Moise Kean

[SpartyBlue]

Just now, StevO said:

I don’t see a bad attitude from him, because I don’t know him to know his attitude. I don’t see an issue with his behaviour, in the same way I don’t with Henry or Lukaku. The only people who can judge his attitude are Carlo and the club staff, and I trust that if they see an issue with his attitude they will handle it as they see fit.

Yeah, I think a lad of 20 is immature, I don’t think it’s an issue, I think it’s normal. 
Two lads work for me who are 22 and 21, I heard them talking about asking their girlfriends to lick their arses the other day. Pretty immature conversation to be having in work, but that’s the immaturity level I would expect from lads that age. If anyone wants to know they both managed to make it happen, pair of top players these kids.

 It’s hard to follow your stance on this. He’s petulant and immature but he doesn’t have a bad attitude? He is being judged by his actions. We don’t know how he is behind the scenes so we are just making a guess but everything so far points to a player that isn’t happy at the club. Yes, things can change but it’s not a leap to say where there is smoke there is the possibility of fire. 

[StevO]

Just now, SpartyBlue said:

 It’s hard to follow your stance on this. He’s petulant and immature but he doesn’t have a bad attitude? He is being judged by his actions. We don’t know how he is behind the scenes so we are just making a guess but everything so far points to a player that isn’t happy at the club. Yes, things can change but it’s not a leap to say where there is smoke there is the possibility of fire. 

I expect petulance and immaturity in lads of 20 because it’s normal. I don’t see why that makes him have a bad attitude. 
I don’t see why he’s unhappy at the club. 

[SpartyBlue]

2 minutes ago, StevO said:

How do you feel about his actual performance though Rob?

I disagree with the rest of your thought obviously. 
I’ll ask, why would Juve want him back if that’s what he’s really like?

Rob can speak for himself but perhaps playing for a world class team in his home country is just where he really wants to be. Wouldn’t even blame him honestly. He’s a young kid away from home in a different country, not seeing much game time coming from a huge club where he was having success. Takes a strong mentality to deal with all that. 

[Hafnia]

36 minutes ago, StevO said:

Said this before and no doubt will again in the future. Piss poor behaviour if you like, but you know nothing of a players attitude. 
How could you? You’ve only seen actions. 

Last week.  Gordon won a penalty that he took ... Gordon congratulated him and he blanked him.  Came across terribly.

Hooker party in lockdown.

Generally comes across as surly and disengaged.

Stories of missing training, late for meetings.

Just my gut feel. 

[barryj]

He was always known for his elaborate goal celebrations.

I don’t really want a player happy to not be in the starting 11 every game and he’s entitled to be grumpy if and only if this has no effect on his game. I haven’t seen a lack of effort. Obviously I don’t know this but he’s probably annoyed at not getting what he sees as a fair chance to get back in and that’s not helped by DCLs goals at the weekend. Also both Riccy and DCL starting tonight wont of helped. He then gets brought on and plays with the ‘lesser’ players, slightly isolated and at a disjointed time of the match. He played for a quarter of the match and scored a goal. So did his job. 

[SpartyBlue]

1 minute ago, StevO said:

I expect petulance and immaturity in lads of 20 because it’s normal. I don’t see why that makes him have a bad attitude. 
I don’t see why he’s unhappy at the club. 

I consider petulance and immaturity part of attitude. That young people/players often have these traits doesn’t change that. 

[barryj]

1 minute ago, SpartyBlue said:

petulance and immaturity

Where has this been evidenced? Just your opinions of his body language? 

[StevO]

Just now, SpartyBlue said:

I consider petulance and immaturity part of attitude. That young people/players often have these traits doesn’t change that. 

Spend more time with lads in their 20s, you might feel different. 
Look at Foden and Greenwood. Just the same. 
There will be others in our team who are just the same. 

[barryj]

Also we mustn’t forget there are no crowds there so it does have the training / pre season feel at the grounds (according to journalists / staff there). 

[SpartyBlue]

Just now, StevO said:

Spend more time with lads in their 20s, you might feel different. 
Look at Foden and Greenwood. Just the same. 
There will be others in our team who are just the same. 

I’m well aware how people in their 20’s behave. Youth is wasted on the young, right? We can agree to disagree here. I hope he does start enjoying his football as I think he has a good deal of ability. Time will tell.

[DownUnderToff]

Think Richy looked every bit as surly today and against West Brom (while putting in great shifts). 

To me it seems to be representative of players that aren't satisfied with performances (Kean) or outcome (Richy), not necessarily just "sulking".  Even Gordon with him being desperate to score.  Last week Kean knew he wasn't playing well and the penalty was a gift, from someone else's good work.  Again tonight, he finished off a smart move from Digne and Nkounkou.  It was a clean enough finish, but pretty much his only decent involvement.

With Carlo and the new arrivals, the pressure has ramped up and there's more of an attitude that near enough isn't good enough.

[StevO]

2 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

I’m well aware how people in their 20’s behave. Youth is wasted on the young, right? We can agree to disagree here. I hope he does start enjoying his football as I think he has a good deal of ability. Time will tell.

Still trying to hold onto my youth at 36 mate

[SpartyBlue]

4 minutes ago, StevO said:

Still trying to hold onto my youth at 36 mate

We are the same age so I understand completely. 

[RuffRob]

26 minutes ago, StevO said:

How do you feel about his actual performance though Rob?

I disagree with the rest of your thought obviously. 
I’ll ask, why would Juve want him back if that’s what he’s really like?

It the 15mins Ancelotti afforded him at the end of an already won league cup game, he did OK, and took his goal well. 

Like many others, in the 12months he has been in the club he just hasn't seemed to got his head and really show or try and proof to us why we paid £28M of him as a 19 year old. There seem to have been as much negative vibe about him as there has been positive. Not seen cameo appearances from him that make me go 'wow', not enough to justify any sort of 'attitude' or 'swagger' yet. Hasn't earned any sort of pass in my eyes.

Now I don't know his true character or real attitude anymore than you do.  Maybe he isn't an arsehole, and he might be the kind of youngster you would like to take your daughter out!! but there have been enough incidents in only 12months for me not to really warm to him as a person.

If he does want to go back 'home' (like all the stories are saying thin past month) to Juve after a year in lockdown in the UK (and who could really blame a young lad), then having a face like a slapped arse after scoring a goal to make a point to the club and fans is kind of the thing I would expect him to do (based on all I have read about the lad). So when this sort of thing happen, it no surprise that as many fans are talking about his miserable reaction as they are about him scoring.  And this kind of sums up Kean's 12 month with us. 

Why do Juve want him back, because he is young and has the potential to become a very good player, then are in need of a backup striker, and think they might get him cheap, and he want to go back. Perhaps!

Give me DCL any day of the week.  he could take my daughter on a date if he wanted to 

 

 

[Romey 1878]

Amateur psychology is exactly the reason I come on TT.

[Sibdane]

3 hours ago, StevO said:

I don’t see a bad attitude from him, because I don’t know him to know his attitude. I don’t see an issue with his behaviour, in the same way I don’t with Henry or Lukaku. The only people who can judge his attitude are Carlo and the club staff, and I trust that if they see an issue with his attitude they will handle it as they see fit.

Yeah, I think a lad of 20 is immature, I don’t think it’s an issue, I think it’s normal. 
Two lads work for me who are 22 and 21, I heard them talking about asking their girlfriends to lick their arses the other day. Pretty immature conversation to be having in work, but that’s the immaturity level I would expect from lads that age. If anyone wants to know they both managed to make it happen, pair of top players these kids.

[London Blue]

7 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

Amateur psychology is exactly the reason I come on TT.

You need help

[Palfy]

12 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

Amateur psychology is exactly the reason I come on TT.

It takes a nutter to know a nutter

[Bailey]

I know I am as guilty as anyone but there is loads of straw clutching going on here at the moment. If we lose at the weekend hopefully it will go back to normal

[Hafnia]

They were talking about Kean on toffee TV.  They seem to be of the opinion that Kean isn't happy that he's not starting and Ancellotti is challenging him. 

 

[Romey 1878]

https://www.teamtalk.com/news/juventus-consider-moise-kean-return-everton-flop-mino-raiola

[Sibdane]

6 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

https://www.teamtalk.com/news/juventus-consider-moise-kean-return-everton-flop-mino-raiola

It really bothers me that they're calling him a flop at 20 years old when he's really only been getting minutes at the end of games. Yes, he hasn't lived up to expectations exactly, but christ, it needs to be put into perspective. He was never bought to come in to become an immediate superstar. 

[barryj]

Looks happy enough in the training videos released on YouTube today. 

[Cisk]

4 hours ago, Sibdane said:

It really bothers me that they're calling him a flop at 20 years old when he's really only been getting minutes at the end of games. Yes, he hasn't lived up to expectations exactly, but christ, it needs to be put into perspective. He was never bought to come in to become an immediate superstar. 

Disagree, I think the club bought him thinking he would hit the ground running and be a real Rom replacement. The money we paid is ALOT for a potential only player.

I was watching him Weds thinking I dont know what style of forward he is. I've settled on a fox in the box. He doesn't seem to be intelligent to make penetrating runs, nor pacey to burst through defensive lines running onto the ball. Hes not a hold up the ball striker and he not a silky footed trickster. I'm a bit lost as to what striker he is... seems to just exist in the penalty area (when hes not running around like a headless chicken between centre circle and the D).

[markjazzbassist]

32 minutes ago, Cisk said:

Disagree, I think the club bought him thinking he would hit the ground running and be a real Rom replacement. The money we paid is ALOT for a potential only player.

I was watching him Weds thinking I dont know what style of forward he is. I've settled on a fox in the box. He doesn't seem to be intelligent to make penetrating runs, nor pacey to burst through defensive lines running onto the ball. Hes not a hold up the ball striker and he not a silky footed trickster. I'm a bit lost as to what striker he is... seems to just exist in the penalty area (when hes not running around like a headless chicken between centre circle and the D).

good post.  i am in complete agreement on the fee, 30m is a ton of money for an unproven kid.  messi was cheaper than that.  he was only 26m and best player in the world.   he was playing in a Juve side that was destroying italian teams and going deep in CL, you could have thrown anichebe in there and he would have banged em in too.  hopefully brands has learned from it and we move on.

[Aidan]

3 hours ago, Cisk said:

Disagree, I think the club bought him thinking he would hit the ground running and be a real Rom replacement. The money we paid is ALOT for a potential only player.

I was watching him Weds thinking I dont know what style of forward he is. I've settled on a fox in the box. He doesn't seem to be intelligent to make penetrating runs, nor pacey to burst through defensive lines running onto the ball. Hes not a hold up the ball striker and he not a silky footed trickster. I'm a bit lost as to what striker he is... seems to just exist in the penalty area (when hes not running around like a headless chicken between centre circle and the D).

Whatever striker he is he looks to be one which doesn't want to be here. 

[StevO]

3 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

good post.  i am in complete agreement on the fee, 30m is a ton of money for an unproven kid.  messi was cheaper than that.  he was only 26m and best player in the world.   he was playing in a Juve side that was destroying italian teams and going deep in CL, you could have thrown anichebe in there and he would have banged em in too.  hopefully brands has learned from it and we move on.

Messi was cheaper? What? When was Messi 26m?

[markjazzbassist]

1 hour ago, StevO said:

Messi was cheaper? What? When was Messi 26m?

Sorry my bad misread it, that’s his salary in pounds

[Aidan]

8 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Sorry my bad misread it, that’s his salary in pounds

Just woke up Mark?

[StevO]

9 hours ago, markjazzbassist said:

Sorry my bad misread it, that’s his salary in pounds

I was about to start a collection to bring him to Everton