Carlo Ancelotti

[Zoo 2.0]

5 minutes ago, Bill said:

And to play Delph at full back and a fullback on the wing makes no fookin sense at all.

Iwobi and Bernard  are on the bench so why play a full back on the wing ? And delph shouldn't play anywhere cos he is rubbish.

Genuinely astounded at how little some people grasp when it comes to football and it's tactics. Delph was playing in the middle of the park, dropping deep to cover the hole that Nkounkou created when bombing forward. He then moved to full-back when we're chasing the game and in desperate need of a goal - structured positions and formations go out of the window when chasing the game, we took off Kenny to allow us to play with a second striker which was 100% the right thing to do. 

Mentioning Bernard, who's about 5'3 in the same sentence as ''full-back'' is delusional. 

[Romey 1878]

A shit show from him today. He couldn't have got anything else wrong in all honesty.

I know we had players missing but the negative line-up killed any chance of us getting a foothold in the game, and then the substitutions were bizarre to say the least.

You know exactly what you're going to get from Newcastle and they gave us no surprises - be solid and compact, sit in and be willing to play on the counter. That is exactly what they did so why the fuck did Carlo go with the slowest midfield he could possibly start with? Not a single one of them was going to move the ball quickly or be willing to run forward with it. That's what you need to break the opposition down when they sit in. 

Then the subs... Gordon must wonder if Carlo rates him at all to bring Iwobi on before him after the shit he served up last week, even though Gordon looked brighter in his cameo. Where is the accountability? And we bring Tosun on to play with DCL but take all width, and the two willing to cross the ball in, off the pitch. So that went well!

I'm disappointed with the players and their peformances but I'm more disappointed in Carlo today.

[Bill]

23 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Genuinely astounded at how little some people grasp when it comes to football and it's tactics. Delph was playing in the middle of the park, dropping deep to cover the hole that Nkounkou created when bombing forward. He then moved to full-back when we're chasing the game and in desperate need of a goal - structured positions and formations go out of the window when chasing the game, we took off Kenny to allow us to play with a second striker which was 100% the right thing to do. 

Mentioning Bernard, who's about 5'3 in the same sentence as ''full-back'' is delusional. 

I think you might be delusional, my comment mentioned Bernard and Iwobi as wingers rather than playing a full back on the wing. If you look at the Kick off you might notice the positions of the players mentioned. Although Delfh came inside on many occasions Niels was always the more advanced.

A Shit formation all round today, and it got what it deserved.

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Genuinely astounded at how little some people grasp when it comes to football and it's tactics. Delph was playing in the middle of the park, dropping deep to cover the hole that Nkounkou created when bombing forward. He then moved to full-back when we're chasing the game and in desperate need of a goal - structured positions and formations go out of the window when chasing the game, we took off Kenny to allow us to play with a second striker which was 100% the right thing to do. 

Mentioning Bernard, who's about 5'3 in the same sentence as ''full-back'' is delusional. 

I think playing is a bit generous. He did cover a lot of ground which meant he was useless over a larger patch of turf and actively ignored Neils at every opportunity. 

[Bailey]

1 hour ago, Zoo 2.0 said:

Genuinely astounded at how little some people grasp when it comes to football and it's tactics. Delph was playing in the middle of the park, dropping deep to cover the hole that Nkounkou created when bombing forward. He then moved to full-back when we're chasing the game and in desperate need of a goal - structured positions and formations go out of the window when chasing the game, we took off Kenny to allow us to play with a second striker which was 100% the right thing to do. 

Mentioning Bernard, who's about 5'3 in the same sentence as ''full-back'' is delusional. 

I think people get it, its not difficult to understand, but it didn't work at any moment in the game. 

Nkounkou has shown his skillset coming from deep but as soon as we had possession he was pressing high up the pitch like a winger and Delph was sitting in his spot. Doucoure was doing the same on the other side so with Allan sitting in his spot we played with what was effectively a defensive 5, two "wingers" who make easy to spot vertical runs and then Gomes and Siggy floating around doing very little partly because it was another one of those days for them but also because they were easy to mark because Newcastle had an overload in those positions. 

It didn't look like it would work from the teamsheet and it amazes me that there was very little change for 60 minutes or so. 

[Palfy]

10 minutes ago, Bailey said:

It didn't look like it would work from the teamsheet and it amazes me that there was very little change for 60 minutes or so. 

I think it worked for 56 minutes until the first goal, it wasn’t expansive football from us because he never set the team up to play like that, so he must have believed he never had the right players at his disposal to play that way, a couple of unlucky breaks and we concede, some better finishing from us and it could have been a completely different story. 
The game plan was to keep tight and nick a couple of goals, that’s why you didn’t see a change for 60 minutes why would you we looked comfortably and the plan was working. 

[Bailey]

1 hour ago, Palfy said:

I think it worked for 56 minutes until the first goal, it wasn’t expansive football from us because he never set the team up to play like that, so he must have believed he never had the right players at his disposal to play that way, a couple of unlucky breaks and we concede, some better finishing from us and it could have been a completely different story. 
The game plan was to keep tight and nick a couple of goals, that’s why you didn’t see a change for 60 minutes why would you we looked comfortably and the plan was working. 

If the plan was to offer no threat then it definitely worked. 

[Hafnia]

Trust me... I had a 4 team coupon, with Southampton. Arsenal, Spurs and Everton looking to pay £370.... I’d love to blame someone.  Can’t point finger at Carlo. 

[Palfy]

4 hours ago, Bailey said:

If the plan was to offer no threat then it definitely worked. 

We had opportunities just didn’t take them, can’t blame the manager for poor finishing, or can and will you. 

[badaids]

The defeat yesterday was on him I think - he picked that team.

What I don’t get is that we’ve found a system that works, which is basically feed it into DCL in the 6 yard box and we’ll score, and we might win. 

Not having Richi or James means that we might make less chances, but why change the system completely to one that was too complicated and clearly wasn’t working? 

[Matt]

25 minutes ago, badaids said:

The defeat yesterday was on him I think - he picked that team.

What I don’t get is that we’ve found a system that works, which is basically feed it into DCL in the 6 yard box and we’ll score, and we might win. 

Not having Richi or James means that we might make less chances, but why change the system completely to one that was too complicated and clearly wasn’t working? 

I think he went back to the idea of being steady like he did when he first came in. The logic of the tactic made sense but you could see clearly in the first half it wasn’t working and he took too long to react.
 

I love the guy, he will make us a great team, and is doing so,  especially when we’ve got some depth. But yesterday showed that our starting 11 is about all we have and if we don’t, then we are bang average and putting certain players players in who don’t deserve a shirt to fill a slot was a bad move. 

[Palfy]

48 minutes ago, badaids said:

The defeat yesterday was on him I think - he picked that team.

What I don’t get is that we’ve found a system that works, which is basically feed it into DCL in the 6 yard box and we’ll score, and we might win. 

Not having Richi or James means that we might make less chances, but why change the system completely to one that was too complicated and clearly wasn’t working? 

DCL blazed high and wide yesterday from 6 yards out Gylfi took an air shot from 6 yards out, let’s blame Ancelotti. 

[StevO]

4 hours ago, Matt said:

I think he went back to the idea of being steady like he did when he first came in. The logic of the tactic made sense but you could see clearly in the first half it wasn’t working and he took too long to react.
 

I love the guy, he will make us a great team, and is doing so,  especially when we’ve got some depth. But yesterday showed that our starting 11 is about all we have and if we don’t, then we are bang average and putting certain players players in who don’t deserve a shirt to fill a slot was a bad move. 

This. He lost three of his best players, one of his centre halves has become a clown and his back up right back is not good enough. 
 

If we can get Richarlison, James, Digne and Coleman back into this team, and Holgate hopefully, we are a different prospect in any game. Without these players we will struggle against anyone too. 

If he could add a player of Isco’s quality in January then we could have a real push for the second half of the season. 
 

Not losing the positivity just yet!

[markjazzbassist]

yep i'm nowhere near ready to throw Carlo under the bus.  terrible recruitment from previous regimes and he's put together a solid 11 from some of it and some of his own.  but there is still so much work, players that need to be sold/released and spots we need filled.  we have 0 depth.  

[Bailey]

14 hours ago, Palfy said:

We had opportunities just didn’t take them, can’t blame the manager for poor finishing, or can and will you. 

Which opportunities did we make with that starting 11? I genuinely don't remember any.

[Bailey]

45 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

yep i'm nowhere near ready to throw Carlo under the bus.  terrible recruitment from previous regimes and he's put together a solid 11 from some of it and some of his own.  but there is still so much work, players that need to be sold/released and spots we need filled.  we have 0 depth.  

No-one is throwing Carlo under the bus here.

The whole point about having a football forum and opinions is that you can discuss them. Carlo has done incredibly well for us so far this season. It slipped a fair bit tactically at Southampton and it went off a cliff yesterday. I don't think anybody is for one minute is suggesting Carlo isn't the man to take us forward. He has been praised by almost all quarters about what a good job he has done with us since the summer and it has been rightly deserved. He has also been criticised for certain things over the last couple of weeks and that too is fair.

[Palfy]

3 hours ago, Bailey said:

No-one is throwing Carlo under the bus here.

The whole point about having a football forum and opinions is that you can discuss them. Carlo has done incredibly well for us so far this season. It slipped a fair bit tactically at Southampton and it went off a cliff yesterday. I don't think anybody is for one minute is suggesting Carlo isn't the man to take us forward. He has been praised by almost all quarters about what a good job he has done with us since the summer and it has been rightly deserved. He has also been criticised for certain things over the last couple of weeks and that too is fair.

What I don’t get is that those who have criticised his team selection weren’t critical of his selections before the game started, in fact some even said that they understood his reasoning for his team, if we would have won he would have been hailed as a hero, yet we lose and the it’s his fault his team and tactics were wrong, really I would listen to anyone who highlighted that before the game started that he picked the wrong team and why, that would be good knowledge, but after the event is easy to criticise when things go wrong anyone can do that, the players let us down not the managers selections otherwise all old wise owls would have been banging there drums before the game started, so I for one back the manager over his selections, and won’t listen to those who said he got the team wrong after the game and not before

[Aidan]

2 hours ago, Palfy said:

What I don’t get is that those who have criticised his team selection weren’t critical of his selections before the game started, in fact some even said that they understood his reasoning for his team, if we would have won he would have been hailed as a hero, yet we lose and the it’s his fault his team and tactics were wrong, really I would listen to anyone who highlighted that before the game started that he picked the wrong team and why, that would be good knowledge, but after the event is easy to criticise when things go wrong anyone can do that, the players let us down not the managers selections otherwise all old wise owls would have been banging there drums before the game started, so I for one back the manager over his selections, and won’t listen to those who said he got the team wrong after the game and not before

But the thing is the lineup was met with confusion and apprehension by people on this forum. Nobody directly criticised his line up, but why would anyone in their right mind do that to Carlo who has given us our best start to a campaign in what was it, 80 years? 

Plus a team sheet isn't always reflective of a system or particular formation, so its difficult for people to give their opinion on it until we can see it in action. It would be like writing a review for a movie when you've only seen the trailer. 

[Palfy]

1 hour ago, Aidan said:

Nobody directly criticised his line up, but why would anyone in their right mind do that to Carlo who has given us our best start to a campaign in what was it, 80 years? 

Exactly this so why so much criticism of the manager after the game and not the players, there the ones who didn’t perform and carry out his tactics based on the players at his disposal. 
Or are a few saying that one of the best managers in the world doesn’t know what he’s doing?

[Btay]

Can't say how grateful i am to have Carlo here, i truly believe he epitomises our club in his personality and approach. However, that doesnt make him above criticism. I can honestly say i woke up at halftime ( 12.30am kick off and off the back off a 28 hour shift ) messaged my brother and asked if we had injuries in the first half. It was moyesesq when we use to play Rodwell at RM. If Silva put that team out he would get crucified. 

We go again however!

[Aidan]

13 hours ago, Palfy said:

Exactly this so why so much criticism of the manager after the game and not the players, there the ones who didn’t perform and carry out his tactics based on the players at his disposal. 
Or are a few saying that one of the best managers in the world doesn’t know what he’s doing?

No, they're probably saying hes one of the best in the world who is also capable of making mistakes.

[Bailey]

On 02/11/2020 at 18:29, Palfy said:

What I don’t get is that those who have criticised his team selection weren’t critical of his selections before the game started, in fact some even said that they understood his reasoning for his team, if we would have won he would have been hailed as a hero, yet we lose and the it’s his fault his team and tactics were wrong, really I would listen to anyone who highlighted that before the game started that he picked the wrong team and why, that would be good knowledge, but after the event is easy to criticise when things go wrong anyone can do that, the players let us down not the managers selections otherwise all old wise owls would have been banging there drums before the game started, so I for one back the manager over his selections, and won’t listen to those who said he got the team wrong after the game and not before

I personally I was late for kick off so was playing catch up until half time, however I think we would have all given Carlo the benefit of the doubt to see how it would work.

It also then showed that it didn't work quickly and people could see what was fairly obvious and started to comment. The same comments apply to the Southampton game. As Aiden says, the best players and managers in the world make mistakes but then its about how you react to those mistakes. We seemed to plough on regardless for 60 minutes, again like we did against Southampton.

The players and manager let each other down IMO. It was poor all round.

[Matt]

1 hour ago, Bailey said:

I personally I was late for kick off so was playing catch up until half time, however I think we would have all given Carlo the benefit of the doubt to see how it would work.

It also then showed that it didn't work quickly and people could see what was fairly obvious and started to comment. The same comments apply to the Southampton game. As Aiden says, the best players and managers in the world make mistakes but then its about how you react to those mistakes. We seemed to plough on regardless for 60 minutes, again like we did against Southampton.

The players and manager let each other down IMO. It was poor all round.

Even if you/people had seen it beforehand and disagreed with it from the off, you’d have others telling you that the manager had no choice. So this “no one complained beforehand” argument is just nonsense. The point is we realised the setup was out of necessity but as Bailey says nothing changed for too long during the game. That bits on the manager. 

[Palfy]

Nothing changed for 60 minutes because we didn’t concede until 58 minutes, so there for that part of the plan was working until the bullshit penalty, we were lacking the right players in the right place to play open and expansive football, we packed the midfield and defence to keep it tight and not concede, with the belief we would get a goal even if from a set piece or on the break, but at worse we should have walked away with a point. 
I could name 5-6 players who didn’t produce step up to the mark call it what you want, but they let the manager down not the other way round, but Bailey you carry on and blame Ancelotti for the last 2 performances I’m sure the players would be happy to hide behind that excuse. 

[Matt]

6 minutes ago, Palfy said:

Nothing changed for 60 minutes because we didn’t concede until 58 minutes, so there for that part of the plan was working until the bullshit penalty, we were lacking the right players in the right place to play open and expansive football, we packed the midfield and defence to keep it tight and not concede, with the belief we would get a goal even if from a set piece or on the break, but at worse we should have walked away with a point. 
I could name 5-6 players who didn’t produce step up to the mark call it what you want, but they let the manager down not the other way round, but Bailey you carry on and blame Ancelotti for the last 2 performances I’m sure the players would be happy to hide behind that excuse. 

How are you still not getting that it’s not on one or the other?

[Palfy]

1 minute ago, Matt said:

How are you still not getting that it’s not on one or the other?

Because I know what I’m on about simple

[Bailey]

21 hours ago, Matt said:

How are you still not getting that it’s not on one or the other?

I was about to say the same thing... If it was all ever one persons fault it would be an easy game!

[barryj]

22 hours ago, Matt said:

Nothing changed for 60 minutes because we didn’t concede until 58 minutes, so there for that part of the plan was working

It wasn’t working! We barely had a noteworthy attack/ chance. They had. Saint-Maximin should have already scored. 

[Matt]

22 minutes ago, barryj said:

It wasn’t working! We barely had a noteworthy attack/ chance. They had. Saint-Maximin should have already scored. 

How did you quote me with what Palfy said?!

[Romey 1878]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/nov/18/paul-clement-carlo-ancelotti-play-for-him-chelsea