Kevin Thelwell (Director of Football)

[StevO]

They look like they have a plan and we need to see it through. Consistency at the club would be lovely, hopefully they both get time to be successful. 

[Gwlad]

Walsh, Koeman and fat Sam did not have a plan. Brands looked the part in his well cut suits (maybe style and less substance) but didn't seem to slow down the decline under Silva, Ancelotti and Benitez.

Frank and Thelwell seem to get along well and clearly have been working together judging by our latest recruitment. Let's hope it yields results and the team we all hope for.

[RuffRob]

I think we can say the vast majority of us are impressed by the way Thelwell has gone about our business in this window. 

I think we have brought in a good mix of experience and youthful talent, but all with hunger, leadership qualities and good character. 

I know we would all have liked a striker or signings to happen sooner. However, I think we have ended up with very good signings, and at very good prices. Sounds like we saved £6m on the Gana deal but standing our ground, and would not pay over the odds for Diaz at the 11th hour. We are not the push over club we had developed a reputation of being.

A lot of welcome changes being witnessed in this first window.

[Goodison Glory]

17 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

I think we can say the vast majority of us are impressed by the way Thelwell has gone about our business in this window. 

I think we have brought in a good mix of experience and youthful talent, but all with hunger, leadership qualities and good character. 

I know we would all have liked a striker or signings to happen sooner. However, I think we have ended up with very good signings, and at very good prices. Sounds like we saved £6m on the Gana deal but standing our ground, and would not pay over the odds for Diaz at the 11th hour. We are not the push over club we had developed a reputation of being.

A lot of welcome changes being witnessed in this first window.

The thing that has impressed me the most has been the judicious approach to contracts. We haven't gone "one size fits all" and given everyone a long contract, we have seemingly given contract lengths based on a variety of factors. 

[Hafnia]

Garner seemed to drag on a fair bit which suggests we didn’t just throw money at him. Likely been put on a solid structure and performance related. 
 

Gomes going is huge,  I’m not saying he was disruptive - far from it. But imagine being in finch farm and watching a bloke go through the motions and be happy to sit on the bench for £100k a week.  Stuff like that seeps into the players and creates resentment.  Lampard clearly wants a competitive group of players. 

[Btay]

Wish we had a transfer strategy like this a few years ago. Or even one at all but still. 

[Matt]

5 minutes ago, Btay said:

Wish we had a transfer strategy like this a few years ago. Or even one at all but still. 

Think we did but was completely undermined. Guess we'll see when Brands writes a book.

[badaids]

27 minutes ago, Btay said:

Wish we had a transfer strategy like this a few years ago. Or even one at all but still. 

It was more of a transfer pamphlet really.

[Bailey]

5 hours ago, Hafnia said:

Garner seemed to drag on a fair bit which suggests we didn’t just throw money at him. Likely been put on a solid structure and performance related. 
 

Gomes going is huge,  I’m not saying he was disruptive - far from it. But imagine being in finch farm and watching a bloke go through the motions and be happy to sit on the bench for £100k a week.  Stuff like that seeps into the players and creates resentment.  Lampard clearly wants a competitive group of players. 

Who says he was going through the motions?

The clips we saw of him last season in training showed him to be on it as much as much as anyone else at the training ground.

[Matt]

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

Who says he was going through the motions?

The clips we saw of him last season in training showed him to be on it as much as much as anyone else at the training ground.

Exactly. His confidence and ability to read the game is what's gone off the boil, not his effort and attitude.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/kevin-thelwell-plan-rejuvenate-everton-25811086

[Palfy]

I can't help thinking this article is just full of sound bites and bullshit. 

[Matt]

8 minutes ago, Palfy said:

I can't help thinking this article is just full of sound bites and bullshit. 

From the Echo?! How dare you!

[plaidharper]

6 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/kevin-thelwell-plan-rejuvenate-everton-25811086

Seems like the Echo just makes a similar headline to the Athletic then take out all the good parts of their original article 

https://theathletic.com/4020709/2022/12/22/kevin-thelwell-everton-director-football/?source=emp_shared_article&redirected=1

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, plaidharper said:

Seems like the Echo just makes a similar headline to the Athletic then take out all the good parts of their original article 

https://theathletic.com/4020709/2022/12/22/kevin-thelwell-everton-director-football/?source=emp_shared_article&redirected=1

The Echo mustn't subscribe so don't know all the extra details .

[Billwelshblue]

What baffles me is we bought squad players Maupay, Mcneil and Garner when we needed a number nine who scores goals!

[StevO]

8 hours ago, Billwelshblue said:

What baffles me is we bought squad players Maupay, Mcneil and Garner when we needed a number nine who scores goals!

We did, and still do, need a number nine who scores goals. They aren’t easy to find, let alone get them in the door. But we also needed back up striker too. 
Garner was brought in as a player for the future, he’s young and talented. 
McNeil isn’t a bad player, but also needs a striker to aim for. 

[Btay]

14 hours ago, StevO said:

We did, and still do, need a number nine who scores goals. They aren’t easy to find, let alone get them in the door. But we also needed back up striker too. 
Garner was brought in as a player for the future, he’s young and talented. 
McNeil isn’t a bad player, but also needs a striker to aim for. 

This for me. He isn’t in a patch of good form but there’s a decent enough player in there & the right age to improve.

This has the same feeling as the Gylfi/Giroud partnership we tried to get.

Ill judge Mcneil more when he’s had time to settle & an actual center forward on the pitch.

[Palfy]

18 hours ago, StevO said:

Garner was brought in as a player for the future, he’s young and talented. 

That's not how he sees it or how it was sold to him, in his interview he said he left Utd because of his lack of opportunities and came to Everton for first team football, and Lampard surely isn't after nearly getting relegated last season buying players for the future when he desperately needs players for the now to avoid the disaster of last season. 

[Shukes]

I don’t think the club brought Maupay in as a replacement striker for Dom. He was brought in to supplement Dom. 
 

Ideally we would have liked to have brought in another striker, but that’s not as easy as we presume it is.

Im not sure anyone predicted that Dom would be injured this much.

[StevO]

5 hours ago, Palfy said:

That's not how he sees it or how it was sold to him, in his interview he said he left Utd because of his lack of opportunities and came to Everton for first team football, and Lampard surely isn't after nearly getting relegated last season buying players for the future when he desperately needs players for the now to avoid the disaster of last season. 

The difference is at United he would have got maybe one or two games in the league cup. At Everton he would probably get ten games in the Premier League with a chance to stake a claim to keep his place as he’s probably fourth choice in a three man midfield. At United he’s probably sixth choice in a two man midfield.

Of course he’s buying players for the future, we have to build at the same time as steadying the ship, every football club needs to do both. That doesn’t mean they aren’t good enough for game time now, just that they will be expected to improve along the way. We didn’t do enough building for the future over the last seven years and ended up with an aging squad worth little value and even less quality. 
 

Players like Garner, Onana, Patterson, Gordon, they aren’t the finished article. They are in the team because they have enough ability to make a difference now, but they are nowhere near to fulfilling their potential yet.
Could probably add Godfrey to that after the football he’s missed over the last couple of seasons too. And McNeil as he only turned 23 four weeks ago, but he’s played 150 first team games and seems like he’s been around forever. 
 

If the club isn’t going to build for the future there is no point having a director of football in the first place. 

[Matt]

We need the whole budget going on a quality forward. Don't care if he's 30, we need a target man who can relieve the pressure on the rest of the team by creating an outlet and space. We've not got the luxury to plan for the future in that role, not this window anyway. Screw the sell on argument, we need goals now. 

[Bailey]

I dont think any of our signings were brought in to be bit part players, even from the off. 

Maupay was always coming here to play a chunk of games. Dom's recent injury history suggests he will keep missing time and Maupay wasn't going to move from one bench to another. I suspect the plan was to play more 532 but that got ditched.

Onana was thrown in at the deepend so Lampard had no intention of giving him time. Garner had played at least a year in the Championship, so he was prepared to make the step up too. 

I believe the club bought into these players to expect them to make an impact now, with the potential for them to get better in time. 

[Palfy]

9 hours ago, Matt said:

We need the whole budget going on a quality forward. Don't care if he's 30, we need a target man who can relieve the pressure on the rest of the team by creating an outlet and space. We've not got the luxury to plan for the future in that role, not this window anyway. Screw the sell on argument, we need goals now. 

Surprised Steve agreed with that I thought he would have advocated a couple of players for the future

[Palfy]

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

I dont think any of our signings were brought in to be bit part players, even from the off. 

Maupay was always coming here to play a chunk of games. Dom's recent injury history suggests he will keep missing time and Maupay wasn't going to move from one bench to another. I suspect the plan was to play more 532 but that got ditched.

Onana was thrown in at the deepend so Lampard had no intention of giving him time. Garner had played at least a year in the Championship, so he was prepared to make the step up too. 

I believe the club bought into these players to expect them to make an impact now, with the potential for them to get better in time. 

Of course they did,  McNeil was Richarlison's replacement, Mykolenko and Patterson were brought into play straight away, the players you mentioned were brought into play straightaway, to think they were brought in as players for the future, to be given a few minutes now and then over an extended period is pie in the sky, and typical excuse from those who can't grasp or don't want to real the problems of our transfer dealings, which are bizarre in most cases to say the least. 

[StevO]

13 hours ago, Palfy said:

Surprised Steve agreed with that I thought he would have advocated a couple of players for the future

Idiot.

[Palfy]

37 minutes ago, StevO said:

Idiot.

Cheers mate, you know me so well

[RuffRob]

It's hard enough for some player to come to a new environment and club and hit the ground running, even when you go in to a settled side. Everton are as far away from a settled side as you could get.

On top of all the summer signing, throw both Patterson and Mykolenko in to the mix, along with Lampard and Thelwell as relative newbies to this club. Then is is bound to take some time for everything to 'come together' on the pitch in a consistent manner. It's going to take this season to try and get any sort of stability in first first time. 

This club has had some major surgery and not a sticking plaster. It take time to recover. 

Thelwell, and ALL the summers signings can only really be judges when this side settles a bit more. 

[Bailey]

After watching one of Haf's posts from El Bobble where he was saying that basically everyone at senior level at the club should go, including Thelwell.

My immediate reaction was that it seemed harsh given he has barely been in the post a year despite his average performance in the summer. Its hard to know what he really has control over and what he actually does, therefore its much harder to untangle his role in this compared to say Lampard, where his work (or lack of it) is clear to see on the pitch. 

I thought I would look at the signing of Onana to see if we had learned from past mistakes. Having been a bit part player at Lille, being a young lad who is far from the finished article, I was expecting him to be on middling money compared to the rest of the squad. According to Sportrac and a couple of other sources, he is one of our higher earners at £100k pw! 

The reports are that West Ham pulled the plug on the deal with him because his wage demands were too high however it looks like we have had our pants pulled down yet again. 

I completely understand he may be well worth that money in years to come but he isn't even an average premier league player at the moment. 

Obviously it cannot be verified so it needs to be taken with a pinch of salt but I wondered why he would choose here over London with a club in a far better position (at the start of the season) than us.

[Palfy]

3 hours ago, Bailey said:

After watching one of Haf's posts from El Bobble where he was saying that basically everyone at senior level at the club should go, including Thelwell.

My immediate reaction was that it seemed harsh given he has barely been in the post a year despite his average performance in the summer. Its hard to know what he really has control over and what he actually does, therefore its much harder to untangle his role in this compared to say Lampard, where his work (or lack of it) is clear to see on the pitch. 

I thought I would look at the signing of Onana to see if we had learned from past mistakes. Having been a bit part player at Lille, being a young lad who is far from the finished article, I was expecting him to be on middling money compared to the rest of the squad. According to Sportrac and a couple of other sources, he is one of our higher earners at £100k pw! 

The reports are that West Ham pulled the plug on the deal with him because his wage demands were too high however it looks like we have had our pants pulled down yet again. 

I completely understand he may be well worth that money in years to come but he isn't even an average premier league player at the moment. 

Obviously it cannot be verified so it needs to be taken with a pinch of salt but I wondered why he would choose here over London with a club in a far better position (at the start of the season) than us.

I would also want to know for all the reasons above, why we made him our third most expensive signing after Gylfi and Richarlison, what clown negotiated that deal as a good deal, surely it had to be Thelwell who sat round the table with Onana's team, and Lille representatives. Firstly agreeing a fee of 33.5 million and secondly agreeing Onana's contract. If this would have been Walsh who presided over this deal he would have been slaughtered, why not Thelwell.