Jordan Pickford

[Btay]

47 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

The American equivalent is all the boomers complaining about their stocks losing so much money and worrying about the economy.  Who cares about money when human lives are on the line?  They do and it sickens me

I understand some people talking about money as it’s key to survival - I’ve lost nearly everything I’ve worked FIFO for in the last 2 years on stocks and to be honest, that’s just how it is as it was always a risk.

Our government has put restrictions in on non essential services. For instance hair dressers can’t take more than 30 mins on a hair cut - they can’t make enough money to pay for their rents but the restrictions mean if they close its a voluntary close not an enforced one - to which they have to pay their rent still.

Honestly, lock it down. Everything that isn’t fighting this pandemic and essential. The economy will recover, eventually.

[MC11]

I don’t think Ancelotti trust him 100%

 

we shall see in the summer 

[StevO]

2 hours ago, MC11 said:

I don’t think Ancelotti trust him 100%

 

we shall see in the summer 

Hardly even on topic

 

[Btay]

6 hours ago, StevO said:

Hardly even on topic

 

Hahaha

[Palfy]

14 hours ago, MC11 said:

I don’t think Ancelotti trust him 100%

 

we shall see in the summer 

You are possibly right, but there’s a hell of a lot more to change before we look at the keeper. 

[AlbanyNYToffee]

Very good agility and shot stopper but his hands, judgement and attitude are crap. He's not good enough as it is and there is a profit to be made here by selling him and signing a cheaper, but better, replacement. I'd address this immediately. Chelsea may look to replace Kepa and Sheffield need to replace Henderson unless he's loaned again. Palace, West Ham and Leeds might be options as well but the fee won't be as high for them. Mat Ryan, Pope, Ramsdale all good enough. 

[Wiggytop]

3 hours ago, AlbanyNYToffee said:

Very good agility and shot stopper but his hands, judgement and attitude are crap. He's not good enough as it is and there is a profit to be made here by selling him and signing a cheaper, but better, replacement. I'd address this immediately. Chelsea may look to replace Kepa and Sheffield need to replace Henderson unless he's loaned again. Palace, West Ham and Leeds might be options as well but the fee won't be as high for them. Mat Ryan, Pope, Ramsdale all good enough. 

Ryan or Pope would give us some calmness which is much needed.

[dunlopp9987]

5 hours ago, AlbanyNYToffee said:

Very good agility and shot stopper but his hands, judgement and attitude are crap. He's not good enough as it is and there is a profit to be made here by selling him and signing a cheaper, but better, replacement. I'd address this immediately. Chelsea may look to replace Kepa and Sheffield need to replace Henderson unless he's loaned again. Palace, West Ham and Leeds might be options as well but the fee won't be as high for them. Mat Ryan, Pope, Ramsdale all good enough. 

I've been on this soapbox for a bit, and will continue to shout it from proverbial soapbox. I actually think Jordan is a good enough keeper for us, but he just has absolutely no one breathing down his neck for the starting spot, which leads to complacency. He can flail around and make boneheaded mistakes because he knows he will always be out there between the sticks. Legitimate competition for the #1 shirt could maybe push him to improve his game, but until that happens, he'll continue to plateau and remain a serviceable keeper, but not a great one. 

[AlbanyNYToffee]

2 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

I've been on this soapbox for a bit, and will continue to shout it from proverbial soapbox. I actually think Jordan is a good enough keeper for us, but he just has absolutely no one breathing down his neck for the starting spot, which leads to complacency. He can flail around and make boneheaded mistakes because he knows he will always be out there between the sticks. Legitimate competition for the #1 shirt could maybe push him to improve his game, but until that happens, he'll continue to plateau and remain a serviceable keeper, but not a great one. 

Your point is well taken but I've always tended to approach it differently. Who exactly was pushing Howard or Neville for all those years? He is serviceable you're exactly right and that's all he'll ever be if he needs a kick up the arse to improve. Howard and Neville competed against themselves. Be better today than you were yesterday. Be better tomorrow than you were today. Also he has plenty of folks knocking on the door for England #1, surely that should be enough to get him going. He just doesn't have the IT so to speak. Is he costing us games? No plenty of other crap out being played out there but why not try to address it while his value is relatively high. 

[Hafnia]

Sell him before he reaches Richard Wright levels of appeal.

I'd swap his occasional world class saves for a keeper with better decision making/concentration and command of the area. 

He's the type of keeper that stopped Liverpool getting where they are now.  Good in isolation but overall he doesn't give them backline confidence. 

[Hafnia]

13 hours ago, Wiggytop said:

Ryan or Pope would give us some calmness which is much needed.

Pope for me. 

[Btay]

I’ve made my feelings on pickford well known but we are much worse is many other positions that replacing him is not a priority for me right now. 

[Hafnia]

21 minutes ago, Btay said:

I’ve made my feelings on pickford well known but we are much worse is many other positions that replacing him is not a priority for me right now. 

The longer we keep him the less value we will get.  Liverpool titted about with keeper after keeper, persevered with mignolet etc till they corrected the situation....  whilst I agree there are more pressing priorities I honestly find that the lad causes disruption to a defence. 

After speaking to ebbrell last week... my silently taken conclusion was that we need more players changing than many will believe.... Carlo has strongly hinted this will be the case 

[markjazzbassist]

On 09/07/2020 at 13:28, AlbanyNYToffee said:

Very good agility and shot stopper but his hands, judgement and attitude are crap. He's not good enough as it is and there is a profit to be made here by selling him and signing a cheaper, but better, replacement. I'd address this immediately. Chelsea may look to replace Kepa and Sheffield need to replace Henderson unless he's loaned again. Palace, West Ham and Leeds might be options as well but the fee won't be as high for them. Mat Ryan, Pope, Ramsdale all good enough. 

i've mentioned Ryan before and some on here thought i was crazy.  i think he's a very underrated keeper.  i would love him here over pickford.  

[StevO]

On 09/07/2020 at 18:28, AlbanyNYToffee said:

Very good agility and shot stopper but his hands, judgement and attitude are crap. He's not good enough as it is and there is a profit to be made here by selling him and signing a cheaper, but better, replacement. I'd address this immediately. Chelsea may look to replace Kepa and Sheffield need to replace Henderson unless he's loaned again. Palace, West Ham and Leeds might be options as well but the fee won't be as high for them. Mat Ryan, Pope, Ramsdale all good enough. 

Cheaper, but better? I like that idea. I can’t believe no one has thought of that before. If we could do that with the whole team we could win the league and make a tidy profit while we’re at it. 

I will also sell my house and get a bigger one for less money too. 

[StevO]

On 09/07/2020 at 23:54, dunlopp9987 said:

I've been on this soapbox for a bit, and will continue to shout it from proverbial soapbox. I actually think Jordan is a good enough keeper for us, but he just has absolutely no one breathing down his neck for the starting spot, which leads to complacency. He can flail around and make boneheaded mistakes because he knows he will always be out there between the sticks. Legitimate competition for the #1 shirt could maybe push him to improve his game, but until that happens, he'll continue to plateau and remain a serviceable keeper, but not a great one. 

Who is breathing down Alison and Edison’s neck to make them better keepers?

No one is having two keepers of similar levels competing for the starting place. I’d like us to have more good players, but you can’t sign another top keeper and hope they will fight for their place from the bench. Just doesn’t happen very often. 

[Palfy]

On 09/07/2020 at 23:54, dunlopp9987 said:

I've been on this soapbox for a bit, and will continue to shout it from proverbial soapbox. I actually think Jordan is a good enough keeper for us, but he just has absolutely no one breathing down his neck for the starting spot, which leads to complacency. He can flail around and make boneheaded mistakes because he knows he will always be out there between the sticks. Legitimate competition for the #1 shirt could maybe push him to improve his game, but until that happens, he'll continue to plateau and remain a serviceable keeper, but not a great one. 

Well the only  evidence to support what you are saying is that he is still England number one, with so called better keepers unable to take his shirt. 

[Matt]

10 hours ago, Hafnia said:

The longer we keep him the less value we will get.  Liverpool titted about with keeper after keeper, persevered with mignolet etc till they corrected the situation....  whilst I agree there are more pressing priorities I honestly find that the lad causes disruption to a defence. 

After speaking to ebbrell last week... my silently taken conclusion was that we need more players changing than many will believe.... Carlo has strongly hinted this will be the case 

Pretty sure we all know that ideally we need 7 or so top quality starters. But that’ll cost about £4-500m in one window which won’t happen, and again we’ll be left with a difficult transition period and a season written off. 
 

DCM, RM/W and CB. Spend £100m (still shocks me writing that) sorting out those first, clear some of the high earners who don’t play off the books, sign 1 big player in January, reassess end of next season.   New keeper is the last priority, concentrate on the 10 in front of him not allowing the ball to get to our box and keep it in the oppositions 

[Palfy]

8 minutes ago, Matt said:

Pretty sure we all know that ideally we need 7 or so top quality starters. But that’ll cost about £4-500m in one window which won’t happen, and again we’ll be left with a difficult transition period and a season written off. 
 

DCM, RM/W and CB. Spend £100m (still shocks me writing that) sorting out those first, clear some of the high earners who don’t play off the books, sign 1 big player in January, reassess end of next season.   New keeper is the last priority, concentrate on the 10 in front of him not allowing the ball to get to our box and keep it in the oppositions 

This window I would be happy with 2 quality MF’s, and get by with the rest of the positions for now they seem to be holding there own, although not much decent back up unless Baines and Kenny stay.  
But the MF is a different story it’s a total car crash and needs drastic changes. 

[Hafnia]

5 hours ago, Palfy said:

Well the only  evidence to support what you are saying is that he is still England number one, with so called better keepers unable to take his shirt. 

I think what we see at international level for England is that once a keeper loses the number 1 shirt then that is it.   Invariably they get lots of chances till they lose it and it goes to the number 2.   I don't take his continued choice as number 1 being that he is the best, just that Southgate hasn't pulled the trigger yet.  

When he does which will be soon imo,  that's when his value will plummet. 

[markjazzbassist]

1 minute ago, Hafnia said:

I think what we see at international level for England is that once a keeper loses the number 1 shirt then that is it.   Invariably they get lots of chances till they lose it and it goes to the number 2.   I don't take his continued choice as number 1 being that he is the best, just that Southgate hasn't pulled the trigger yet.  

When he does which will be soon imo,  that's when his value will plummet. 

yep works the same way in the US, Tim Howard the prime example

[Hafnia]

4 hours ago, Matt said:

Pretty sure we all know that ideally we need 7 or so top quality starters. But that’ll cost about £4-500m in one window which won’t happen, and again we’ll be left with a difficult transition period and a season written off. 
 

DCM, RM/W and CB. Spend £100m (still shocks me writing that) sorting out those first, clear some of the high earners who don’t play off the books, sign 1 big player in January, reassess end of next season.   New keeper is the last priority, concentrate on the 10 in front of him not allowing the ball to get to our box and keep it in the oppositions 

I would actually say we need 8 players..... minimum

New keeper,  new centre half, new right back, 3 centre kids. Striker, left sided attacker, right sided attacker. 

I genuinely think a new keeper is key, it's the cornerstone of the defensive unit. 

[Palfy]

5 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

I think what we see at international level for England is that once a keeper loses the number 1 shirt then that is it.   Invariably they get lots of chances till they lose it and it goes to the number 2.   I don't take his continued choice as number 1 being that he is the best, just that Southgate hasn't pulled the trigger yet.  

When he does which will be soon imo,  that's when his value will plummet. 

It’s taking Southgate a long time to come to this realisation that Pickford isn’t good enough, some on here have been banging on about how poor he is for 18 months, yet numerous club managers and the England manager don’t seem to see it that way, and the latter doesn’t need to go into the transfer market to replace him, he can pick any of the keepers you have mentioned yet he doesn’t. 
So there must be something about him that others see and his detractors don’t.  
I personally don’t think he’s the best keeper in the league I would put him at 3 or 4, which is a bonus for us considering we are struggling to be top 10.

[StevO]

Since lockdown we’ve conceded one goal from an on fire Danny Ings, one own goal, one goal where our player kicks the ball at on opponent and it goes in. Three goals. Only one of which came from an opposition team cutting us open and scoring. Two unfortunate incidents for two of our most in form players in Keane and Holgate. 
For those three goals we played five matches. Liverpool, Norwich, Leicester, Spurs and Southampton. 
I’ve not missed a minute of these games, I’ve not seen Pickford throw one in. Seen him drop the ball and go unpunished once or twice. But from the three goals we’ve conceded in the last five games, Pickford is not out of form at all. If anything our back five in most games has been solid, even when Mina came in for Holgate. 
 

Got to ask anyone who thinks we need rid of Pickford. Who’s going to buy him?

[Zoo 2.0]

Jordan Pickford isn't the best thing since sliced bread and has a lot to improve on, but some of the criticism that he gets (unfortunately mostly from "Evertonians") is laughable in the extreme.

[Hafnia]

5 hours ago, Palfy said:

It’s taking Southgate a long time to come to this realisation that Pickford isn’t good enough, some on here have been banging on about how poor he is for 18 months, yet numerous club managers and the England manager don’t seem to see it that way, and the latter doesn’t need to go into the transfer market to replace him, he can pick any of the keepers you have mentioned yet he doesn’t. 
So there must be something about him that others see and his detractors don’t.  
I personally don’t think he’s the best keeper in the league I would put him at 3 or 4, which is a bonus for us considering we are struggling to be top 10.

Like mjb said... international keepers aren't rotated and dropped and bought back in.  They get a shot and even when they have a shit time they are persevered with till the moment comes where they are dropped.

Hart was picked long in to his decline, as was seaman... he was given the 2002 world cup lobbed by ronaldinho then more games to fail.  Shilton, James.... the list goes on.  They play well past the time where the form suggests they should have been dropped. 

I'd have Ryan, Henderson, ederson, Allison, pope, Heaton, schmichael. De gea, ahead of him... and that's before we get to debating the likes of debruvka, krul, fabianksi etc...

He should be near the top based on reputation etc... for me he's not near. 

[Shukes]

6 hours ago, StevO said:

Since lockdown we’ve conceded one goal from an on fire Danny Ings, one own goal, one goal where our player kicks the ball at on opponent and it goes in. Three goals. Only one of which came from an opposition team cutting us open and scoring. Two unfortunate incidents for two of our most in form players in Keane and Holgate. 
For those three goals we played five matches. Liverpool, Norwich, Leicester, Spurs and Southampton. 
I’ve not missed a minute of these games, I’ve not seen Pickford throw one in. Seen him drop the ball and go unpunished once or twice. But from the three goals we’ve conceded in the last five games, Pickford is not out of form at all. If anything our back five in most games has been solid, even when Mina came in for Holgate. 
 

Got to ask anyone who thinks we need rid of Pickford. Who’s going to buy him?

To be honest, if you have watched every minute of these games and not saw Pickford drop a ball..... you simply turned away.... his beat fans have started questioning him.

But.... I think he is still a good keeper and one we should work with. For me, he needs a good smacking to bring him down to earth and he could be great.

 

edit: sorry just read your post again. Think I misunderstood you. You were saying you SAW him drop and go unpunished.

My mistake mate.

[pete0]

Looking at the goals conceded in the first half of the season and I've got him to blame for two of them. At a push if you're Gary Neville you could argue three, as he reckons Pickford was to blame for the city fk. 

The ones I've got him responsible for are the first goals against Brighton and Sheffield, although I'd argue the Sheffield one he was obstructed but he/we got fucked by VAR. 

Not looked at the rest of the season yet but 2 from the 24 conceded in the first half isn't bad. He's only cost us 1 point, which is all he cost us in the whole of last season (I had him to blame for three goals last year). 

[c1982]

That there just now is why I’d happily sell Pickford (as he just stops a one on one!!!) almost throws one into his own goal then laughs it off. Aside from thinking he wouldn’t be that hard to replace - he just seems a bit of an idiot to me. He may not have been directly at fault for many goals but he’s very clumsy and gets away with a lot.

[Aidan]