busting his arse to get back. He was instead the laziest one in the team. His fault imo Which requires Walcott to be looking at Coleman when he does it. He waves his arm about but its far too late. He is quick but not that quick. If this goal starts with Walcott turning over possession and then not getting back in then fair enough but I cant remember how the ball came into Utd possession. Palfy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted October 31, 2018 Report Share Posted October 31, 2018 21 minutes ago, Bailey said: Which requires Walcott to be looking at Coleman when he does it. He waves his arm about but its far too late. He is quick but not that quick. If this goal starts with Walcott turning over possession and then not getting back in then fair enough but I cant remember how the ball came into Utd possession. Watch the first few seconds of the clip Haf put up. You can see Coleman tracking back with Martial keeps turning his head to keep an eye on him but then gets sucked into Rashford. The full back tends to leave a big gap and stay more central if the play is on the opposite side as you have time to get back into position if the other team do switch the ball. But Coleman here has got completely caught out, he's gone too far central (started marking the wrong man) and not noticed Martial had moved away from the sideline into a dangerous position. StevO and Palfy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 57 minutes ago, pete0 said: Watch the first few seconds of the clip Haf put up. You can see Coleman tracking back with Martial keeps turning his head to keep an eye on him but then gets sucked into Rashford. The full back tends to leave a big gap and stay more central if the play is on the opposite side as you have time to get back into position if the other team do switch the ball. But Coleman here has got completely caught out, he's gone too far central (started marking the wrong man) and not noticed Martial had moved away from the sideline into a dangerous position. Correcto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 I have no hate towards Walcott. Just think he is an average footballer and we should aim higher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 11 hours ago, hafnia said: Who hates which players? Name them and lets get them banned. No place for hate.... a strong dislike of someone isn'ttt good. It's important this place respects footballers who wear the shirt. Name the posters who hate the players? Me personally I love any player who has a great game in an Everton shirt and shows loyalty to the club. It makes me annoyed when they don't. Hates a very negative thing... no place for it In regards to Theo I would say you and Markjazzbassist have been hating him, or at least showing a very strong dislike. In my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 49 minutes ago, London Blue said: In regards to Theo I would say you and Markjazzbassist have been hating him, or at least showing a very strong dislike. In my opinion. You strongly need to calibrate your understanding of hate... If your wife or child or soneone you may live with continually leaves dirty plates left out rather than putting them in the dishwasher - and you continually have to tell them to put them away. Does that mean you hate them??? Of course it doesn't. It's a trait that irritates you. It doesn't make you hate them. If they personally offend you, upset you, hurt you - that drives hatred. I probably made the mistake of thinking you were a bit more intelligent than that. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 12 hours ago, EFC-Paul said: He's been awful Palfy I fully agree and it pains me to say it but the lad looks completely shot at times I'd play Kenny tbh not as quick but his end product is better and positionally although he isn'ttt great is better than what Coleman's has been Definitely a position we need to look at adding to in the near future And Kenny will continue to improve. It's no surprise that many top defenders are older: Experience is very important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 10 hours ago, markjazzbassist said: I have no hate towards Walcott. Just think he is an average footballer and we should aim higher. I accept your opinion of Walcott, and can I point out that the your critique of Walcott is word for word the same as I’ve used on summing up Gana, and I believe his performance against Utd showed I was right he looked very average. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 17 hours ago, Matt said: I was wondering who was going to join me in the pub analogy. It’s one of your better ones too, but there’s one correction to make... steve and I are always in the bar because we’re helping in running it, along with Romey, under the managers supervision and for the landlord. We’ll join in with the locals, debate/argue with them, have laughs with them and if people get rowdy, try to quieten them down so the others don’t get pissed off with the distractions and leave. I’m honestly curious, which pub-type do you see yourself as? Anyway, cheers! You just never buy a round! Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 14 hours ago, pete0 said: Watch the first few seconds of the clip Haf put up. You can see Coleman tracking back with Martial keeps turning his head to keep an eye on him but then gets sucked into Rashford. The full back tends to leave a big gap and stay more central if the play is on the opposite side as you have time to get back into position if the other team do switch the ball. But Coleman here has got completely caught out, he's gone too far central (started marking the wrong man) and not noticed Martial had moved away from the sideline into a dangerous position. He has to go inside and cover that space otherwise Rashford has lots of space between him and Keane and then the cross comes in, Rashford nods it in and everyone blames Coleman for not tucking in more. To me he looks dammed it if he does and dammed if he doesnt. You can point fingers of blame in different directions but none of them come close to the fact we were unlucky with how the move developed and then unlucky with Martial putting the ball in the one place Pickford couldnt get to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 8 minutes ago, Bailey said: He has to go inside and cover that space otherwise Rashford has lots of space between him and Keane and then the cross comes in, Rashford nods it in and everyone blames Coleman for not tucking in more. To me he looks dammed it if he does and dammed if he doesnt. You can point fingers of blame in different directions but none of them come close to the fact we were unlucky with how the move developed and then unlucky with Martial putting the ball in the one place Pickford couldnt get to. No luck about it. Keane should pick up Rashford. The midfield Gomes/Gana/Sig/Bernard have been poor in the build up as well not reacting fast enough resulting in Pogba being free. Which makes Walcott one of the last to blame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 How about this. Since it's a team game, they're all to blame? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 1 minute ago, Matt said: How about this. Since it's a team game, they're all to blame? Were would be the fun in that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 1 minute ago, pete0 said: Were would be the fun in that? True, but my eyes and sanity would be grateful... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggytop Posted November 1, 2018 Report Share Posted November 1, 2018 4 minutes ago, Matt said: True, but my eyes and sanity would be grateful... As Pete says, where’s the fun in that. Bottom line for me is, if we had scored like that, we would be creaming our pants, like we did for Siggys goals against Fulham, we didn’t blame any of their defenders fur the goals. Martials strike was excellent, so let’s buy him in Jan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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