Qualifying for Europe

[Shukes]

10 hours ago, MikeO said:

My brain is telling me that it's presented when you win it, but it's a 61 year old organ so I'd not rely on it in all honesty.

Depends when you win it.

if you win with games spare they try to organise it for your next home match. 
If it’s the last match of the season, or your last home match they have it on site just in case.

Remember a few seasons ago it went to the last match, they had a helicopter on stand by to take it to the winning venue. I think it had to do a loop the loop between the two Manchester teams!

[Romey 1878]

2 hours ago, Shukes said:

if you win with games spare they try to organise it for your next home match. 

I'm not sure that's right. Remember when United lifted the trophy at Goodison? I don't recall that being the last game of the season, but I could be wrong.

[Zoo 2.0]

4 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

I'm not sure that's right. Remember when United lifted the trophy at Goodison? I don't recall that being the last game of the season, but I could be wrong.

Indeed, it's awarded when the league has been won. Hence why United lifted it at Goodison despite having a home game the week after.

Edit: On reflection, the above might be bollocks . Actually do remember that RVN penalty though, one of the worst dives I've ever seen.

[pete0]

3 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

I'm not sure that's right. Remember when United lifted the trophy at Goodison? I don't recall that being the last game of the season, but I could be wrong.

It was last game of the season and the referee absolutely robbed us that day to make sure we didn't rain on their parade. 

Beckham scored a freekick that never should have been given. And they were given a pen for the winner, can't remember if it was a foul outside the box or a dive, but it was never a pen.

Edit:

Everton succumbed to controversy. Ruud van Nistelrooy lost his footing and crumpled under vague challenge from Stubbs 11 minutes from time and Mike Riley awarded the seventh penalty he has given United this season.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2003/may/12/match.everton

[Romey 1878]

2 hours ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Indeed, it's awarded when the league has been won. Hence why United lifted it at Goodison despite having a home game the week after.

 

20 minutes ago, pete0 said:

It was last game of the season and the referee absolutely robbed us that day to make sure we didn't rain on their parade. 

Beckham scored a freekick that never should have been given. And they were given a pen for the winner, can't remember if it was a foul outside the box or a dive, but it was never a pen.

Edit:

Everton succumbed to controversy. Ruud van Nistelrooy lost his footing and crumpled under vague challenge from Stubbs 11 minutes from time and Mike Riley awarded the seventh penalty he has given United this season.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/football/2003/may/12/match.everton

Which one is it then?  

[Shukes]

Haha I’m more confused now.

[StevO]

With them having fans in the ground for just one game it would be ridiculous for them to get the trophy any other day. 
But no doubt the premier league will mess that up. 

[Bailey]

On 08/05/2021 at 09:10, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

I think European football, in whatever guise, is an essential step in our development plus it’s another shot at a trophy so I personally couldn’t give a toss how cold it is if it means we end our 26 year trophy drought

We will hopefully add 2 or 3 quality players to the starting XI in the summer so that coupled with the good crop of youngsters we have coming through means the squad should be more than ready to compete in what is Europe’s third tier competition

I thought this was interesting from you as you are very much all about playing your best side and trying to win these trophies.

I always think it is a waste to spend all season trying to get into these competitions only to play the reserves or kids when the games come around. The only problem is something has to give as well and some element of rotation is needed. I think inevitably we will have to prioritise some competitions at some stage.

On 08/05/2021 at 10:16, Shukes said:

I feel the same, even if we just use it to send a team of fringe players for experience. 

And if we fail spectacularly, then it’s another pointer to just how far behind we are.

You say that but a lot of decent sides have fallen out of these comps by playing weakened teams, or have lost games by playing weakened teams at the weekend.

As above, its a really difficult balance and it will be a big struggle for us next season. I don't think it should be underestimated how hard it has been for the sides in Europe this season because of Covid, especially the ones that have gone far in the domestic competitions as well. What City have achieved this season, is as good as they have ever been even if they don't have as many points on the board as they have done.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

2 hours ago, Bailey said:

I thought this was interesting from you as you are very much all about playing your best side and trying to win these trophies.

I always think it is a waste to spend all season trying to get into these competitions only to play the reserves or kids when the games come around. The only problem is something has to give as well and some element of rotation is needed. I think inevitably we will have to prioritise some competitions at some stage.

You say that but a lot of decent sides have fallen out of these comps by playing weakened teams, or have lost games by playing weakened teams at the weekend.

As above, its a really difficult balance and it will be a big struggle for us next season. I don't think it should be underestimated how hard it has been for the sides in Europe this season because of Covid, especially the ones that have gone far in the domestic competitions as well. What City have achieved this season, is as good as they have ever been even if they don't have as many points on the board as they have done.

That’s right I do, it ruins my day if we lose a preseason friendly, and you are spot on in that it would be criminal to qualify and then not take it seriously. If we are in it I want us to win it

My point was the squad should be more than capable of handling the extra games, the only way it would be acceptable to field a team full of kids is if it was a dead rubber

 

[MikeO]

Josh annoyed Arsenal have relegated us to 9th but to me it's an irrelevance. They've only got two games left so we need seven points from four to finish above them, and we need that and more to get a place in the top seven so it really doesn't impact our chances at all. In fact, with Chelsea having two cup finals to worry about and only two not easy games left, if they win neither of them we can now overtake them with four wins, so a CL place remains possible. OK, unlikey we finish with four wins but it was equally unlikely we'd start with four.

[Hoof_It_Nev]

Could have done without Arsenal winning against Chelsea. I know we have 2 games in hand but I hate seeing us in 9th...

 

If Man U do over the Shite tomorrow then it's pretty much in our hands to come 5th as long as West Ham don't win their last 3 games. I'm totally lost on European positions this year, but 5th place is Europa right?

[Hoof_It_Nev]

2 minutes ago, Hoof_It_Nev said:

Could have done without Arsenal winning against Chelsea. I know we have 2 games in hand but I hate seeing us in 9th...

I'm not MikeO's Josh by the way 

[MikeO]

2 minutes ago, Hoof_It_Nev said:

I'm not MikeO's Josh by the way 

Are you in league with him?

[MikeO]

7 minutes ago, Hoof_It_Nev said:

Could have done without Arsenal winning against Chelsea. I know we have 2 games in hand but I hate seeing us in 9th.

If we were to finish outside Euro places I don't really give a shit whether it's 8th, 9th or even 10th, the only difference is £2/4m in prize money which is chump change in the PL nowadays; and we'd still have taken a step forward from last season. I'm still looking up the table rather than down and Arsenal being ahead of us will stop tomorrow, trust me.

[Hoof_It_Nev]

20 minutes ago, MikeO said:

If we were to finish outside Euro places I don't really give a shit whether it's 8th, 9th or even 10th, the only difference is £2/4m in prize money which is chump change in the PL nowadays; and we'd still have taken a step forward from last season. I'm still looking up the table rather than down and Arsenal being ahead of us will stop tomorrow, trust me.

I'm ashamed that I forgot we were playing tomorrow! Massive day then, Everton & Man U win and we're laughing. Please let things go our way for once 

[StevO]

10 hours ago, MikeO said:

Josh annoyed Arsenal have relegated us to 9th but to me it's an irrelevance. They've only got two games left so we need seven points from four to finish above them, and we need that and more to get a place in the top seven so it really doesn't impact our chances at all. In fact, with Chelsea having two cup finals to worry about and only two not easy games left, if they win neither of them we can now overtake them with four wins, so a CL place remains possible. OK, unlikey we finish with four wins but it was equally unlikely we'd start with four.

Arsenal did us a favour. We can finish in the top four now.

[StevO]

9 hours ago, Hoof_It_Nev said:

I'm ashamed that I forgot we were playing tomorrow! Massive day then, Everton & Man U win and we're laughing. Please let things go our way for once 

Thing have been going our way for months. All the teams around us keep losing, it’s just we do too. 

[Romey 1878]

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-europa-conference-league-20581575

[Bailey]

21 hours ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

That’s right I do, it ruins my day if we lose a preseason friendly, and you are spot on in that it would be criminal to qualify and then not take it seriously. If we are in it I want us to win it

My point was the squad should be more than capable of handling the extra games, the only way it would be acceptable to field a team full of kids is if it was a dead rubber

 

Completely agree and I just hope that management see it the same way!

15 hours ago, MikeO said:

Josh annoyed Arsenal have relegated us to 9th but to me it's an irrelevance. They've only got two games left so we need seven points from four to finish above them, and we need that and more to get a place in the top seven so it really doesn't impact our chances at all. In fact, with Chelsea having two cup finals to worry about and only two not easy games left, if they win neither of them we can now overtake them with four wins, so a CL place remains possible. OK, unlikey we finish with four wins but it was equally unlikely we'd start with four.

I think it is important for us to try and get some momentum going so that everyone can look at the start pre-season with a bit more excitement and confidence. If that means we will only finish 8th or 9th, I want to see us finish with a rattle!

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

Think our only hope now is if the teams above us are even more determined than us not to qualify 

[Elston Gunnn]

Ancelotti has actually said positive things about the Europa Conference League.  Unfortunately that’s about our best level, just now.

So our realistic shot for 7th is to win our next 2 to get to 62, and hope Spurs draw at home to either Wolves or Villa and lose on final matchday away to Leicester.

I’ve little confidence we’ll finish 7th, but that scenario is our best bet.

 

 

[Bailey]

15 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

Think our only hope now is if the teams above us are even more determined than us not to qualify 

I think we have a good chance with Arsenal and Spurs as those two teams! 

[Gwlad]

I don't like to rely on other results.

[MikeO]

16 minutes ago, Elston Gunnn said:

So our realistic shot for 7th is to win our next 2...

I think we'll have a better chance if we win our next three.

[Elston Gunnn]

12 minutes ago, MikeO said:

I think we'll have a better chance if we win our next three.

Definitely a better chance, but not as realistic as winning next 2 and hoping Spurs falter.  Nor as realistic as winning next 2 and taking a final desperate point away to City’s B/C team, and hoping Spurs will down tools on the final matchday rather than suffer (what they but not Everton would consider) the ignominious glory of playing Conference League football next season.

After today’s misfire, I’m not even sure “realistic” is realistic.

[c1982]

Win our next 2 and we’ll get into Europe.

[Shukes]

Liverpool go behind to Man U, and decide to fight for their chance to go to Europe.

Why can’t we have that mentality. 

Its not losing or drawing that hurts so much, but the not trying.

[MikeO]

9 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Win our next 2 and we’ll get into Europe.

Win two home games on the bounce? I'll have some of what you're smoking please (actually scrub that because I'm anatomically incapable of smoking even if I wanted to, I'll have some of what you're drinking instead, I can do that).

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

7 minutes ago, c1982 said:

Win our next 2 and we’ll get into Europe.

Not if Spurs beat Wolves & Villa at home

[Zoo 2.0]

Spurs have Wolves, Villa and Leicester. 

West Ham have Brighton, West Brom and Southampton. 

I don't think either side takes maximum points, although of course West Ham's final few games are a lot friendlier than Spurs'. 

Personally, I think we might just miss out on the Europa League (given that we have City on the final day) but may just sneak into the new Conference League which I'd be happy with. Any form of European football is better than what we've had this season and gives us something to work on, plus we would hopefully be one of the big teams in the new league, as they rest is surely made up from the same positions on the continent plus the likes of small nations "top" teams.