Summer Transfer Window

[RuffRob]

1 hour ago, StevO said:

We aren’t even back at square one yet. He’s still trying to get us to square one. 

To get  there he will still need to shift at least five more players on big money. Then he can work on square two. 

https://www.grandoldteam.com/2020/08/11/how-steve-walsh-ruined-everton/

very timely - this is a article that sums up what we had going on at the club before Brands arrived and illustrate the monkey he has on his back since his appointment 2 year ago. The spectre  of the Walsh/Koeman regime still lingers around place like an egg fart.  Might want some tissues handy - as it made me want to cry 

Stevo is bang on right, there is a lot of undoing of bad transfer STILL to be done two years down the line. 

The kind of transfers we are bring in under Brands at the moment are infinitely better than what preceded.  Like I said there is now a philosophy I can get behind, (but 54.6% may chose not to get behind it ) -  and I am prepare to have a little patience with it.  

look at Liverpool since FSG took over - there has been ups and down before their strategy has truly paid dividends in the last couple of year. Even Klopp took them backwards in his first season in charge - I am sure they are glad they had a little patience with the overarching FSG management strategy and then Klopp.  

 

 

[markjazzbassist]

For reference next summer end of contract is Sandro, Walcott, Bolasie, besic, Pennington, And Virginia.  That’s a large chunk of deadwood and wages.  
 

summer 2022 is keane, Gylfi, tosun, delph, Coleman, Kenny, lossl, branthwaite, banigame.  
 

it will take 2 more summers till some of those mistake buys are out of contract (hoping we can somehow sell them before that).  That’s how long of a project and overhaul from Walsh era it is.

[Palfy]

22 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

https://www.grandoldteam.com/2020/08/11/how-steve-walsh-ruined-everton/

very timely - this is a article that sums up what we had going on at the club before Brands arrived and illustrate the monkey he has on his back since his appointment 2 year ago. The spectre  of the Walsh/Koeman regime still lingers around place like an egg fart.  Might want some tissues handy - as it made me want to cry 

Stevo is bang on right, there is a lot of undoing of bad transfer STILL to be done two years down the line. 

The kind of transfers we are bring in under Brands at the moment are infinitely better than what preceded.  Like I said there is now a philosophy I can get behind, (but 54.6% may chose not to get behind it ) -  and I am prepare to have a little patience with it.  

look at Liverpool since FSG took over - there has been ups and down before their strategy has truly paid dividends in the last couple of year. Even Klopp took them backwards in his first season in charge - I am sure they are glad they had a little patience with the overarching FSG management strategy and then Klopp.  

 

 

A good few of those who you mentioned haven’t kicked a ball for us since he arrived, and some are still being picked to play now, whether through choice or not the only person who can truly answer that is Ancelotti. 
Walsh had 2 years at the club and spunked away 250 million or so we are led to believe, he has denied this and quoted that a lot of the players bought whilst he was here were Moshiri’s Kenwright’s and Koeman’s choices and against his advice, he also stated that a couple of his suggestions were turned down by the 3 above and have gone to other clubs and turned into big players, when this article was published nobody from the club denied it was factual, but really that doesn’t matter either way Walsh loses his job a long with Koeman, 2 years later another 250 million spent and Silva loses his job the team finishes lower in both seasons and Brands is held in high esteem by 46.4%

[Bailey]

3 hours ago, AlbanyNYToffee said:

Question/s for those who understand tactics better than me - which should be just about everyone  

What type of player is Carlo targeting for the LM and RM positions?
Does his system always set up with LM more attacking and RM more defensive, or could for instance those roles switch and the LM becomes more defensive and RM becomes more attacking?
Would he prefer both LM and RM to be more attacking, he just set us up that way because our CM is horrid?

I see all these names being linked to us and they are mostly attacking wingers. I'm just trying to get a sense of which are most realistic and most importantly which will fit in Carlo's system.

StevO has covered most things but I would be surprised if Ancelotti wouldn't like to be able to switch the "10" wide man to the right and the more direct wide man to left.

It remains to be seen as to whether we continue with the 442. I'm not really sure it works well enough but with different players in the middle it could be a different story. 

3 hours ago, Palfy said:

Are you and Rob saying you are a cut above the average fan and the 54.6 percent who didn’t agree with you don’t deserve a voice, you can give philosophical answers to questions but they are no substitute for results, and in the 2 years Brands has been here and for hundreds of millions spent that he has presided over we haven’t improved as a team, in fact quite the reverse has happened, you can make a case for every individual player brought in by him to find excuses for the dismal return on our investment to try and justify why it isn’t happening, but there comes a time when you have to accept this ain’t happening, which is sad because we go back to square one but better to realise now after 2 years than in 5.

Not at all. The point is, how many of that 100% actually have a clue about what happens and how man are basing it on what their perception is of his role. Only those inside the club know what he does day to day. 

Its clear that this season has been a massive disappointment but we improved in our first season under his stewardship and I would bet fairly big money that we would have done a lot better this season with either Gana staying or Gbamin not being out for the whole year, especially when that is compounded by Gomes' injury. It would have made a big difference to us because our midfield is that poor without someone with a bit of energy. You can argue that is poor management and I would agree that its a fairly big oversight to not have a back up player with energy in the ranks but then you have 7 midfielders for 3 places (2 since Ancelotti). 

As far as Brands is concerned its fairly clear where our problems lie at the moment. He HAS to sort them out this window. He has improved our defenders, he has added bolstered our striking options and the next thing on his remit is to sort out the middle of the park. I suspect that if he does that, we will look a much better side. Either that or he should be sacked!

 

[Palfy]

6 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

For reference next summer end of contract is Sandro, Walcott, Bolasie, besic, Pennington, And Virginia.  That’s a large chunk of deadwood and wages.  
 

summer 2022 is keane, Gylfi, tosun, delph, Coleman, Kenny, lossl, branthwaite, banigame.  
 

it will take 2 more summers till some of those mistake buys are out of contract (hoping we can somehow sell them before that).  That’s how long of a project and overhaul from Walsh era it is.

I’d love that to be the end and we all live happily ever after, but I can see 3-5 of Brands in takes being the next list of players we can’t rid of, I hope I’m wrong but I fear I’m going to be proven right. 

[markjazzbassist]

54 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I’d love that to be the end and we all live happily ever after, but I can see 3-5 of Brands in takes being the next list of players we can’t rid of, I hope I’m wrong but I fear I’m going to be proven right. 

which ones don't you like that Brands brought in?

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, markjazzbassist said:

which ones don't you like that Brands brought in?

I wouldn’t say I don’t like them as such, but I can see them not meeting the standards required, they are Bernard Delph and Mina, and a I’m 50/50 on Kean and Iwobi, I would like nothing better than them all to fit in, but I believe Ancelotti as seen tried and not been impressed with the majority of players at the club, and we will start to see the buying of players he wants not the owners and director’s. 

[RuffRob]

2 hours ago, Palfy said:

A good few of those who you mentioned haven’t kicked a ball for us since he arrived, and some are still being picked to play now, whether through choice or not the only person who can truly answer that is Ancelotti. 
Walsh had 2 years at the club and spunked away 250 million or so we are led to believe, he has denied this and quoted that a lot of the players bought whilst he was here were Moshiri’s Kenwright’s and Koeman’s choices and against his advice, he also stated that a couple of his suggestions were turned down by the 3 above and have gone to other clubs and turned into big players, when this article was published nobody from the club denied it was factual, but really that doesn’t matter either way Walsh loses his job a long with Koeman, 2 years later another 250 million spent and Silva loses his job the team finishes lower in both seasons and Brands is held in high esteem by 46.4%

That's why I have been trying to call it Walsh/Koeman regime (will won't disagree that Moshiri most likely had a hand in this trying to be the big I am in the first couple of season - not sure this is Kenwrights style - but I don't know) - I personally am not trying to hang the 2016-18 debacle on to single person - it seen to be the over all strategy during that period which was the problem.  It all seemed rudderless - even us fans wonder why on earth we bought Rooney, Gylfi and Klassen - what the fuck!! Yes, £250M or whatever spunked away - and that's the right terminology - did anybody get excited by most of these addition for the money they cost and wages they demanded - it was pretty plane to see at he time we where being mugged off as everybody knew we had come into money - It was all foolhardy. Everybody must have seen us signing Bolasie for £27M and started to rub there hand!, the club didn't help themselves with this statement of intent! 

I would like to think the board have learnt their lesson if they where indeed sticking there beak in to the details of the transfer dealings and got there finger burnt. 

I don't hold Brands in any particular high esteem - I think he has done a decent enough job since he has come in and as I keep saying I can appreciate that there is now a proper plan and strategy in place now, but I can also appreciate that this was always going to take more than 2 years. 

Off the dozen or so signing made since Brands arrival which are the ones that you have the problems with any why? I don't see the money spend in the past two year being 'spunked' away in any shape of form. 

[Palfy]

10 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

That's why I have been trying to call it Walsh/Koeman regime (will won't disagree that Moshiri most likely had a hand in this trying to be the big I am in the first couple of season - not sure this is Kenwrights style - but I don't know) - I personally am not trying to hang the 2016-18 debacle on to single person - it seen to be the over all strategy during that period which was the problem.  It all seemed rudderless - even us fans wonder why on earth we bought Rooney, Gylfi and Klassen - what the fuck!! Yes, £250M or whatever spunked away - and that's the right terminology - did anybody get excited by most of these addition for the money they cost and wages they demanded - it was pretty plane to see at he time we where being mugged off as everybody knew we had come into money - It was all foolhardy. Everybody must have seen us signing Bolasie for £27M and started to rub there hand!, the club didn't help themselves with this statement of intent! 

I would like to think the board have learnt their lesson if they where indeed sticking there beak in to the details of the transfer dealings and got there finger burnt. 

I don't hold Brands in any particular high esteem - I think he has done a decent enough job since he has come in and as I keep saying I can appreciate that there is now a proper plan and strategy in place now, but I can also appreciate that this was always going to take more than 2 years. 

Off the dozen or so signing made since Brands arrival which are the ones that you have the problems with any why? I don't see the money spend in the past two year being 'spunked' away in any shape of form. 

I did post the players I think are not going to make it here above, I didn’t use the terminology of spunked away when referring to Brands spending because there are positives in Richarlison Digne and Gomes, and I hold out hope for Iwobi and Kean, but if Ancelotti gets another striker in then Kean will be further down the pecking order and surplus to requirements. 

[London Blue]

In many ways, and despite the excellent work on the new stadium and re-arranging of the board, the footballing side of the club has been a complete farce for the last couple of years.

So many different managers wanting different players to suit their different playing ideas and styles. The Chairman getting carried away with being a chairman and not being able to say "No" to managers requests for new players, or holding them to account.

But, in appointing Brands, and now Ancelloti we have a experienced manager who knows what it takes to make a successful team and a director of football who has experience of running a successful football club. They need time to clear out the unwanted players, time to bring in new targets.

I am impressed with the signings of Gomes, Gambin, Keane, Richarlison, Digne, Mina

I see the reason behind Sidibe and Delph (although he has been so very very poor), and Bernard.

Iwobi I will reserve judgement on until the end of next season.  

[StevO]

5 hours ago, Palfy said:

That’s a lot of players in and money spent and a lot of players out and we are still not at square one, the mind boggles we do need to get rid of Sandro Tosun Bolassie and Gylfi, but I can’t see them going until their contracts virtually expire or expire, he’s had 2 years to get rid of Sandro and Bolasie just proves nobody wants shit on big wages. 

The four players you mention already have big wages here, and we’re signed before Brands. He can’t be held responsible for no other club wanting to buy our cast offs. Can he?

The majority of players signed in Brands time here probably won’t be the players we’ll be replacing any time soon. They will be the players we build around. 

[Palfy]

32 minutes ago, StevO said:

The four players you mention already have big wages here, and we’re signed before Brands. He can’t be held responsible for no other club wanting to buy our cast offs. Can he?

The majority of players signed in Brands time here probably won’t be the players we’ll be replacing any time soon. They will be the players we build around. 

I haven’t said he’s responsible for those I mentioned, but he was tasked with getting rid of them. 
I really can’t see us building a team around Bernard Delph Mina Kean Iwobi anytime soon, but that’s just my opinion.  

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

I haven’t said he’s responsible for those I mentioned, but he was tasked with getting rid of them. 
I really can’t see us building a team around Bernard Delph Mina Kean Iwobi anytime soon, but that’s just my opinion.  

But to sell anything there has to be someone willing to buy it. If no one wants to buy these players who have nice fat contracts then I don’t see how you can hold that against him. 
If there were clubs knocking on the door and Brands was trying to hardball them into paying more money then I’d understand. But there aren’t clubs out there trying to buy these lads. 
 

Others on here have given enough reasoning to get behind his buys, apart from Delph, so don’t think I need to add to it. 

[London Blue]

8 hours ago, Palfy said:

I haven’t said he’s responsible for those I mentioned, but he was tasked with getting rid of them. 
I really can’t see us building a team around Bernard Delph Mina Kean Iwobi anytime soon, but that’s just my opinion.  

You cant sell what people don't want to buy.

 

[Bill]

4 hours ago, London Blue said:

You cant sell what people don't want to buy.M

 

We bought them.

[Matt]

3 minutes ago, Bill said:

We bought them.

I won’t be surprised to see Southampton come in for Walcott, rumours of Tosun going... things will move eventually, just got to be patient. 

[StevO]

I don’t see the value in selling Walcott. He’s still our best option on the right at the moment. If he’s replaced then fair enough, but I’m more concerned by the midfield. 

[markjazzbassist]

24 minutes ago, StevO said:

I don’t see the value in selling Walcott. He’s still our best option on the right at the moment. If he’s replaced then fair enough, but I’m more concerned by the midfield. 

even if we get a starting RW we need Walcott for backup/rotation.  

[Matt]

59 minutes ago, StevO said:

I don’t see the value in selling Walcott. He’s still our best option on the right at the moment. If he’s replaced then fair enough, but I’m more concerned by the midfield. 

I do. I’d rather put anyone ahead of him and I don’t even mind the lad. 

[markjazzbassist]

20 minutes ago, Matt said:

I do. I’d rather put anyone ahead of him and I don’t even mind the lad. 

i can't believe i'm saying this, i've never rated theo and have always thought it was a bad buy and he's not a good player.  ok got that out the way.  but i do see his value a little as a rotation player.  he stretches the defense and keeps them honest on the break.  DCL richarlison walcott they have to give them all respect on that break.  which means those 2 CB are spread thin.  which gives us an advantage.  iwobi has nowhere near the pace of walcott, he's never a threat on the break, same with bernard.  for this reason alone i see his value.  also he's a half decent crosser of the ball.  he is able to put it in the box.

[Matt]

2 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

i can't believe i'm saying this, i've never rated theo and have always thought it was a bad buy and he's not a good player.  ok got that out the way.  but i do see his value a little as a rotation player.  he stretches the defense and keeps them honest on the break.  DCL richarlison walcott they have to give them all respect on that break.  which means those 2 CB are spread thin.  which gives us an advantage.  iwobi has nowhere near the pace of walcott, he's never a threat on the break, same with bernard.  for this reason alone i see his value.  also he's a half decent crosser of the ball.  he is able to put it in the box.

Absolutely see him as a squad player too. But if the right bid came in, I can see him going with a pat on the back and a thank you 

[Palfy]

5 hours ago, Bill said:

We bought them.

Great point, response please London. 

[Bailey]

5 hours ago, Matt said:

Absolutely see him as a squad player too. But if the right bid came in, I can see him going with a pat on the back and a thank you 

I'd agree with you normally but I can see the value of holding onto him for another year. Then again I think the same about all of our wingers. There isn't enough about them for me to think they cant be replaced and in fairness Walcott is the one who is the oldest and earning the most money.

[London Blue]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Great point, response please London. 

Ok.

Siggy was a Walsh Koeman purchase who on paper looked like a good player who we vastly overpaid for, not only that we gave him wages that would cripple any team who might, just might be interested in signing him.

He could be a good player for a team prepared to build a side around him like Swansea did, but on his wages at the wrong side of 30 who is going to take him?

Cenk - Allardyce purchase. Not a bad idea as we needed a striker and he had done well in the Champs league. But failure with us and Palace plus a serious injury does not make him an attractive purchase. Maybe a Turkish side?

Delph - injury prone veteran midfielder on high wages, a mistake to sign him but I understand the idea that we needed a role-model in midfield. May go to Villa or a promoted side.

Yannick Bolasie - Koeman signing - Awful signing, massive injury, failed at every loan club, in the last year of contract so no chance of anyone coming in for him.

Walcott - High wages, not been a great success, may go to Southampton, if we are lucky and can get a replacement in.

Sandro - Cheap buy but expensive wages, a striker who has literally set records in failing to score in may leagues for many sides. The only person who will take this turkey off our hands is a chairman who has lost a bet or their mind.

All in all the above are not the stuff of dreams for potential suitors, they are the shit mix, expensive risks that very very few teams will take.

 

 

[Palfy]

18 minutes ago, London Blue said:

Ok.

Siggy was a Walsh Koeman purchase who on paper looked like a good player who we vastly overpaid for, not only that we gave him wages that would cripple any team who might, just might be interested in signing him.

He could be a good player for a team prepared to build a side around him like Swansea did, but on his wages at the wrong side of 30 who is going to take him?

Cenk - Allardyce purchase. Not a bad idea as we needed a striker and he had done well in the Champs league. But failure with us and Palace plus a serious injury does not make him an attractive purchase. Maybe a Turkish side?

Delph - injury prone veteran midfielder on high wages, a mistake to sign him but I understand the idea that we needed a role-model in midfield. May go to Villa or a promoted side.

Yannick Bolasie - Koeman signing - Awful signing, massive injury, failed at every loan club, in the last year of contract so no chance of anyone coming in for him.

Walcott - High wages, not been a great success, may go to Southampton, if we are lucky and can get a replacement in.

Sandro - Cheap buy but expensive wages, a striker who has literally set records in failing to score in may leagues for many sides. The only person who will take this turkey off our hands is a chairman who has lost a bet or their mind.

All in all the above are not the stuff of dreams for potential suitors, they are the shit mix, expensive risks that very very few teams will take.

 

 

You have assessed them very well, but the point was you can sell and people will buy, Bills response was we are the proof of that

[Sibdane]

I keep forgetting about Sandro. One of the players I was most excited about. He's the biggest disappointment for me.

[London Blue]

12 minutes ago, Palfy said:

You have assessed them very well, but the point was you can sell and people will buy, Bills response was we are the proof of that

True, but the silly wages we gave them make them very hard to sell on.

Plus Cenk, Sandro, and to an extent Siggy and Bolasie were chances we took to see if they could perform at a higher level, all failed miserably. 

Who is going to take on a failed experiment, especially one on high wages?

[Gwlad]

Sounds like we are a basket case. In my 60s now, seems I'm never going to see anything since 1995 

[Cisk]

1 hour ago, Sibdane said:

I keep forgetting about Sandro. One of the players I was most excited about. He's the biggest disappointment for me.

How bad was he though - do any of us remember? I'm all for giving him some time in preseason again

[London Blue]

19 minutes ago, Cisk said:

How bad was he though - do any of us remember? I'm all for giving him some time in preseason again

2017–	Everton	8	(0)
2018	→ Sevilla (loan)	13	(0)
2018–2019	→ Real Sociedad (loan)	24	(0)
2019–2020	→ Valladolid (loan)	24	(3)

 

Epically bad, we are talking Bret Angel levels of failure.