markjazzbassist Posted July 6, 2015 Report Share Posted July 6, 2015 I didn't read it as 20m plus Lennon. I read it as 20m, with Lennon being part of that 20m. Either way, it's a 'No' from me. Ah then it's a no from me. 20m plus a player? A yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUnderToff Posted July 6, 2015 Report Share Posted July 6, 2015 I read it as 20 + Lennon, with it sounding like the cash component is likely to be higher. At 25+ & Lennon, I can't see how you could say no. Particularly if he's unhappy Early enough in the period to turn that into several high quality players on the Market. Although we could already cover, that could Include targeting a number of quality/promising CDM's either on permanent or loan (Lucas Silva & Casemiro come to mind as loans). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUnderToff Posted July 6, 2015 Report Share Posted July 6, 2015 Just to add, I'm not saying that's the offer. Just where I couldn't resist. 20 & Lennon, would probably take it. 20 including Lennon...hold out for more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeQuince Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Okay. So, we know nothing about McCarthy actually being unhappy. There haven't been any quotes from him or his agent. All that's been made is gossip in the papers. Whether he wants away or not, McCarthy is worth significantly more than £20m+ Lennon. He's a player we don't need to sell, and he doesn't seem like the type of player to default on their contract in order to go somewhere else. He's 24 and has 3 years on his contract. He's the most vital player in our squad, and in all likelihood he looks to be our future captain. We will scoff at anything less than £50m, I'm sure. If they actually do put in a lowball bid like that, you can expect Roberto to make another remark along the lines of what he's said in the past regarding Baines and Barkley. In addition, we have already signed two players who have played as wingers under Martinez this summer. We aren't desperate for Aaron Lennon, and that much should be clear. We can have him for free in a year's time. If we want him, I'm sure he knows it. If he wants to come to us, Levy can deal with that how he sees fit. He could sell him to a club he doesn't want to join, or he can stay at Tottenham and collect a paycheck under a manager who doesn't care to play him. Levy doesn't have the upper hand here in the least bit. Anyhow, McCarthy isn't going unless it's for silly money. I would be shocked if this turned out any other way. chicagoblue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Just to add, I'm not saying that's the offer. Just where I couldn't resist. 20 & Lennon, would probably take it. 20 including Lennon...hold out for more. How much would you have to pay for a player with McCarthy's abilities to replace him? More than £20 million I bet. Besides Lennon is in the last year of his contract I think so his value is diminishing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Remember I got slated on here for saying we should sell baines to fund mccarthy's move and build the team round him instead (witth the added bonus of blooding garbutt in). He was worth double what we paid, don't know what that works out in new TV deal money, but he is certainly the first name on the team sheet and not worth selling to a similar league position wise club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) How much would you have to pay for a player with McCarthy's abilities to replace him? More than £20 million I bet. Besides Lennon is in the last year of his contract I think so his value is diminishing. You don't need to replace him like for like. Play like barca with busquets who is a hybrid destroyer/passer. The old McCarthy style solo destroyer is Great but I would like to see a more attack minded approach. Already have Gareth Barry and Besic who can defend and make a tackle, would be nice to see a centre mid that links up play and can distribute. I'm not sold on the 4231, would love to see 4141 attack mode or 352. 2 defensive centre mids is too much for me. Edited July 7, 2015 by markjazzbassist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deacs Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 You don't need to replace him like for like. Play like barca with busquets who is a hybrid destroyer/passer. The old McCarthy style solo destroyer is Great but I would like to see a more attack minded approach. Already have Gareth Barry and Besic who can defend and make a tackle, would be nice to see a centre mid that links up play and can distribute. I'm not sold on the 4231, would love to see 4141 attack mode or 352. 2 defensive centre mids is too much for me. Who would you play as the holding player in front of the 4 in a 4141? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeQuince Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 You don't need to replace him like for like. Play like barca with busquets who is a hybrid destroyer/passer. The old McCarthy style solo destroyer is Great but I would like to see a more attack minded approach. Already have Gareth Barry and Besic who can defend and make a tackle, would be nice to see a centre mid that links up play and can distribute. I'm not sold on the 4231, would love to see 4141 attack mode or 352. 2 defensive centre mids is too much for me. I think you're grossly misrepresenting what McCarthy brings to the table. Also, I think you're being a bit simplistic about our formation. Yes, we set up as a "4-2-3-1". But, this formation shifts situationally. When we are attacking, we become a 3-4-3 of sorts. Barry or McCarthy stay deep in between the CBs, while Baines, Coleman and whichever of the two CDMs doesn't stay home venture further forward. Having two CDMs who are versatile in that they can cover defensively, move the ball intelligently and make plays further up the pitch, means that they can rotate in these duties and we can always have one of them fresh to go forward and help the attack. Having two CDMs also allows us to move the ball out of the back with more ease, which is crucial to our style of play. If we had only one sitter in a "4-1-4-1" then Baines, Coleman, Barkley, and whoever else would be playing further up would have more defensive responsibilities, which would negatively impact our attacking play. Otherwise, our single sitter would have to cover the space that our two CDMs cover now (which is already an ass ton of space). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) I think you're grossly misrepresenting what McCarthy brings to the table. Also, I think you're being a bit simplistic about our formation. Yes, we set up as a "4-2-3-1". But, this formation shifts situationally. When we are attacking, we become a 3-4-3 of sorts. Barry or McCarthy stay deep in between the CBs, while Baines, Coleman and whichever of the two CDMs doesn't stay home venture further forward. Having two CDMs who are versatile in that they can cover defensively, move the ball intelligently and make plays further up the pitch, means that they can rotate in these duties and we can always have one of them fresh to go forward and help the attack. Having two CDMs also allows us to move the ball out of the back with more ease, which is crucial to our style of play. If we had only one sitter in a "4-1-4-1" then Baines, Coleman, Barkley, and whoever else would be playing further up would have more defensive responsibilities, which would negatively impact our attacking play. Otherwise, our single sitter would have to cover the space that our two CDMs cover now (which is already an ass ton of space). Negatively impact our attacking play? We didn't have any! We were terrible on the attack, we pass around slowly, move to the box pass and turn over. Barry and McCarthy did little to nothing offensively. Hence rid of them or change formation. Why is everyone so worried about defense? Arsenal play one holding mid (used to be arteta now coquelin?) and their fullbacks bomb and they have no issues. Barca has busquets that's it, rakitic moves the ball forward with iniesta, they are both advanced and their fullbacks attack. Man city had one holding mid, Fernandinho, yaya doesn't defend, he just attacks. If you have a good enough holding mid you don't need 2. And in the case of busquets he even advances the ball not sideways McCarthy passes! I like McCarthy great engine and tackle, I'd rather we sold Barry and morphed McCarthy, but that won't happen. Edited July 7, 2015 by markjazzbassist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Simply NO from me. We need to keep McCarthy so Spurs (of all teams) can fuck right off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainbeaker Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 With Man U and Arsenal interested, he'll prefer a move to them anyway and the price would get nearer to £30million, with the signings of Gerard D and Cleverley signing Lennon is not a must anymore so he won't be a trump card anymore just a bonus. Does anyone else feel it may be worth trying Barkley a bit deep in the McCarthy role he, he's more than capable of doing it and it would get him on the ball more and making runs from deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Simply NO from me. We need to keep McCarthy so Spurs (of all teams) can fuck right off. I agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 McCarthy part of any deal is a no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) McCarthy part of any deal is a no. Depends if it included Eriksen, Loris and Lennon. Then i'd consider it Edited July 7, 2015 by tenaciousj markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 How about we take Lennon off them. He wants to come here so we offer them a reasonable price with a take it or leave it option. If they try and play hard ball walk away and tell Lennon if he waits until next season and signs on a free we'll give him half the fee we were prepared to pay this year as a bonus for waiting. Fuck Levy and his hard line tactics. He has a player in the final year of his contract. The player and us hold all the cards here. If he's stupid enough to be stubborn and refuse our offer then he's a knob and loses x millions of pounds. Moffer 4 mil all up front and get the lad in. markjazzbassist, MikeO and Quinn31 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markjazzbassist Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 How about we take Lennon off them. He wants to come here so we offer them a reasonable price with a take it or leave it option. If they try and play hard ball walk away and tell Lennon if he waits until next season and signs on a free we'll give him half the fee we were prepared to pay this year as a bonus for waiting. Fuck Levy and his hard line tactics. He has a player in the final year of his contract. The player and us hold all the cards here. If he's stupid enough to be stubborn and refuse our offer then he's a knob and loses x millions of pounds. Moffer 4 mil all up front and get the lad in. spot on. if he wants to hard ball we should too. with gerry now, we don't "need" lennon, so we have the leverage. levy is a hard headed fella though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinn31 Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I wouldn't sell McCarthy to anyone unless stupid money is offered for him (20m+). I would love to bring back Lennon though if McGeady can be shipped out. Hell, I'd love to move Pienaar out the door as well (not because he can't still be effective, but he's never fit and is certainly on a veteran player's wages). Lennon isn't a worldbeater, but he's an effective winger who has been able to make far more of an impact than McGeady and is fit far more often than Pienaar. With one year left on his contract, I think a 2-3m pricetag is fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I wouldn't sell McCarthy to anyone unless stupid money is offered for him (20m+). I would love to bring back Lennon though if McGeady can be shipped out. Hell, I'd love to move Pienaar out the door as well (not because he can't still be effective, but he's never fit and is certainly on a veteran player's wages). Lennon isn't a worldbeater, but he's an effective winger who has been able to make far more of an impact than McGeady and is fit far more often than Pienaar. With one year left on his contract, I think a 2-3m pricetag is fair. Lennon is the industrious, defensive type winger who balances the team. He's pivotal for the team's overall balance and style. In a team, you hope for an industrious and skillful player on either side (including the fullbacks). Winger that is a creative, flair player. You need a defensive fullback. The winger that's the industrious type, will allow you to have a more forward roaming fullback (Coleman). Our problem over the years is having Baines and Mirallas on the side side. Both want to get forward and when they are, it only takes a misplaced pass to the opposition, to give them the space behind where the fullback has been, to really open us up. It's why Pienaar worked soo much better with Baines, because 'nuts had the stamina and defensive desire to make up for Baines's forward runs. Quinn31 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Lennon is the industrious, defensive type winger who balances the team. He's pivotal for the team's overall balance and style. In a team, you hope for an industrious and skillful player on either side (including the fullbacks). Winger that is a creative, flair player. You need a defensive fullback. The winger that's the industrious type, will allow you to have a more forward roaming fullback (Coleman). Our problem over the years is having Baines and Mirallas on the side side. Both want to get forward and when they are, it only takes a misplaced pass to the opposition, to give them the space behind where the fullback has been, to really open us up. It's why Pienaar worked soo much better with Baines, because 'nuts had the stamina and defensive desire to make up for Baines's forward runs. Bingo. This is exactly why I'm confused about the noise for another creative winger or any winger at all really. However Lennon gives us width and helps get the best out of our FB. Plus, he causes no end of trouble for the opposition with his determination and speed. 1 last thought... If we got him in for say 5m - thats 3 quality additions for under 10m quid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowensda Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Bingo. This is exactly why I'm confused about the noise for another creative winger or any winger at all really. However Lennon gives us width and helps get the best out of our FB. Plus, he causes no end of trouble for the opposition with his determination and speed. 1 last thought... If we got him in for say 5m - thats 3 quality additions for under 10m quid Błaszczykowski would have been perfect a couple of years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 I'm fully with Ten and Matt here. He's also minimal risk, we know he fits in with the other players. Doesn't cause trouble and we could get three very good years out of him for little cost in comparison to some of the prices this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) As I said on last page, offer £4-5m. McCarthy is a no go. Hardly a deal breaker he can sign for £0 next year. Great lad and for me rescued us Last season. Edited July 7, 2015 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted July 7, 2015 Report Share Posted July 7, 2015 Błaszczykowski would have been perfect a couple of years ago. You're just showing off that you know how to spell his name. (I used to have a colleague with a very similar Polish name. He was so fed up with being asked how it's spelt that he would always make reservations under the name 'West'. I was with him once when he made a reservation at a Chinese restaurant. "The name's West." "Can you spell that for me, sir?" We ate Indian food that evening.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oztoffee Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 Gone real quiet about Lennon. Is the deal with Spurs/Mirallas gonna happen? Or could we get him for a reasonable fee without another deal? Wot Ya Think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 (edited) I reckon, as I've mentioned before, we won't here about any deal until TDD. That goes for Lennon and every other "target". Think we'll get Lennon for 2m in January personally. The only story that's going to continue is the Stones nonsense, with JM trying his best to destabilise the kid. Well keep him though. Edited July 22, 2015 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 Gone real quiet about Lennon. Is the deal with Spurs/Mirallas gonna happen? Or could we get him for a reasonable fee without another deal? Wot Ya Think? I'm hoping that it means Martinez is seeing it the way I am; that we're looking at better than Lennon and he'll be a fall back option if we can't bring in someone else. Lowensda and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 For me he is a player that "every side" needs. There have been times when I watched Man United play Park, times when Liverpool played Kuyt, times when Man City played milner etc etc He is a better option than these players who were used for their positional discipline, work rate and defensive capabilities against side with strong full backs and wingers. As Baines said, he infects the other players with his industry and shames them into a high work rate. His pace stops the opposition pushing out and he has more quality than he is given credit for. I would not be disappointed to see us spend £5m on him. I know we need a number 10 but if we get him in and keep Mirallas and have Gerry then I would be happy with that. Matt, Lowensda and Quinn31 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinn31 Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 For me he is a player that "every side" needs. There have been times when I watched Man United play Park, times when Liverpool played Kuyt, times when Man City played milner etc etc He is a better option than these players who were used for their positional discipline, work rate and defensive capabilities against side with strong full backs and wingers. As Baines said, he infects the other players with his industry and shames them into a high work rate. His pace stops the opposition pushing out and he has more quality than he is given credit for. I would not be disappointed to see us spend £5m on him. I know we need a number 10 but if we get him in and keep Mirallas and have Gerry then I would be happy with that. Gerry, Lennon, and Mirallas would be a proper set of wingers. Would love to bring in Adama Traore too and move McGeady on and hopefully not have to play Cleverley, Osman, or Naismith out wide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finn balor Posted July 22, 2015 Report Share Posted July 22, 2015 I think Lennon is a bargain for £5 million. Especially away from home with his work rate, if we could get rid of mcgeady too that would be all the better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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