Rafael Benitez

[Cornish Steve]

18 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Hwang Hee-chan; Scored 4 goals in 6 games.

Nope. It was Max Kilman. It was his first goal for Wolves and his first goal in the PL. My point is that other teams are forced to bring in new players all the time. Let's not make excuses. We have players: Gordon, Dobbin, and Welch were all available to play. Instead, we play Iwobi. In too many previous games, we played Rondon. We bring on Delph.

A common phrase around here is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Surely the corollary is "if it is broke, go fix it". We have options, so use them.

[Bailey]

20 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

Nope. It was Max Kilman. It was his first goal for Wolves and his first goal in the PL. My point is that other teams are forced to bring in new players all the time. Let's not make excuses. We have players: Gordon, Dobbin, and Welch were all available to play. Instead, we play Iwobi. In too many previous games, we played Rondon. We bring on Delph.

A common phrase around here is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Surely the corollary is "if it is broke, go fix it". We have options, so use them.

Whilst there were many poor performances I think a lot of that first half came down to poor preparation and poor tactics, whereas the opposition manager had done that work. 

I didn't see any real evidence of how we had prepared to deal with how Wolves play, we stuck to this two man midfield and sat incredibly deep yet again and we succumbed to another avoidable set piece goal. 

The good news is that Benitez did change his tactics (contrary to your earlier post) but unfortunately the horse had bolted. You can put who you like into that first half side and they would have struggled. 

I hope that in making those changes Benitez has seen the light and won't repeat the same mistakes at the weekend.

[c1982]

1 hour ago, Cornish Steve said:

Who scored Wolves' first goal? How many times has he played for his team? How many goals has he previously scored in the PL? We're falling into the trap of blaming the squad. Why wasn't Gordon playing? Or Dobbin? Benitez has a ready-made excuse, and we're giving him a free pass. I don't agree with this.

Kilman has been 1st choice all season (keeping Boly out) and played a lot last season. The Wolves fans really rate him. He’s a big unit so, although he’s a centre back, he will score a few. Wolves were pretty much full strength last night bar Jonny, Neto and Marcal (who’s poor anyway) - they weren’t without the spine of their team like us; Wolves without Coady, Neves and Jimenez would be pretty poor.

[Btay]

On 02/11/2021 at 08:43, StevO said:

I don’t think he’s without fault, not for one minute. But I just don’t think he’s the biggest problem we’ve got. 
One thing we are crying out for more than anything is consistency, and another manager won’t help that. 
 

We lose the next few games and it will get uncomfortable, and I expect us to be back at square one. Still with a poor squad and still with no money to spend. 

Agree. He didn’t need the injuries we’ve had but he needs to help himself. 

Personally I don’t like playing on the counter - it’s the not the style I like to see but I accept it’s our effective strategy with the squad we have. 

He needs to help himself a bit here though and be more astute tactically. We need clean sheets first are foremost which with our backline won’t be easy, especially when giving the opposition as much ball as we do. So we need to box out the midfield and offer some coverage, play for recoveries and 2/3 quick passes be on the break to our players that offer the most threat. 

The players need to do a lot more. Centre backs need to be brave and get tight to their man, Keane especially. 

When we get our first 11 fit we can evolve to more possession and attacking but right now we need to grind out results.

[RuffRob]

The premier league is of such a good quality, that our squad can ill afford to be with out so many key players through injury - and to be honest in the last half dozen matches I don't really think it matter who the manager is - results will be difficult to come by in Premiership matches. Beyond our first 15 players the squad is poor and we all know this and it is not of Benitez making. 

The last game it was Mina, Digne, Doucoure and DCL, Gomez and out,  added to Siggy. two or three games back a few more can be added to this list. You can also add to that Godfrey and Richarlison not being match fit.

I not sure its fair to lambast Benitez until he's had a decent run of games with a near full strength squad and had a decent stab at the transfer market. it not like this squad of players has shone for any other manager. 

At the end of the transfer window I was resigned to the fact this season was going to be a sticking plaster and the slow start of a rebuild. Given the number of first team players who have be laid up, this is even more the case.

 

[Bailey]

Just as I was last season, I am nervous about simply relying on injuries as a big factor in the way we are playing at the moment. It obviously doesn't help, but players don't suddenly come into the team, snap their fingers and everything becomes good again. Good players in a bad team just make the team slightly less bad. We saw that last season.

Think about it this way, Mina has never been considered our best defender and most wanted him gone in the summer. He isn't suddenly going to stop us conceding. Before the weekend, Digne was considered as under-performing massively to the extent there were call for Godfrey to play in his position.

Gomes has long been on the "to sell list" and Gylfi is probably doing us a favour by not being available because it is someone we don't have to worry moaning about.

Losing Dom is a miss but I don't think he was playing well before his injury and as we saw from Richarlison on Monday, he isn't going to make a crap side loads better.

I do think the big miss is Doucoure and I said that before he got injured purely because his energy is absolutely crucial to how we play. He is missed even more because it is one of our weakest areas of the pitch and there is simply no replacement in the squad to cover what he does in our 4411 formation. His impact isn't as detrimental in a 433 formation, nor is it if we were trying to control the ball more and dominate possession (his weakest attributes).

I am not saying we wont improve for more players being available, but it isn't going to be a complete transformation that I think many are hoping it will be.

 

[Shukes]

Each of those players coming back isn’t going to make a massive difference, but five first team players coming back will.

Our whole tactical set up is broken at the moment as the right players aren’t there, and as we know… the players coming in aren’t good enough.

Let’s see if we can do something in January and see how Rafa does with a decent amount t of games behind him.

[Palfy]

32 minutes ago, Shukes said:

Each of those players coming back isn’t going to make a massive difference, but five first team players coming back will.

Our whole tactical set up is broken at the moment as the right players aren’t there, and as we know… the players coming in aren’t good enough.

Let’s see if we can do something in January and see how Rafa does with a decent amount t of games behind him.

And in a nutshell that pretty much sums it up, we haven’t got the players in our squad that can come in and adequately cover any injuries. 

[Cornish Steve]

32 minutes ago, Palfy said:

And in a nutshell that pretty much sums it up, we haven’t got the players in our squad that can come in and adequately cover any injuries. 

I wish it were that simple. Gordon (stepped in as a result of injuries) has been very good, whereas Keane (a regular starter) has been atrocious. I understand that it takes time to get used to new teammates, but that doesn't explain poor tactics and weird substitutions. I get the sense that players sometimes don't know what they've been told to do. That's all on the manager.

[Palfy]

22 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

I wish it were that simple. Gordon (stepped in as a result of injuries) has been very good, whereas Keane (a regular starter) has been atrocious. I understand that it takes time to get used to new teammates, but that doesn't explain poor tactics and weird substitutions. I get the sense that players sometimes don't know what they've been told to do. That's all on the manager.

Gordon stepped in and has been good not very good, honestly where do you think he would rank in the leagues top MFs. Where do you rank Holgate v Mina Gbamin or Davies v Doucoure Rondon v DCL do I need to go on. No manager has been able to get any consistency out of these players, is it because the managers we’ve had don’t know what they are doing or the players aren’t good enough to do what’s been asked of them   

[Cornish Steve]

32 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Gordon stepped in and has been good not very good, honestly where do you think he would rank in the leagues top MFs. Where do you rank Holgate v Mina Gbamin or Davies v Doucoure Rondon v DCL do I need to go on. No manager has been able to get any consistency out of these players, is it because the managers we’ve had don’t know what they are doing or the players aren’t good enough to do what’s been asked of them   

A bit of both.

[Wiggytop]

I think RPG has it right here, we need to see this season out, as painful as it may get, we’re good enough to avoid the drop. The season was always going to be difficult after Ancelotti's flounce away ( which will probably be a good thing in the long run as we were rubbish and looked clueless for a lot of last season ) I’d like to see him change or improve how we zonal mark as it’s killing games for us

[RuffRob]

21 hours ago, Bailey said:

Just as I was last season, I am nervous about simply relying on injuries as a big factor in the way we are playing at the moment. It obviously doesn't help, but players don't suddenly come into the team, snap their fingers and everything becomes good again. Good players in a bad team just make the team slightly less bad. We saw that last season.

Think about it this way, Mina has never been considered our best defender and most wanted him gone in the summer. He isn't suddenly going to stop us conceding. Before the weekend, Digne was considered as under-performing massively to the extent there were call for Godfrey to play in his position.

Gomes has long been on the "to sell list" and Gylfi is probably doing us a favour by not being available because it is someone we don't have to worry moaning about.

Losing Dom is a miss but I don't think he was playing well before his injury and as we saw from Richarlison on Monday, he isn't going to make a crap side loads better.

I do think the big miss is Doucoure and I said that before he got injured purely because his energy is absolutely crucial to how we play. He is missed even more because it is one of our weakest areas of the pitch and there is simply no replacement in the squad to cover what he does in our 4411 formation. His impact isn't as detrimental in a 433 formation, nor is it if we were trying to control the ball more and dominate possession (his weakest attributes).

I am not saying we wont improve for more players being available, but it isn't going to be a complete transformation that I think many are hoping it will be.

 

I not expecting a complete transformation - even when everybody is fit we have a mediocre squad in Premier league terms. On paper its a mid table squad. Benitez's job is to get build that squad to a European challenging team first. He is never going to do any better than mid table if a decent chunk of his starting 11 have been missing most weeks - I would say this has been the case most of the season for him.

Like I have said its a fine line in the Prem given the quality of pretty much every team. 2 or 3 key players (including your main goal scorer) a slight improvement and consistency of starting 11 make a massive difference in prem games.

 

[Zoo 2.0]

 

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rafa-benitez-everton-press-conference-22083248

[Palfy]

13 minutes ago, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rafa-benitez-everton-press-conference-22083248

Very true most Evertonian’s do realise the squad is weak and key injuries have weakened it further which can’t be laid at the door of Benitez. 

[Bailey]

On 04/11/2021 at 12:07, RuffRob said:

I not expecting a complete transformation - even when everybody is fit we have a mediocre squad in Premier league terms. On paper its a mid table squad. Benitez's job is to get build that squad to a European challenging team first. He is never going to do any better than mid table if a decent chunk of his starting 11 have been missing most weeks - I would say this has been the case most of the season for him.

Like I have said its a fine line in the Prem given the quality of pretty much every team. 2 or 3 key players (including your main goal scorer) a slight improvement and consistency of starting 11 make a massive difference in prem games.

 

I don't completely disagree but it is the question of how much better do we get with each player that comes back. For example, I doubt we will see huge improvements with Digne / Mina, nor Dom if we don't start playing better behind him but Doucoure is a big miss. I would say his loss eclipses the rest given how we were playing before his injury.

All sides have injuries / suspensions etc but only so many of them actually make much of a difference to the quality of the side. A big example is KDB at City. He was at the top of his game for City when he got injured a few years back, but Silva and others stepped in and it didn't effect how they played. They won the league without him. When they had the Laporte injury / Kompany leaving, they couldn't cope because it left them vulnerable despite having other quality players in the squad. 

We need to start making moves over the next two windows to start making sure this squad doesn't fall apart when someone gets injured. 

[Palfy]

5 hours ago, Bailey said:

A big example is KDB at City. He was at the top of his game for City when he got injured a few years back, but Silva and others stepped in

Silva is a world class player no surprise he can fill the boots of any MF player in the league, Doucoure gets injured and we have Davies to replace him no comparison but if we had Silva to come in it would be a completely different story. We have a very weak squad and when everyone is fit we have an average starting 11 then you take DCL Richarlison Doucoure Mina and Digne out of that 11 pretty much all at the same time then we are fucked, no Silva’s or others of note in our squad to step in and fill the void. 

[Btay]

After that, I can’t see Rafa accepting anything less than that for effort. The talent will come when we get our first team fit but that’s exactly the effort Everton fans thrive on.

Win, lose or draw the fans will always back the boys up if they apply themselves like that.

[Zoo 2.0]

Absolutely bonkers substitutions again, and nearly threw away the game. Even before the sending off we went from putting them under pressure, to the point where Lloris was wasting time and Conte trying to calm them down to us being on the ropes, with them cracking the post in the process.

I thought we'd get annihilated, so will take the point but could quite easily have been a 0-1. 

[Bailey]

13 hours ago, Palfy said:

Silva is a world class player no surprise he can fill the boots of any MF player in the league, Doucoure gets injured and we have Davies to replace him no comparison but if we had Silva to come in it would be a completely different story. We have a very weak squad and when everyone is fit we have an average starting 11 then you take DCL Richarlison Doucoure Mina and Digne out of that 11 pretty much all at the same time then we are fucked, no Silva’s or others of note in our squad to step in and fill the void. 

He might be very good in his own right, but he is nowhere near as good as KDB. The difference between the two in quality is the same as Doucoure / Davies, just at a different level. 

We saw today that we can compete against other PL sides, it just needs more thought. You can't take out a key piece and play the same way. Rafa tried and it didn't work and thankfully he has now seen sense.

[Palfy]

31 minutes ago, Bailey said:

He might be very good in his own right, but he is nowhere near as good as KDB. The difference between the two in quality is the same as Doucoure / Davies, just at a different level. 

We saw today that we can compete against other PL sides, it just needs more thought. You can't take out a key piece and play the same way. Rafa tried and it didn't work and thankfully he has now seen sense.

It takes players given more than it does a manager making a tactical decision, never saw the game but what I’m hearing is the players gave there all for once and not about a tactical change from Benitez. I agree he may not be as good as KDB but he’s still probably better than what most of City’s opponents have, so they don’t miss DB as much as we miss Doucoure. 

[Shukes]

Am I the only one that sees KDB as more of a SSP darling?

He is good don’t get me wrong, but F me he misses twice as many as Dom did when he wasn’t scoring. Dom misses and he should have scored. KDB misses and it’s an incredible save!
He also sprays passes about all game…. But a good portion are miles away from the quality of Davies.

let’s be honest here… would anyone swap Delpth for him?

[Gwlad]

On 11/11/2021 at 18:03, Shukes said:

Am I the only one that sees KDB as more of a SSP darling?

He is good don’t get me wrong, but F me he misses twice as many as Dom did when he wasn’t scoring. Dom misses and he should have scored. KDB misses and it’s an incredible save!
He also sprays passes about all game…. But a good portion are miles away from the quality of Davies.

let’s be honest here… would anyone swap Delpth for him?

Worth a punt for the depth.

[MikeO]

5 minutes ago, Gwlad all over said:

Worth a punt for the depth.

That's deep.

[Shukes]

I have this sinking feeling we will be seeing the old Delpth again very soon!

[Palfy]

If spelling his name right meant the difference between sinking or swimming then you would definitely need your rubber ring and arm bands on. 

[Gwlad]

Delft pots are very fragile.

[Matt]

I know injuries are playing a big part in this, but so much for defensive and organised. I was willing to give him 18 months but seeing the players so... uninterested is purely down to him. He's already walking on very thin ice and I don't see how he can turn it around. 

[badaids]

12 minutes ago, Matt said:

I know injuries are playing a big part in this, but so much for defensive and organised. I was willing to give him 18 months but seeing the players so... uninterested is purely down to him. He's already walking on very thin ice and I don't see how he can turn it around. 

But who comes in for him and will do better with no money and the terrible squad? Just have to hope the injured come back soon and Rafa can get a result in the next 6 games. To sack him would be madness at this stage. My pre season prediction for us this season was relegation, given the terrible players and attitudes, and I still think if he manages that he’ll have done alright.