Moise Kean

[sydneyneil]

This lads talent has been exaggerated from day one. The only talent we should be nurturing right now is the boss in the dugout 

[Hafnia]

10 hours ago, barryj said:

Did his performance reallly warrant Ferguson to completely ignore him? Kean also looked a little confused when he was subbed on and immediately had a chat with Richarlison. I’m sure none of us will get to know the real reason. If it’s just about chasing the ball and you want a striker to just run and run (with little control or no end product) then Niasse is your man. I’m surprised Ferguson doesn’t realise the difference between the two as I could tell you beforehand what you’d get from each player. 

The problem we have as a club is that too many people seem to think that it's ok for some players not to "run around" cos they have a bit of quality.

This has been a long bug bear of mine.  Hard work and quality aren't mutually exclusive. 

There are fans who over indulge supposed talented yet half arsed players but slate hard working yet technically less proficient players....  we are where we are because as a team we have been found wanting. Players ball watching, not tracking runners.... soft natured.  It's got to stop!!!

I spoke to someone who has a contact at melwood,  when Klopp took over the Liverpool players thought they were fit.... not the case. He had them working, spewing, double training sessions and he takes no shit.  Look at them now.

I want Everton to do well, and maybe Big Dunc has sat frustrated like the rest of us watching players take the piss.   A 19 year old athlete should not be strolling around the pitch.... if he didn't know what's expected then he does now! As will the rest. 

We shouldn't be expected to see a lesser quality footballer come on in place of a 19 year old prodigy because he may not try hard....  try hard as a bare minimum. 

[nogs]

4 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

I think that's the point Barry is making really - if that's what he wanted then why wasn't Niasse the sub in the first place? Because that's his whole game - to run around like an excited puppy.

I don't think those stats suggest Niasse ran around like an excited puppy though. They suggest he got into the game and won his duels. If anything Kean was the one who was all headless chicken but lost every single battle with an opponent. Sadly the lad looks out of his depth tactically and physically - a little like Klaasen but for different reasons. Again, my concern is not so much with the player but the fact that our recruitment may well have pulled off another howler. 

[Sibdane]

https://old.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/ebcagr/the_moment_when_moise_kean_got_subbed_off_15/

Hurts to watch. Say what you want about the substitution, but at the end of the day he's still just a kid, and that is massively embarrassing.

[Bailey]

On 15/12/2019 at 17:11, duncanmckenzieismagic said:

He was blowing out of his arse and strolling back as if he didn’t have a care in the world, correct decision for me

I have noticed him blowing out of his arse in other games as well. I can't imagine it's because he isnt fit but something isn't right there. It must just be that he cant deal with the intensity.

[markjazzbassist]

NOTE:  "blowing out of his arse" means diarrhea in american english.  i've been perplexed/laughing as i read these comments.  gotta love the colloquialisms 

[Bailey]

2 minutes ago, markjazzbassist said:

NOTE:  "blowing out of his arse" means diarrhea in american english.  i've been perplexed/laughing as i read these comments.  gotta love the colloquialisms 

I hope I don't ever have to see that interpretation!

[sydneyneil]

It’s an obvious comparison but when Balotelli had a reputation for being very talented and he just needed  to sort his disciplinary problems out, I just could never see this supposed talent.

i think I saw him have one good game, an international against England in about 5 years yet the media portrayed him as this troubled soul with immense potential. Could never see it myself, he always looked bang average at best. Keans not played much but I just don’t see it?? Maybe it’s Italian journalists......

[pete0]

Find Caraghers conclusion to be a bit weird, he analysed Kean saying that he's switched off here and lost the ball etc, even points out Ferguson pointing him into position and Kean just not being up to speed with the flow to get into the positions yet. So after giving all the reasons Ferguson is frustrated with him and even saying managers are right to sub a sub, Caragher than says however Kean should have stayed on but with no explanation why. Baffling considering he's just pointed all the reasons why he got subbed. 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/12040/11888347/duncan-ferguson-and-moise-kean-jamie-carragher-gives-his-verdict-on-monday-night-football?fbclid=IwAR2hiOkliXGIqZU0LOVT3F4CzJNpk-bOZ0QTkOEk5MkqQeH8c0cC7IrsZZ4

[Palfy]

6 hours ago, pete0 said:

Find Caraghers conclusion to be a bit weird, he analysed Kean saying that he's switched off here and lost the ball etc, even points out Ferguson pointing him into position and Kean just not being up to speed with the flow to get into the positions yet. So after giving all the reasons Ferguson is frustrated with him and even saying managers are right to sub a sub, Caragher than says however Kean should have stayed on but with no explanation why. Baffling considering he's just pointed all the reasons why he got subbed. 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/12040/11888347/duncan-ferguson-and-moise-kean-jamie-carragher-gives-his-verdict-on-monday-night-football?fbclid=IwAR2hiOkliXGIqZU0LOVT3F4CzJNpk-bOZ0QTkOEk5MkqQeH8c0cC7IrsZZ4

You sound surprised that Caragher is talking a load of shite, you should be use to it by now

[barryj]

13 hours ago, pete0 said:

Find Caraghers conclusion to be a bit weird, he analysed Kean saying that he's switched off here and lost the ball etc, even points out Ferguson pointing him into position and Kean just not being up to speed with the flow to get into the positions yet. So after giving all the reasons Ferguson is frustrated with him and even saying managers are right to sub a sub, Caragher than says however Kean should have stayed on but with no explanation why. Baffling considering he's just pointed all the reasons why he got subbed. 

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/12040/11888347/duncan-ferguson-and-moise-kean-jamie-carragher-gives-his-verdict-on-monday-night-football?fbclid=IwAR2hiOkliXGIqZU0LOVT3F4CzJNpk-bOZ0QTkOEk5MkqQeH8c0cC7IrsZZ4

I think that’s your unconscious bias as I heard him pointing out what you’ve said but also saying mitigating points. Such as two long sprints, players often get out of position in games, CDL on right (surely just as much his fault as Keans), sometimes hard to get up to speed etc

[pete0]

4 hours ago, barryj said:

I think that’s your unconscious bias as I heard him pointing out what you’ve said but also saying mitigating points. Such as two long sprints, players often get out of position in games, CDL on right (surely just as much his fault as Keans), sometimes hard to get up to speed etc

The only mitigating is the two sprints, which was kind of Caragher to say as the lad was definitely not at the right fitness level. 

Being out of position can happen, but the first thing he done was run into the wrong position and never really recovered from there. 

There's no mitigating not being up to the speed of the game and to keep losing the ball. Only reason I can see to leave him on would be emotional, so not too damage his feelings (which of Caragher said than fair enough, but as far as I can see there's no reason given to leave him on). Just hope he learns his lesson rather than gets the hump. 

[Bailey]

47 minutes ago, pete0 said:

The only mitigating is the two sprints, which was kind of Caragher to say as the lad was definitely not at the right fitness level. 

Being out of position can happen, but the first thing he done was run into the wrong position and never really recovered from there. 

There's no mitigating not being up to the speed of the game and to keep losing the ball. Only reason I can see to leave him on would be emotional, so not too damage his feelings (which of Caragher said than fair enough, but as far as I can see there's no reason given to leave him on). Just hope he learns his lesson rather than gets the hump. 

Exactly. It's all well and good sprinting everywhere but if it's in the wrong situation or because you have already been caught out of position it's largely irrelevant.

I used to play footy with a young lad who was technically a very decent player but he had no appreciation of being a team player. His idea was to pretend he was being a team player after the event by running back after the man had gone. Instead of reacting after he had given the ball away he would remonstrate with himself to show his emotional involvement when all the team needed was for him to just drop 5 yards and get back behind the ball and stop an easy pass. That what I saw from Kean but an elite level. There is no doubt he was trying, it's just that most of it was misplaced effort. If he had dropped back in straight away, maybe 5 or 10 yards when it was clear he wasn't getting the ball, he would have had to sprint 40 yards to chase Shaw and knacker himself out.

[Shukes]

Well I’m sure if Ancelotti comes, it should have a positive effect in Kean. Maybe this could be just what he needs.

[barryj]

There was one point in Carragher summing up where Kean was in the perfect position on the last man for a ball to be slid through to him but it wasn’t taken. I think the way we currently play really doesn’t suit him. In the short amount of time I’ve seen him both in the stadium and on tv he almost plays like Vardy on the last man but we rarely look to go through the middle (on the deck). 

[MC11]

You can see this lad has real talent. Just needs a goal. If Ancelotti rumours are true I’ve no doubt this lad will get goals

[DownUnderToff]

Dunc turned to him early and he put in a shift.  The crowd got behind him and he didn't seem to have any ill feeling towards Dunc. 

[Shukes]

8 hours ago, DownUnderToff said:

Dunc turned to him early and he put in a shift.  The crowd got behind him and he didn't seem to have any ill feeling towards Dunc. 

The crowd gave him a massive lift when he came on. I’m sure that won’t go unnoticed by him. Loved the way Holgate looked after him as well.

I know it’s way to early, but is Holgate a captain in the making? Not necessarily with us, but some team.

[DownUnderToff]

35 minutes ago, Shukes said:

I know it’s way to early, but is Holgate a captain in the making? Not necessarily with us, but some team.

No need to qualify it with "some [other/lower] team" I reckon.  He's only, just, 23.  He's good enough to play now.  He's aggressive, keen to take on a challenge, and seems to be becoming far more confident in his ability/right to be in the epl.  Still plenty of scope for a leap forward in ability/growth as a player.

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, Shukes said:

The crowd gave him a massive lift when he came on. I’m sure that won’t go unnoticed by him. Loved the way Holgate looked after him as well.

I know it’s way to early, but is Holgate a captain in the making? Not necessarily with us, but some team.

When he was warming up at half time he got a big cheer from the Bullens too, which he acknowledged. 

Loved seeing how into celebrating Davies' goal he was too.

[Bill]

It must be just me then, I haven't seen anything from this lad to think he's ever going to be a top player, I know he hasn't played many minutes but I can see why, whenever he comes on he doesn't do anything to warrant a place. I'd love him to prove me wrong but I think he's going to be another blank.

Niase, Sandro, Tosun, Kean. ?

[Heath]

 

Thought he did ok when he came on against Leicester. It actually looked like the penny had dropped with him, time will tell of course. Not sure if it's just me, but does anyone else feel he's a little out of condition? It may have been the stream I watched the game on, but Kean looked to have a huge ass. I know that may sound a little odd.

[Bill]

1 hour ago, Heath said:

 

Thought he did ok when he came on against Leicester. It actually looked like the penny had dropped with him, time will tell of course. Not sure if it's just me, but does anyone else feel he's a little out of condition? It may have been the stream I watched the game on, but Kean looked to have a huge ass. I know that may sound a little odd.

Now then keep your feelings to yourself.

[Hoof_It_Nev]

2 hours ago, Heath said:

 

It may have been the stream I watched the game on, but Kean looked to have a huge ass. I know that may sound a little odd.

Probably taking training tips from Pickford

[Wiggytop]

Showed glimpses of what we were hoping to see, but still inexperienced, ran into too many dead ends and tried to take one one man too many too often. He did put in one lovely ball from the right hand side. Hopefully starting to find his feet here. 

[Sibdane]

I think it would be foolish to let him go anytime soon. He's still only 19 and needs more experience to get up to the pace of the league. Skill is there. He needs a confidence boost though. I think a goal would do him wonders. 

Remains to be seen, but like I said before he wasn't bought to come in and make an immediate impact. We paid the high price for his potential and not his current level. 

[Palfy]

3 hours ago, Heath said:

 

Thought he did ok when he came on against Leicester. It actually looked like the penny had dropped with him, time will tell of course. Not sure if it's just me, but does anyone else feel he's a little out of condition? It may have been the stream I watched the game on, but Kean looked to have a huge ass. I know that may sound a little odd.

Was you streaming it off the adult channel

[Bill]

2 hours ago, Sibdane said:

I think it would be foolish to let him go anytime soon. He's still only 19 and needs more experience to get up to the pace of the league. Skill is there. He needs a confidence boost though. I think a goal would do him wonders.

Thought he might of stepped forward for one of the penalties.

[Matt]

8 minutes ago, Bill said:

Thought he might of stepped forward for one of the penalties.

Considering the manager chooses the takers usually (I think), he probably didn’t want to step on toes

[barryj]

23 minutes ago, Bill said:

Thought he might of stepped forward for one of the penalties.

Was he not going to take the 5th Pen?