James Rodríguez

[MikeO]

6 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think you have to always take the full picture. Even for someone whose job is at the other end he does cost us some with the nonexistent defensive effort. If you like I’ll also include giving the ball away in our own half trying to be tricky when it’s not called for. This all sounds like I hate him as a player, I don’t and I’d take him again in a heartbeat, but I get why he couldn’t get on the field for Real Madrid. 

First three seasons at Real he played 111 games and scored 36 goals, final season not so much (unsure why) so I think saying he couldn't get on the pitch is a bit of a stretch.

[Bill]

We are not good enough to carry passengers, if he doesn't pull his weight this season I can see Rafa sending him home, ambling about and giving the ball away won't cut it with Rafa.

 

[MikeO]

9 minutes ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. Never chases back and if Richie was to do that  he would be slaughtered as well.

Can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

How much defending did Jimmy Greaves do? Not what the man's there for.

[Bill]

See the opening sentence in my previous post.

[Palfy]

Well if Benitez has told him he’s not in his plans and he’s as good as some say, selling him for 30-40 million should be very easy and if that was to happen I’d say FairPlay to him and take the money, because regardless of his pros and cons him and Benitez aren’t going to get on. 

[Palfy]

11 minutes ago, MikeO said:

First three seasons at Real he played 111 games and scored 36 goals, final season not so much (unsure why) so I think saying he couldn't get on the pitch is a bit of a stretch.

Didn’t Zadane dislike him. 

[MikeO]

3 minutes ago, Bill said:

See the opening sentence in my previous post.

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

[Romey 1878]

4 minutes ago, MikeO said:

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

As far as I'm concerned, he's (or any attacking player for that matter) only a passenger if he's not creating.

[Palfy]

11 minutes ago, MikeO said:

How much defending did Jimmy Greaves do? Not what the man's there for.

Mike with respect mate for people of our age the game as changed since we were watching Greavesie, I wish it bloody hadn’t but the reality is it has, not losing is more focused on than winning for a majority of teams.  

[Romey 1878]

2 minutes ago, Palfy said:

not losing is more focused on than winning for a majority of teams.  

And for the majority of fans as well by the looks.

[SpartyBlue]

30 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Didn’t Zadane dislike him. 

Do you think he would have disliked him if he was his best option though? His ability is obvious. So are his deficiencies. 

[SpartyBlue]

47 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

You're just ruining my Friday night now, Sparty, stop it .

This isn't a James thing, this is a let our attacking players attack thing. I was the same with Deulofeu when our fans complained that he didn't race back to the edge of his own penalty area to defend with the other 10 players we already had there. I didn't give a shiny shite because his job was at the other end of the pitch.

If we can't afford to have one player with his main job being to make things happen and let him off with doing as much defensively, then that speaks volumes about how shit our actual defensive players are or maybe how low opinions of them are. 

I think it’s always gonna be iffy when you have a one dimensional player. That dimension better be very very good. The issue for me with James is he isn’t a striker or even the sort of winger who spends all his time at the top of the pitch. A lot of the time when he’s lazy with the ball or giving no effort to hinder an opponent it’s in our own half and it’s really hurting us. Gerry would try his tricks and not really get back but it was generally in the attacking third where it didn’t really punish us. This is a tangent but I’d have liked to have him on the squad for us last season down the right. 

[SpartyBlue]

57 minutes ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. He never chases back and if Richie was to do that he would get slaughtered as well.

You can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

I think this is why Richie is probably our best player. He’s not the finished article but he’s productive offensively and actually quite responsible defensively. He’s always working hard. 

[Btay]

I just dont think he can play RW against any half decent team thats going to attack us. If its against a team that will sit back and we have 60/70% possession its not so bad but he isnt going to track his full back.

Play him as the 10, he doesnt need to tackle or throw himself about. If we are set up tactically at all we will have plans and traps set and he just needs to influence those by cutting passing lanes or marking a deep lying CM. Allan/Doucoure/Gbamin/Davies are all industries players who can do the hard yards behind him. James can pick the ball up 30 yards out and make something special happen.

[Palfy]

37 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said:

And for the majority of fans as well by the looks.

Well the majority on here are getting quite used to the minority always being right so there’s no change there. 

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

Last season Holgate was getting slaughtered for  ambling about and not looking bothered ....... Mention the same about James and there's uproar in defence of him.  Haven't seen him make one tackle all the time he's been here, he trots toward the attacker and waves his foot at him and that's it. He never chases back and if Richie was to do that he would get slaughtered as well.

You can't have a separate rule for James when he is as bad as others.

 

Comparing defensive effort of a centre half and a number 10? Makes sense. 
Jesus Christ!

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

As far as I'm concerned, he's (or any attacking player for that matter) only a passenger if he's not creating.

Absolutely! Why don’t we get on the defenders cases for not scoring enough goals? 
As long as James is creating enough chances that’s what he’s on the pitch for. 

[StevO]

1 hour ago, MikeO said:

I'm very happy to carry a "passenger" who's got magic in their boots (not being player specific, just in general), we have nine other outfield players who can do the hard yards. Not going into names but there have been countless luxury players in the game over the years, why can't we have one?

You ask why we can’t have a luxury player? Read this thread. 
 

I wonder if there are Barca forums where they complain about Messi not putting enough tackles in.

[StevO]

53 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think it’s always gonna be iffy when you have a one dimensional player. That dimension better be very very good. The issue for me with James is he isn’t a striker or even the sort of winger who spends all his time at the top of the pitch. A lot of the time when he’s lazy with the ball or giving no effort to hinder an opponent it’s in our own half and it’s really hurting us. Gerry would try his tricks and not really get back but it was generally in the attacking third where it didn’t really punish us. This is a tangent but I’d have liked to have him on the squad for us last season down the right. 

Out of curiosity, how many goals did we concede from James losing possession and trying tricks in his own half?

Ive seen every minute he’s played in an Everton shirt and this has just not been an issue. 

[StevO]

54 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I think this is why Richie is probably our best player. He’s not the finished article but he’s productive offensively and actually quite responsible defensively. He’s always working hard. 

If Richarlison was as good offensively as James, with his work rate, he would be up there with Ronaldo and Hazard. But he’s not. I love Richarlison, he’s very effective but he doesn’t have that magic. 

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

Well the majority on here are getting quite used to the minority always being right so there’s no change there. 

[Palfy]

27 minutes ago, StevO said:

Out of curiosity, how many goals did we concede from James losing possession and trying tricks in his own half?

Ive seen every minute he’s played in an Everton shirt and this has just not been an issue. 

Possibly none but we have seen teams concentrate more men and attacks on his side of the field and take advantage of the the fact he won’t track back to help his RB out, and goals have been conceded in those scenarios, it doesn’t take long for other managers to work out a team’s weakness and exploit it, he did do some decent stuff but he has had no consistency to his game bar not helping out with any form of defence he was very consistent in that approach, I honestly don’t think there’s a team in this league who would take him, I could be wrong and Villa or Wolves may give him a go. I remember many years ago when I was a regular at home games the supporters would turn on players that didn’t work for every ball available, now some seem to be advocating it, strange how times change.  

[Palfy]

18 minutes ago, Matt said:

[Shukes]

I’m lost. Feels like a lot of fans want us to be boring old Everton again. 
We finally get a player that we can truly be excited about in the last third…….. and we don’t want him because he can’t defend!

[Bailey]

I get the comments about James being our best player and that he should just focus on attacking but if Man City, Liverpool, Utd, Chelsea cannot afford to have someone shirking their defensive responsibilities then how can we?

The other point is that when James cant be bothered to chip in, the other side have an overload. It could be wide, it could be in midfield. If they have an overload, it is easier for them to keep the ball. If they have more of the ball, it reduces James' impact as an attacking footballer and exposes his defensive ability. It also means he is more likely to be on the ball in his own half rather than where he can do real damage. 

If we want to get the most out of James, we needs to have lots of the ball and to be able to pin them in their half and sustain regular attacks. If we can do that then start him every game. If we cant, then I think he has to be viewed as an option rather than the first name on the teamsheet.

[Btay]

50 minutes ago, Bailey said:

I get the comments about James being our best player and that he should just focus on attacking but if Man City, Liverpool, Utd, Chelsea cannot afford to have someone shirking their defensive responsibilities then how can we?

The other point is that when James cant be bothered to chip in, the other side have an overload. It could be wide, it could be in midfield. If they have an overload, it is easier for them to keep the ball. If they have more of the ball, it reduces James' impact as an attacking footballer and exposes his defensive ability. It also means he is more likely to be on the ball in his own half rather than where he can do real damage. 

If we want to get the most out of James, we needs to have lots of the ball and to be able to pin them in their half and sustain regular attacks. If we can do that then start him every game. If we cant, then I think he has to be viewed as an option rather than the first name on the teamsheet.

I think it’s as much poor managerial tactics as much as it’s his perceived lack of effort. Remember McGeady when he said he couldn’t believe how every team’s fullbacks were rapid.. the game has evolved that your wide players have to be athletic unless you are going to dominate the ball. 

James does enough for me to play 10 and to contribute to a defensive shape. He doesn’t have to make a single tackle, intercept or anything all game but if he pushes the play to where we tactically want it or closes down the space, passing lane or man he’s been told to then that’s enough.

[Matt]

19 minutes ago, Btay said:

I think it’s as much poor managerial tactics as much as it’s his perceived lack of effort. Remember McGeady when he said he couldn’t believe how every team’s fullbacks were rapid.. the game has evolved that your wide players have to be athletic unless you are going to dominate the ball. 

James does enough for me to play 10 and to contribute to a defensive shape. He doesn’t have to make a single tackle, intercept or anything all game but if he pushes the play to where we tactically want it or closes down the space, passing lane or man he’s been told to then that’s enough.

Completely agree with that. My only complaint about his defensive work is when the RB is missing and he must contribute then. Otherwise I'm happy for him to sit and link up play.

[pete0]

Mad thing is the fans who don't want him were happy with Sigurdsson behind the striker chasing shadows and barely making an interception.

A lot seems to be about his effort levels. He's competitive, he wants to win and he gets stuck in. 

[Bill]

Good morning everybody,  see this thread is still the busiest,  never seen Steve so busy in such a short spell ......  5 posts one after the other quoting 5 different posts. 

I'm leaving this thread now because we all have our different views about James and I don't think anybody will change them.  I just hope that if he plays this season he has a good season and doesn't disappoint us.

[RuffRob]

I would love James here for another season, just to see him proper in front of a rocking Goodison.

He is definitely a 'luxury' player and I can understand why he might not be a lot of managers cup of tea, especially in a league like the Premiership. Maybe Benitez just wants to start as he means to go on, and we have to respect him a bit if James isn't in his plans or he has to compromise his playing style to much, or if getting him off the wage bill allows the signing he wants to come in. I think bringing in an another creative player would be key. 

However, James IS at the club, so it is kind of a shame not to have a good go at getting the best out of him. We don't have players like James on the books very often so it would be a shame not to see him next season.

Like others have said we may not see Gyfi player for a while, if again in a blue shirt. So this area of the pitch would need serious attention if James is not around either.