Aidan Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I'm not saying Koeman can't do right. I'm saying that believing injuries and ACON hasn't shaped the winning team we have at the minute is pure stupidity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I'm not saying Koeman can't do right. I'm saying that believing injuries and ACON hasn't shaped the winning team we have at the minute is pure stupidity. It's not stupidity, maybe it has had some affect but I fully expect Gana to come back and improve us further in February- after all he's been our stand out player up to now. Unfortunately, it seems you can't see past your dislike for Koeman and see this as the only answer when many have pointed out a number of other factors which have clearly contributed. Get over it and enjoy your last few months on the forum as Koeman is beginning shape this team and we're clearly moving in the right direction on and off the pitch. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badaids Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 What I'm pleased about is that Joel is developing as a player, keeper and team member, finally. Before he's had plenty of chances, but never really looked ready to step them up, and remember some of those errors? He's looked technically and mentally the business lately and that is rubbing off on the back four and team. So good to see, and i thi k he can get even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Sometimes vicissitude can be serendipitous. Injuries and Acon were unwelcome challenges, but they forced the manager's hand to do something different. It turns out that something different, at least in the last two games, has worked like a charm. Is that luck or skill? Surely both. I still want to see a clear strategy and consistency. Yesterday built on last weekend, but I still couldn't really tell you what is our strategy as a team. We'll get there, I'm sure, and good results and team consistency are very welcome, but there's a way to go. Hopefully soon, the clouds will begin to lift and we'll see exactly where we're heading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 It's not stupidity, maybe it has had some affect but I fully expect Gana to come back and improve us further in February- after all he's been our stand out player up to now. Unfortunately, it seems you can't see past your dislike for Koeman and see this as the only answer when many have pointed out a number of other factors which have clearly contributed. Get over it and enjoy your last few months on the forum as Koeman is beginning shape this team and we're clearly moving in the right direction on and off the pitch. Thing with Gana he looked the man in a team that was playing badly, but he was bordering on terrible the last 2 games before ACON when others were showing massive improvement, so if you think he should walk straight back into a winning team who you going to drop Davies or Barry, and then you've got Schneiderlin knocking on the door.If there playing well and the teams winning leave it till it breaks, Gana has know right to walk straight back into the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 It's not stupidity, maybe it has had some affect but I fully expect Gana to come back and improve us further in February- after all he's been our stand out player up to now. Unfortunately, it seems you can't see past your dislike for Koeman and see this as the only answer when many have pointed out a number of other factors which have clearly contributed. Get over it and enjoy your last few months on the forum as Koeman is beginning shape this team and we're clearly moving in the right direction on and off the pitch. Yep yep and yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Gana's form had dipped and he wasn't dropped. If Koeman had brought Davies in earlier I'd be made up, but he never ACON forced his hand. Likewise with injuries to Jags and Stekelenberg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Gana's form had dipped and he wasn't dropped. If Koeman had brought Davies in earlier I'd be made up, but he never ACON forced his hand. Likewise with injuries to Jags and Stekelenberg.Spot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Gana's form had dipped and he wasn't dropped. If Koeman had brought Davies in earlier I'd be made up, but he never ACON forced his hand. Likewise with injuries to Jags and Stekelenberg. The fact remains that he dropped players like Barry, Ross and Jags when they were poor. Yes there have been injuries but those who have come in and played well have stayed in the team on merit and not been replaced when others have recovered. When Gana comes back, Schneiderlin and McCarthy, plus Besic to come there will be real competition in midfield. What we need is strength in defense, a center back, left and right back assuming Oviedo and Garbutt are not up to it. We also need some inside forwards / wingers to replace Geri and Lennon and a striker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 The fact will remain that Gana shouldn't get his place back right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 When we played badly it was Koemans fault. Now we're playing great it's not Koemans fault. Ok! I don't know if this was aimed at me or just a general point but I don't think it is unfair to say that Koeman is only doing things that a lot of people have been begging for. As someone else has pointed out, this isn't a massively different team to the one we had last year and yet we have only just snapped into some sort of philosophy. We have seen him play around, switch people in and out, get players to do things they aren't really suited to before almost going back to the type of football we did against Spurs. I completely get that he is a manager in a new job and getting to grips with his squad and it may even be that he doubted himself and the squad a little after our early success. Koeman should definitely be getting credit for playing this system as it does seem to suit the guys we have in the starting 11 and the squad. Im very happy to see that he is trusting the young lads and that in return they are rewarding his trust. Long may it continue! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shy_Talk Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Back to Robles, I'm not even going to try to hide it, I am at the other end of the spectrum from his biggest fan. Too cosy with "our previous manager" and the comedy howlers he threw in would have made Wright blush, but, some daisy-cutter clearances to the opposition aside he has been above average of late, so fair play to Koeman for keeping faith for an extended run, fair play to our new look defence that have clicked so well and trust the GK & vice versa. Robles has proved he can do some of the exceptional goal keeping stuff,where I want improvement is on the day to day mundane stuff. It's as though he loses focus and concentration because one minutehe looks world class, the next a juggler with no hands. Earned his position at the moment, maybe it was good management chopping and changing earlier in the season to force both gk's to up their games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palfy Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I don't know if this was aimed at me or just a general point but I don't think it is unfair to say that Koeman is only doing things that a lot of people have been begging for. As someone else has pointed out, this isn't a massively different team to the one we had last year and yet we have only just snapped into some sort of philosophy. We have seen him play around, switch people in and out, get players to do things they aren't really suited to before almost going back to the type of football we did against Spurs. I completely get that he is a manager in a new job and getting to grips with his squad and it may even be that he doubted himself and the squad a little after our early success. Koeman should definitely be getting credit for playing this system as it does seem to suit the guys we have in the starting 11 and the squad. Im very happy to see that he is trusting the young lads and that in return they are rewarding his trust. Long may it continue! I'd like to think most people would echo that, he's learning things about his players strengths and in turn the players are learning how he wants them to play.And this could be the start of things coming together, feeling very positive again instead of suicidal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 The fact will remain that Gana shouldn't get his place back right now. He shouldn't but it's a good problem to have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Fook me.... people call me blinkered over lukaku? Let's get it straight... if something isn't right or what I like to see then I call it out. If he addresses these things I acknowledge them. So koeman... pretty much has been a roller coaster for me. Pretty great to start with followed by a "what the fuck is he doing".... What he has done is get the team performing. Gana off to Africa, Stek injured, bolassie injured.... blah blah blah. He's making decisions.... they aren't forced. I wasn't sold on his 3 man defence- he's made it work. Give the man credit. This is about Everton football club not koeman or being right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) Wasn't aimed at you Bailey, just the general notion that it's not Koemans fault when we do well but it is when we do badly. I think Koeman is treating this job very different as any he has had before. He is coming here, with Walsh and Moshiri, to take us to the top. There was a good interview with Baines in the echo this week where he says now everyone knows their job and believe in what the manager is asking. That told me the players weren't behind him 100% at first, but now they are. They all look to be fighting for their place, they even look more like a group that is together again. We all need to get used to Koeman, he'll move us forward just with his standards alone as far as I'm concerned. The man knows the game, he has a plan, he deserves credit for getting us playing well regardless of the circumstances that prompted these changes. He could so easily have made different decisions and it might not have gone so well. Edited January 22, 2017 by StevO London Blue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue 250 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Robles and Davies should hold their place in the starting line up until they let their form slip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Fook me.... people call me blinkered over lukaku? Let's get it straight... if something isn't right or what I like to see then I call it out. If he addresses these things I acknowledge them. So koeman... pretty much has been a roller coaster for me. Pretty great to start with followed by a "what the fuck is he doing".... What he has done is get the team performing. Gana off to Africa, Stek injured, bolassie injured.... blah blah blah. He's making decisions.... they aren't forced. I wasn't sold on his 3 man defence- he's made it work. Give the man credit. This is about Everton football club not koeman or being right. If Bolasie wasn't injured would he still be playing? Highly likely. If Gana wasn't at AFCON would he be playing? Highly likely. They are forced changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 If Bolasie wasn't injured would he still be playing? Highly likely. If Gana wasn't at AFCON would he be playing? Highly likely. They are forced changes. Yes they are forced, but he has shown he will make his own decisions by dropping Barry, Mirallas, Jags, Barkley etc. By changing from 3 at the back to 2 at the back. As StevO said its as if the players get it now and are 100% behind him playing as a team with a plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 If Bolasie wasn't injured would he still be playing? Highly likely. If Gana wasn't at AFCON would he be playing? Highly likely. They are forced changes. And how do you know we wouldn't of won each game anyway? You don't so you can't say we're only winning because Koeman was forced to make changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 He could have picked someone else to replace them and stick with the same system. Instead he changed system and gave Davies and Holgate chances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 If Bolasie wasn't injured would he still be playing? Highly likely. If Gana wasn't at AFCON would he be playing? Highly likely. They are forced changes. I think either of those players would be fine and not negatively impacted results. Gana instead of Barry.... bolassie carries a different threat to mirallas. Maybe similar in strength but different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Yes they are forced, but he has shown he will make his own decisions by dropping Barry, Mirallas, Jags, Barkley etc. By changing from 3 at the back to 2 at the back. As StevO said its as if the players get it now and are 100% behind him playing as a team with a plan. He's been swapping and changing from a back two to three all season. The personel change has been a massive contributor IMO. Forced changes have helped. I can't complain right now. Just as long as he doesn't upset the form with silly decisions. If he has finally got it right it's taken him half a season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I think either of those players would be fine and not negatively impacted results. Gana instead of Barry.... bolassie carries a different threat to mirallas. Maybe similar in strength but different. I have no complaints about Gana. He's played well. But that doesn't mean we are a better side with him in it. Right now I wouldn't have him in the side. Bolasie just doesn't do it for me. Looked excellent when he came in but gradually got worse and worse. 100% benefit he's not playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 And how do you know we wouldn't of won each game anyway? You don't so you can't say we're only winning because Koeman was forced to make changes. The same reasoning applies to your theory too then. Null comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Out of 22 games Joel has kept 11 clean sheets. didnt think it was that good! I hope I'm not remembering it wrong . I wasn't remembering it wrong, phew. http://evertonforum.com/evertons-joel-robles-on-clean-sheet-record-holgate-and-preparing-for-stoke/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 The same reasoning applies to your theory too then. Null comment. It doesn't though because we are winning and that's not because Bolasie got injured and Ganas away. You just don't like him because we never got De Boer who younwanted. Get over it and give him credit where it's due. markjazzbassist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 It doesn't though because we are winning and that's not because Bolasie got injured and Ganas away. You just don't like him because we never got De Boer who younwanted. Get over it and give him credit where it's due. Bold: read that to yourself again! then read your post you sent to me before the last. Same theory applies to both. Behave, I had absolutely nothing against the man before he came here. He came with a clean slate with me. He wasn't my preferred choice but he had my full backing. Right now he seems to have turned it around, which I'm happy about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Oh you sneaky bastards! So you've moved the mad rumblings about Koeman from the Koeman thread to the Robles thread. You think I wouldn't notice?! I've got spies...spies everywhere. Bastards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shy_Talk Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Wasn't aimed at you Bailey, just the general notion that it's not Koemans fault when we do well but it is when we do badly. I think Koeman is treating this job very different as any he has had before. He is coming here, with Walsh and Moshiri, to take us to the top. There was a good interview with Baines in the echo this week where he says now everyone knows their job and believe in what the manager is asking. That told me the players weren't behind him 100% at first, but now they are. They all look to be fighting for their place, they even look more like a group that is together again. We all need to get used to Koeman, he'll move us forward just with his standards alone as far as I'm concerned. The man knows the game, he has a plan, he deserves credit for getting us playing well regardless of the circumstances that prompted these changes. He could so easily have made different decisions and it might not have gone so well. Alternatively the players weren't behind "our previous manager" at all, now things have changed, its just taken a while to shake the rust off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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