Longest Thread For Drivel (or the Romelu Lukaku thread)

[Hafnia]

I genuinely think Naismiths success is coming from the attention Lukaku gets... Credit to Naismith don't get me wrong I've been hugely impressed with him and with out his goals we would be gone ( similar to Cahill a few years back ) however I'm reserving judgement on Rom until Ross is back.. For what ever reason Naismith doesn't attract attention of defenders and Ross does creating space for others. And haf I don't think you can critise Rom relentlessly for poor touch/lay offs when Naismith is really no better..

 

Its not like teams double up on Rom - people are really starting to look for anything remotely positive in order to suppress the real concerns that they should have over the lad.

 

He is not getting special attention - defenders like I said at the end of last year have identified that to nullify his threat you get in tight to him as his poor touch and balance allows you a chance to nick the ball. I have seen examples of this game after game. Williams had him in his pocket as did Wes Morgan for Leicester - they were centre halves. Moreno who is a full back marked him tight and nicked the ball of him numerous times.

 

There really is nothing much that he is contributing to the all round play within the team - I'm afraid if anything attacks are breaking down when the ball gets hit to him.

 

Does it make you feel better about Rom if you compare Naismiths touch to his? It really doesn't for me because Nais even if he does the occassional blooper is mentally strong enough to keep looking, keep working, making the runs, chase lost causes and when that hard work pays off he finds the net. There is a massive difference in hunger between the two, there is a massive difference in attitude and agression. Rom could learn so much from this lad.

[MC11]

I think we all agree that Lukaku is not a technically gifted footballer with his back to goal. In fact he's bordering on terrible. But we have to play to his strengths to get the best out of him and if all he can offer is match winning goals we have to accept that.

 

For me we need creativity for that. The players behind him need to start putting him in front of the sticks with the ball at his feet facing goal.

[MC11]

Haf would you say Lukaku is a quality operator facing goal?

 

Miguel

[Hafnia]

Haf would you say Lukaku is a quality operator facing goal?

 

Miguel

 

Yeah, he is very clinical, he takes his shots nice and early within the area and doesn't allow the keeper to set his feet. I'm not worried about that side of his game. His long shooting is a bit erratic.

 

The problem is that penalty area specialists can be bought alot cheaper than £28m.

[Guest blueboy122]

Good debate going on here.

 

He is only 21 so i am hoping he can develop his game a lot more but at the moment he is looking poor and that is an under statement.

[Bailey]

There is more to his game that just scoring goals though. He does make good runs (look at the ball Baines played to him first half and the one in the second half where he almost split the CB'S from the half way line. His first touch is erratic but he can front up defenders, beat them for pace and strength especially in game where there is room to play.

 

My biggest gripe with him is in congested games where opposition teams can crowd him out. Naismith, Kone, Etoo etc can still find space but Lukaku then needs someone to then do the work for him.

[Bailey]

I think his impact against Krasnodar is being overlooked since the Utd game. He played a huge part in us getting the ball up the field and also in us scoring the goal. He hasn't made the impact he did last year but some of the comments on here overlook some of the positive contributions he has made.

[markjazzbassist]

 

Its not like teams double up on Rom - people are really starting to look for anything remotely positive in order to suppress the real concerns that they should have over the lad.

 

He is not getting special attention - defenders like I said at the end of last year have identified that to nullify his threat you get in tight to him as his poor touch and balance allows you a chance to nick the ball. I have seen examples of this game after game. Williams had him in his pocket as did Wes Morgan for Leicester - they were centre halves. Moreno who is a full back marked him tight and nicked the ball of him numerous times.

 

There really is nothing much that he is contributing to the all round play within the team - I'm afraid if anything attacks are breaking down when the ball gets hit to him.

 

Does it make you feel better about Rom if you compare Naismiths touch to his? It really doesn't for me because Nais even if he does the occassional blooper is mentally strong enough to keep looking, keep working, making the runs, chase lost causes and when that hard work pays off he finds the net. There is a massive difference in hunger between the two, there is a massive difference in attitude and agression. Rom could learn so much from this lad.

 

they all have double teamed him, what games have you been watching? every run down the middle versus man u he had 2 defenders on either side. no special attention, read the sentence before again, he's getting double teamed which is special attention. occasional blooper? he can only pass backwards poor nais, every time we counter and he gets the ball the counter breaks down because he passes back to a CM or CB and we lose the advantage. if he does try to pass forward its to the other team. i love nais just as much as the next guy, but he's a poacher, and that's it. his passing is woeful.

 

if we didn't have Rom pulling the 2 defenders nais wouldn't be getting open as much, simple as that. put chris long in there and nais will suddenly be in a drought.

Edited October 9, 2014 by markjazzbassist

[Hafnia]

 

they all have double teamed him, what games have you been watching? every run down the middle versus man u he had 2 defenders on either side. no special attention, read the sentence before again, he's getting double teamed which is special attention. occasional blooper? he can only pass backwards poor nais, every time we counter and he gets the ball the counter breaks down because he passes back to a CM or CB and we lose the advantage. if he does try to pass forward its to the other team. i love nais just as much as the next guy, but he's a poacher, and that's it. his passing is woeful.

 

if we didn't have Rom pulling the 2 defenders nais wouldn't be getting open as much, simple as that. put chris long in there and nais will suddenly be in a drought.

 

Giving Rom plaudits for making runs is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role!

 

There are always 2 centre halves, if he drops one goes with - he's not doubled up on at all, Its not because its Rom that there is space - it is bog standard centre forward play that a striker moves and makes runs, from there it is up to the team mates to exploit any space. Rom was marked by one player against Man United - McNair.

 

Can you explain why McNair a 19 year old novice had him in his pocket?

[markjazzbassist]

 

Giving Rom plaudits for making runs is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role!

 

There are always 2 centre halves, if he drops one goes with - he's not doubled up on at all, Its not because its Rom that there is space - it is bog standard centre forward play that a striker moves and makes runs, from there it is up to the team mates to exploit any space. Rom was marked by one player against Man United - McNair.

 

Can you explain why McNair a 19 year old novice had him in his pocket?

I agree with your first paragraph. mcnair didn't do anything to "have him in his pocket". Our attack was terrible so he didn't have much to do.

 

Look I get what you say and agree with half of it. But this isn't golf, it's a TEAM sport, you can't blame everything on one person. I agree rom hasn't been great, touch is rough, passing could be better, and could give more effort. No argument there. I just can't dig the it's all his fault thing. We have 4 game changing starters out, it's going to be rough.

 

You're a Brit so this might miss the mark but here goes anyway. Lebron James is one of the best basketball players. When in Cleveland his supporting cast was dire, and he drAgged them to the playoffs every year but once they were up against good teams, they'd simply take him out of the game strategically and watch the bad supporting cast tank it. He goes to Miami with 2 other world class player, bosh and wade. they start winnin championships left and right because you can't eliminate all 3 when only 5 play on the court.

 

This is how it is with rom (in my opinion). We are one dimensional and he gets tactically taken out. Someone else needs to step up to take the target off his back. We don't have Ross and kev and Seamus so it's very easy to neutralize us.

 

This has more to do with Roberto than Rom. since our bench lacks impact players (or they are injured).

Edited October 9, 2014 by markjazzbassist

[Hafnia]

I agree with your first paragraph. mcnair didn't do anything to "have him in his pocket". Our attack was terrible so he didn't have much to do.

 

Look I get what you say and agree with half of it. But this isn't golf, it's a TEAM sport, you can't blame everything on one person. I agree rom hasn't been great, touch is rough, passing could be better, and could give more effort. No argument there. I just can't dig the it's all his fault thing. We have 4 game changing starters out, it's going to be rough.

 

You're a Brit so this might miss the mark but here goes anyway. Lebron James is one of the best basketball players. When in Cleveland his supporting cast was dire, and he drAgged them to the playoffs every year but once they were up against good teams, they'd simply take him out of the game strategically and watch the bad supporting cast tank it. He goes to Miami with 2 other world class player, bosh and wade. they start winnin championships left and right because you can't eliminate all 3 when only 5 play on the court.

 

This is how it is with rom (in my opinion). We are one dimensional and he gets tactically taken out. Someone else needs to step up to take the target off his back. We don't have Ross and kev and Seamus so it's very easy to neutralize us.

 

This has more to do with Roberto than Rom. since our bench lacks impact players (or they are injured).

 

But thats the problem he ain't Lebron James - he's more Kyrie irving. He just ain't that good!

[Shukes]

We need to watch Naismith more closely for one. He can be frustrating as he turns back attires when he doesn't need to...but 50% of the time it's intelligent play to keep the ball.

 

Naismith is also blessed with the ability to find space and split defenders. A defenders best ability when faced with two attackers is to give the attacker two options...one take me on, but I'm also going to keep the pass open for you. This way the attacker is undecided. When the opportunity comes along ypu close it up.

 

The best forwards don't let that happen as they dictate the play...Rat face is a master at it, or was for the reds.

Naismith is good at it but lacks the pace to use it to his best advantage but does a good job.

 

When lukaku learns this he will be extremely dangerous and it will make up for his poor touch.

 

Naismith is no Ranoldinho when it comes to killing a ball, but he's hardly a donkey either.

[Matt]

What game did you watch? Sorry to break it to you but a free signing from the Scottish league is our top striker at the moment. The £28m poster boy is about as much use as mirallas and Barkley at this moment in time.

 

I know you love the marquee name players but really you need to open your eyes to what they are bringing to the party - not what they can bring if and when. Without Naismiths goals this season we would be close to bottom 3.

Probably the one you didn't.

 

Naismith in the United game was absent most of the time, though improved in the second half. That said, he turned up when he needed to. Despite his poor performance in that game, he has been essential to what little progress we have made this season and is one hell of a player when he turns up, which is more often than not if he is playing striker.

 

You've been bloody lucky if you could run on a broken toe a week later. I've broken them more times that I care to count, it is not a dull ache.

[Matt]

There is more to his game that just scoring goals though. He does make good runs (look at the ball Baines played to him first half and the one in the second half where he almost split the CB'S from the half way line. His first touch is erratic but he can front up defenders, beat them for pace and strength especially in game where there is room to play.

 

My biggest gripe with him is in congested games where opposition teams can crowd him out. Naismith, Kone, Etoo etc can still find space but Lukaku then needs someone to then do the work for him.

 

 

Giving Rom plaudits for making runs is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role!

 

There are always 2 centre halves, if he drops one goes with - he's not doubled up on at all, Its not because its Rom that there is space - it is bog standard centre forward play that a striker moves and makes runs, from there it is up to the team mates to exploit any space. Rom was marked by one player against Man United - McNair.

 

Can you explain why McNair a 19 year old novice had him in his pocket?

I've explained this twice; no service, massive workload, Rojo supporting, Rom knackered after 45 mins. It really is that simple. Saying a 19 yr old defender "having a player in his pocket" with those conditions is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role...

[MikeO]

Can you explain why McNair a 19 year old novice had him in his pocket?

 

We had a nineteen year old novice playing centre half last season who had many a top striker in his pocket; maybe McNair's just a decent player?

[JoeQuince]

 

We had a nineteen year old novice playing centre half last season who had many a top striker in his pocket; maybe McNair's just a decent player?

This. And I can't remember who said it elsewhere, but the one time we played something over the top for him, he turned him and almost scored. Then... we never put in another ball like that for the rest of the game. Instead, Roberto pushed Lukaku out wide. I think Lukaku's dry spell has as much to do with Barkley being out as it does with Martinez refusing to respond tactically in way that suits the players we actually have on the pitch.

[Hafnia]

 

I've explained this twice; no service, massive workload, Rojo supporting, Rom knackered after 45 mins. It really is that simple. Saying a 19 yr old defender "having a player in his pocket" with those conditions is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role...

 

Service as in the ball passed to him? I'm pretty sure I seen the ball passed to him on many occassions - I don't expect him to control it and dribble past 5 men and score. I do at least expect him to control it and find a team mate and make a run off the shoulder - that I did not see.

 

Rom is knackered after 45 minutes - why?

 

We can dilute expectations as the season draws on if that suits? Or we can be brutally honest and face the fear of signing a player who may not evolve his game in order to be worth what we paid for him.

[Matt]

 

Service as in the ball passed to him? I'm pretty sure I seen the ball passed to him on many occassions - I don't expect him to control it and dribble past 5 men and score. I do at least expect him to control it and find a team mate and make a run off the shoulder - that I did not see.

 

Rom is knackered after 45 minutes - why?

 

We can dilute expectations as the season draws on if that suits? Or we can be brutally honest and face the fear of signing a player who may not evolve his game in order to be worth what we paid for him.

Hang on, I am talking about the United game because thats what was being discussed. Thought you didn't watch that game?

 

Why is he tired? I will, again, refer you to the answer you seem to be missing:

 

I've explained this twice; no service, massive workload, Rojo supporting, Rom knackered after 45 mins. It really is that simple. Saying a 19 yr old defender "having a player in his pocket" with those conditions is like giving an A-Level student a mark for spelling their name correctly - its part of the role...

Edited October 10, 2014 by Matt

[MC11]

This just keeps going round and round, the same conversations page after page. Where do you want it to go Haf? because we're stuck with him.

 

Things aren't going to change. There is no viable replacement in the short term. We can look at Eto'o but the manager just doesn't see it!

 

The squad is so thin at the moment we've just got to hope that things come good with him. He is a threat.... Other teams don't like to see his name on the sheet. That's beneficial in itself. He'll get the goals and he's the last of our worries atm IMO

[Hafnia]

Hang on, I am talking about the United game because thats what was being discussed. Thought you didn't watch that game?

 

Why is he tired? I will, again, refer you to the answer you seem to be missing:

 

 

Sky plus is awesome.

 

If you are saying he's tired because of how far he ran in the 45 minutes then my question to you is "why is he so unfit and lacking in stamina" - why have we yet to see a full 90 minutes shift from him without looking like he's competing in a race across the sahara desert after 60 minutes?

 

Is it the same reason that WBA kept him as an impact sub?

[Hafnia]

This just keeps going round and round, the same conversations page after page. Where do you want it to go Haf? because we're stuck with him.

 

Things aren't going to change. There is no viable replacement in the short term. We can look at Eto'o but the manager just doesn't see it!

 

The squad is so thin at the moment we've just got to hope that things come good with him. He is a threat.... Other teams don't like to see his name on the sheet. That's beneficial in itself. He'll get the goals and he's the last of our worries atm IMO

 

Where do I want it to go? I want to be able to discuss the issue at large which is that we have a £28m asset who is not performing. For some reason people are trying to find one ray of sunshine to make it all "not so much of a problem".

 

Listen, I put all my chips on Martinez as at last year - if I'm honest I was wrong to do so as he is showing behaviours and weaknesses that I did not expect to see. I'm fine to do that - it doesn't make me an idiot for doing so.

 

It would make me more of an idiot to blatently ignore these issues that have come to light. For some reason people predicted that Lukaku was going to be a "beast" (cos he looked like predator and was a 6ft 4 unit) - he hasn't shown that but for some reason we are meant to appreciate his clever runs, hard work for 45 minutes, or blame the other players for not putting it on a plate for him.

 

Absolute nonsense and an insult anyones intelligence.

 

If you bought a £1000 suit and it didn't fit and you had thrown away the receipt would you walk around telling everyone that it fits lovely just because you have no other option but to wear it? Personally I would keep quiet, get it adjusted and hope it fits afterwards.

[MC11]

 

Where do I want it to go? I want to be able to discuss the issue at large which is that we have a £28m asset who is not performing. For some reason people are trying to find one ray of sunshine to make it all "not so much of a problem".

 

Listen, I put all my chips on Martinez as at last year - if I'm honest I was wrong to do so as he is showing behaviours and weaknesses that I did not expect to see. I'm fine to do that - it doesn't make me an idiot for doing so.

 

It would make me more of an idiot to blatently ignore these issues that have come to light. For some reason people predicted that Lukaku was going to be a "beast" (cos he looked like predator and was a 6ft 4 unit) - he hasn't shown that but for some reason we are meant to appreciate his clever runs, hard work for 45 minutes, or blame the other players for not putting it on a plate for him.

 

Absolute nonsense and an insult anyones intelligence.

 

If you bought a £1000 suit and it didn't fit and you had thrown away the receipt would you walk around telling everyone that it fits lovely just because you have no other option but to wear it? Personally I would keep quiet, get it adjusted and hope it fits afterwards.

Ok, so at least you've admitted that the fault lies majorly with Martinez. A) for spending so much & for not dropping him.

 

Before he signed on loan I wasn't as impressed as other Evertonians. I seen him as a bit of a lump upfront. However over the course of the season I realised he was better than I thought he scores goals and most importantly he can score against the bigger clubs.

 

Not once have I ever thought of him as an amazing footballer though.

 

However, the signing made a big statement of the direction the manager and club were looking to head. It sent a message that Everton were in a strong position financially and we got our man. No longer hoping to penny pinch and hope we could find a temporary replacement.

 

Martinez was addiment he wanted Lukaku and the way I look at it is..... If we hadn't have got him... What questions would us fans be asking now.... The what if's etc etc. the signing was he right thing to do at the time, it made a lot of fans happy and I'm convinced we have a real goalscorer on our books. It will all come together!

Edited October 10, 2014 by MC11

[Hafnia]

Ok, so at least you've admitted that the fault lies majorly with Martinez. A) for spending so much & for not dropping him.

 

Before he signed on loan I wasn't as impressed as other Evertonians. I seen him as a bit of a lump upfront. However over the course of the season I realised he was better than I thought he scores goals and most importantly he can score against the bigger clubs.

 

Not once have I ever thought of him as an amazing footballer though.

 

However, the signing made a big statement of the direction the manager and club were looking to head. It sent a message that Everton were in a strong position financially and we got our man. No longer hoping to penny pinch and hope we could find a temporary replacement.

 

Martinez was addiment he wanted Lukaku and the way I look at it is..... If we hadn't have got him... What questions would us fans be asking now.... The what if's etc etc. the signing was he right thing to do at the time, it made a lot of fans happy and I'm convinced we have a real goalscorer on our books. It will all come together!

I seen the issues that I'm highlighting quite quickly if I'm honest. The same way I identified that when Michael Owens hamstrings had gone then so would the goals.

 

It's all very well saying spending £28m is a statement of intent, but unless you have another £50m to spend on the calibre of players that you are said to be attracting then what's the point?

 

For me I would have gone for Bony as an all round player or welbeck as a cheaper less risk signing. But hey ho.

[Brett Angel]

The worst part and most frustrating part at the moment is is football brain. He signalled for the ball to be played over, when it was he was treading sand and was nowhere near play. Then, understand him wanting to come shorter to get the ball, but I seen him run back twenty yards to ask for a pass off Barry, then passed it straight back to him and ran back into position. This pass was two yards. He baffles me as I don't know what his strengths are anymore and have never seen a player of his physicality get muscled off the ball so much.

[Hafnia]

The worst part and most frustrating part at the moment is is football brain. He signalled for the ball to be played over, when it was he was treading sand and was nowhere near play. Then, understand him wanting to come shorter to get the ball, but I seen him run back twenty yards to ask for a pass off Barry, then passed it straight back to him and ran back into position. This pass was two yards. He baffles me as I don't know what his strengths are anymore and have never seen a player of his physicality get muscled off the ball so much.

He reminds me of a lad who used to play on our team, 6ft 4,.built like a tank. Unbelievable how easy it was to knock him off the ball. Garbage in the air but not bad in front of goal. He had really good games if defenders shit themselves at the sight of him.

 

If they didn't care and got stuck into him he was ineffective.

 

I wouldn't mind seeing long or mcaleny getting game time.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/everton-perfect-says-romelu-lukaku-4421926?

[Shukes]

Imagine if Lukaku starts firing and Ross comes back in the next few weeks. It will feel like we have just brought two new players.

A week off allows me to build my undying optimism again haha!

 

Were gonna explode into life!

[Newty82]

Was he picked for Belgium?

 

Hopefully the international break will benefit him.

 

I've no doubt he'll bang them in at some point. Hopefully his all round game will improve sooner rather than later.

[Romey 1878]

Was he picked for Belgium?

 

Hopefully the international break will benefit him.

 

I've no doubt he'll bang them in at some point. Hopefully his all round game will improve sooner rather than later.

 

Yeah, he came on for the last 20 or so minutes.

[Newty82]

 

Yeah, he came on for the last 20 or so minutes.

Oh ok. Maybe not so much of a break but a bit of time away from the Everton spotlight.