Rafael Benitez

[AlbanyNYToffee]

52 minutes ago, Matt said:

My only concern for the last few months has been whether he can stop the rot and lift players spirits. Depleted squad and squabbles are valid reasons but do not excuse the absolute lack of will to perform and fight for 90 minutes from what I've seen us play (granted not that much with the visa and house purchase issues). Transfers should give an initial boost but if we don't see a change in attitude then it's not about the squad, it's about the lack of the managers ability to motivate. That's my only concern, and if he can we will do well with him. But I'm not sure he can pick the players up. I hope to be proven wrong. 

While one win in 13 is horrendous by any measure, but throughout this awful run I've been impressed that we don't get down after conceding. From what I remember the Koeman and Marco teams would totally quit. That's encouraging sign that he hasn't lost the dressing room in spite of his seemingly selfish grudge against Digne. 

[AlbanyNYToffee]

15 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

 

Don't get me wrong, no Everton fan has enjoyed the football this past few months, I am guessing its not actually been than much fun for Benitez either with the lack of players available and the real ability of the players we actually have - I would totally be down on him if we are watching 'his' team play, but that's not what we are really getting this past few month is it? I am sure he is as disappointed as we are with the showings we are getting from most of the incumbent players. Has he been able to actually stick the same team out in two consecutive games since he has been here?

Two players who actually shone out in the Brighton game - Gordon and Grey (again).  Gordon looks a different player this season under Benitez and Grey is arguably one of the premier league signings of the season and first name down on our team sheet. The signing look decent enough to me so there are actually positives about the place for those prepared to look. 

I think Benitez deserves a change of a proper run with this team with a fit DCL actually spearheading the attack. DCL is fundamental to this team in its current form and him being out really has been massive. 

 

Completely agree. And I'd add Richarlison. DCL and Richarlison have only started together 3 times (the first 3 matches of the season) in 20 matches so far. In those matches we scored at least 2 goals in every game and won 2 and drew 1. I know we are all quick to react as fans but even into October without DCL we were still ok. Then the watford capitulation happened and we've been horrible since. Until Rafa proves he can't get results with a darn near or fully healthy squad I'm not giving up on him. 

P.S. If i had my choice for manager it would be graham potter but having said that we won 2-0 at brighton so let's not pretend rafa is being totally outclassed. 

[StevO]

48 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

 

Don't get me wrong, no Everton fan has enjoyed the football this past few months, I am guessing its not actually been than much fun for Benitez either with the lack of players available and the real ability of the players we actually have - I would totally be down on him if we are watching 'his' team play, but that's not what we are really getting this past few month is it? I am sure he is as disappointed as we are with the showings we are getting from most of the incumbent players. Has he been able to actually stick the same team out in two consecutive games since he has been here?

Two players who actually shone out in the Brighton game - Gordon and Grey (again).  Gordon looks a different player this season under Benitez and Grey is arguably one of the premier league signings of the season and first name down on our team sheet. The signing look decent enough to me so there are actually positives about the place for those prepared to look. 

I think Benitez deserves a change of a proper run with this team with a fit DCL actually spearheading the attack. DCL is fundamental to this team in its current form and him being out really has been massive. 

 

But they were telling us what a great coach he is and how he improves players, yet we need to wait until he buys 11 new ones. Why isn’t he coaching and improving these players to be better? 
 

Gordon is a young player improving all of the time, he had decent spells last season too, hopefully he continues on this upward trajectory. But it started long before this manager turned up. 
Very happy with Grey, stroke of luck or genius? Not bothered as long as he keeps doing the business. 
 

Hanging everything on DCL seems to be Rafa’s plan anyway, so let’s hope the lad has an amazing second half to the season. As for the most part he’s the only one missing for all of this shite run we’ve been on. 

[StevO]

39 minutes ago, AlbanyNYToffee said:

While one win in 13 is horrendous by any measure, but throughout this awful run I've been impressed that we don't get down after conceding. From what I remember the Koeman and Marco teams would totally quit. That's encouraging sign that he hasn't lost the dressing room in spite of his seemingly selfish grudge against Digne. 

Yeah, its heart warming that while we’re getting beaten every week the players still seem interested. 

[StevO]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/jan/04/rafael-benitez-nathan-patterson-wins-everton-toxicity
 

[MikeO]

On 02/10/2021 at 17:27, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

I thought he set us up brilliantly today, this team again showing so much fight and togetherness which we’ve missed since the days of David Moyes

Surely he is starting to win over the dissenters now? The job he is doing and the way he has us playing given all the injuries and financial restrictions we’ve had is nothing short of remarkable, even more so given the dross that was served up after the millions his predecessors had at their disposal 

How things change, fourth place back then (post Man U), five points from the eleven games since....and those five points taken off Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea

[Palfy]

12 minutes ago, MikeO said:

How things change, fourth place back then (post Man U), five points from the eleven games since....and those five points taken off Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea

Football is like life and as in all walks of life shit happens, it’s happened in mine a few times but it’s how you react to it that changes it. Imagine if we had got rid of Kendall in his first stint his start was poor and people were calling for his head, but the owners stuck by him which gave us the best footballing years of our lives. For myself I’m prepared to give him the time to turn it round and I say that with a bit of fought, I think he is a loyal focused man who knows how to be successful, and given time he will surround himself with the players that share is ideals and show the same passion and loyalty to the club as he doe’s. If the club stands behind him and give him a lot more than half season to implement his plan could be the best move this club has made since the eighties. Sometimes it pays to stick with managers who are their own men like Kendall was and give them the opportunity to turn it round, sadly we can’t ask Kendall what his thoughts were on been given the time to turn it round, but Alex Ferguson would say it works and we know what happened there. And if it doesn’t go right then hey shit happens and he gets sacked and we move on. 

[RuffRob]

35 minutes ago, StevO said:

But they were telling us what a great coach he is and how he improves players, yet we need to wait until he buys 11 new ones. Why isn’t he coaching and improving these players to be better? 
 

Gordon is a young player improving all of the time, he had decent spells last season too, hopefully he continues on this upward trajectory. But it started long before this manager turned up. 
Very happy with Grey, stroke of luck or genius? Not bothered as long as he keeps doing the business. 
 

Hanging everything on DCL seems to be Rafa’s plan anyway, so let’s hope the lad has an amazing second half to the season. As for the most part he’s the only one missing for all of this shite run we’ve been on. 

Difficult to coach those player on the treatment table. and you are also going to find if difficult to develop your teams way of playing while many are missing. He has been fire fighting to a certain extent in last 3 months. You will also get some players who are just plain poor and prone to mistakes, some who don't want to listen and some who are simply past their best, and some just don't have the right assets or mentality, and one even hidden away in a safe house - new players will be needed. Some players are improving, a lot are as bad as they have ever been. In the squad of players he inherited why would your plan A be anything other than getting the most out of DCL?

Gordon had hardly a look in last year under Ancelotti and only managed to play 11 times when sent out on loan with PNE in the championship. He did not have a decent last season and was on no sort of ongoing upwards trajectory.  He looked to be going backward if anything. You will need to be more specific to quantify last years decent spells. So these two players (who highlighted as doing well in the last game) who are improved you simply want to put down to 'luck' and a 'natural development'.

DCL is maybe the only one missing throughout the whole of this bad run of injuries, but plenty of other key players have been missing alongside him at anyone time. A lot of players have been missing on this shite run (nobody can argue there has not been a shite injury run over the period of bad results)  - and this chopping and changing of the team with different players injured is a hindrance in itself. DCL was back against Brighton, but is far from match fit.

I am not even trying to say Benitez is a great manager or is going to get us playing entertaining football. I am just saying its a little harsh righting him off as shite or useless without really seeing what he can do with a squad of fit players and half a dozen of his own signings.

Look at somebody like Artea at Arsenal, they have looked shocking at times and been on horrible runs themselves with a much much higher quality squad - but a couple of year at the helm things are starting to click there, because some time has been allowed. 

To me not giving somebody a fair amount time is not on, and the more we do this them more we deserve to be in the sort of situation we are in.  

[MikeO]

6 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Sometimes it pays to stick with managers who are their own men like Kendall was and give them the opportunity to turn it round, sadly we can’t ask Kendall what his thoughts were on been given the time to turn it round, but Alex Ferguson would say it works and we know what happened there.

Two managers a game away from the sack by all accounts, Mark Robins and Inchy (with Brock assist) to the rescue. Small margins.

[RuffRob]

I may also be a little bias toward Benitez at the moment because so many knob end 'pundits' seem to want their say about him and our club. Some of these media commentators like to try and whip up a frenzy about stuff they are mainly ignorant about. The more I hear many of these pricks try and justify there column space the more I actually want Benitez to turn things around.  

[StevO]

2 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

I may also be a little bias toward Benitez at the moment because so many knob end 'pundits' seem to want their say about him and our club. Some of these media commentators like to try and whip up a frenzy about stuff they are mainly ignorant about. The more I hear many of these pricks try and justify there column space the more I actually want Benitez to turn things around.  

Glad you noticed. And happy to see your bias towards him is to spite the media and not from the actual things you’ve been posting about for the last few months Rob.

[Palfy]

6 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

I may also be a little bias toward Benitez at the moment because so many knob end 'pundits' seem to want their say about him and our club. Some of these media commentators like to try and whip up a frenzy about stuff they are mainly ignorant about. The more I hear many of these pricks try and justify there column space the more I actually want Benitez to turn things around.  

I don’t back Benitez because the pundits don’t I actually believe he’s the right man. Yet I get what you say about about the pundits particularly Carragher, McManaman and Owen who stood on the terraces of Goodison as Evertonian’s yet through the mouth of the media constantly spout their shit when it comes to commenting about us, fucking hate those 3 cunts. 

[RuffRob]

2 minutes ago, StevO said:

Glad you noticed. And happy to see your bias towards him is to spite the media and not from the actual things you’ve been posting about for the last few months Rob.

it's actual a bit more of a bias to a Manager who has only been in charge of a injury ravaged squad for 20 games (Benitez just happens to be that manager). I want the manager to be give a fair crack with a fit squad of players and half dozen purchases of his own choice - I believe everybody should be give a fair chance - half a season with any injury crisis for most of it is not fair.  Like I have said - there have been some positives (like the signings so far) and I am now curious of where this could lead.  

I didn't want he for the very reason he wouldn't be accepted by many and would cause fractions, but I dropped my 'I don't want Benitez hat' the moment he was announced as Everton manager and am willing it to work because he is the Everton Manager and not Benitez.

as an aside modern media f*cks me off so much - not just football. Why the f*ck do I want to know some random uneducated man (or womans) on the streets bias and uninformed opinion on a topic on primetime BBC news. The world is now full of uninformed opinions that are no use to man or beast. The value of informed people opinions or arguments get water down in the bullshit.

Not like Toffeetalk 

[RuffRob]

16 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I don’t back Benitez because the pundits don’t I actually believe he’s the right man. Yet I get what you say about about the pundits particularly Carragher, McManaman and Owen who stood on the terraces of Goodison as Evertonian’s yet through the mouth of the media constantly spout their shit when it comes to commenting about us, fucking hate those 3 cunts. 

and the like off Richard Key, Gabi Abonglahor, Danny Murphy = the list is fooking endless of ill informed people who chuck in their two pence worth. Its getting worse - you go on to newsnow for a bit of news - and all the articles listed are just random media opinions with a load of advert pop ups on them.

[Bailey]

4 hours ago, StevO said:

There are managers out there who can set up a team to be positive and to exploit the opposition. This interview alone has me jealous of Wolves for picking this guy up. He’s got a handful of decent players and a load of average ones. They might not be right up there at the top of the league, but I’d take what they are doing over what’s happening here. 
 

 

Wolves actually have some really poor defenders. Their central midfield is pretty immobile and lacks depth but they do have some real talent up front, when they are fit.

Someone else mentioned it before but they are a very technical side. They can pretty much all play, apart from Traore! 

[Bailey]

If I am completely honest, I am confused by Benitez. 

I expected shit football but its actually been a bit better than I expected in moments. 

As an example Brighton are generally a good defensive side. They were never going to be as good as they were last year but in both games we have created chances against them and we have disrupted them and transitioned quickly. 

The bit I am most disappointed about is that we are getting worse and worse at the back. We are crumbling under too much pressure coming through midfield, systems the defenders aren't comfortable with and generally players looking confused and doubting themselves. 

The two players that have improved are Gray and Gordon. Allan has been better than he was at the end of last season too. He has used Doucoure better than Ancellotti but at the same time he is still the same player. The rest have all gone backwards. 

It remains to be seen how these new lads get on. I think they will need time especially on the training pitch and if Benitez is here still in the summer then we will see how he gets on. 

[Matt]

4 hours ago, AlbanyNYToffee said:

While one win in 13 is horrendous by any measure, but throughout this awful run I've been impressed that we don't get down after conceding. From what I remember the Koeman and Marco teams would totally quit. That's encouraging sign that he hasn't lost the dressing room in spite of his seemingly selfish grudge against Digne. 

Well, yeah. It's better that we fight back after going behind of course. I'm still stuck with the motivating from the outset part though. Shame and anger can drive a team to fight back, but a good manager needs that guile instilled from the kickoff of the game, not after conceding. 

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Bailey said:

Wolves actually have some really poor defenders. Their central midfield is pretty immobile and lacks depth but they do have some real talent up front, when they are fit.

Someone else mentioned it before but they are a very technical side. They can pretty much all play, apart from Traore! 

Yet somehow their manager has made the most of the talent at his disposal. Who’d have thought it. 

[Bill]

I see Duncan's still in the running 6-1.  Rooney 7-2. Never heard of the favourite.

https://www.planetsport.com/soccer/features/rooney-odds-slashed-new-everton-manager-rafa-benitez

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Bill said:

I see Duncan's still in the running 6-1.  Rooney 7-2. Never heard of the favourite.

https://www.planetsport.com/soccer/features/rooney-odds-slashed-new-everton-manager-rafa-benitez

Rooney is doing a great job at Derby. Wouldn’t want him right now, but I’m intrigued to see how he progresses as a manager. 

[MC11]

Genuinely think it’ll be Potter if we do get rid of Benitez.
 

I’m also very intrigued to see what Rooney does this season. Far to early to know if he will be a good match for us. 

[Gwlad]

I don't want to change managers we'll just look even more foolish than we do now.

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Gwlad all over said:

I don't want to change managers we'll just look even more foolish than we do now.

At what point do we look foolish for not changing manager?
Losing at Millwall away in the league?

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

8 hours ago, Bill said:

I see Duncan's still in the running 6-1.  Rooney 7-2. Never heard of the favourite.

https://www.planetsport.com/soccer/features/rooney-odds-slashed-new-everton-manager-rafa-benitez

He is the manager of the Danish national team, been linked a few times recently but no chance of him leaving before the World Cup

[Zoo 2.0]

34 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

He is the manager of the Danish national team, been linked a few times recently but no chance of him leaving before the World Cup

I think he would be a massive gamble when we can't afford to take a massive gamble IMO. Though I do agree that he will likely take Denmark to the World Cup rather than jumping ship elsewhere. 

I think Rooney is quite likely tbh, think it's something Bill would be all over.

[dunlopp9987]

3 hours ago, MC11 said:

Genuinely think it’ll be Potter if we do get rid of Benitez.
 

I’m also very intrigued to see what Rooney does this season. Far to early to know if he will be a good match for us. 

Why on Earth would he leave Brighton to go to a club lower in the table whose boardroom is a clusterfuck?

[MikeO]

1 minute ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Why on Earth would he leave Brighton to go to a club lower in the table whose boardroom is a clusterfuck?

Current circumstances aside we're a massively bigger club than Brighton historically, currently and going forward, even if we got relegated we'd be a bigger job than Brighton.

[Romey 1878]

Potter couldn’t handle the Brighton fans booing, he’d be done in a month here .

[RuffRob]

1 hour ago, MikeO said:

Current circumstances aside we're a massively bigger club than Brighton historically, currently and going forward, even if we got relegated we'd be a bigger job than Brighton.

But we now have the hire and fire interfearing Moshiri factor, the FFP monkey on our back, let alone the compensation cost to move Benitez out the door and pay Brighton off for Potters service. Not sure Everton job is the most appealing at the moment. 

[Aidan]

5 hours ago, MC11 said:

Genuinely think it’ll be Potter if we do get rid of Benitez.
 

I’m also very intrigued to see what Rooney does this season. Far to early to know if he will be a good match for us. 

Like I've said before I wanted him prior to Rafa, but in all honesty why would he want to move to Everton as a project when he's doing a great job at Brighton already and is in the process of building a good team? Other than a big pay cheque of course. If Potter came here he'd have to work with the incompetence that is our board and the poor running of the club will reflect on him, thus likely denting his reputation. Same goes for any manager wanting to come here. Granted our old managers mostly do seem to go on to bigger things for some reason