Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Exactly, also when scoring the first goal to break the deadlock and relax the team. Completely irrational and unthought out "fact". Just as unthought of as "where would we be without his goals".... as if somehow we would have scored far less as a team.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Just as unthought of as "where would we be without his goals".... as if somehow we would have scored far less as a team.... No. One we know the outcome of because it actually happened. The other we have no idea what would have happened because it didn't so we're guessing. Poles apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40545516 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 (edited) No. One we know the outcome of because it actually happened. The other we have no idea what would have happened because it didn't so we're guessing. Poles apart. I'd argue that if he actually pulled his finger out his arse and tried to pretend that the likes of man United, arsenal and Liverpool were wearing a west ham or Sunderland kit in those key end of season games then just 2 or 3 goals and a bit of sweat rather than his 24 goals mainly against cannon fodder would have made a bigger difference. That's just me being highly critical though.... But yes unless people drop the ridiculous "i wouldnt like to think where would we be without his goals" summisation then I will match it with another summisation. As I've said... his goals come at a cost... and that cost is a player who can't hold on to the ball for shit and gives possession back to the other side. Specific example:- dying minutes against man United.... 1 nil up. Lukaku has the ball 2 on 2 and gives it away. United break and get a penalty. Many would argue that Williams handballed it. I would argue that a competent player would not give the ball away 2 on 2 in the final minutes when winning 1 nil. Edited July 8, 2017 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirallas Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Besides the unlikely and downright ridiculous rethoric that Everton would have gotten just as many goals out of some other striker, ignoring the fact no one scored as many goals and on such a consistent basis for EFC since the beginning of the EPL, the fact still stands that he was bought out for twenty something million pounds, and now sold on to ManU for 87 million, more than likely recovering anything he cost the club in the meantime, if all the merchandise didn't do that already. All-round, Lukaku has been one of the biggest blessings to EFC in a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Besides the unlikely and downright ridiculous rethoric that Everton would have gotten just as many goals out of some other striker, ignoring the fact no one scored as many goals and on such a consistent basis for EFC since the beginning of the EPL, the fact still stands that he was bought out for twenty something million pounds, and now sold on to ManU for 87 million, more than likely recovering anything he cost the club in the meantime, if all the merchandise didn't do that already. All-round, Lukaku has been one of the biggest blessings to EFC in a long time. Not as many goals from 'another striker' .... but simply put a striker with different qualities may have led to our team conceding less and scoring as much - not from his own personal ststs. Merchandise? You clearly don't know much about our clubs commercial deal in lukakus time here do you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyblue23 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Also I hope this is true: http://www.teamtalk.com/news/romelu-lukaku-arrested-in-la-after-throwing-huge-party-reports Apparently arrested in LA last week A few hours late with that news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 A few hours late with that news. Time zone difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 What concerns me is that of yet we haven't signed anyone to score us 24 goals next season, I'm not in the camp of we didn't need his goals or game play because we would have been no worse off with out his contributions, now I've heard a lot of rubbish spoken on this site, and I'm as guilty as anyone for spouting shite. But to say that his goals didn't help the team to finish in the position they finished, takes the biscuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 I'd argue that if he actually pulled his finger out his arse and tried to pretend that the likes of man United, arsenal and Liverpool were wearing a west ham or Sunderland kit in those key end of season games then just 2 or 3 goals and a bit of sweat rather than his 24 goals mainly against cannon fodder would have made a bigger difference. That's just me being highly critical though.... But yes unless people drop the ridiculous "i wouldnt like to think where would we be without his goals" summisation then I will match it with another summisation. As I've said... his goals come at a cost... and that cost is a player who can't hold on to the ball for shit and gives possession back to the other side. Specific example:- dying minutes against man United.... 1 nil up. Lukaku has the ball 2 on 2 and gives it away. United break and get a penalty. Many would argue that Williams handballed it. I would argue that a competent player would not give the ball away 2 on 2 in the final minutes when winning 1 nil. As so often you don't address the point made but go off on a tangent, but I suppose that's better than the numerous occasions when you simply ignore a post/stat proving you wrong. Talis vita est. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 What concerns me is that of yet we haven't signed anyone to score us 24 goals next season. We didn't signed him knowing he will score 24 goals 3 years later, as we don't know if Sandro will score us 24 goals, but it's possible. It's uncertain that Lukaku will score 24 goals for United any time soon either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Oh get a grip Pete... he watched the lad take a ball from his own half slalom between 2 city players and clip it over a keeper.... knowing full well he never touched the ball he actually tried to claim it. Something Davies himself confirmed. That's not the hallmark of a striker..that's the hallmark of a selfish prick who syltole bolassie goal earlier in the season. He tried to steal a brilliant first senior goal. He's a tit. I'd expect any striker to do the same. Yes it would have been a shame not to go too Davies, but without that selfishness and hunger a striker won't reach the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 As so often you don't address the point made but go off on a tangent, but I suppose that's better than the numerous occasions when you simply ignore a post/stat proving you wrong. Talis vita est. Your point is that the rationale to take lukakus goals away from the results and apply the net effect is inaccurate due to an inability to apply the difference in minder of the opponents should he not have scored? Yes I get that a game that is 1-0 and Rom doesnt make it 2-0 May see the opponents stick at it... yes... but in the same way that you said... that is how the result stayed. Theorize as much as possible but if he scores a third goal in a 3-1 win are you telling me you would trade that goal for a goal to make it 1-0 in another game? There is various ways of looking at this. Rom is better when the game relies on the other team having to go for it and throw caution to the wind. Which I believe is true. Rom is more likely to score again in a game that he has already scored in... quite true. 6 out of the 18 occasions he scored last season he scored more than once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 I'd expect any striker to do the same. Yes it would have been a shame not to go too Davies, but without that selfishness and hunger a striker won't reach the top. I expect a striker to follow up and make sure - yes. I dont expect a striker to take an air shot at a ball that is already literally over the line.... not only that... knowing full well he never fuckin touched it he tried to lie and say he touched it. No doubt you will try and continue to defend him. Many ex and current pros were pretty annoyed by it ... blassie for one... McBride and Hutchison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Your point is that the rationale to take lukakus goals away from the results and apply the net effect is inaccurate due to an inability to apply the difference in minder of the opponents should he not have scored? Yes I get that a game that is 1-0 and Rom doesnt make it 2-0 May see the opponents stick at it... yes... but in the same way that you said... that is how the result stayed. Theorize as much as possible but if he scores a third goal in a 3-1 win are you telling me you would trade that goal for a goal to make it 1-0 in another game? There is various ways of looking at this. Rom is better when the game relies on the other team having to go for it and throw caution to the wind. Which I believe is true. Rom is more likely to score again in a game that he has already scored in... quite true. 6 out of the 18 occasions he scored last season he scored more than once. Where would we be without Barkleys goals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Your point is that the rationale to take lukakus goals away from the results and apply the net effect is inaccurate due to an inability to apply the difference in minder of the opponents should he not have scored? Yes I get that a game that is 1-0 and Rom doesnt make it 2-0 May see the opponents stick at it... yes... but in the same way that you said... that is how the result stayed. Theorize as much as possible but if he scores a third goal in a 3-1 win are you telling me you would trade that goal for a goal to make it 1-0 in another game? There is various ways of looking at this. Rom is better when the game relies on the other team having to go for it and throw caution to the wind. Which I believe is true. Rom is more likely to score again in a game that he has already scored in... quite true. 6 out of the 18 occasions he scored last season he scored more than once. I'm afraid that post really makes no sense to me at all, fail to see what point you're trying to make . "to apply the difference in minder of the opponents" What? "6 out of the 18 occasions he scored last season he scored more than once" Is that a bad thing? Kane nicked the golden boot off him by doing the same at the end of the season, does that make him shite? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 (edited) I expect a striker to follow up and make sure - yes. I dont expect a striker to take an air shot at a ball that is already literally over the line.... not only that... knowing full well he never fuckin touched it he tried to lie and say he touched it. No doubt you will try and continue to defend him. Many ex and current pros were pretty annoyed by it ... blassie for one... McBride and Hutchison. How many said they would have claimed it? Any top striker from Shearer to Maradona would call for it. Nature of the beast. Edited July 8, 2017 by pete0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 (edited) I'm afraid that post really makes no sense to me at all, fail to see what point you're trying to make . Essentially you are trying to say that if lukaku scored the 5th goal in a 5-0 drubbing that maybe even the 5th goal was the tipping point in preventing a 4-4 draw? Whereas the stats that the echo pulled would essentially say he never changed the result. Lukakus goals won us 9 points all said and done. We could carry this on and say that Joel Robles won us 50 points based on the fact that he never let shots that he saved go in... regardless of how easy they were. Top and bottom of it is lukakus goals in terms of criticality won us 9 points... without them we would have finished 7th. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/talksport.com/football/revealed-one-player-whose-goals-have-won-most-points-their-premier-league-club-season%3Famp This was at march... Edited July 8, 2017 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Essentially you are trying to say that if lukaku scored the 5th goal in a 5-0 drubbing that maybe even the 5th goal was the tipping point in preventing a 4-4 draw? Whereas the stats that the echo pulled would essentially say he never changed the result. Lukakus goals won us 9 points all said and done. We could carry this on and say that Joel Robles won us 50 points based on the fact that he never let shots that he saved go in... regardless of how easy they were. Top and bottom of it is lukakus goals in terms of criticality won us 9 points... without them we would have finished 7th. Not really. See mine and Mike's earlier posts. You have to factor in when it was scored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 How many said they would have claimed it? Any top striker from Shearer to Maradona would call for it. Nature of the beast. Bollocks. He did exactly the same thing to bolassie earlier on in the season.. You can guess what you like... I've never seen shearer do that in all the goals he scored. Maradona is a cheat... but not even he would try and steal a kids stunning first goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Essentially you are trying to say that if lukaku scored the 5th goal in a 5-0 drubbing that maybe even the 5th goal was the tipping point in preventing a 4-4 draw? Whereas the stats that the echo pulled would essentially say he never changed the result. Lukakus goals won us 9 points all said and done. We could carry this on and say that Joel Robles won us 50 points based on the fact that he never let shots that he saved go in... regardless of how easy they were. Top and bottom of it is lukakus goals in terms of criticality won us 9 points... without them we would have finished 7th. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/talksport.com/football/revealed-one-player-whose-goals-have-won-most-points-their-premier-league-club-season%3Famp This was at march... I'm sorry but that's just complete nonsense; you're not willing/able to see it so no further point in debating. Outa here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 I'm sorry but that's just complete nonsense; you're not willing/able to see it so no further point in debating. Outa here. Not really... you are trying to establish a "rule" in terms of what is valid and what isn't. There isn't one. Merely a different way of presenting the data and arguing over its merits. Fact is he scored 24 goals Fact is Goals win games Fact is he scored many goals which were scored at a stage where they didn't impact the result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 No. One we know the outcome of because it actually happened. The other we have no idea what would have happened because it didn't so we're guessing. Poles apart. did you just apply logic to this discussion? More fool you; here be dragons... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Not really... you are trying to establish a "rule" in terms of what is valid and what isn't. There isn't one. Merely a different way of presenting the data and arguing over its merits. Fact is he scored 24 goals Fact is Goals win games Fact is he scored many goals which were scored at a stage where they didn't impact the result. so opening the scoring against Bournemouth (going on to score 4) was irrelevant. Ok. Mike, hold the taxi. I want to get out off the blindhatethatbringswithitittotaldelusion train. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Not really... you are trying to establish a "rule" in terms of what is valid and what isn't. There isn't one. Merely a different way of presenting the data and arguing over its merits. Fact is he scored 24 goals Fact is Goals win games Fact is he scored many goals which were scored at a stage where they didn't impact the result. And you've not distinguished the amount of goals for that final one. Your blasé stat makes out that none of them mattered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 8, 2017 Report Share Posted July 8, 2017 Bollocks. He did exactly the same thing to bolassie earlier on in the season.. You can guess what you like... I've never seen shearer do that in all the goals he scored. Maradona is a cheat... but not even he would try and steal a kids stunning first goal. At the time I'm sure one of Lineker, Shearer, or Wright said they would. Possibly all three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chach Posted July 9, 2017 Report Share Posted July 9, 2017 One word.... POGBA They also smashed the record for Angel Di Maria before that. "Because Man United did it" is not an argument for something being value for money, they are clearly in the business of paying premiums for players because they can and because their fans expect it. My brother who is a Man U fan is trying to see the brightside lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted July 9, 2017 Report Share Posted July 9, 2017 So he hasn't even joined them yet and has already given an interview to ESPN stating how they are the best club, best fans, best history, it has always been his dream (thought that was Chelsea?!). They have the best fans lads...Lukaku says United, who he hadn't even signed for, has the best fans. If that's not enough for those brainwashed by his goals to finally put the nails in his coffin, then....I don't know!!! http://www.espn.co.uk/football/manchester-united/story/3155160/romelu-lukaku-opens-up-about-his-move-to-man-united-jose-mourinho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Romey 1878 Posted July 9, 2017 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted July 9, 2017 As odd as it sounds what is happening with this actually shows how far we've come as a football club. Most of us aren't gutted he's going, it's actually more of a feeling of excitement in wondering how we're going to replace him, how we're going to spend the money he'll bring in. In the past the majority of fans would be sat there worried about what was going to happen next, if we'd replace him at all. But this feels different, it's seen more as opportunity. I'm not going to sit here and say I'm glad he's going because I'm not, I'd much rather we kept a quality goalscorer like him and I've always said that. But I've also always said I'm all about Everton Football Club and I'd sell any player if it makes sense. He doesn't want to be here and we're getting a lot of money in for him, so it makes sense. I won't wish him luck, that would be false because I wish him nothing but abject failure as he's now an enemy. We'll be fine and it's exciting to wonder how we'll make ourselves bigger and better from this. Come on you blues! MikeO, StevO, Sibdane and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gethinO Posted July 9, 2017 Report Share Posted July 9, 2017 As odd as it sounds what is happening with this actually shows how far we've come as a football club. Most of us aren't gutted he's going, it's actually more of a feeling of excitement in wondering how we're going to replace him, how we're going to spend the money he'll bring in. In the past the majority of fans would be sat there worried about what was going to happen next, if we'd replace him at all. But this feels different, it's seen more as opportunity. I'm not going to sit here and say I'm glad he's going because I'm not, I'd much rather we kept a quality goalscorer like him and I've always said that. But I've also always said I'm all about Everton Football Club and I'd sell any player if it makes sense. He doesn't want to be here and we're getting a lot of money in for him, so it makes sense. I won't wish him luck, that would be false because I wish him nothing but abject failure as he's now an enemy. We'll be fine and it's exciting to wonder how we'll make ourselves bigger and better from this. Come on you blues! Well said. Not bothered in the slightest he's leaving. We'll replace him with another quality player. I'm loving this new Everton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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